Serious question about crafting in 6.0

[juliushorst]

And you stilll don't get the point. If you can craft everything easily there is no point of playing anything,

 

Always thought the main reason to play a game is to have fun

[TheCardinal]

I'm set for life, believe I don't need more money, have billions. And you stilll don't get the point. If you can craft everything easily there is no point of playing anything, then remove the gear all together. So there is no way they are going to let you have it. Harder content will and should pay more.

 

I think you are missing the point.

 

What difference does it make if we can craft the best armour shells, Armour, Enh, Mods ?.

The short answer is NONE. The only thing that changes is that more can take part in harder content.

 

There is NO reason what so ever to gate items for the high end items in this case behind NiM or Ops in general.

 

And IF you have all that money you say you do, that only proves ONE point, that to gate high end mats is wrong.

Since that exclude most of the player base and make a few very rich.

 

Not all have countless hours to spend playing, and some stated here, to craft and to get all that's needed takes ALOT more effort then to run a NiM once a week.

Yet we get nothing for it. now how is that fair for you....

[TrixxieTriss]

Always thought the main reason to play a game is to have fun

 

I’m sure that’s what most of us think. Not sure about these people who want gaming to be a second job

[Joonbeams]

What are you even saying? If the crafters would be able to craft BiS without gated mats, for a cheap, not bound etc, why would people play ranked pvp or ops or anything. Just go buy from gtn or craft bis on one day, done. And that goes against being social.

Everyone has a way to acquire BiS gear, you want be only crafter? Good, craft, get cq and cxp => galactic crates = gear.

Chuck points => gear.

 

Basically you are getting gear by botting and doing dailes and you are still complaining.

 

All the cry I heard so far is for ' I'm not gonna be able to make easy money if I can't craft bis '. As the song says, cry me a river 🤷*♂️

 

You can gate crafting in other ways. In the earlier game, it was gated by time/resources. Time, in that it took hours of RNG RE'ing to get the best schematics. I was one who got every schematic and all levels, for all skills -- and then crafted every purple in the game and sold them on GTN. It was a full-time job. Resources, in that the rare, purple mats used to come from running and critting high level crafting missions. This also was time-consuming (and costly).Gating the mats behind hardest content actually undermines crafting as a gameplay alternative and defeats the purpose (it really just adds in a pointless side activity: play for the mat for the item you want to craft, then craft the item you want to play for:confused:)

 

The players focused on these crafing (done right) will not be able to focus on end-game, hardcore content -- or practically any time-consuming content. It's nearly a full time job - when I did this (and made a truckload), I didn't have time to do anything else, and I enjoyed every second of it!

 

Now if the hardcore player wants to get my rare, top-tier, crafted item they will have to earn by playing or pay major credits for it. Either is net beneficial to the game. But crafting it themselves isn't an option. That's why it all works....

[DarthSpuds]

What are you even saying? If the crafters would be able to craft BiS without gated mats, for a cheap, not bound etc, why would people play ranked pvp or ops or anything.

 

Because they enjoy it?

 

All The Best

[Sareeph]

You can gate crafting in other ways. In the earlier game, it was gated by time/resources. Time, in that it took hours of RNG RE'ing to get the best schematics. I was one who got every schematic and all levels, for all skills -- and then crafted every purple in the game and sold them on GTN. It was a full-time job. Resources, in that the rare, purple mats used to come from running and critting high level crafting missions. This also was time-consuming (and costly).Gating the mats behind hardest content actually undermines crafting as a gameplay alternative and defeats the purpose (it really just adds in a pointless side activity: play for the mat for the item you want to craft, then craft the item you want to play for:confused:)

 

The players focused on these crafing (done right) will not be able to focus on end-game, hardcore content -- or practically any time-consuming content. It's nearly a full time job - when I did this (and made a truckload), I didn't have time to do anything else, and I enjoyed every second of it!

 

Now if the hardcore player wants to get my rare, top-tier, crafted item they will have to earn by playing or pay major credits for it. Either is net beneficial to the game. But crafting it themselves isn't an option. That's why it all works....

 

You are over dramatizing things here. I also have every one of those earlier patterns and also had time to raid. Crafting and doing other things in the game should not be exclusive of each other as you suggest and seem to want. You wish to craft only then have at it, but do not try to convince everyone that to make crafting viable that no one but a full time dedicated crafter should be able to craft high end gear. You are not suggesting play our way but rather play "your" way.

[HoloTweed]

It's really clear that you have never raided before, have 0 clue to do what it takes to be NiM raider. You want to simple answer? Cause its unfair. People in this game has 50 character, if you had your way, with a simple mouse macro, (not even a script) I can make my main BiS in one night, and maybe even shorter depending on required number of mats. . The game has 0 macro detection system implemented, and is not possible to implement a good one without this engine.that's why all the crafting rewards are gone now, same as the pve space Missons. Now you want a BiS, moddable gear. Sorry but no, it's not going to happen. Crafting should be remove all together cause this bots breaking econom.

