This from a person whom in another thread can't figure out how to play his class (saying they suck in PvP), and then coming here and saying they are in fact OPed. [thread]387333[/thread] [thread=387333]Click Me![/thread] Obviously, all the qqers of this topic are coming from players who are just really bad at PvP and seek to blame the class and not themselves.

Did you miss anyone?? When you name like over HALF of the classes/spec as overpowered.... I think its you that has the problem.

No offense, but housing imo is a complete waste of time and effort, especially when they have pretty much stated that our spaceships will be our player housing. Even with it being in the game already, I think any time they spend on spaceship housing is a depressing waste of time and effort better spent elsewhere. I've played lots of mmo, and alot that have housing (Lotro, EQ2, AO, probably others I can't think of) and housing has NEVER been more than the most momentary of distractions. I'd never hinge my decision on whether to stay or go in an mmo on whether or not they have housing.

I am so glad they don't let you balance this game. I won't explain why because you just don't get it, that one class doing 300k spread over 15minutes is balanced one way, and another class that maybe does a little less (lets say 250k), but does this damage in much shorter span of time (because their targets get DEAD) is balanced another way. Oh wait, maybe I did just explain it, but will you GET it?? Now, I do agree that some dps classes/specs may suffer from a lack of utility/variety in exchange for their burstiness.... but their damage is fine.

If you want arena just like WoW, do what this guy did, go back to WoW. Problem solved. Nothing good will come of putting Arena in this game, and if you just want to deathmatch, go to Illum and set up some matches. If you are seriously going back to WoW just for Arena, then I don't think this game is for you in the first place.

I don't understand why you think that just because you don't like huttball, everyone else shouldn't either?? Get over yourself I love huttball, because it really shows the difference between people who understand objective-based pvp, and those who just know how to deathmatch people (I call them Arena-kiddies). Whatever your favorite WZ is, I am sure I can point out 2 dozen reasons why Huttball is better. Don't hate on the WZ when its just that you're bad.

You are just out and out wrong.... and let me tell you why. Tanks may in fact end up doing more damage over the course of a WZ, because they'll tend to stay alive longer and will be guarding a healer (thus benefiting from heals more often). But they are not bursting anywhere NEAR what a pure DPS class/spec can. Any decent dps spec is going to see alot more killing blows than any tank ever will.... and burst is king in PvP as it always has been. If WZs actually tracked number of killing blows, you would probably not see tanks at the top of the heap. You can populate your whole team with healers and guarding tanks, and run around doing tons of damage to the other side and taking and healing tons of damage, yet no one ends up dying. OR, you can do what any decent team does and throw some pure dps in there instead of all tanks, and actually be able to FINISH your kills. I've played a sentinel and a vanguard at 50.... and actually I've always managed to do similar total amounts of dps in each warzone (maybe consistently 25% more dps on the sentinel), but when I have a really good game, Sentinel dps numbers just soar to where a vanguard can never reach. However, my sentinel is ten times more burst capable than the vanguard. SO, if you really think that tanks do the same dps as a pure dps class, go try it sometime. There's a big difference between TOTAL damage done in a match, and damage done to a single target in a short amount of time. BURST

Its funny that you say you hate chicken, but your version of PvP with apparently no CC available would result in a bunch of people running around unhindered trying to deathmatch each other..... running around kinda like chickens with their heads cut off. CC is neccessary...... otherwise every team would be made up of nothing but healers guarded by tanks. You guys talking about force chokes.... thats actually the fairest form of CC in the game, because it takes both the Choker and the Chokee out of the engagement equation, AND they are on a cool down. If you are getting chain choked, you have TWO separate people doing pretty much nothing but focusing you down. Are you saying that you should not be able to be focused down??? CC is a learn to play issue..... learn to play

They REALLY should have implemented cross-server WZs before they tried this stuff....

The "right" way, lol seriously!?!?!!? What do you care what others are wearing, how easy they got it, and how good they are with it? Do you really need to know that you have something better than someone else in order to feel good about your own accomplishments? What do you care if they can get it easier now... you still had it FIRST didn't you??? I seriously don't understand you gear progression PvE crybabies..... I really think you should be raiding something somewhere, you don't have a PvP mindset at all. Oh but then, raiding requires other people, doesn't it. Lets face it, anyone with time to waste can become BM.... its not an accomplishment that you should particularly feel proud of. However, the more people you can get involved in PvP the better..... I want MORE competition not LESS. You all whine so hard about the easy gear now, because you see your gear advantage now going away for rated WZs.

