AlexRose Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 (edited) Grandma won't be able to tell you there's a problem, but any actual gamer will. Grandmas are paying customers too . The time and player base will tell if this issue is worth fixing. But tbh I have a feeling that this problem is not so easy to solve. If the game code is designed in a certain way it cant be changed over night with a simple patch. Edited December 30, 2011 by AlexRose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcore Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 (edited) Grandmas are paying customers too . The time and player base will tell if this issue is worth fixing. But tbh I have a feeling that this problem is not so easy to solve. If the game code is designed in a certain way it cant be changed over night with a simple patch. Definitely not easy to fix. However, definitely the reason for WoW's success and failure of every other MMO with the exception of EvE Online as that is a whole different story. Edited December 30, 2011 by Xcore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicmanNC Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 As others have said, this in no way will make or break SWTOR. I have no problem not being able to smack something with my lightsaber when it's still in midair, regardless of what the GCD says. I don't even know if that is still the issue, as you couldn't pay me to read through that second thread. I'm sorry I wasted my time in the first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoranX Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 As others have said, this in no way will make or break SWTOR. I have no problem not being able to smack something with my lightsaber when it's still in midair, regardless of what the GCD says. I don't even know if that is still the issue, as you couldn't pay me to read through that second thread. I'm sorry I wasted my time in the first. I guess you were not the brilliant one in class, huh? *facepalm* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexRose Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 As others have said, this in no way will make or break SWTOR. I have no problem not being able to smack something with my lightsaber when it's still in midair, regardless of what the GCD says. I don't even know if that is still the issue, as you couldn't pay me to read through that second thread. I'm sorry I wasted my time in the first. It may or it may not. for now just leave out this speculation. The only thing that you must acknowledge is that the problem exists - BW knows it and a lot of players who are posting in this giant thread. .. and I am sorry too that you wasted your time in the first thread but: I think you are in a recursive loop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcore Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 As others have said, this in no way will make or break SWTOR. I have no problem not being able to smack something with my lightsaber when it's still in midair, regardless of what the GCD says. I don't even know if that is still the issue, as you couldn't pay me to read through that second thread. I'm sorry I wasted my time in the first. I can't believe some of you people, I thought this thread, these posts are clear and defining. I thought that its demonstrable evidence and that just about everyone under the sun could finally see and even recreate these issues for themselves. At this point it has got to be, you being blinded by your "Love for SW:TOR or Bioware" or "Hatred for WoW and Blizzard" that has you missing the entire subject. OR You simply are not able to perceive the issue due to your slower and more methodical playstyle. Your reaction time may be too slow... Perhaps its some mixture of the two, but please understand: Just because you are unable to see, perceive or recognize this issue... IT STILL IS THERE.. Staring you blankly in the face every time you're in the game. Whether you want or can see it or not is a different topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taeccool Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 As others have said, this in no way will make or break SWTOR. I have no problem not being able to smack something with my lightsaber when it's still in midair, regardless of what the GCD says. I don't even know if that is still the issue, as you couldn't pay me to read through that second thread. I'm sorry I wasted my time in the first. Whether it'll make or break the game is up for debate, but that doesn't change the fact that it's a major issue and can cost thousands of subscribers if not addressed properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TipsyDrow Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 /signed again for the third incarnation. Last night was by far the worst when it comes to delays after tapping keys. I have posted on the previous threads but not really in a complaining manner. This is a complaint. Last night play was horrendous. Force kick simply would not go off at all unless I was standing still and previous animation had ended 5 seconds ago. Riposte...*shakes head sadly* Sometimes would simply cut off previous animation and end the damage from previous ability but do nothing on it's own. Sweep after force jump.....might happen, might not. Taunt? Do make me taunt you a second time, silly english kinigits!! ...or a third, orr ..wait nvm it's not working. Something going on behind the scenes at this point? I mean seriously it wasn't quite this bad before. It was bad enough to post support for this thread but, not this bad. an yes before anyone asks, I was sober!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Choomba Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Back up you go Mr Topic ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcore Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 Whether it'll make or break the game is up for debate, but that doesn't change the fact that it's a major issue and can cost thousands of subscribers if not addressed properly. What is not up for the debate is the fact that it will seriously hinder and impeded it meeting its fullest potentials and possibly exceeding it. Also, re-created threads should keep their full Star Votings... its sad that we had almost 200 People Voting and 5 Starring it and now some people with a lack of understanding can downvote it, potentially scaring away newcomers to this thread discussion. /Upvoted.