Premades in Regs

[MercMara]

When is Bioware devs going to do something about premades in regs? its ridiculous to be stuck on a team with objective players and having a premade of 4 or more farming them at spawn! Almost every premade is also comprised of flavor of the month specs. IE, AP PT, Eng/Virulence Sniper, madness sorc, rage jug with tank & heals. It's so far out of hand you cant enjoy the game and you cant leave matches because of penalties. You can't play specs you enjoy because they dont stand a chance against fotm. This games pvp is beyond trash now. 

[sithBracer]

Everyone complains about skank juggs, PTs, snipers, rage juggs, tank heals, 6 person premades, lack of matchmaking, garbage rewards.

Biowares first solution to all problems ever: nerf sins.

Biowares second solution to all problems ever: We tried everything and don't know what else to do.

Edited June 3 by sithBracer

[Samcuu]

6 minutes ago, sithBracer said:

Biowares second solution to all problems ever: We tried everything and don't know what else to do.

I wouldn't even go that far. They are basically just not even attempting to fix pvp and completely ignoring it. One of the easiest fixes is changing the group size allowed to queue and they are sitting on their hands, idk if they understand it's a problem at this point because it's never been addressed once, and they don't comment on the pvp forums. To keep the pvp fresh the other very simple solution is balancing classes and changing the meta maybe once every 8 months? 8 mos is generous it should be more often but that would at least be semi acceptable. I have a friend who plays wow and his favorite classes got nerfed, and now buffed again, meanwhile class changes haven't happened for going on two years in swtor 😂😂 it's legit negligence and unacceptable on so many levels. 

Edited June 3 by Samcuu

[MercMara]

13 minutes ago, Samcuu said:

I wouldn't even go that far. They are basically just not even attempting to fix pvp and completely ignoring it. One of the easiest fixes is changing the group size allowed to queue and they are sitting on their hands, idk if they understand it's a problem at this point because it's never been addressed once, and they don't comment on the pvp forums. To keep the pvp fresh the other very simple solution is balancing classes and changing the meta maybe once every 8 months? 8 mos is generous it should be more often but that would at least be semi acceptable. I have a friend who plays wow and his favorite classes got nerfed, and now buffed again, meanwhile class changes haven't happened for going on two years in swtor 😂😂 it's legit negligence and unacceptable on so many levels. 

I agree. Especially if you are a paying subscriber. Bioware isn't fulfilling their end of the deal. 

[MercMara]

In my opinion, premades need to be removed completely from warzones. Create a Q for premade PvP. With the skill level that most players are at now, premades don't have a place in warzones but to farm.  

[Zekiirah]

5 minutes ago, MercMara said:

In my opinion, premades need to be removed completely from warzones. Create a Q for premade PvP. With the skill level that most players are at now, premades don't have a place in warzones but to farm.  

Queuing solo as a healer is often a miserable experience regardless of what kind of premade or composition is present on the other team. Even the stupid among the PvP population can understand "kill healer." Additionally, the server populations cannot handle different queues. I responded to your previous, almost identical post about premades what, a couple weeks ago? I noticed you didn't respond to anyone discussing the other problems present in the PvP community. Are you going to keep posting nearly identical topics until you get enough people and conversation to validate an echo chamber that has already existed for years?

[MercMara]

1 minute ago, Zekiirah said:

Queuing solo as a healer is often a miserable experience regardless of what kind of premade or composition is present on the other team. Even the stupid among the PvP population can understand "kill healer." Additionally, the server populations cannot handle different queues. I responded to your previous, almost identical post about premades what, a couple weeks ago? I noticed you didn't respond to anyone discussing the other problems present in the PvP community. Are you going to keep posting nearly identical topics until you get enough people and conversation to validate an echo chamber that has already existed for years?

Yup, that's the idea. Bioware obviously isn't doing anything about it. Maybe if people mention PvP issues enough they'll take notice. Doubtful though, I know. 

