Slicing: Why it had to be nerfed.

[Deedre]

I think that most of the people complaining are those who picked a crafting profession(s) instead of slicing. I also expect this to backfire and crafted item prices drop substantially as the slicers are not there to buy their goods. It's a lose/lose situation. Slicers have considerably less money, crafters lose money on crafting.

 

Some short term deflation will happen, yes. This is a good thing.

 

Slicers are not the only source of money in this game. What they were doing, however, was dramatically accelerating the growth of money supply over and above what the game itself introduced. This was never going to have a happy ending. They thankfully nipped it in the bud -- but it never should have gone live like this to begin with.

[Sakes]

I think that most of the people complaining are those who picked a crafting profession(s) instead of slicing. I also expect this to backfire and crafted item prices drop substantially as the slicers are not there to buy their goods. It's a lose/lose situation. Slicers have considerably less money, crafters lose money on crafting.

 

You're partially correct, there are those without slicing who think this won't effect them, and it will. There will be less credits coming into the economy and that will certainly effect everyone.

 

The thing is, this HAD to happen. The alternative would have hurt everyone even more in the long run.

[Lazzerswords]

harvesting nodes? you can't be serious........

 

 

this is how mmos work time = money slicing takes time therefore your recieve money

 

Crybaby crafters who idiotically trying to level crafting while leveling are broke and are jealous of slicers. When most people are lvl 50 and need gear and materials guess who wins? I knew the devs were nubs at MMO balance with this overboard nerf, blizzard use to do this many many years ago, but they learned.

[Sticksabbi]

Quite frankly, I don't give a damn about the slicing making money. I may not like the nerf, but my central argument is a lack of credit income. If slicing makes me the credits I NEED to survive, then I am damn well going to fight my *** off to make it change and be profitable. Like I have stated before, at lvl 26 my mission rewards don't give me enough credits, and killing random enemies (which i enjoy doing) only gets me 1 MAYBE 2 trash items to sell every 6-10 enemies. How am I suppose to survive in this mmo with 0 credits?

 

That is my central argument, and also the argument of many others. I do not wish to play this game being poor. I also don't expect to be a billionaire at lvl 13. I want the credits to survive, that's it. I don't mind grinding to get them, so long as I ACTUALLY get the credits. This is why I am not playing my lvl 26 sage. I have no meny for ANYTHING. I can not craft, I can not buy the armor I need... Hell, I am not even REMOTELY close to getting that damn speeder skill.

 

Sure a lot of people say "oh screw you.. I had that at lvl 13..." I say ********.

 

Find a way to increase credit gain without breaking the game. That is ALL I want.

I'm a lvl 38 merc bounty hunter my armormech/scavaging/UT skills are all at around 300 I've made 0 money from selling items on the gtn. I've made 0 money from selling my matts to vendors. I've sunk tens of thousands of credits into UT. I have all my class skill purchased as well as all recipe's from the vendors.

 

With scrimping and saving I was able to purchase my speeder skill and speeder at 25. I'm well on my way to being able to purchase my lvl 40 speeder skill and speder.

 

Basically, if your having problems affording your skills the fault lies in you.

[Kordoyn]

You're partially correct, there are those without slicing who think this won't effect them, and it will. There will be less credits coming into the economy and that will certainly effect everyone.

 

The thing is, this HAD to happen. The alternative would have hurt everyone even more in the long run.

 

I agree that a nerf was needed, as I stated in one of these threads, I made over 3 million credits in the last week with slicing. I think that it was too severe, and will impact the non slicers more than the slicers in the long run, and will suppress pricing on crafted goods to a point where it is no longer profitable to craft.

[Deedre]

I agree that a nerf was needed, as I stated in one of these threads, I made over 3 million credits in the last week with slicing. I think that it was too severe, and will impact the non slicers more than the slicers in the long run, and will suppress pricing on crafted goods to a point where it is no longer profitable to craft.

 

If it turns out that the ingame economy isn't growing its money supply quickly enough, this can be solved with ease by the developers and in a controlled fashion. They can always find new ways to introduce more credits in the economy. (Or, in the alternative, they can reduce the money sinks, lower training prices, etc.)

 

But putting this in the hands of the players is just insane.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Deedre

[Vodrin]

 

If I spend 1000 credits on a Scavenging mission, I will use the mats for crafting. I see that as paying for the mats. If I spend 1000 on a Slicing mission and only get 800 in return. It's a waste of my time and money. Therefore, not going to do it.