^^^ this guy won the thread. Right on

I love huttball, and most of what you say is ridiculous exageration and hyperbole (grapple for ridiculous range? its 30m like every other ranged ability, like force leap, sage rescue). To say huttball takes zero skill and zero strategy.... you're right.... to play it. To play it well, you actually need to have a plan and know what you are doing. Like I said, grapple specifically is only 30m range, does very little damage, and if it puts you in a pit, you should know how to get out of it. "You think it takes skill to target someone, stand in a pit and then pull then in and stun them in it is skill?" actually, it does... try it some time. It requires some nifty footwork and timing to put an enemy down in a fire pit with grapplinghook without getting fried yourself. Takes alot more skill than playing an Op turret, sage turret, BH turret etc etc. And btw on my vanguard, I have had grappling hook fail plenty of times... mainly when the target is already rooted.

Not a good idea to reset cooldowns on death.... and I am saying that as a Sentinel (some really nice abilities I have on 1 -2 min. cooldowns). It would encourage people to just run into a fight and blow their load without any thought to long-term strategy, die, rinse, repeat. Whats the point of even having cooldowns if you can just act stupid and reset them real fast by dying?? In the example you give.... as a vanguard for example, you have to plan out whether you want to use your grappling hook to yank some poor slob into the fire pit for some gratuitous fun..... or SAVE the ability a bit to try and yank an enemy ball carrier before they score... same can go for cryo-grenade which is on an even longer CD. Heck, if CDs reset on death, you'd almost be stupid NOT to jump into an acid pit every 30 secs to get your abilities off CD. Death has consequences, shouldn't be rewarded for dying by getting all your cool abilities back off CD.

The vote for MVP will never be fair. Why?? Because the people doing the voting are all voting for different reasons, with different prejudices, different priorities for what they think is the most valued contribution to the team (is it damage? healing? how bout the totally un-recorded number of touchdowns in huttball??). Some dps only vote for other dps. Some dps only vote for healers, some healers only vote for tanks that guard them, some really crazy people only vote for people who did some spectacular plays that aren't at all reflected in the stats at the end of the game (thats just crazy, to vote for something thats not reflected by numbers, amirite?). YOU know what you contributed to the match, and anyone with half a brain would too. I'm not saying there isn't room for improvement in how they display and tally the stats, but I wouldn't hang your hopes on that making the voting process any better, or benefit you specifically. I'd love to see huttball changed to reflect # of completed passes, rushing yards, touchdowns, etc. Even interceptions would add so much more "flavor" to the match. As far as those who guard/deflect... remember there's probably a whole host of dpsers out there who never get guarded (as most tanks will guard a healer before a dpser)... and therefore never feel benefited by guard, and won't vote for you anyways.

Ok seriously??? You all play too much. WAY too much.... I don't know why you even think this game is what you should be playing. I suggest EQ1... probably has enough content to keep you all busy for at least a year or two.... start from the first expansion and progress the old fashioned way, you'll have a ball I'm sure. One you are done with that, THEN come back to swtor.... might be enough new content at that point to keep you all busy for another 3 months (because you play WAY TOO MUCH). Oh and for anyone who says "well I'm maxed out 5 characters full BM/Rakata and I don't play too much" just stop... cause you do.

Bye, can't wait for you to leave!! Most of you 'hardcore' are actually the ones who have left this game already, or are just playing it as a placeholder for whatever uber game you think is going to be the next best thing (don't worry, you won't last long in that game either). The problem is, you play this game too much. You probably play every mmo you've ever been in way too much. You think this entitles you to more than casuals, and in fact you've been given more than casuals. You've had the gear advantage, grats you grinded there first, what an accomplishment!!! /rolls eyes Nothing you have gained in PvP is something that can't be gained by everyone.... let me say that again for emphasis.... EVERYONE else in the game, it's just a matter of TIME SPENT PLAYING. Do you understand this??? It's not work, it's not skill, its just TIME SPENT PLAYING. Now, by adding in ranked WZs, they have finally provided some ACTUAL progression that is not based solely on time spent playing... you actually have to be decent at the game. And to facilitate some actual REAL competition, they have made the time grind for gear easier. Your elitism and sense of entitlement because you play more is astounding to me.... yeah we all know you get more for playing more/longer, but what the heck does it matter to you what everyone else has? I really don't think people like you even play these games for fun.... its some perverse sense of competition based on investing your self worth and whether or not you are achieving anything within the game as an inverse relationship to what everyone else has or has not. Oh and by the way, I am sure as a casual, I will be playing this game LONG after you have left, with only your elitism whine as a legacy to what you have accomplished in this game. You'll probably have missed the best to come too, when WZs go cross-server with some decent competition not based solely on gear. Have fun grinding out in some other game whatever passes for 'gear progression' in PvP in that game.... I'm sure you'll be first to the top, ready to pwn noobs.

Was thinking the same thing..... seriously OP, maybe its time to get out in the sun. Just remember to put on some sunblock.... I recommend something with at least SPF 50. IMO, ppl who spend this much time playing the game are always the first to get burnt out, say this game sucks, and leave for another. I think your time is come. I suggest though, next time play less and you will like the game for a longer period of RL time. No modern MMO is really putting out games that cater to you anymore.... most people play alot less and thus don't burn through the game as fast as you.