 

If you have problems with posts, simple solution is not read them. Its in the subject line. Or you can cry about it. 

[Zekiirah]

9 minutes ago, MercMara said:

Yup, that's the idea. Bioware obviously isn't doing anything about it. Maybe if people mention PvP issues enough they'll take notice. Doubtful though, I know. 

 

If you have problems with posts, simple solution is not read them. Its in the subject line. Or you can cry about it. 

 

I'm interacting with your post. I'm attempting to create a dialogue with another player who clearly also has some love for the last bits of PvP this game has. Do you not think it possible that there are many problems with PvP, and not just premades? Because I do. It's a disservice to everyone involved in the PvP community to scrutinize, villainize, and ostracize folks who join premades. It whittles down the argument to: if you solo queue, you're "better" and "legitimate", and if you queue premade, you are the problem and I don't like you. That has been a huge part of my experience coming back to this game the last several months, and quite frankly, it's why I refuse to queue as a healer without friends now. The PvP community at large -  probably those who would agree with you - do not care about teamwork, objectives, or supporting their healers. Until we have better solutions where hardcore PvPers feel more comfortable queuing solo because they can trust that they won't queue in with selfish doorknobs, premades will persist.

But hey, you're free to ignore me, not read this, or cry about it. I'm perfectly capable of carrying on a conversation and debate without getting defensive right off the bat, though. 

[MercMara]

1 hour ago, Zekiirah said:

 

I'm interacting with your post. I'm attempting to create a dialogue with another player who clearly also has some love for the last bits of PvP this game has. Do you not think it possible that there are many problems with PvP, and not just premades? Because I do. It's a disservice to everyone involved in the PvP community to scrutinize, villainize, and ostracize folks who join premades. It whittles down the argument to: if you solo queue, you're "better" and "legitimate", and if you queue premade, you are the problem and I don't like you. That has been a huge part of my experience coming back to this game the last several months, and quite frankly, it's why I refuse to queue as a healer without friends now. The PvP community at large -  probably those who would agree with you - do not care about teamwork, objectives, or supporting their healers. Until we have better solutions where hardcore PvPers feel more comfortable queuing solo because they can trust that they won't queue in with selfish doorknobs, premades will persist.

But hey, you're free to ignore me, not read this, or cry about it. I'm perfectly capable of carrying on a conversation and debate without getting defensive right off the bat, though. 

You're right, no need to me to get snippy. 

 

As I see it, the core problems are unbalanced classes/specs and player skill level. 

 

Unbalanced classes:

 

Madness Sorcerer - The self healing is too strong as well as the damage reduction and force speed being up too frequent. I very good Madness Sorc won't lose 1v1 to too many specs. The spec is too loaded with passive defensives and healing. 

 

Advanced Prototype Powertech - The burst is insane. The Auto crit specifically needs to be removed. That would solve most problems with AP PT. Self heals, extra damage reduction, 35% defensive chance, a pull, leap and Hydro overrides... The spec is too over powered. 

 

Rage Jug - The burst needs to match that of a Fury Mara, currently Rage is able to do 100k+ in one raging burst. Let alone the tactical that resets the CD on rages 2nd biggest hit. The 10 meter leap needs to be cut down as well. 

 

Sniper Eng/Virulence - Both specs burst is stupid, especially Eng. Being able to do almost 200k in one shot is ludicrous. Same for Virulence, if they give Virulence, Madness, Lethality a DoT collapse they need to do the same for Annihilation Mara. 

 

Player skill level - Vast majority of players have no interest in learning how to actually use all their skills and abilities. They treat SWTOR like COD, and just jump on and play objectives. So when you do solo queue and you're up against a premade some if not all of your team doesn't know how to DPS, stay alive and so on. 

 

Premades - I think what would solve the problems with premades is limiting them to 4 players again. As well is only allowing say, one AP PT not two AP PTs with tank/heals.  

