The fact that I had to pay 2.5m for trading 10 adrenals and 10 medpacks to my raidmate is just wrong. You need to revert this.

[RealDarkness]

I was so frustrated that I had to pay that amount to share some consumables with my raidmate. This change makes no sense. This again destroys players as myself that do not play the market every day. I have to basically do a day of dailies to be able to compensate for the trade tax. And I am not going to start asking credits for a friendly trade. There is no game that has this implemented and it makes no sense.

[klizilii]

Agreed, especially considering this quote from Joe Stramaglia on the topic:

Quote

An additional aspect that we’re going to adjust here is removing item trade/mail tax for some gameplay focused items such as Medpacs, Grenades, and so on.

edit: if you share a guild with your raidmate, give the items via guild bank as this is what the developers want the guild bank to assist with.

Edited June 14, 2023 by klizilii

[JackieKo]

Moving this over to the bug report sub-forums as this is not working as intended. The team will be looking into a fix for it. 

[VegaMist]

9 minutes ago, klizilii said:

if you share a guild with your raidmate, give the items via guild bank as this is what the developers want the guild bank to assist with.

For this to work, they'd have to be next to the guild bank. I'd imagine exchanges like OP mentioned happen mostly either during rades or in the areas right before it.

[codydmaan]

Plus they'd have to be in g for 30 days 

 

Most people move guilds back and forth 

[SteveTheCynic]

46 minutes ago, codydmaan said:

Most people move guilds back and forth 

Do you have some sort of evidence for this remarkable assertion?

[blakkwiddow]

37 minutes ago, SteveTheCynic said:

Do you have some sort of evidence for this remarkable assertion?

There are some people that have toons in multiple guilds, or that just tend to flop around a lot because a guild that they joined promised things and didn't deliver, so yeah, there are some people who swap guilds like undies.

[Dekibra]

8 minutes ago, blakkwiddow said:

There are some people that have toons in multiple guilds, or that just tend to flop around a lot because a guild that they joined promised things and didn't deliver, so yeah, there are some people who swap guilds like undies.

Yet some is not most

[blakkwiddow]

7 minutes ago, Dekibra said:

Yet some is not most

No some is not most. That doesn't change that "some" is a large enough number to cause more than enough annoyance community wide,

[SteveTheCynic]

7 minutes ago, blakkwiddow said:

No some is not most. That doesn't change that "some" is a large enough number to cause more than enough annoyance community wide,

As noted, "some" is not the same thing as "most", and I was objecting to the "most" part rather than the guildhopping part.  (Various changes over the years have been clearly intended to reduce the amount of guildhopping, whether it's voluntary or not, which is a big part of why I contested the "most" aspect.)

[TheFiveOhFirst]

Guild hopping shouldn't be punished. Our guild officer move characters around frequently. We maintain 6 regular guilds for our community. We have a guild we use for holding giveaway items and prizes.

30 Days is atrocious and the taxes are all over the board and just out of line.

[LJ_Gibbs]

Why do I feel like this was intentional and they were hoping no one would notice (or care).

[Trance-Gemini]

4 hours ago, blakkwiddow said:

There are some people that have toons in multiple guilds, or that just tend to flop around a lot because a guild that they joined promised things and didn't deliver, so yeah, there are some people who swap guilds like undies.

As a recruiter in my guild, I do see that quite often. But mostly people that hop in and first check the guild bank and then dip when they can't take anything.

[DIVAvonFarstar]

5 hours ago, LJ_Gibbs said:

Why do I feel like this was intentional and they were hoping no one would notice (or care).

😁... that begs the question of why the patch notes mentioning it aren't being read

[Darthjantom]

20 hours ago, JackieKo said:

Moving this over to the bug report sub-forums as this is not working as intended. The team will be looking into a fix for it. 

@JackieKo Some of the fees are just outrigth ridiculous. We do giveaways in the guild of a bunch of random stuff we have in our guild banks, and now the system wants us to pay 28 MILLION CREDITS for a crappy silver Yellow Gold Indestructible Color Crystal!

28 MILLION! Like WTF! And the big joke is the crystal is for sale on gtn for just 3 to 3.5 million! That is rediculous! 28 million, damn...