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miltana Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Everyone talk aboit Bioware and SWTOR. What if this problem can't be fix by Bioware beacuse the problem is not in SWTOR and instead in Simutronics Corporation's HeroEngine. Remember that Bioware did not developed the game engine for this game, instead they used HeroEngine. Has anyone played with another game based on HeroEngine and saw the same problem in those games ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TipsyDrow Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 I can't believe some of you people, I thought this thread, these posts are clear and defining. I thought that its demonstrable evidence and that just about everyone under the sun could finally see and even recreate these issues for themselves. At this point it has got to be, you being blinded by your "Love for SW:TOR or Bioware" or "Hatred for WoW and Blizzard" that has you missing the entire subject. OR You simply are not able to perceive the issue due to your slower and more methodical playstyle. Your reaction time may be too slow... Perhaps its some mixture of the two, but please understand: Just because you are unable to see, perceive or recognize this issue... IT STILL IS THERE.. Staring you blankly in the face every time you're in the game. Whether you want or can see it or not is a different topic. Xcore, those folks are simply not even worth your time anymore my friend. We have a response from devs saying they are indeed looking into it seriously and they know it's an issue or rather several issues, yet we still have knuckleheads who are self delusional. Pffft don't waste your energy trying to make them understand any longer. You have done more then your part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiyow Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Have it with my Sith Assassin. When i go through my melee ability's and do a Shock or Discharge i just stand there doing nothing for 0.5/1 second because i am waiting for other ability's to come back up. That doesn't look like much but it doesn't make the combat as fluid like World of Warcraft does so well. If this gets fixed in 1 way or another this game will grow, i can guarantee that. For the rest the game is simply awesome, i am really enjoying it even because of the ability delay. Keep it up and i hope we see it fixed 1 day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olarid Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Worth my upvote, thanks for looking into this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlescuba Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 I must disagree, in WoW classic, the combat system worked the same way, GCD was correctly showed, and the exact time it was ended you could fire a new ability and it was instantly fired upon the target, unless you had latency high, wich is logical, but it isnt something "WoW has developed in 7 years" as other people try to argument Your wrong though the combat in wow was messed up for about 6 months. They work on the net code alot apparently in those months if some people didn't even notice it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowMasterRP Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Buffs, the most instant of instant abilities ever, are also subject to the problem. I've been casting Blade Ward and not having it cast in the midst of combat all the time. That's especially fun when you think you've cast it and can take on a tough elite NPC only to realize after dying that it never actually got executed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dumpiduke Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 From my perspective, it seems that there are two MAIN issues: Instant casts are not truly instant. Name one instant skill in WoW that doesn’t go off right when you push the button? That’s right, there isn’t a single one. You push the button, you see a number. The same can’t be said for TOR as evidenced in a number of the videos posted. Some instants have longer animations than others, which means there is a slight delay between when you push the button and when you see the number on the screen. So what’s the solution? Does the community want more stylized combat at the cost of fluidity? Hell no! Shorten all of the instant animations and show the damage or healing done at the precise time that you hit the button, not when the animation strikes the target. The second issue, as evidenced by the mount and healing videos, is that there is no “grace period” between the finishing of the cast (1.5 sec cast for instance) and avatar movement. We need this grace period—the animation should continue on while you begin to move like in the WoW healing video. When that 1.5 sec cast says that it’s done, we NEED to be able to get mobile without having to worry about our spell or mount being interrupted. It’s valuable time wasted and as little as .3 seconds can mean the matter of life in death in a PvP or PvE scenario. Seriously Bioware, watch WoW’s combat and copy it, it’s that easy! I guarantee you that subscribers will cling to this game if that is accomplished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larlar Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 (edited) The main issue that we all must accept is that almost everyone is coming to this game from WOW. The success of WOW has almost dictated that this is the case - its just the reality. And if you don't get the responsiveness to match up with WOW, the game just feels bad. This can be glossed over for a few weeks as the levelling process and the new world and professions provide the incentive to play, but once all of that ends, the glaring