[WaffleQwop]

4 hours ago, Zekiirah said:

It's a disservice to everyone involved in the PvP community to scrutinize, villainize, and ostracize folks who join premades

Everyone I think agrees that it's best to limit premades to 4. Limit groups to 4 for PvP and that will make a pretty big difference. If there were more people queing and the player population was larger with more pops in general people would complain less because you would run into solo players more often. 

[TrixxieTriss]

On 6/4/2024 at 4:35 AM, MercMara said:

I agree. Especially if you are a paying subscriber. Bioware isn't fulfilling their end of the deal. 

Which is why so many of us have unsubscribed. No point paying for something that doesn’t offer any value.

[SentinalMasterWW]

On 6/3/2024 at 7:09 PM, MercMara said:

You're right, no need to me to get snippy. 

 

As I see it, the core problems are unbalanced classes/specs and player skill level. 

 

Unbalanced classes:

 

Madness Sorcerer - The self healing is too strong as well as the damage reduction and force speed being up too frequent. I very good Madness Sorc won't lose 1v1 to too many specs. The spec is too loaded with passive defensives and healing. 

 

Advanced Prototype Powertech - The burst is insane. The Auto crit specifically needs to be removed. That would solve most problems with AP PT. Self heals, extra damage reduction, 35% defensive chance, a pull, leap and Hydro overrides... The spec is too over powered. 

 

Rage Jug - The burst needs to match that of a Fury Mara, currently Rage is able to do 100k+ in one raging burst. Let alone the tactical that resets the CD on rages 2nd biggest hit. The 10 meter leap needs to be cut down as well. 

 

Sniper Eng/Virulence - Both specs burst is stupid, especially Eng. Being able to do almost 200k in one shot is ludicrous. Same for Virulence, if they give Virulence, Madness, Lethality a DoT collapse they need to do the same for Annihilation Mara. 

 

Player skill level - Vast majority of players have no interest in learning how to actually use all their skills and abilities. They treat SWTOR like COD, and just jump on and play objectives. So when you do solo queue and you're up against a premade some if not all of your team doesn't know how to DPS, stay alive and so on. 

 

Premades - I think what would solve the problems with premades is limiting them to 4 players again. As well is only allowing say, one AP PT not two AP PTs with tank/heals.  

I think the issue lies in that DPS is wayy too high, Healers cannot keep up at all with the absurd amount of DPS, and that Tanks are nigh unkillable (Skank tanks are literally broken OP), and Guard is absurdly broken. 

This is not even bringing up something like second wind implant..

[supertimtaf]

On 6/3/2024 at 8:21 PM, Samcuu said:

meanwhile class changes haven't happened for going on two years in swtor it's legit negligence and unacceptable on so many levels. 

At this point I'm starting to believe that the person charged with class balance didn't move to Broadsword. That would actually explain a lot.
However, the fact that they're not communicating about it *or* hiring someone else is even more worrying.

But I also remember that the 5.0 meta lasted for more than two years, so did the 6.0 one... Idk who to ping on the dev team for an answer about that but I'd actually like to know what is their opinion on "class meta" and the likes.

 

1 hour ago, AocaVII said:

PvP makes like 10k per year 

Cartel market makes 10 million 

Only because they let it fester and die. Saying "the cash shop is more profitable", while true, doesn't prevent the fact that it's profitable *because* they sucked at making the rest of the game decent.

[TrixxieTriss]

20 hours ago, AocaVII said:

PvP makes like 10k per year 

Cartel market makes 10 million 

What u think that type of game gonna look like?

The same people who sub for PvP also pay for stuff on the cartel market. Looking after ALL players like pvpers is in Broadswords best interest. 

[supertimtaf]

1 hour ago, TrixxieTriss said:

The same people who sub for PvP also pay for stuff on the cartel market. Looking after ALL players like pvpers is in Broadswords best interest. 

