Lol. I know. Epic fail.

I like dailies. They are a simple way to keep the game stable at a nice pace. I mean do you want to get to level 50 in one day and have a million coms? You would be as board as heck within hours. If we could all do this everyone wouldl leave the game quicker. I can understand your frustration but, maybe it's not the dailies, maybe it's endless walking, or how hard it is to group? But too each his own. There have been times where I have been annoyed by the dailies too. What exactly do u suggest instead? I'm sure a compromise could be dreamed up, put it in the suggestion box

They have owned up to it many times, and I have played in "cheating" groups. It's all debatable of course. People who play for coms don't always think it's cheating, they speak openly about it if you call them out. But if you get sucked in with them you are screwed, because they already decided to win or lose before u got there. They let each other win like this; one side wins, other side wins, one side wins, other side wins until they get all the coms they need. I lost ELO because I left a ranked group that was doing this. But this isn't the only kind. Bio Ware once made a statement about people having multiple accounts, and multiple toons playing at the same time. That's the whole point of my chart. It's to show all the different kinds of cheating, and how playing in WZ's is like a spider web that I would like BW do something about.

I ran out of time and had to go play the game I just wanted to test it out. I have more work to do. The chart is about cheating, each line is someone talking to the opposite side during the match, using bots, inspecting common players while on the other faction, making deals with the opposite side. Whatever. It's about cheating premade groups mostly. But also other kinds of cheating. You see the easiest way to cheat in SWTOR is not with hacking, it's the "classic" kind. Fixing matches, setting them up for coms, talking to the other side, it's about making deals, or just messing up matches by queing as a guild and sucking in puggers (not intentional). Each line represents someone who is "connected" to some one from the opposing side possibly making the match unfair. Horizontally the two circles are faction vs faction and looking at them vertically it's faction vs opposing faction. I will fix and repost sometime in the future. Hope that makes it a little clearer now, thanks for the crit.

Picture to Imageshack below. Double check by hoovering/inspecting element. It's authentic. Just been thinking about these "6 degrees" a lot. The reason there is so much cheating, in my opinion, is because there are way too many outcomes for what's going on in the way of cheating. My diagram is in no way 100% accurate. It's just a thought. These are just possibilities of what it's like to play in a war zone and why there is so much confusion, cheating etc. It's for fun. Feel free to laugh, crit, or examine. Let me know what you think. ***The black lines are for the most part bad. They represent people communicating amongst them selves instead of the team, cheating via feeding information, cheating via letting each other win for coms, inspecting "nemesis" or hard to beat players than switching back to the other team etc. and more. http://imageshack.us/a/img39/2575/thesixdegreesofpremades.jpg

I really think this game is great, but what BW did wrong is try to do too much; Too many classes, with too many side stories (all with voice actors), too many servers, unnecessarily large planets. I've seen this a hundred times, companies get too big and fall over. We all do this in our own lives sometimes too. I guess it's part of human nature. It happens. If Bio Ware backs out a little and focus's on the most important things first, one at a time. Than slowly the game will revive it's self. That's my hope at least. ***Having voice actors for side stories....big mistake. I mean sometimes it's cool, but I think we wouldn't have cared if they didn't have them. Only the heroics, FP, bonus series need them. It would have, in contrast, made the heroics, FP etc. more fun to play, and would have given the devs more time to spend on making those missions even better. Sorry just my opinion.

Dude there are a lot of problems but stun is not one of them. You should have two abilities that get you out of it on top of resolve. Now I don't play many other clases so maybe you can inform, but I never have a problem with it. I mean it's annoying at times, but so are all abilities. In addition characters like my Jedi Shadow have to stun. I am all protection/absorb based and can't kill anyone, I have never won a duel. Why? My character plays the support role. I support the team. I can not survive on my own. Stun is my only way out, ever.