Mail Fee Screenshot: https://i.imgur.com/wJNergY.png

Current Listings On GTN: https://i.imgur.com/ahQfFy1.png

Why is the trade fee for this specific item set to match the highest listings on the GTN?

My guild isn't big, and we survive on generous donations from guild members only in regards to guild credits in the guild bank. With insane fees like this it's going to bankrupt my guild in no time, essentially making it not worth it to do giveaways of any kind for our guildmembers.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Darthjantom

[ceryxp]

6 minutes ago, Darthjantom said:

@JackieKo Some of the fees are just outrigth ridiculous. We do giveaways in the guild of a bunch of random stuff we have in our guild banks, and now the system wants us to pay 28 MILLION CREDITS for a crappy silver Yellow Gold Indestructible Color Crystal!

28 MILLION! Like WTF! And the big joke is the crystal is for sale on gtn for just 3 to 3.5 million! That is rediculous! 28 million, damn...

Mail Fee Screenshot: https://i.imgur.com/wJNergY.png

Current Listings On GTN: https://i.imgur.com/ahQfFy1.png

My guild isn't big, and we survive on generous donations from guild members only in regards to guild credits in the guild bank. With insane fees like this it's going to bankrupt my guild in no time, essentially making it not worth it to do giveaways of any kind for our guildmembers.

This whole system is utterly mental.  They were warned about these consequences, just like they were warned about the consequences of the quick travel tax, and they simply do not care.

These trade taxes have made it nearly impossible for me to trade things from my preferred account to my main account.  So, what I did instead was list the item on the GTN for 1 credit buyout.  I queued up the search on my other account (I have two computers and dual-box) so that the moment I listed on one I could refresh the search on the other and buy it right away.  Annoying to have to wait an hour, but with these changes this is the only way I can move things between my accounts.

[Char_Ell]

42 minutes ago, ceryxp said:

These trade taxes have made it nearly impossible for me to trade things from my preferred account to my main account.  So, what I did instead was list the item on the GTN for 1 credit buyout.  I queued up the search on my other account (I have two computers and dual-box) so that the moment I listed on one I could refresh the search on the other and buy it right away.  Annoying to have to wait an hour, but with these changes this is the only way I can move things between my accounts.

With respect, my guess is this is an edge use case that BioWare may have accounted for but still decided they needed to move forward with.  I'm sure you understand that SWTOR does not have a mechanism to link accounts.  The game has no way to tell your preferred account is for the same person as your premium account.  It just knows that it needs to apply the 8% tax to in-game mail attachments if the recipient is not on the same account as the sender.

EDIT:  That being said, I wanted BioWare to only tax credit transactions, not transactions where no credits were being transferred.  For a reason that I don't believe they communicated, BioWare decided non-credit transactions needed to be taxed as well.  And unfortunately this new functionality is not working as intended and creating a lot of angst.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Char_Ell
additional commentary

[ceryxp]

3 minutes ago, Char_Ell said:

With respect, my guess is this is an edge use case that BioWare may have accounted for but still decided they needed to move forward with.  I'm sure you understand that SWTOR does not have a mechanism to link accounts.  The game has no way to tell your preferred account is for the same person as your premium account.  It just knows that it needs to apply the 8% tax to in-game mail attachments if the recipient is not on the same account as the sender.

With respect, bollocks.  Mine is not an edge case.  This was discussed at length when on PTS, how these changes would affect give-aways, charity, trading between friends, etc., and BW did not care.  If there are no credits involved then there should be no tax whatsoever.  Credit transactions being taxed would still have some unfortunate impacts, but would be less so than this abomination.  Merely making the mail and trade tax 10 or 12% would encourage people to lower prices and sell on the GTN.

[Char_Ell]

7 minutes ago, ceryxp said:

With respect, bollocks.  Mine is not an edge case.  This was discussed at length when on PTS, how these changes would affect give-aways, charity, trading between friends, etc., and BW did not care.  If there are no credits involved then there should be no tax whatsoever.

Agreed.  I failed to mention that I thought taxing character-to-character trades and in-game mail attachments where no credits were being exchanged to other players was going too far and did not seem to be in alignment with Eric Musco's stated objective for the credit economy.  But they decided too move forward with this change anyway.