This.
The number of PvP players at the time who had either primeval stalker, satele shan, dark andeddu or ajunta pall set pieces on their glam was absurd. Now it's more varied because there are some more good sets. And I don't think that PvP is known for the massive amounts of credits it gives. So my guess is most likely that they had to buy cosmetics at some point. Along with the infamous 15€ black dyes.

[WaffleQwop]

4 hours ago, TrixxieTriss said:

The same people who sub for PvP also pay for stuff on the cartel market. Looking after ALL players like pvpers is in Broadswords best interest. 

This 100%. Not sure if Broadsword fails to realize it or not but if they showed some love and attention to PvP, it would bring back old players and drum up interest for new players in PvP. PvP players absolutely spend on the cartel market, and if PvP continues on this negative spiral downwards, they will continue to lose subs as they have for quite a while now.

[RaithHarth]

What they need to do is separate Regs from Premades, in regs you should be able only to solo queue in a different warzone than those that queue as premades.

The current state of pvp is like being forced to play ranked, which I hated with a passion.

[septru]

7 minutes ago, RaithHarth said:

The current state of pvp is like being forced to play ranked

... except for the fact that ... it's not. 

Edited July 1 by septru

[WaffleQwop]

15 hours ago, RaithHarth said:

What they need to do is separate Regs from Premades, in regs you should be able only to solo queue in a different warzone than those that queue as premades.

The current state of pvp is like being forced to play ranked, which I hated with a passion.

First of all, that will never ever happen. Second of all, it's not a very good idea to make separate queues since the population for some servers is rather low, and splitting up the queues would only make wait times higher between matches. Yeah, premades are an issue but even as a Solo Q'er I run into premades less than half of the time. And rarely do I run into a full 8man but it does happen. The simplest and quickest thing Broadsword could do is limit premades to 4.

[RikuvonDrake]

just find some friends and play with them = problem solved

this is a mmo, group content in this game is meant to be played in a group with friends

[varietasplus]

The problem is not 4-men premades. The real source of the problems is number farmer players abusing a terrible meta.

First step, remove scoreboard from the end and voilá, these players will be gone. They won't come to solo quere arena, they never do, they don't like challenge.

As for better class balance or matchmaking, we all know that is not going to happen. I still remember thouhgh patch 7.0 ability prunning was explained as an easier base to adjust classes with each upcoming 7.x patch. The rest is history ...

[Bullyabass]

solo-only q and "open" q 

if you want to premade or don't mind playing against premades then q in open 

if you don't want to face premades then q in solo only

also a pvp ignore so you can put the toxic players on ignore. theres no ranked any more so no reason not to give players the tools to manage their own community

[Exly]

On 7/1/2024 at 12:21 AM, RaithHarth said:

What they need to do is separate Regs from Premades, in regs you should be able only to solo queue in a different warzone than those that queue as premades.

The current state of pvp is like being forced to play ranked, which I hated with a passion.

I agree that you can't really avoid premades if you pvp as a solo player.  In my experience though, you can avoid them if you stop.

I stopped pvping about 8 months ago and haven't had to queue with premades ever since.  I do miss pvp, but I'd rather not play it than join a mixed solo/premade queue.

The devs have obviously decided that they would rather see people like me to stop pvping.  I just wonder how many people have decided to stop playing the game altogether because of their decision to remain silent and stubbornly do nothing to address the issue. 

[Crazykidddd]

Limit prems to 4 and balance some classes, reintroduce both 4s and 8s ranked queues as a separate queue in which you can only q with your toon's original combat style and min 336 IR.
There's some obvious changes needed to be made, the rest is just luxury.
However none of this matters as long as they neglect to fix their engine.

Edited July 9 by Crazykidddd

[GheisMatthrell]

if they actually add more pvp content then just obj based matches. it could help in general. also what could help for players crying about premades, get some friends to pvp with you. ggs