OneHit Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 I'm guessing you're making your point from a pvp perspective, as I was more forthcoming from a pve point of view. I don't pvp much, but I have noticed that heat IS an issue when it comes to wz's. Operations too. Unless rapid shots is a mainstay of your rotation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K_osss Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 (edited) Thanks for listening to the player feedback guys! I'm curious if the ferocity/precision stacks affect the damage associated with the ataru form procs on those abilities? If not do Ataru procs need a slight buff? Ferocity/Precision used to affect Ataru hits. Edited November 3, 2017 by K_osss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ultimarb Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 Operations too. Unless rapid shots is a mainstay of your rotation just stay away from this dulfy/marisi powershot rotation garbage and just get comfortable with 2 rapidshots in your rotation. ...no overheating...you have massive rescources for aoe parts in fight and even dot spread. you'll only notice the dps difference on dummy parses or dummy like bosses with two rapidshots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneHit Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 just stay away from this dulfy/marisi powershot rotation garbage and just get comfortable with 2 rapidshots in your rotation. ...no overheating...you have massive rescources for aoe parts in fight and even dot spread. you'll only notice the dps difference on dummy parses or dummy like bosses with two rapidshots. See. Mainstay of the rotation. Shouldn't have to be like that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ultimarb Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 See. Mainstay of the rotation. Shouldn't have to be like that of course. otherwise you wouldn't have a window where you can cou rescource negative and do a short duration of time more dps. ifnot you can get rid of energy management on all classes and just press the buttons with the most dmage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneHit Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 of course. otherwise you wouldn't have a window where you can cou rescource negative and do a short duration of time more dps. ifnot you can get rid of energy management on all classes and just press the buttons with the most dmage. Ya but I play a lot of classes. And this is the only one that needs auto attack in order to manage it's resources. And I play a lot of dot spread classes. I'm not saying you're wrong about having to use rapid shots in order to maintain heat. I'm saying it's wrong we have too. The devs saved us 15 heat off an instant cast and act like IO is fixed. Sure they saved us a second and 15 heat. I doubt it's going to take rapid shots out of the rotation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eloi_BG Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 (edited) Tbh if you have heat issues with IO sounds like a you problem. Yes IO can overheat easily, but that's what makes it fun. Always make the most out of the heat available. If they "fix" heat, as you say, they'll have to nerf DPS output of other stuff, which sucks. Having to basic attack at some point in a rotation is ok (especially since our basic attack is 30m, not like 4m sorc basic attack, and we have to use it less than once per rotation on average). Removing any heat management would turn this spec into a completely static rotation which is boring. This DoT spread change is very nice, it makes our DoT spread be more competitive with other classes, and gives us two options (instant one that does a bit less damage, useful if one the move, casted one that does more damage). EDIT: Just read your last comment. Some sniper specs need to use basic attack occasionally. Both PT specs need to. Some mara specs (not up to date here but in 4.0 2 of them). Hatred needs it. Concealment needs it. There are other issues they should work on (such as PT defensives). Edited November 3, 2017 by Eloi_BG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneHit Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 Tbh if you have heat issues with IO sounds like a you problem. Yes IO can overheat easily, but that's what makes it fun. Always make the most out of the heat available. If they "fix" heat, as you say, they'll have to nerf DPS output of other stuff, which sucks. Having to basic attack at some point in a rotation is ok (especially since our basic attack is 30m, not like 4m sorc basic attack, and we have to use it less than once per rotation on average). Removing any heat management would turn this spec into a completely static rotation which is boring. This DoT spread change is very nice, it makes our DoT spread be more competitive with other classes, and gives us two options (instant one that does a bit less damage, useful if one the move, casted one that does more damage). There are other issues they should work on (such as PT defensives). They already nerfed our dps. And gave us a big nothing burger in return. I've never seen so many people excited over 15 heat. Btw it's not just my problem. There's at least a dozen threads about it over the years. It's why we are the rare few that play it. IO's rotation is what makes it fun. Overheating does not lmao. It's my problem? But that's what makes it fun? Chi please. IO has been my main for three years at least. I know it inside out, upside down and sideways. I play in pve, and PVP. I could play that **** in GSF while decorating my stronghold if I had too. Who ever said IO's dot spread was too hard? I'm sorry following up fusion missles with a Insta cast was hard? No it wasn't. It was just hard on your resources cause IO is hard on your resources. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyroman Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 (edited) Ya but I play a lot of classes. And this is the only one that needs auto attack in order to manage it's resources. And I play a lot of dot spread classes. I'm not saying you're wrong about having to use rapid shots in order to maintain heat. I'm saying it's wrong we have too. The devs saved us 15 heat off an instant cast and act like IO is fixed. Sure they saved us a second and 15 heat. I doubt it's going to take rapid shots out of the rotation 12 out of the 18 damage specs have to use basic attacks to maintain a stable max dps rotation, northing wrong with it and doesn't necessarily hurt a spec's dps. Look at pyro, it is near the top (if not the top) in basic attack uses but is also one of the highest sustained dps specs. Hard on resources does not mean resource management is bad. Edited November 3, 2017 by shyroman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneHit Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 12 out of the 18 damage specs have to use basic attacks to maintain a stable max dps rotation, northing wrong with it and doesn't necessarily hurt a spec's dps. Look at pyro, it is near the top (if not the top) in basic attack uses but is also one of the highest sustained dps specs. Hard on resources does not mean resource management is bad. I don't play pt. But they use a lot of rapid shots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuiwe Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 12 out of the 18 damage specs have to use basic attacks to maintain a stable max dps rotation, northing wrong with it and doesn't necessarily hurt a spec's dps. Look at pyro, it is near the top (if not the top) in basic attack uses but is also one of the highest sustained dps specs. Hard on resources does not mean resource management is bad. Really? Pyro one of the highest parsing DoT based specs? Maybe if we count it in real situation when Into the Fray / Electro Shield start popping like crazy, but otherwise....eh? What? And besides, we should use LESS basic attacks, not MORE! What's more fun: Flame Burst or Rapid Shot? If I wanted to Rapid Shot, I'd have created a Merc, not a Powertech! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eloi_BG Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 (edited) I don't play pt. But they use a lot of rapid shots? Pyro about 50% more than IO. AP 25% less than IO. Also yes Pyro is a top spec. Equal or just behind lethality, those are the two top DoT specs. Fury and carange (which is about to get nerfed) are over it. Edited November 3, 2017 by Eloi_BG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneHit Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 Really? Pyro one of the highest parsing DoT based specs? Maybe if we count it in real situation when Into the Fray / Electro Shield start popping like crazy, but otherwise....eh? What? And besides, we should use LESS basic attacks, not MORE! What's more fun: Flame Burst or Rapid Shot? If I wanted to Rapid Shot, I'd have created a Merc, not a Powertech! Then let me recomend IO. You'll love all the rapid shots 😂😂😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyroman Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 I don't play pt. But they use a lot of rapid shots? Yes, pyro uses about twice as many rapid shots as io. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneHit Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 Pyro about 50% more than IO. AP 25% less than IO. You heard it here first folks. NERF RAPID SHOTS! Eric. Oh Eric. Can you please convert this thread. It is now the official nerf rapid shots thread😂😂😂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godsuxx Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 (edited) See. Mainstay of the rotation. Shouldn't have to be like that It's called adapting and improving. There are three different rotations that I use, but all of them require me to use rapid shots no matter what due to the massive amount of heat that I get if I don't. If this spec is not up to your expectations, then I suggest you play another one. It's what we have to live with. This is what makes the spec very fun and rewarding to play. Risk and reward. Edited November 3, 2017 by godsuxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyroman Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 Really? Pyro one of the highest parsing DoT based specs? Maybe if we count it in real situation when Into the Fray / Electro Shield start popping like crazy, but otherwise....eh? What? And besides, we should use LESS basic attacks, not MORE! What's more fun: Flame Burst or Rapid Shot? If I wanted to Rapid Shot, I'd have created a Merc, not a Powertech! Yes it can parse over 