iFenris Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 Does anyone know if LS Jaesa will be SGR only, or bi? I'd really like to try every romance in the game, but I find it a tad difficult to get through the warrior storyline with a female character and not romance Quinn. It's like a reflex. She's gonna be bi for both versions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seireeni Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 She's gonna be bi for both versions. Thanks! I guess I'll find a male warrior to romance her, then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaoZhao Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 This isn't Dragon Age 2. Not everyone should be bisexual. That's just pandering and bad writing. I think they did the right thing if they're not making any changes to Doc. In the original knight story, Doc's womanizing was mostly played for laughs. That kind of over-aggressive flirting is a classic comedy trope and it works fine, just the way it is. Just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyrusramsey Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 (edited) Mixy feelings. I was rather (pleasantly) surprised when I read about this (edit: Jaesa and Nadia). A welcome thing. I have a general preference for 'playersexual' npcs/companions because every argument against it seems to not hold up when looking at it as being just one/your story, where the sexuality of anyone you're not romancing or anyone another player is romancing is really irrelevant. I have an incredibly hard time imagining Doc as anything other than a sexist philanderer.. It occurs to me that I might actually be less (or.. not at all?) offended by him in a same-gender romance. I.. might actually end up romancing every vanilla character if they do this. An interesting thought. But.. I sorta suspect that they won't. Edited October 13, 2018 by cyrusramsey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IoNonSoEVero Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 Back on topic, I think the direction of this thread has gotten a little derailed. In my opening post, I wasn't intended to start a debate on whether or not they should change Doc's sexuality. I was merely asking for some clarification on whether or not Doc was included in the added options because I found the statement to carry implications that Charles may or may not have intended. IMHO if they intended to do that with Doc, they would have announced it along with the SGR for Nadia and Jaesa. Since they didn't, it's probably safe to say that Doc will not be offered for SGR. Given the dearth of F/F romances in the game I think they decided to concentrate on that demographic for this patch, and IMHO that's a very good thing. But IMHO the devs' comments suggest that Nadia and Jaesa may not be the *last* of the class companions that may be scripted for SGR, and that this might be something to look forward to with the companions who have not yet emerged from the KOTFE cloud. We know that Scourge, Kira, Tharan and Zenith are yet to return. They are making LS Jaesa available for romance when she never was a LI before, so I think they could do the same for Scourge, Zenith and Tharan. If any of them are offered as romance options I do think they will be open to both genders. I wouldn't be surprised if Kira were available for SGR when she returns, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldVengeance Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 (edited) Jaesa does not admit to sleeping with women. Her sexuality isn't any more vague than Doc's. If anything, her sexuality even seems less ambiguous than most other companions. She's dedicated to exploring her passions and only ever mentions men. And being in a romance with her makes her sexual attraction to the PC a major factor in her companion conversations. I'd say it can become a pretty start contrast with unromanced Jaesa at times. Fictional characters aren't really the same as real life people, they become whatever their writers want them to be. And one aspect that does concern me is that most companions won't have their original writers anymore. If one is against changing characters' in game sexuality at all, I think Jaesa probably should still be considered straight. It's a difficult question, because there isn't really any reason any type of character "should" be gay, straight or bi. Being a womanizer in and of itself wouldn't preclude being bisexual. Why should the female equivalent? But the characters themselves certainly weren't portrayed as being bisexual before now. And the other important thing to remember is that just because a character hasn't been specifically established as being queer, doesn't necessarily mean they aren't. The question becomes what constitutes a character "being established as being straight?" Is it even possible to do that? And that's something many people are going to dramatically disagree about because everyone interprets characters differently, and may also have very different intuitive processes about whether any character is queer or not. The more I think about it, I find I'm more on board with Nadia than Jaesa being a SGR option. If I had to choose people to be female Same Sex Romance options from the original cast, I think Risha might have been a better pick than Jaesa. She even had a line about being "more than friends" with an unromanced Smuggler. Edited October 13, 2018 by OldVengeance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonicphoto Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 They mentioned that even companions that have already returned could come back into the story in some way and get same sex when they didn't get it on their return so will have to see. But no, in the livestream they never said Doc. They suggested Khem Val would be though. Those were their 3 options, which excluded Doc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JennyFlynn Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 Jaesa does not admit to sleeping with women. Her sexuality isn't any more vague than Doc's... And that's something many people are going to dramatically disagree about because everyone interprets characters differently, and may also have very intuitive processes about whether any character is queer or not... (shortened for length) This is on point. We can argue a companion's sexuality until the cows come home but at the end of the day, we all have our own interpretations and perceptions. We have them for who the character really is in our eyes (ie: a traitor vs. a loyal soldier in a difficult situation), and in this case for their sexual orientation. Doc? I see a straight man in him and while I'm aware it is possible there is more to him, I personally don't see it. Someone else might though. Scourge