 

Like seriously what are you doing with BiS gear? If you identify yourself as crafter at max what you are doing is story fp's and some pvp? Bolsters got you so you don't need anything. You just want to sell and make billions doing it. Not going to happen

 

How is it "unfair"? You get BiS gear for doing what you enjoy, a crafter gets it for doing what they enjoy. It's not like it will take a small amount of mats to put it together (and they may end up selling it anyway). So how are you harmed?

 

And we can't make games to ward off outliers... most players can't or don't use macros, so we shouldn't gimp them because somebody COULD.

 

Crafting should be able to make BEST gear in game. Sadly, they won't be able to make empty shells... but they will be able to make BEST Relics, ear pieces, implants... as it should be. Crafters should be viable and be NECESSARY to have the best gear (through crafter-only created add-ons to gear). It's really just that simple. Looks like it's going to happen, so better brace for it now.

[Sarlegant]

Once upon a time, crafting was a necessary part of a good raiding guild. It was hand in hand, raiding and crafting, mains and alts.

 

Now we live in this world, where raiders just want to log in 15 minutes before raid time, to get their “exclusive” BIS gear.

 

There’s some real confusion between what a dedicated raider is, or was.

[DarthSpuds]

How is it "unfair"? You get BiS gear for doing what you enjoy, a crafter gets it for doing what they enjoy. It's not like it will take a small amount of mats to put it together (and they may end up selling it anyway). So how are you harmed?

 

And we can't make games to ward off outliers... most players can't or don't use macros, so we shouldn't gimp them because somebody COULD.

 

Crafting should be able to make BEST gear in game. Sadly, they won't be able to make empty shells... but they will be able to make BEST Relics, ear pieces, implants... as it should be. Crafters should be viable and be NECESSARY to have the best gear (through crafter-only created add-ons to gear). It's really just that simple. Looks like it's going to happen, so better brace for it now.

 

ESO has (or did when last I played) Crafting Dailies, they award a token that, in various multiples, can be traded in for Recipes.

 

So why not have something like that in SWTOR?

 

Dailies that award "Crafting Component".

Weeklies that award "Superior Crafting Component".

 

Then have the Recipes for BiS Gear cost some multiple of each. By setting those values Bioware can effectively gate BiS Crafted Gear behind any period of time they want. But crucially it would give Crafters the route to gear that they have as much of an equal claim on as another type of player.

 

Anyone "Paying The Same In" deserves to "Get The Same Out".

 

I see no valid reason why Crafters should be denied the ability to make empty shells, to my mind that is just pandering to the faux elitism of those who reject Crafting as a valid path to gearing up.

 

Think about the definitive weapons of our own history. The English Longbow - how did archers obtain one? Killing enemy officers, or buying it from a Craftsman?

 

The Katana? Did Samurai kill trash-mobs to get one, or commission one from a Master Craftsman?

 

All The Best

[DarthSpuds]

Once upon a time, crafting was a necessary part of a good raiding guild. It was hand in hand, raiding and crafting, mains and alts.

 

Now we live in this world, where raiders just want to log in 15 minutes before raid time, to get their “exclusive” BIS gear.

 

There’s some real confusion between what a dedicated raider is, or was.

 

Exactly.

 

In my LOTRO days I was a Master Crafter for my Guild - had maxed out crafters in all professions, with all Rep Gated recipes unlocked. If I stopped Crafting then Raids stopped happening, because the Guild Crafters were 100% necessary to keep a Raid Team functioning and supplied.

 

All The Best

[TheCardinal]

Exactly.

 

In my LOTRO days I was a Master Crafter for my Guild - had maxed out crafters in all professions, with all Rep Gated recipes unlocked. If I stopped Crafting then Raids stopped happening, because the Guild Crafters were 100% necessary to keep a Raid Team functioning and supplied.

 

All The Best

 

Well, the same was is Star Wars Galaxies long ago.

That game was totaly crafted driven, Gear, food, Houses, Deco, all you could ever need came from a crafter.

Then in turn we crafters needed Scout for hides and meat, Combat char to get schematics and other rare items to made some parts, we needed to make factorys to guild items. We had decay for a part of the game what in it self meant that no one could ever buy something and that's it, since in the end it did break and you needed to replace it.

Again, crafters needed a combat toon to get some parts, IE, Armour, for that you needed different types of hides, for that you needed a combat char with scout skills to get it for you, so you made a deal with them to get you set amount.

 

That in turn let the crafter made the armour that the scout needed, so symbiosis

Same for chef, he/she needed meat, again, scout as a combat char, gets the meat, sells to the chef, chef makes food that you will need.