On 2/10/2023 at 1:11 PM, EricMusco said:

It is very important that we make these changes slowly and that we monitor their impacts closely.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Char_Ell
added important condition about no-credit transactions

[Aaesith]

I believe this change was made to avoid the situation when credits stop being the trade currency between players and get replaced buy other items with a somewhat constant value, such as Ultimate Boxes or Hypercrates (much like how some items are traded now for other reasons, such as bypassing the character credit cap) in order to avoid that 8% or whatever tax.

This in itself is somewhat complementary to their other measures because in order for the tax to have any effect, trades in credits need to actually happen between players.

The tax by itself further incentivizes players to employ alternative trade mediums.

 

Just to clarify, in no way do i believe that taxing non-credit trades between players is actually a good idea as it has a far more detrimental effect in my opinion to player experience than the marginal benefit it might have for reducing credits inflation.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Aaesith
Added clarification.

[LJ_Gibbs]

10 hours ago, ceryxp said:

With respect, bollocks.  Mine is not an edge case.  This was discussed at length when on PTS, how these changes would affect give-aways, charity, trading between friends, etc., and BW did not care.  If there are no credits involved then there should be no tax whatsoever.  Credit transactions being taxed would still have some unfortunate impacts, but would be less so than this abomination.  Merely making the mail and trade tax 10 or 12% would encourage people to lower prices and sell on the GTN.

They have NEVER listed to PTS feedback... why start now?

[ceryxp]

1 hour ago, LJ_Gibbs said:

They have NEVER listed to PTS feedback... why start now?

Which is why I am done.  I need two more weeks to finish off GS on the three Euro servers (already done on the NA servers).  After that I am dropping my subs until Broadsword takes over, at which point I will reevaluate whether I wish to continue to financially support this game.  I have been increasingly displeased with the direction of the game.  6.0 was nearly it for me, I did cancel after 7.0 but came back after BW added gear mods, but it is time I stop hoping for better from this company.  They will not change.  They will not do better.  And I am done.

[Xatoo]

Will the credit issues be addressed anytime soon? Taxation/Trades...going to a bug report is like dropping the subject into a hole. Can the community get a viable response from the developer team on fix and a timeframe? 

[Nee-Elder]

3 hours ago, Xatoo said:

Will the credit issues be addressed anytime soon? Taxation/Trades...going to a bug report is like dropping the subject into a hole.

Can the community get a viable response from the developer team on fix and a timeframe? 

Everyone knows that Dev Teams don't give out ETA's ( except for *soon* )  but BioWare has already given a "viable" response here a few posts up in this very same thread you just posted in--> https://forums.swtor.com/topic/929958-the-fact-that-i-had-to-pay-25m-for-trading-10-adrenals-and-10-medpacks-to-my-raidmate-is-just-wrong-you-need-to-revert-this/?do=findComment&comment=9764812

Otherwise, today is sunday ( non business-day ) , so it looks like you're stuck in the same um "hole"  as this subject until later this week when BioWare is back at-work to hotfix it.

*My guess is tuesday or thursday

Edited June 19, 2023 by Nee-Elder

[DawnAskham]

On 6/15/2023 at 7:47 AM, Char_Ell said:

With respect, my guess is this is an edge use case that BioWare may have accounted for but still decided they needed to move forward with.  I'm sure you understand that SWTOR does not have a mechanism to link accounts.  The game has no way to tell your preferred account is for the same person as your premium account.  It just knows that it needs to apply the 8% tax to in-game mail attachments if the recipient is not on the same account as the sender.

EDIT:  That being said, I wanted BioWare to only tax credit transactions, not transactions where no credits were being transferred.  For a reason that I don't believe they communicated, BioWare decided non-credit transactions needed to be taxed as well.  And unfortunately this new functionality is not working as intended and creating a lot of angst.

LMFAO

They didn't put any thought into the system's impact on players, community, or social aspects - they just decided as usual to do whatever the hell they wanted to do, players be damned, regardless of feedback on the stated changes or testing done on the PTS.

And of course one of those impacts is that WHEN (not if) items are assigned incorrect values in their tables or WHEN (not if) items are miscategorized (e.g. taxable / non-taxable), we'll all have to wait weeks to months to some unknown timeframe before they correct their mistakes with a patch.

Edited June 19, 2023 by DawnAskham