faults in the responsiveness and combat come to the fore. The game needs to be a pleasure to play in of itself. New content, fun sidegames, brilliant raid bosses matter not a jot if the fundamental mechanics of the game can't match WOW, because everyone will think "this just doesn't feel as good as wow". I honestly believe I will never subscribe to any MMO that can't match or better WOW in this way. Its just too important. I just can't enjoy a dungeon or a BG(Warzone) if I don't feel the smoothness of my character - if I don't enjoy the combat in its own right. This just has to be the difference between WOW and the challengers. All of the other games have better graphics, equally as good content, interesting and different questing systems, new ideas (holocrons, space battles in this case etc) and similar incentives schemes to play (new gear etc) - yet WOW remains the MMO behemoth and all challengers fall. The common theme is the feel of the character and responsiveness. They all get this wrong and its always the first thing I notice. WOW is a pleasure to play even without the typical incentive scheme that MMOs rely on. I will play a WOW battleground even to this day, with no rewards on offer, just because it is fun just playing the game - and I've been playing WOW for seven years. To rival WOW you just have to match them in this regard. Edited December 30, 2011 by Larlar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampagio Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Its not even only the responsiveness, for me the character often will do the initial movement of the ability and then start the ability over again. like for regular swings on jedi sentinel the char will do one swing then restart animation and do the regular three swings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubbersharkk Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Quote: from Xcore If you are a WoW player, and have played WoW with any amount of skill, competitiveness, you cannot help but cringe when in a Warzone in SW:TOR. It feels unresponsive, frustrating... as if something is wrong with you! but there is nothing you can do about it! This is how i feel :[ Rated/ subbed In for changes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starcus Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 This ties in with another major game flaw of class imbalance... It's unfair that a Smuggler's 'instant' kick attack takes 0.5 seconds to perform yet the horde (empire oops) equivalent is literally instant based solely on the animations. Healing on my scoundrel is beyond frustrating when I'm used to the fluidness of my holy priest. The problem really pains me because this could be a near perfect mmo if the delay and class imbalance were sorted. No one who has played an MMO before is going to take such an imbalanced game seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Proto Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 I wasn't really happy with their official response to this issue. It was just "we're workin on it". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khoranth Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 (edited) I would really like an answer as to why they are just now adressing this problem. Why are they only coming and responding now, after the game is released and people are in a frenzy over unresponsive controls? Why, when in Beta the testers constantly brought unresponsive controls to their attention, and the testers begged them to fix this issue, before release, why didn't they adress this problem before release? This is really upsetting. I feel really bad for all the people at bioware who are going to get the 'mythic treatment' soon if this is not fixed extraodinarily fast, because people will quit over this, eventually. I feel bad for all the bioware employees who will get fired in the parking lot, or through emails and text messages, then undoubtably have all the blame shoved onto them by EA. Edited December 30, 2011 by Khoranth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thelzan Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Nothing to say that hasn't really been said already. I will only add my generic response that this issue is priority number one on my list and not having it fixed will be detrimental to the games lifespan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaggyShow Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Repeating myself from the previous thread. To Bioware: This issue should be your number 1 priority unless the gamecode makes certain hardware melt down. Also money or manpower should not be made an issue to fix this. The waiting time to login, chat bugs, graphics bugs, loot bugs, quest line bugs, title bugs or maintanence times or any of the other complaints that i have seen on the forums will be forgotten and forgiven once you fixed them down the road (it took blizzard like 2 years to fix the loot bug? Nobody seems to remember... Just to name something). But if this responsiveness issue is not fixed or atleast reduced, there will not be a "down the road" where u can fix these bugs simply because people refuse to play this game. To a point where the game becomes a excellent RPG with a very nice co-op mode. But that will not be enough to keep people subscribed for longer then 2 or three months at most. Simply because real competative play (Guild PVE progress, player vs player) is not possible. But competative play is for many one of the biggest if not the biggest reason to play any game online. Fix this and: players will stick around, new players keep commin. The company can keep patching and adding stuff or improving it while making tons of money. And in 5 years people start to leave for a new MMO just to end up comparing it to SWTOR and tellin that other developer how much better SWTOR was and never had a single bug or problem. I call that a win win situation for developer publisher and gamer. Go Bioware! Keep giving me the good stuff like you did in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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