 

 

How often are you selling scavenging mats or crafted items for a profit. I'm not seeing it and have leveled synthweaving and archeology pretty aggressively. Both can generate some money influx, but nowhere near the rate of what slicing missions could. Granted, they may have over killed on nerfing slicing, but it definitely needed to be adjusted to give similar financial returns to the other gathering professions.

[Caliginosucks]

I'm about lv 250ish with my slicing right now and i have to say, what the hell? I have been making money off of slicing missions. I believe the higher tier class 4 missions cost around 1150 credits or so and the lockbox generally is give or take around 1700 credits, not as much of a profit as before but no where near negative. Sorry for the ballpark math, not on my normal computer and can't post screenshots or anything but i have rarely seen negative credits from missions post slicing nerf. I've also seen a decent amount of safes while questing regardless of the number of slicers.

[Daragoz]

My roommate has slicing on one of his republic toons. He showed me his slicing boxes from several missions. Every box was no higher than 80% of what he spent on the mission. He loses money on every mission he does.

 

As for me, I am no longer making profit either. Before the patch I was making a LITTLE profit. Now, after the nerf, I am making nothing.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Daragoz

[Iridor]

Except its not always cash in the boxes...

 

Really? Because at 400 slicing, having done most of it on lockbox missions, I have never ONCE gotten anything from a lockbox except credits. Are you talking about Treasure Hunting lockboxes?

[Daragoz]

Anyone who thinks that the boxes from slicing gives more than credits, doesnt slice. When you slice you get a white rarity, green, blue, etc box that yields credits. The only way you get anything else is running missions. On the missions you get credit boxes most frequently, but you can get shematics, and crafting missions. But from just the slicing boxes, all you get is credits. And, after this nerf, nobody wants to spend 1000 credits on a missions just to get 600 or 800 in return. It makes NO sense whatsoever. The credits ARE your reward for the missions. The schematics and mission items are just a bonus on occasion.

[Peckingorder]

Just for the hell of it I started writing down the cost of each mission I sent my companions out on yesterday. On 25 missions ranging from level 5 to level 6 I lost money on 5 of them. I made right around 6k in profit without factoring in schematics or missions. While it is quite a bit lower then what it used to be it still brings in credits.

 

I realize my sample size is not very scientific so maybe I just had a string of luck, but to say you can't still make money on missions, at least in my humble opinion, appears to be wrong.

[Peckingorder]

Anyone who thinks that the boxes from slicing gives more than credits, doesnt slice. When you slice you get a white rarity, green, blue, etc box that yields credits. The only way you get anything else is running missions. On the missions you get credit boxes most frequently, but you can get shematics, and crafting missions. But from just the slicing boxes, all you get is credits. And, after this nerf, nobody wants to spend 1000 credits on a missions just to get 600 or 800 in return. It makes NO sense whatsoever. The credits ARE your reward for the missions. The schematics and mission items are just a bonus on occasion.

 

I have gotten one mission from a box on the ground.

[Daragoz]

I was referring to the credit boxes themselves. Not the nodes.

[Peckingorder]

I was referring to the credit boxes themselves. Not the nodes.

 

Ah, yea reading comprehension for the lose on my part. I blame all the cold medicine.

[Caliginosucks]

Just for the hell of it I started writing down the cost of each mission I sent my companions out on yesterday. On 25 missions ranging from level 5 to level 6 I lost money on 5 of them. I made right around 6k in profit without factoring in schematics or missions.

 

This, slicing is still making a profit, i'm still making money off missions alone myself. The people who are complaining had a bad string of luck or ran a mission one or so times, saw it was negative and went to the forums and started crying.

[Repefe]

I realize my sample size is not very scientific so maybe I just had a string of luck, but to say you can't still make money on missions, at least in my humble opinion, appears to be wrong.

 

You can still make money ... but not enough to justify a crew skill slot. Not if you do any crafting.

[Daragoz]

I say just solve the whole problem and reverse the changes. nobody wants to listen, everyone wants to complain (I realize I am doing a fair share of complaining as well, but for good reason regardless of what anyone says. The truth of what I post is still the truth and not opinion as per my lack of credits in-game. And it is not "user error" that I am not making enough funds). Put things back the way they were, and stop listening to the useless complainers. It's no fun being broke. I like to earn my way in games, however, as things stand... That is not possible without doing grinding in amounts even I hate.