was mentioned as a potential SGR by someone in this thread because they think he could be, but again, I don't see it myself. I never have and that has nothing to do with "Well it wasn't possible before" because hell, I let my headcanon go wherever it wants to, I don't need the game's permission or cooperation for that. I just do not see him as bisexual or gay. Don't kill me but, I can actually see it for Quinn though and in a sense, for Vector too. Cedrax might be just as happy with a holo-boy instead of Holiday. I can see it for Akaavi, for Jaesa and Kaliyo (despite any runarounds she gives you in the past). Can't see it for Nadia but clearly, others do. I can't see it with Mako, I don't really get that vibe from her and I had to dissuade her from pursuing Torian so I could have him to myself but, who knows? Those are my personal opinions though and how I see those characters. The next poster may think the complete opposite and at the end of the day... it's all gonna come down to what the writers think is and isn't workable. PS: Genuine question because I've never done every single available romance and some of it is quite some time ago; Has any companion/LI ever actually said "I am only into men/women"? Not our perception based on their behavior or the fact SGR didn't exist in vanilla due to Disney/etc. but have any of them ever stated they are 100% straight? Because if not then this isn't Bioware changing a character's previous orientation to cater to—it is them at last, and for the first time, defining a vanilla companion's orientation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elessara Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 (shortened for length) PS: Genuine question because I've never done every single available romance and some of it is quite some time ago; Has any companion/LI ever actually said "I am only into men/women"? Not our perception based on their behavior or the fact SGR didn't exist in vanilla due to Disney/etc. but have any of them ever stated they are 100% straight? Because if not then this isn't Bioware changing a character's previous orientation to cater to—it is them at last, and for the first time, defining a vanilla companion's orientation. I'm not sure that it would ever have really needed to come up as you mostly couldn't flirt with companions who couldn't be romanced (or have a fling with). There were a couple of flirts that female inquisitors could have with Talos but I'm pretty sure there were only two and they never went anywhere. Like, as a female smuggler I don't ever recall being able to flirt with Akaavi or Risha, just Corso (as far as companions go). And if you could romance them, there's no real need for a companion to say, "I'm only into male/female/any" . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ylliarus Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 Extremely unlikely that they will reconstruct the base class stories, especially not just for one companion of one class. They said on stream they'd only add same gender romances for old companions upon their return after KotFE/KotET. Same gender romances won't be added to the base game romances, sadly but understandably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totemdancer Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 (edited) She's gonna be bi for both versions. She will only appear bi if you play her that way. If you are female and made certain choices, she will appear to be gay. You shouldn’t think of her as straight, bi or gay. You should think of her as a blank slate and the way you play your story determines what she is. Edited October 14, 2018 by Totemdancer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaveRun Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 (edited) Can we please keep this thread free of personal politics? Me personally, I always hate watching stuff that forces indoctrination of politics on you like some Game of Thrones scenes and I much rather prefer BW keep the indoctrination to a minimum. It's already pretty bad in some cases but at least they are options right now. I draw the line when it's a part of the story and then forced onto you. Edited October 14, 2018 by WaveRun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damask_Rose Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 I have a general preference for 'playersexual' npcs/companions because every argument against it seems to not hold up when looking at it as being just one/your story, where the sexuality of anyone you're not romancing or anyone another player is romancing is really irrelevant. I have an incredibly hard time imagining Doc as anything other than a sexist philanderer.. I prefer playersexual too. I have never seen an argument against it that was convincing in the least. I think some people just can't wrap their heads around different versions of the same characters. (They must have a lot of trouble with all of the different Marvel universes...) We spend so little time with our companions and know so little about them, there is tons of wiggle room. I don't see Doc as sexist or a womanizer or a philanderer. He's just a flirt. I think the comparison to Jack Harkness was spot on. That fits him far more than Han. I never would have guessed anyone would have thought he was modeled after Han 🙄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elessara Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 I prefer playersexual too. I have never seen an argument against it that was convincing in the least. I think some people just can't wrap their heads around different versions of the same characters. (They must have a lot of trouble with all of the different Marvel universes...) We spend so little time with our companions and know so little about them, there is tons of wiggle room. I don't see Doc as sexist or a womanizer or a philanderer. He's just a flirt. I think the comparison to Jack Harkness was spot on. That fits him far more than Han. I never would have guessed anyone would have thought he was modeled after Han 🙄 Honestly, I prefer the way DAI did it. Some are gay, some are straight, some are bi, some have race preferences, and some don't care who/what you are as long as they get to tie you to the bedposts. It makes the characters seem more like individuals to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthCasus Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 Honestly, I prefer the way DAI did it. Some are gay, some are straight, some are bi, some have race preferences, and some don't care who/what you are as long as they get to tie you to the bedposts. It makes the characters seem more like individuals to me. We're way beyond attempting that sort of level of depth now, we're lucky we're getting anythin g besides straight now, considering how