10.6k, it does very high sustained dps. Also what I find the most fun is maximizing my flame burst usage while not overheating. It requires me to think a few gcd's ahead of time of what will I be using and will it overheat me. If I was just able to spam flame burst without worry all the time then it would take all thinking out of the spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneHit Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 It's called adapting and improving. There are three different rotations that I use, but all of them require me to use rapid shots no matter what due to the massive amount of heat that I get if I don't. If this spec is not up to your expectations, then I suggest you play another one. It's what we have to live with. Which one would you recomend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eloi_BG Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 (edited) You heard it here first folks. NERF RAPID SHOTS! Eric. Oh Eric. Can you please convert this thread. It is now the official nerf rapid shots thread😂😂😂 Wut? Me saying Pyro uses rapid shots more than IO is me asking to nerf rapid shots? Anyway this is getting off topic, so I'll be stopping there. Back to the topic at hand. If some devs read this. Thanks for changing IO Dot spread. Thanks for changing Viru energy and making it less RNG related. Thanks for nerfing some survivability utilities. Thanks for adapting carnage changes (even tho removing clipping is lame). Hopefully you can keep listening to feedback and see about PT survivability and other real issues people have mentioned. Edited November 3, 2017 by Eloi_BG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneHit Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 Wut? Me saying Pyro uses rapid shots more than IO is me asking to nerf rapid shots? Anyway this is getting of topic, so I'll be stopping there. Back to the topic at hand. If some devs read this. Thanks for changing IO Dot spread. Thanks for changing Viru energy and making it less RNG related. Thanks for nerfing some survivability utilities. Thanks for adapting carnage changes (even tho removing clipping is lame). Hopefully you can keep listening to feedback and see about PT survivability and other real issues people have mentioned. Tldr but I agree with him. Nerf rapid shots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samoth_Nomad Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 Hey folks, Here are some updated changes for Carnage and Combat from the dev team: -eric Wow! Thank you for listening to player suggestions! I think these changes are a very good compromise. My heart isn't feeling so heavy from the impending death of the spec I love Very very cool of you guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ld-Siris Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 Hey folks, Here are some updated changes for Carnage and Combat from the dev team: -eric Why is the combat team moving toward making Carnage the burst spec and fury the hybrid (quasi) spec? That is the reason carnage keeps getting nerf and tee nerf in 5.0+. Carnage was designed to be the hybrid spec and fury or old rage was the burst. It’s why carnage has such a fluid rotation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuiwe Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 Then let me recomend IO. You'll love all the rapid shots 😂😂😂 Yeah, that is my #1 Mercenary Discipline. I love how improvised it feels. Explosive Bullets, Explosive Darts, Magnetic Shots, Hollow Point Shots(Serrated), Normal Shots...I love it. If I could combo it with Pyro and perhaps a Shield, I'd be eternally happy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zerglord Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 (edited) And how about you give DPS Sorc some real survivability , pls pls pls Lightning Sorc maybe will feel this buff, but madness surely won't. Edited November 3, 2017 by zerglord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyuuu Posted November 3, 2017 Share Posted November 3, 2017 (edited) Hey folks, Here are some updated changes for Carnage and Combat from the dev team: -eric facepalm this still results in net loss of dps, to a Puredps class should have higher target dps then dps class that can be heal/tank/dps and Melee puredps class should have higher dps target then ranged pure dps class. and for class that rely s heavily on alacrity to begin to fit as much as possible in to that window. you by result make alacrity pretty much mean nothing and when everyone fiqure out to better drop alacrity for crit/power forget about the fact your ruining the flow and fun of the spec by these changes you gonna say it need to be nerfed again.. please keep taking and taking from carnage you's been doing it since 4.0 and when people find way to get dps back, you go and nerf em again. leave Ferocity as it now with it small window it has now or make it 3 stack inside and OUT side berserk , i rather have the small window is it is now then stacks cause it will make alacrity pointless. Why this change is listed in first place when has ZERO to do with utility first place everything else in that list is utility changes. Edited November 3, 2017 by Kyuuu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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