 

Just reverse the change and be done with it. Who cares how rich others get. I am poor in real life, I do not wish to be poor in a game world as well. I play the game to forget, not relive my real life.

 

Living on disability from being a disabled army veteran is a pain, literally.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Daragoz

[Cormanthor]

I'm a lvl 38 merc bounty hunter my armormech/scavaging/UT skills are all at around 300 I've made 0 money from selling items on the gtn. I've made 0 money from selling my matts to vendors. I've sunk tens of thousands of credits into UT. I have all my class skill purchased as well as all recipe's from the vendors.

 

With scrimping and saving I was able to purchase my speeder skill and speeder at 25. I'm well on my way to being able to purchase my lvl 40 speeder skill and speder.

 

Basically, if your having problems affording your skills the fault lies in you.

 

Exactly. Every person crying about not having enough credits without slicing is just being foolish.

 

I am 29, have all my skills, speeder skill, speeder, and my profs are almost all at 200. I have made zero profit from my crew skills yet I still manage.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Cormanthor

[Serranex]

Seriously slicers, you're not doing anyone a favor when you buy their goods.

 

Unless you dump every single credit that you gain from slicing back into the economy, then you are still getting further ahead of everyone than you should be. A parallel would be a billionare CEO in real life asking for tax breaks so that they can hire more people at slave wages, then being outraged that their tax break was taken away. Trickle-down economy does NOT work, since everyone always slices (hurrr) a piece of the pie to keep for themselves. Crafters BARELY break even when you DO spend your "hard earned slicing credits" on their goods. I know, since I have both a slicer and a cybertech that has RE'ed every single lvl 19, 23, and 26 earpiece and have been selling them as much as I possibly could.

 

It's like "well, I spend about 6000 credits buying something off the GTN when my bankroll is near 2 million credits...now that slicing is gone, I'm not spending that 6000 credit... the economy is ruined!"

 

Anyways, I'm glad it's nerfed. I'm sad I didn't set up a factory with 8 alts like I should've, but I did get a nice chunk of change that I can use for quite some time.

[Rehneu]

If that was true then it would have been nerfed before launch

 

Slicing was nerfed before launch.

[Aharkahram]

You are losing money running missions. You were never intended to make money running missions. You make money harvesting nodes.

 

Other gathering professions have the added benefit of providing free leveling to your crafting skills. Slicing does not have that- the idea is, you sacrifice the utility of discounted mats for easy money. This is no longer the case.

[Repefe]

Other gathering professions have the added benefit of providing free leveling to your crafting skills. Slicing does not have that- the idea is, you sacrifice the utility of discounted mats for easy money. This is no longer the case.

 

Yep ... I break even with treasure hunting lockboxes. But unlike slicing I get source of crafting material and gifts in that skill as well. With slicing I don't break even ... I get tiny profit but lose gifts and crafting material source. That ain't good.

 

If augments were usable it could be different story, but they ain't.

[Whitemane]

If that was true then it would have been nerfed before launch

 

AS a closed tester (F&A) since March I can say that the OP is correct. Slicing was nerfed several times in Beta ( just not far enough ). You think it is correct the Slicing was the only crewskill you would directly make hordes of cash from just running the missions rather than actually crafting anything from the results of the missions?

Edited December 28, 2011 by Whitemane

[Jjix]

My point was what you call "inflation" i call normalization and once the economy normalized around a level 50 player base the entire economy will shift and slicing would become obsolete as other sources of income become more profitable.

 

I completely understand the concept of a "print money" button but when that button can only produce a set amount no matter what then why would it be worth investment if there are other areas of growth that have a much higher potential for return?

 

Slicing only appears to be a "print money" button now because there is no market for:

 

- augments

- high end crafted items

- high end materials

- expensive vanity items

- mods/ship items

- companion items

 

The current market population is almost exclusively leveling characters and the initial wave of level 50's that are more than likely the foundation of the initial wave of raiders.

 

My whole point is that the market isn't MATURE enough at this point to make such a rash decision and all economic theory points to an eventual decline in the value of slicing as most people view it.

 

edit: i'll grant that BW has access to the actual statistics and my conclusions are based on personal observation but I just find it highly unlikely that 2 weeks could be enough time to determine the overall effect slicing in it's previous state would have had.

 

Excellent post, including your previous ones. Thank you!