Can we talk about 258 gear?

[Totemdancer]

Still locked out today. So yeah it looks like 2 per week at the moment.

 

That’s bad.

 

Can I just confirm. Is that 2 per character or 2 per legacy/account on a server?

Edited November 6, 2018 by Totemdancer

[kukumburr]

That’s bad.

 

Can I just confirm. Is that 2 per character or 2 per legacy/account on a server?

 

Definitely per character. So 2 per week per character as of current PTS.

[Totemdancer]

Definitely per character. So 2 per week per character as of current PTS.

 

Did it turn out to be 500/1000 cost per character or 500 for the first and a 1000 for each subsequent character.

[kukumburr]

Did it turn out to be 500/1000 cost per character or 500 for the first and a 1000 for each subsequent character.

 

The pricing is per character. You always pay 500 first then 1000 on each character. So if you have multiple characters you can buy 2 MWS for 1500 on each one.

[Kaizersan]

OMG. PVP gearing will be terrible

 

given the minor difference in stats between bis 248 and bis 258 it won't make much of a difference at all certainly not enough to turn the tide of any pvp match.

[TrixxieTriss]

The pricing is per character. You always pay 500 first then 1000 on each character. So if you have multiple characters you can buy 2 MWS for 1500 on each one.

 

Ok, thanks for checking and posting.

[ultimarb]

given the minor difference in stats between bis 248 and bis 258 it won't make much of a difference at all certainly not enough to turn the tide of any pvp match.

 

you'll have 400 bonus damage more with 258 than 248. in pvp tuned gear the difference will be more. but yeah minor stats difference

Edited November 6, 2018 by ultimarb

[DzastinBiberi]

With the current exciting™ pvp matchmaking system where there's a full 258 team against random 230ish, it's gonna be like Predators vs Stone age ppl with sticks.

[Eriamea]

given the minor difference in stats between bis 248 and bis 258 it won't make much of a difference at all certainly not enough to turn the tide of any pvp match.

 

And how long before they nerf classes again because they are "overperforming" in endgame pve and you are relegated to grinding his stuff again and again for your toons just to keep doing what you are already doing?. They did just that when they introduced 248s...The quantity of new content does not justify this awful grind unless they want to call it "Knights of the Infinite Grind".

Edited November 7, 2018 by Eriamea

[TrixxieTriss]

given the minor difference in stats between bis 248 and bis 258 it won't make much of a difference at all certainly not enough to turn the tide of any pvp match.

 

That is completely false. If you’ve ever played a match with equally good players on both sides and one team has 242 gear and the other has 248 gear, the team with the higher gear will win. Hence gear does turn the tide of matches.

[Syal]

Here's what is currently on PTS:

• Each piece of gear costs 4 masterwork shards (MWS), except for helm, chest, and legs, which cost 5. MH and OH are NOT available for purchase on the 258 vendor. All gear requires Hero rep except bracers and belt, which require Newcomer.
  

 

So much farm... it's so disgusting !

Edited November 7, 2018 by Syal

[Andryah]

That is completely false. If you’ve ever played a match with equally good players on both sides and one team has 242 gear and the other has 248 gear, the team with the higher gear will win. Hence gear does turn the tide of matches.

 

1) Sounds like you are basing this on solo player vs player which is not how MMOs are balanced.

 

2) Comparing and rationalizing on 242 vs 248 and saying that = 248 vs 258 is an assumption on your part.. and you need to spend more time actually analyzing the gear in my view.

 

Plus... it really does depend on how good the teamwork is in a match.

 

And there is an RNG factor always at play with combat and defense equations. Weapon damage and defense stats ARE randomized to a range in each combat cycle.. and while RNG can and will average out over time... most PvP combat is fairly brief-2-a-death.... so this nominal improvement in gear simply may not overcome good team work and RNG variables in a majority of cycles.

 

The biggest benefit of better gear in any given situation is to help make up for a skill disadvantage.

 

Please note: I'm not saying it's zero benefit with the new gear.. and neither is the person you are responding to.. but it does appear to be a fairly marginal increase in gear power vs current BiS... and as such.. it's contribution is smaller then you are implying.

 

A skilled, competitive, and persistent PvP player such as yourself will likely beat a geared 258 while you are in 248s... a majority of the time.

Edited November 7, 2018 by Andryah

[kukumburr]

I took screenshots of the difference in stats between 248 gear with 240 augs and 258 gear with 240 augs. This is with Medicine Operative set, no changes to mods or enhancements, I based stat allocation on getting alacrity to 1857 for the 1.3s GCD breakpoint, then crit to 2000, then extra into mastery.

 

248: https://i.imgur.com/cwavsR7.png

258: https://i.imgur.com/2NpG3bh.png

 

You can hit 1859 alacrity which is practically on the dot for the 1.3s GCD which is nice. That's a fairly significant difference in HP too.

 

Also just to confirm the UC trade-in did reset for the week. So it is currently a weekly repeatable mission to trade-in 1500 UCs for 2 MWS per character.

[Rion_Starkiller]

Very nicely cropped screenshots

 

So roughly:

• 8k more hp
  
• 400 more power
  
• 800 more mastery
  
• 0.78% DR
  
• and 427 more tech power
  

Edited November 7, 2018 by Rion_Starkiller

[Totemdancer]

I took screenshots of the difference in stats between 248 gear with 240 augs and 258 gear with 240 augs. This is with Medicine Operative set, no changes to mods or enhancements, I based stat allocation on getting alacrity to 1857 for the 1.3s GCD breakpoint, then crit to 2000, then extra into mastery.