 

In SWG there was no one stop NPC vendor to get all you wanted, no Boss or instance were you could get all you wanted and be set for life, it was fully player driven and that DID work.

 

For anything to work we need each other. Crafters are here to support and to make as good as they can.

Combat char is here to get the best gear and be as good as they can.

 

In SWG for those that remember the DWB, or Death Watch Bunker

 

I remember one time then a fellow guilde wanted to craft a Jetpack.

I made him the best stormtrooper armour I could make, But he KNEW that after we done his armour that armour will be totaly junked, that armour did cost him a pritty penny, be he KNEW and he was fine with that.

Since DWB was the hardest content as a "bunker" goes in SWG.

The most funny thing was, you NEEDED a crafter with you down there to make the Jetpack, The combat chars ONLY goal was to keep the crafter ALIVE.

 

ALL knew that it would cost alot of deaths and money to protect the crafter and to make that Jetpack.

But we ALL knew that it was worth it, so in the end, the combat char, got all the looted parts for the Jetpack.

BUT in the end, a crafter was NEEDED to make it, and they needed to protect him doing it too.

 

ALL was fine with that, all knew what it was all about, and I never ever heard anyone complain. EVER.

WE all knew what our roll was, what was needed of us. I knew that I would likely die in here since as a crafter 1 hit and you are all but dead.

 

In the end, he got his Jetpack, I got to craft a few in my days, we all had a blast, and we all needed each other and we all had fun.

 

THIS is what it should be about, FUN, we work as a team, no one is better then the next one.

 

IF I wanted a Jetpack as a crafter, I HAD to pay someone to loot all the parts for it, then pay to have bodyguards to protect me, and I did, that's how you "pay" back to the community.

 

We all enjoyed it and it did work.

 

Added....

 

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/wiki/SWG_Guide_Brief_Guide_to_the_Death_Watch_Bunker_and_Jetpack_Crafting

 

This is how is should be OBS..... LONG read..... Enjoy

 

ADDED.....

24 min guide how to craft it. Again ALL about symbiosis

 

Thank you.

Edited June 4, 2019 by TheCardinal
Added link

[Noerra]

I also think crafting components should not be gated behind ops or such minority activity.

 

Crafting components should come equally from all content and on top of that rarests mats should come from crafting/gathering (something you gather or make that takes time or is hard to find).

 

It seems some ops players think that just because they run ops they should be offered everything else on gold plate as well. They don't need the crafting mats any more than other players and crafting is not needed to run trough the ops. It is different activity all together and should not be linked.

 

Time for ops players to try and dictate what other players should or should not have is gone. People do not want to play game which limits their opportunities just so one small group of players would feel superior enough.

 

I wish we get answer for OP question soon.

[Joonbeams]

You are over dramatizing things here. I also have every one of those earlier patterns and also had time to raid. Crafting and doing other things in the game should not be exclusive of each other as you suggest and seem to want. You wish to craft only then have at it, but do not try to convince everyone that to make crafting viable that no one but a full time dedicated crafter should be able to craft high end gear. You are not suggesting play our way but rather play "your" way.

 

I see where you're coming from. It's hard to read these posts in context because often times I'm responding to multiple things. So the earlier post of mine was responding to the question "why let crafters craft top-tier items, because if you do that, ppl won't raid, ranked, etc. -- they'll just quickly craft?" And my response to that was if you make crafting a separate, time-consuming process, then players (those w/out unlimited time) will really have to make a choice between choosing to craft or choosing to play the hardest content. The presumption being that players who enjoy Ops, ranked, etc. would rather do that than craft if it was a true either/or.

 

The post you're responding to above, follows my earlier response and addresses a point made by someone else that crafting mats should be gated behind the most challenging content. In responding to that (tied into my earlier response), the point here is that putting mats behind the hardest content collapses crafting down into a side activity for hardcore players, rather than a separately viable gameplay option (as it was in the past) for those who don't do those activities. Now, I do hold this view in general, and would be willing to flesh it out further later. But in this context, I'm still addressing the point of allowing crafters to craft top-tier items -- and how gating doesn't have to be limited to hardest content (it can be gated by time spent, for example). Does that make sense?

[OlBuzzard]

You completely miss the whole point of “playing the way you want” and crafting.

 

Some people just login to craft and play the GTN. They even acknowledged this in the stream. So for crafters to be able to play as they want, they will need a way to obtain those mats outside of operations and ranked pvp.

 

And no, crafters will not be able to make BiS gear. Bioware have already said that. So your argument that crafters feel entitled is flawed.

 

Ya know... Crafting is the one aspect of this game I've just never done. I was one of the best (in another game)... And LOVED it ! It seems like here in this one it's a bit ... well somewhat a confused mess ???