Not just 8 man. It could be 4 or 6. It's more often the latter, It's way more complicated than you guys are making it. Here are the problems; 1.) Pug get's stuck with 4 man premade, on either side or both. One side is letting the other side win. The pugs who aren't in on the "fixed match". Just wasted all their time, no one was listening to them or helping them. Matter of fact they were the primary targets. Very, very mean, and unfair. 2.) A guild from the other side plays against pug. It has nothing to do with "8" men. Some great guilds on my server team up with other guilds in total only having 6 and two good pugs. Those 6 will still obliterated must pug groups. 3.) A guild on one side is working with the guild on the other side, and pugs get sucked in. There is no communicationg with half of the team, one half is using vent, the other half is chatting. A big waste because sometimes the game is fixed anyway, and even if it wasn't it's like trying to pull a ship two different directions. THE SOLUTION IS THAT WE NEED TO KNOW WHO IS GROUPING UP ON BOTH SIDES, AND WHO WE'RE STUCK WITH IN PUG. IN ADDITION EVEN A 6 MAN PREMADE SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO PLAY AGAINST PUG, ITS NOT DIFFERENT THAN 8. THEY STILL HAVE A TOWERING ADVANTAGE. THERE ARE MANY SOLUTIONS TO THESE ISSUES, MEANWHILE BIO WARE JUST MICROMANAGES. I SAY ALL THIS IN HOPES THAT THEY WILL DO SOMETHING! CAUSE I LIKE THE GAME.

It's not just kids buddy, and that's insulting. Read some of the recent posts. Experienced pug players are probably better than most guilded players in certain ways. So with that in mind they probably aren't all kids. Kids are the ones that quit, cheat, or move on to ranked. I would say half of the cheating is probably done by kids, even when it comes to premades. Also kids have more time to spend with a guild, a lot of older players have strict, or demanding schedules that work better with pug. Why do you think so many people are complaining about this? Most kids wouldn't have the stamina. They are already playing a different game. It's an MMO it could be absolutely anybody, doing anything.

This sounds fun. I'm game.

Fine as along as they have an even more extreme punishment for "fixing matches" with premades, people screaming at noobs, or for people hacking. They caused all this. So they deserve even more punishment. They MAKE people leave. You should go after them instead. Pull the "root' and you'll get the weed. It's unfair to penalize people for leaving WZ's when WZ's can be so unfair.

for all you who want everyone to join a guild and think that it will solve this problem... WHY GUILDING DOESN'T ALWAYS "SYNC UP", 6 REASONS WHY ( first off i want to say ahead of time guilds are cool, and fun, but there are many reasons why people might not want to be in a guild as well. i think both opinions make a lot of sense. Just telling people to join a guild, and to make friends will not solve this problem, it goes beyond pug verses guilds anyway, it's about cheating and fairness at the end of the day.) 1.) Using vent is kind of weird and uncomfortable. In a way it's lame. I use it and it's cool. But sometimes I just want to go play without having to spend so much time setting up vent and WAITING for everyone to get there. I don't have all night ya know. So vent just causes as many problems as it solves sometimes. 2.) Not everyone has time for guilds, and even if they do they might not be "in sync" with their guild for a specific week but still want to stay up and grind for their gear in pvp at "strange times". 3.) Noobs generally don't want to play with guilds, they need practice and don't want to be embarrassed. There are too many jerks out there so they want to be "prepared". Can't get mad at them for that, they are doing you a favor. Even if they join a guild the guild might create fake matches for them to get coms, or they'll do it, making this whole situation even worst. BUT HERES THE THING. IF THEY DIE ALMOST INSTANTLY, LIKE I HAVE SEEN HAPPEN MANY TIMES THIS WEEK, THEY DON'T GET PRACTICE AND THEY WON'T GET BETTER. THEY WILL QUIT THE GAME, OR JUST DO MORE PVE. 4.) There is something extra fun about going into a pug match. It has that all out war feeling, you have to think quicker, and act quicker, and sometimes go against greater odds. That's cool. Guilding can be more boring. You do the same plays every time, or told what to do by the same person every game. etc. etc. etc. If I lose in pug that's cool I'll get over it, if I suck that's cool I'll learn, if there are noobs playing that's completely understandable, but getting obliterated 7 to 200 kills. Not acceptable. It doesn't need to be like that, there is no excuse. It's not about gear, it's not about inexperience, it's about high ranked guilds, going against the lowest of the low, or it's about hacking. That is TRUE inbalance. Pug can truly be exciting as it is, when it is fair. 5.) People may have had bad guild experiences and just like the freedom that pug brings. There is nothing wrong with taking a break, everyone needs a break sometimes. 6.) If new players are in fact practicing in pug they need some experienced players playing with them to point them in the right direction, but experienced players can't teach them if the team doesn't even have a chance. Some people like myself like helping others out, and it's also a good place to recruit people. But when matches are extremely unfair your making the experienced players angry too, when I'm trying to be a nice guy and help others out.