vanilla and even Makeb was handled. I'm thankful for it, I just wish they'd bring back some class stories flings and short-term romances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ylliarus Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 (edited) I prefer playersexual too. I have never seen an argument against it that was convincing in the least. I think some people just can't wrap their heads around different versions of the same characters. (They must have a lot of trouble with all of the different Marvel universes...) We spend so little time with our companions and know so little about them, there is tons of wiggle room. I don't see Doc as sexist or a womanizer or a philanderer. He's just a flirt. I think the comparison to Jack Harkness was spot on. That fits him far more than Han. I never would have guessed anyone would have thought he was modeled after Han 🙄 I have no problems with playersexual either. In one playthrough I headcanoned Theron Shan as gay, in another as straight, it's absolutely no problem and moaning about it comes across as nitpicky to me. If Doc was an option for same gender romances as well, why not? Sexual orientation has a broad spectrum, it's not clear and cut straight or gay. Bisexuality is a thing you know and a bisexual with a stronger preference for women than men but still into men if they found the right one is perfectly realistic. Sure, Doc may come across as a ladies' man, but that doesn't even remotely mean he might not fall in love with a guy if he met the right one. Let's be open minded about stuff, stuff in our world doesn't function one on one in the fictional universe of Star Wars. The outdated concepts on sexuality people still hold onto in our world likely are mostly non-existent in a universe as technologically advanced as Star Wars. Sexual orientation doesn't matter there, it's just part of who you are and you aren't judged for it. It's merely a fact about yourself. Perhaps we could apply some of that logic onto our real world too, hmm? Edited October 14, 2018 by Ylliarus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThrakhathSpawn Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 (edited) Very disappointing about LS Jaesa. She was the one hot female companion that no one could have. Made her unique. Now she's lost her identity. Her character was fairly clear, they should not have done this. Does not speak well to the rest of the story if they can't work with her strong character. Edited October 14, 2018 by ThrakhathSpawn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WayOfTheWarriorx Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 Very disappointing about LS Jaesa. She was the one hot female companion that no one could have. Made her unique. Now she's lost her identity. Her character was fairly clear, they should not have done this. Does not speak well to the rest of the story if they can't work with her strong character. I agree with you, whats the point of making two different Jaesas [the only comp in the game that's the case with] if they are just gonna provide the same exact experiences anyways, just with with calmer words and less tight fitting clothes. But, at the same time, if it makes players more happy and they enjoy the experience more that way, screw it, let's go for making the most amount of people happier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveTheCynic Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 PS: Genuine question because I've never done every single available romance and some of it is quite some time ago; Has any companion/LI ever actually said "I am only into men/women"? Not our perception based on their behavior or the fact SGR didn't exist in vanilla due to Disney/etc. but have any of them ever stated they are 100% straight? Because if not then this isn't Bioware changing a character's previous orientation to cater to—it is them at last, and for the first time, defining a vanilla companion's orientation. If your character is a female non-agent, Kaliyo, on her return, can be flirted, and she turns you down. She says, "I'm getting too old for head games, and that's all I'm good for with women." I read that as, "I'll sleep with a woman if doing so helps me get what I want from her [money, a place to stay, etc., but not romance], but that's as far as it goes." No, it's not a definite "I am only into", but I think it's as close as you'll find in any of them. (And I think it was put in there precisely to "troll" the forumites who said that she was obviously written to be ready to be player-oriented.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RexxGFL Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 (shortened for length) shortened for length. That's like Hot water heater... Or Jumbo shrimp... Or Military intelligence... Words that seem silly when you put them together into one term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordRapheus Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 shortened for length. That's like Hot water heater... Or Jumbo shrimp... Or Military intelligence... Words that seem silly when you put them together into one term. How about "It's the same difference"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThrakhathSpawn Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Let's be open minded about stuff, stuff in our world doesn't function one on one in the fictional universe of Star Wars. The outdated concepts on sexuality people still hold onto in our world likely are mostly non-existent in a universe as technologically advanced as Star Wars. Sexual orientation doesn't matter there, it's just part of who you are and you aren't judged for it. It's merely a fact about yourself. Perhaps we could apply some of that logic onto our real world too, hmm? We should perhaps evaluate some other possibly outdated biological concepts such as our hearts, lungs, stomachs, etc... What if I have a preference for drinking down my trachea? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ylliarus Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 (edited) We should perhaps evaluate some other possibly outdated biological concepts such as our hearts, lungs, stomachs, etc... What if I have a preference for drinking down my trachea? Your post is not making any sense, really, I tried approaching it from different angles but I am not getting a thing you're trying to say. If this was an attempt at sarcasm it was a rather very poor one. If you are however interested in organs and don't feel a need for your own, please do register as an organ donor! I hope it won't ever be necessary, but that way you could potentially save a life! Edited October 15, 2018 by Ylliarus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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