 

I thought about getting into it when I came back. The regular part of the game is a real grind right now. OK... sooo I work a bit longer to get there. BUT.. now wait. I've heard a lot of crafters doing a lot of comlaining about crafting. Trying to get mats for high end stuff . This seems to be true BEFORE 6.0

 

I really would like to try to craft again. But ONLY if it is really worth it. Not just for the sake of my own gear.. but for selling it on the GTN and getting other stuff that is for now just totally out of reach.

 

Besides I think crafting can actually add to the over all SWTOR experience if done correctly.

 

Trixxie: I think you are asking a good question. You're not the first to pose that kind of question in the last few months. I've read similar posts from others.

[JakRoanin]

It would be nice if all the schematics from launch to before 6.0 were available by your trainers. Also some of the really rare mats should be a little easier to get.

[OlBuzzard]

It would be nice if all the schematics from launch to before 6.0 were available by your trainers. Also some of the really rare mats should be a little easier to get.

 

Or at the very least dropped more frequently in those Chests we get every day !

[casirabit]

I'm set for life, believe I don't need more money, have billions. And you stilll don't get the point. If you can craft everything easily there is no point of playing anything, then remove the gear all together. So there is no way they are going to let you have it. Harder content will and should pay more.

 

I am going to guess you never played SWG then as crafting was something necessary for the game and the funny thing is no one threw a fit about the crafters crafting the good gear for those that did the raids/pvp or whatever they did. They learned how to work together for the good of the community.

[EricMusco]

Will we be able to get all crafting mats without having to do hard content?

 

Ie, will highend mats be gated behind OPs or Ranked pvp as they currently are.

 

Also, will Augments still be a thing or will they end up being obsolete for pvp.

 

The current plan is that high-end crafting will require materials that come from content, yes, but that material will come from most types of content and not just Ranked PvP and Ops.

 

Thanks!

 

-eric

[Joonbeams]

The current plan is that high-end crafting will require materials that come from content, yes, but that material will come from most types of content and not just Ranked PvP and Ops.

 

Thanks!

 

-eric

 

Great news! You guys are on a roll!

[Arstechnica]

The current plan is that high-end crafting will require materials that come from content, yes, but that material will come from most types of content and not just Ranked PvP and Ops.

 

Thanks!

 

-eric

 

Don’t mean to high jack the post, but consider adding Chef for a profession for a variety of buffs. I want to be SWTOR version of a sushi master chef.

[Rion_Starkiller]

Soooo you'll get the mats from Conquests and GR. Ya?

[SteveTheCynic]

Don’t mean to high jack the post, but consider adding Chef for a profession for a variety of buffs. I want to be SWTOR version of a sushi master chef.

It's called Biochemistry in SWTOR, although the range of buffs is a bit limited. Magic food (what most High and Low Fantasy MMORPGs have from Chef-type crafting(1)) doesn't seem appropriate in SWTOR.

 

(1) Check the lists of recipes for GW2's "Chef" profession, for example. Much of it is ordinary food in "appearance", although often not very "fantasy universe" in nature (burgers(2), pizzas(2), grilled sandwiches, that stuff).

 

(2) No, I'm not kidding.

[TrixxieTriss]

The current plan is that high-end crafting will require materials that come from content, yes, but that material will come from most types of content and not just Ranked PvP and Ops.

 

Thanks!

 

-eric

 

Thank you Eric.

 

Any news on the second part of my post regarding Augments?

Edited June 4, 2019 by TrixxieTriss

[DuchessKristania]

The current plan is that high-end crafting will require materials that come from content, yes, but that material will come from most types of content and not just Ranked PvP and Ops.

 

Thanks!

 

-eric

[/QUOT

 

For the sake of transparency, when you say "most content" it includes content that the average level player can solo, correct?

Edited June 4, 2019 by DuchessKristania

[Joonbeams]

Eric, here is an abbreviated list of necessary conditions to make crafting a viable profession in 6.0 and beyond:

 

1. Mats Obtainable From A Variety of Activities:
   
2. Top-Tier Items Craftable:
   
3. Requires Substantial Crafting Time/Resources: ??
   

 

We still don't have clarity on #3. The reason this one is important is that if crafting is to be viable as a profession--one that creates a vibrant economy of gatherers, crafters, sellers, buyers--it cannot be easily accessible to people who don't put the time into it. The requirement of (crafting) time is what helps regulate supply, and keeps crafting (including gathering) from being reduced to just a sideshow.

 

Time ==/== difficulty. Any player of any skill level should be able to craft. But if all players can craft/gather all items without any requirement of dedicated time/resources, then crafting becomes merely a side activity rather than a viable gameplay option/profession.

 

So which is the objective here: a) crafting is designed to be a viable in-game profession/gameplay activity or b) crafting is merely a casual side activity?