I see what you're saying but I like how all the caps between Novare, Void, and Ald are different. I think they all bring something different. I personally love how the WZ's are set up. I think fixing the premade matches (fixed), hacks, and bots are more of a problem. Plus if BW does what they say...and they really emphasized it, we should have a lot of new war zones in the future and I'm sure the caps will be like you want, Novare, the latest WZ is evidence! So that's good news! I would love capping like you say.

Me too. I have many videos of it now. I am going to post on here soon. It is the worst I have EVER seen. In all my videos we don't get more than 10 kills. I kid you not. We don't get over ten!!!! What do they get? Approx 200!!!!!! 200 kills!!!!!! This is either hack cheating, premades that are cheating (fixed matches), or bots. I mean hey I like the game a lot. But at the end of the day...when I think, "is this really worth my time and money?". Will I stick around when I'm playing an artificial match? I doubt it. What's the point? It's no different than playing another game against the computer. It will only take me one new game to leave and never come back...I mean how does this benefit me? Most importantly I can't trust Bio Ware, cause they never have ONCE tried to fix any of these issues. I never know what matches are real and what matches aren't. At the end of the day it just seems like a big waste. For all I know I played 6 fake matches in a row over the past two days. Bio Ware needs to make a statement and show us they are against this. I really can't support a company that doesn't take this seriously. I'm not trying to be mean, but I really feel like I could be wasting my time on these fake matches and it could move me to leave without a little support or confidence from the company.

I think it's been enough time...and some of us don't have factions up to par. If one started out on a specific side obviously that is their better toon. Also it's more than faction. Guilds "set up" same faction games on same faction too. Technically if you get stuck with them you can lose out cause they will already determine the winner verbally before you start.

I agree. Hey, when no one plays any more they will be the ones QQing. Playing the same old guild gets boring, and the normal subscribers (like you and me) will just leave. We need REAL balance. Not stupid "micro managing".

Exactly. Look at my previous post. When the first scene is awesome...than you don't really follow it through with your character...it's a disappointment from day one. I was let down, I thought I was gonna start fighting along side Satele Shan (repub) or at least meet here at the landing bay! At least it would have been a lot more exciting that way. Instead I end up helping this "old hag" doing endless quests that felt like they took forever. She was a nice "old hag" though, and she got possessed which was kind of cool but it doesn't make up for a bad first impression.

Sorry have to disagree. For me this is what happened... I played so many side missions I always forgot what was going on in my story. I have been impressed by it many times but I always end up getting distracted. If it's not by helping people with FP it's doing PvP. So I can't even judge the story overall. In addition I haven't even finished my class quest because I just PvP or help others with FP etc. For me it's just really messy. If someone would have told me to play the story straight through first I would have enjoyed my Story more, as the story is my favorite part of the game. I can see where you are coming from though, but for me it's a bit diff. HOW TO SOLVE BOTH OUR PROBLEMS; The side missions are a waste, not all of them, but most. If BW would have not wasted time on them in every way they could have used all that extra time and money to make the class story longer or more interesting. I also would have focused more on my class quest. I hope they take this in to account on the new planet! Completely agree! This is really interesting thing. Do you remember when you first start the game? There is this AMAZING intro scene. That's how a story should start!! I was really excited to play after this...only to find out one of those characters were in my story...and left me wondering....what a waste. but like you said a "defined" beginning was already there...than they go and change it...? I just was really excited to get into THAT story...only to start a brand new one. Or at least that's what it felt like..it felt very sloppy from the start. I should have started my story right than and there. I was really let down from the start of the game.

Qyzen. Cause he's hilarious. All he does is talk about killing things (hunting) and winning and than he get's sad if he can't do it.

"hide the helmet"? on companions? I can't see my helmet ever on Qyzen!!!! What's up?