 

248: https://i.imgur.com/cwavsR7.png

258: https://i.imgur.com/2NpG3bh.png

 

You can hit 1859 alacrity which is practically on the dot for the 1.3s GCD which is nice. That's a fairly significant difference in HP too.

 

Also just to confirm the UC trade-in did reset for the week. So it is currently a weekly repeatable mission to trade-in 1500 UCs for 2 MWS per character.

 

Wow, that’s a big difference in damage and health.

[PetersCD]

I took screenshots of the difference in stats between 248 gear with 240 augs and 258 gear with 240 augs. This is with Medicine Operative set, no changes to mods or enhancements, I based stat allocation on getting alacrity to 1857 for the 1.3s GCD breakpoint, then crit to 2000, then extra into mastery.

 

248: https://i.imgur.com/cwavsR7.png

258: https://i.imgur.com/2NpG3bh.png

 

You can hit 1859 alacrity which is practically on the dot for the 1.3s GCD which is nice. That's a fairly significant difference in HP too.

 

Also just to confirm the UC trade-in did reset for the week. So it is currently a weekly repeatable mission to trade-in 1500 UCs for 2 MWS per character.

 

As a second point of reference going from fully optimized 248 to close to optimized 258 gear on an IO merc i picked up 567 mastery, 710 endurance, 422 power, 203 crit, 22 alacrity and 11 accuracy. this boosted my 2.5m dummy parse (debuffs enabled) from ~9200 at 40.3 APM to ~10200 at 39.7 APM. That is a non-trivial difference.

[giorgo]

As a second point of reference going from fully optimized 248 to close to optimized 258 gear on an IO merc i picked up 567 mastery, 710 endurance, 422 power, 203 crit, 22 alacrity and 11 accuracy. this boosted my 2.5m dummy parse (debuffs enabled) from ~9200 at 40.3 APM to ~10200 at 39.7 APM. That is a non-trivial difference.

 

Ty for posting this. This is more than 10% dps increase. Maybe now all these guys ( 2 guys actually) saying that we don't need this gear (lol) can finally shut up.

I can't wait till some guy in full 258 appears in PvP against a 230 casual. Getting globalled will get a new meaning .

Edited November 8, 2018 by giorgo

[PetersCD]

Ty for posting this. This is more than 10% dps increase. Maybe now all these guys ( 2 guys actually) saying that we don't need this gear (lol) can finally shut up.

I can't wait till some guy in full 258 appears in PvP against a 230 casual. Getting globalled will get a new meaning .

 

I don't disagree that the gearing has the potential to distort ranked PVP pretty badly, atleast for a short period. People who find a way to get geared quick will have a window to dominate probably even equivalent players. The boost to damage was actually higher than i'd anticipated, mostly due to all the tertiary stat going into crit causing me to crit more and harder on top of the linear damage increase from other stats. But.. to be frank, i was actually a bit surprised at how easy its going to be to get my main into near 258's. A day or so after the livestream i had my plan and a couple days after PTS opened up i was pretty sure it would let me be geared in 258 for everything but MH/OH, without even doing anything i would consider an outrageous grind, sometime in week 2 after the release. And none of this would require teaming up with other players to do ops and fight over tokens or fight with the (IMHO) radioactive pit that is ranked PvP

Edited November 8, 2018 by PetersCD

[Totemdancer]

Getting globalled will get a new meaning .

 

It’s called getting shafted

[Syal]

Very nicely cropped screenshots

 

So roughly:

• 8k more hp
  
• 400 more power
  
• 800 more mastery
  
• 0.78% DR
  
• and 427 more tech power
  

 

So 4 month dayly farming for this...

[Rion_Starkiller]

Let's keep in mind that we may be getting a new tier of augments as well

[Kaizersan]

Wow, that’s a big difference in damage and health.

 

Not really when you consider how fast one can do 8k damage in pvp it's really nothing at all just a extra hit or 2 depending on the class and attack.

[Kaizersan]

Ty for posting this. This is more than 10% dps increase. Maybe now all these guys ( 2 guys actually) saying that we don't need this gear (lol) can finally shut up.

I can't wait till some guy in full 258 appears in PvP against a 230 casual. Getting globalled will get a new meaning .

 

dummy parse are not a real world example of the damage you can output in pvp as in pvp you are fighting people who can move and counter then things you do and prevent damage from being done factors that are not in place when you are hitting a dummy that doesn't move or fight back.

[Totemdancer]

Not really when you consider how fast one can do 8k damage in pvp it's really nothing at all just a extra hit or 2 depending on the class and attack.

 

Just an extra hit or two is all it takes to win a fight. If you are consistently losing because of the gear, it makes you not want to play.

I cannot understand how you and others don’t understand that if you aren’t having fun because you are losing to gear gods, then you don’t want to play. It’s a pretty simple concept and plenty of pvpers have expressed the same thing.

Gear should never even be a thing in pvp. But if you must have it, then it should be relatively fast to obtain and there should only be a small difference in the best gear to the lower gear, like we had in 4.x pvp gear.

Edited November 8, 2018 by Totemdancer

[Rion_Starkiller]

Yeah, it's actually a huge difference.

 

I don't think it's a difference worth 2 gear tiers 248 to 258, but it's a noticeable chunk more stats. You're going to feel it in pvp, especially with 4 people in voice comms. In raids, I would guesstimate maybe 1k more dps?

Edited November 8, 2018 by Rion_Starkiller