Just when I thought I had seen every conceivable whine possible..... you've proved me wrong. I want to be able to meditate/recuperate while in combat.... and since attacking me would interrupt said ability, I want to be immune from all damage while meditating in combat@!@! All I hear from you is 1) I want my stealther to be able to stealth at will at any time 2) This game isn't enough like WoW, please make it moreso (ala shadowstep) 3) Class X has some really cool stuff, I think my class should have it too. p.s. I really hope no one at bioware even reads this thread, its a waste of time

You're like some guy who's stuck in WoW land, I don't even understand why you aren't still there playing the game. Everything you talk about is in WoW terms.... maybe you are just having trouble relating to A DIFFERENT GAME. I've seen these threads before too, in WoW land. You propose an argument and seek to get feedback, but what you really have done is already made up your mind, and any argument to the contrary is rudely dismissed in the most derogatory fashion. You even refer to Bioware like they should have been aware of the ret pally and what they "used to do"..... damn dude not everyone lived WoW like you did. Oh, and you really just need to l2p

Really, imo the only ones sad about the current state of mmos are the ones who play too much anyways.... seriously. I played EQ back in the day when it was really the only thing out there (UO aside)... and while I have fond memories of some of it, I would never go back to that type of "hardcore" game, because FFS, who has the time to deal with that crap any more? I remember taking 45 mins just to get my CORPSE back after a failed raid into Fear or Hate plane... and I guess I put up with it because I didn't know any better. Todays gamer has a lower tolerance for needless grinding and obvious time wasting. And when you apply that to PvP, you'll have a great deal of people who will be totally unwilling to put up with being a Pinata in PvP while fully geared guys one and two shot them. People will not participate in PvP, and your WZs will be empty. At the very least they should take the RNG factor out of gaining the equipment, which of course they have. And now with rated WZs, the goal will be to be the BEST in the ratings, not to have "better gear". And really, what could be a better goal or justification for your time spent than to show you have done well in rated WZs???? Thats so much more rewarding than knowing you spent X number of hours achieving BM status (because it is an inevitable status, not an achievement).

The only morons around imo are the ones who rushed to grind out battlemaster gear, and then act like its their god given right to lord over everyone else with their gear advantage. You mention Dark age of Camelot.... I bet you just LOVED Trials of Atlantis where you could care-bear PvE to get yourself the best weapons/artifacts to pwn in RvR. Anything a game does to level the playing field or at the very least make it easier to get the gear required for PvP is a good thing imo... and any rational PvPer with even a hint of a notion of fair play would agree. 1) Brings more people to the PvP field who might otherwise avoid it like the plague if its ruled over by the "ZOMG I grinded to full BM gear in the first two weeks" crowd. 2) More and varied competition is always a good thing. 3) Gear isn't an indication of how good you are at PvP, only how long you've played. 4) You must really be lousy at PvP to be so fearful of losing your gear advantage. 5) The game has been out 3 months... YOU are full BM already.... obviously it wasn't that hard to do in the first place (hint hint, it wasn't).

Dude, you are NOT a pvper. You are a care bear gear progression type. PvPers don't care about gear, only the competition.

And the sad thing is, Vaipyr, they're not really PvPers!!! They are really PvEer gear progression types who have found they like PvP only when they have a gear advantage. If there was no PvP, they'd be whining when BW makes PvE epic equipment easier to get in anticipation of the release of the next expansion. Everything is a farm to them, and god forbid someone else has an easier time than they did getting it. Competition and fairplay.... screw that, I'm trying to farm here!!

HILARIOUS!!!! Thank you sir.... let me translate: Games sucks now cause people will have an easier time getting gear that I played way too much too long too fast to get. It will be FTP in a month cause I no longer like it. ROFLMAO

Do you enjoy PvP?? No seriously, from your post you really sound like you don't, you only grind it out so you can be "high ranked". You even refer to it as a "farm", I mean seriously can that be any more Freudian of a slip?? PvPing should be its own reward. People will recognize your greatness or suckedtude whether you are valor65 or valor15. Its like you feel you have no justification for PvP unless you are presented with a nice little piece of equipment after "farming" enough WZs.... How bout YOU determine your self-worth in PvP??? Thats whats so cool about it, your skill tells you how good you are, not some arbitrarily reached level of notoriety (determined mainly by how LONG you've played). You're a sheep, you are waiting for Bioware to determine some level that you must grind towards, and THAT determines your self-worth in PvP... not what goals YOU set for YOURSELF. And heaven forbid someone else might have the same gear you "worked so hard" for.... egads, some competition might happen!!!!