Zhaker. Do you realize almost all the problems I pasted above, from your post, could be cheating? If someones not defending there is a big chance they aren't defending on purpose. I was queued with a group that was specifically telling people when to cap a door..and when not too. They said they owed the other team a win. It wasn't normal guild chatter, and they admitted they were doing it for coms. It could also be a bot, or someone playing two characters at once (lol). But entirely possible. Bio Ware wastes too much time micromanaging and needs to start fixing these problems first. Little spec changes are worthless in comparison. As far as these statement they are good things. First of all if someone is talking a lot in chat that means they are communicating. Communicating is part of the "trifecta" of what makes a guild "clobber" pug. Pugs, for some reason unknown to man, don't like to use chat. They think it's weird or something. What they don't get is that that is their secret weapon when facing a guild. -You should be trying to shout out plays all the time, just like the guilds. -You should be chatting when you are getting killed by someone and u are the last one left. It's better to die and tell someone right away than to wait until you re-spawn. Secondly I am full WH and under 13,000 health. That's how the DEVS made my gear. I regret buying it a little bit but I didn't know it would be like this when I started. Also the Dev's did it for a reason. Obviously I'm "strong" in other ways. So 13,000 hp has nothing to do with anything. But I leave matches too. So I feel your pain. I lost ELO the other day because I left that premade and no one told me we were cheating until I got inside the match.

It's called Bolster. and a level 30 can be stronger in someways than a 45 (guessing on levels). There is a special "concoction" that happens to low level players that makes them better. At least it used to be like this, and there are many blogs about it. But yeah check out Bolster. I used to get #1 in medals sometimes I would get 6 first place's in a row. Than I went higher in level and it became more difficult because Bolster wasn't helping as much. This is why some people like pre-50 pvp better. It does seem to have a better equalizer.

We're all the same server now. RIght? Anyway. I understand the Ranked thing. Even though it's not 100% fair it's just a sucky predicament. We all kind of lose out a little, and everyone is kind of sacrificing in some way or another. I will say what most say in response and that is "com's don't make you better" and neither does an artificial match. But if you have three other toons or something like that I can completely understand why you might want to have fun and let each other win etc. in ranked. You have probably "grinded" way more than me and not on the dance floor. ha.

This is a great point, but your missing what I said. You are in many guilds. Ya know not everyone is like you? You seem to be a guild "elite". I mean that's cool and all but that's exactly what I'm speaking against, kind of. For you guys yeah, obviously, you are board in general and you might notice some small spec problems. That's fine. You guys are the "cult" market. That's cool but what about all the "nuubs" (first time players), people who had bad experiences in guilds and quit them, and people who only have time for pug ( i myself play countless hours but don't really want to get in a dedicated guild just yet). Those people might be good, or become good but they are having different problems than you. They are a market that is probably equally important in bringing longevity to the game. We might be geared well, and even communicate o.k. but when guilds destroy us no matter how well we have it together, or because they are controlling the game that is way more important than a couple gear "quabbles". That's why I say the bigger problem is Guild vs Pug etc.and cheating premades of one type or the other. ***I played with a group of all WH today everyone seemed to be geared great. But something wasn't right they were communicating but it seemed to maybe be amongst them selves, but they were doing o.k with chatting. Point is we still got completely hammered. Why? Were they cheating and helping the other side win? It felt like the premade I was in the other day where people were cheating that's for sure. Weird random caps, certain people getting crazy damage amounts, they are all results of a "fixed" game. I play everyday and there are strange matches that stick out like this. Lets say 25% of the matches were elite guilds going against new pugs, and 25% teams that are cheating for coms. You can't tell me if that was eliminated that it wouldn't bring balance. Come on!? NO MORE MICROMANAGING PLEASE!!! But I can see your side of the story too. Both things would help in one way or another, but I still think what your proposing only helps elite guilds at the end of the day and no one else.

I have to disagree with this too. It's not about class balance, it's about guild and pug balance. Why would we even queue for ranked if we get stuck playing guilds and die 24/7? I don't want to even get into the endless cheating cycle this sparks. The more I play the more I learn who the people are around me and the more I realized how many "fixed" matches there are. Micromanaging "classes" is a lame way to fix a HUGE problem that is pug vs guilds, or premade "fixed" matches on same faction or cross faction. One example of why PvP is dying on Republic is because when We Haz Cookies (or any other great guild) plays for two hours straight and dominates every pug match, people don't see the point of playing anymore...or they, in turn, cheat...and make the problem worst. So all you have left are a couple guilds who can play ranked. Congrats! Maybe if this stuff never happened there would be a couple more guilds hanging around to play in ranked. But most other players couldn't even get that far, they gave up because they got hammered on so much.