Good Sportsmanship and why it matters, at least to me.

[Ramalina]

The distinction I'm usually drawing is that you have an implied obligation to help your team, and an obligation to hurt the enemy team (which helps your team). It's a team game, after all, and you aren't responsible for optimizing the fun and success of the enemy team, but you kinda have that implied obligation for YOUR team. I do see your point about not wanting to play the most team-synergy ship possible at all times, of course. I feel that wouldn't be so much of a discussion point if Bioware had followed through on their strike buffs, because you wouldn't end up with players who were stuck with a great concept and playstyle that was so poorly rewarded by the game balance. In principle the discussion point would still be around, but it wouldn't carry much impact, it would be mostly academic.

 

The issue some people have is that they think the population is sufficiently mixed in terms of skill level that there are reasonable grounds for an obligation to both your team and the other team.

 

Think of it as a set of a few municipal baseball fields that're managed by someone who in theory is supposed to find teams for people, but most of the time is drunk or napping to the point where it's effectively first come first serve when it comes to forming teams.

 

So you get your teams, you start to play baseball. Some of the time it's more or less fine. What happens though when you have that system give you six kids from the local T-ball team on one team and four MLB All-Stars walk on for the other team? Should the MLB pitcher be pitching 97 mph fastballs high and inside to 6 year olds stepping up to the plate? Is a kid likely to think playing ball is fun if that's what they get the first few times?

 

At some point on the skill curve it's less of an issue. Depending on the school, at the high school varsity level a Pro-level fastball may be difficult and a bit scary, but it also becomes an opportunity to maybe, just maybe, hit the sweetest home run you've ever hit.

 

What GSF could really use is a dedicated practice field, but what we've got is a kid's fair beanbag toss (which teaches all the ball skills you'll ever need, according to the city rec department).

 

It's sort of a sucky situation. If you're high skill and go easy any time there are potential T-ball players, you're going to have to go easy in at least 99.5% of your games, which is deeply frustrating if you have the drive to become competitive in the first place. I'm willing to hop around the bases on one leg in many of these sorts of cases, but I'd really much rather be sprinting. Fast balls, flattening someone as you slide into base, catching every pop fly from a batter who needs to be reminded which end of the bat to hold, I know that if you do these sorts of things often enough names disappear from the beginner's rosters. On the other hand, if there are lots of games where I do that I'm not having nearly as much fun as I'd like to.

 

In the US in recreational sports, "good sportsmanship," applies primarily to the behavior you exhibit toward your opponents, not your behavior to your teammates. I think that definition is pretty deeply ingrained in some people, to the point that if you suggest otherwise they basically assume you're uncivilized or sociopathic.

 

So if there's a pair of abandoned fields standing empty at the corner of Bastion and Jung Ma, there's a view that the MLB, AAA, college, and maybe even high school varsity players should pack up their gear and go play there if they're serious about wanting good games. It makes perfect sense if you want to have as many people playing as long as possible. Call it the T-ball parents' booster organization view.

 

On the other hand, the municipal park rules say the fields are for everyone, it's not a commute to the far edge of town where no one lives, and the good burger joint and the good pizza place are just across the street from the city fields. So why should the good players be forced to give up all those perks if they're not breaking any rules? The T-ballers could in theory all cluster together in groups large enough so that they'd get all t-ball level games. Why should the skilled players who just want a pick up game after work be the ones forced to do a ton of organizational and administrative crap plus accept a large amount of inconvenience?

 

It's a situation that pretty much guarantees conflict and strong feelings, because both sides basically have gripes founded in legitimate concerns. It's the rec department's fault, but they have no budget for improvements, and the fact that the football and soccer leagues have been raising h3ll over the state of their fields which serve 20 times more people means that there's not likely to be a budget for our fields any time soon.

 

Neither side is yielding in this squabble, because at the core of their complaints neither side is actually wrong.

 

In theory, the skilled players could always throw every game for the sake of the T-ballers thus achieving 100% satisfactory results from the parents' view, but that's not really a reasonable request. It's also not really a fair request.

Given that everyone assumes that the rec department is never going to do anything about it though, the only people available to yell at are the high skill players.

 

I guess I'd call it a structurally unsatisfactory situation for everyone involved. One that perfectly balanced ship game mechanics would do very little to address (though I'd LOVE that on super serious nights, and pretty much every reasonably close game).

 

The, uh, stereotypical Nice Mom from Wisconsin, types think that you should, "play nice with the other kids Verain." Even if they understand the extent to which that irritates you (some may not), they want you to do it anyway, every time. Midwestern Nice Moms are like that, and can get surprisingly nasty if they think you're not being nice enough. After all, "being nice is more important than having fun, even if it's just a game." Or sometime especially if it's, "only a game."

 

That'd be easier to swallow though if Lendul could be relied on to supply hot-from-the-oven favorite deserts through the SWTOR client. Sure it's basically bribery for being good, but the Midwestern Nice Mom does tend to be enough of a realist to realize that, "being good," is a hard sell if there's never any reward for it.

 

I guess we could ask Bioware to implement some sort of CC based pastry delivery service through the cartel market? Sort of like ordering stuff on a mobile. Problem is that for rural and late night deliveries the cookies would be cold long before they arrived. Also knowing Bioware, they'd go with the cheapest franchised chain available, and not bother including the good bakeries.

[Lendul]

^ This is probably the most clever post of the year in the GSF forum. Good job Ramalina. The bad news is that sports references are lost on Verain. I did not know this until he said so himself last night in Drak's stream.

[wvwraith]

I'm going to sum up everything for newbies in learning gsf . Its like a hard lesson in swimming when you don't know how to swim and you get thrown in the water. Someone yells to you "Sink or swim." That's pretty much it. Now you may dogpaddle for awhile and that's expected. Eventually it gets better. I know someone mentioned misses and all that. I'll tell you there are little green Martians watching us and they're called the "RNG Gods" and boy do they make you have a bad day even when you're fully upgraded.

[Ramalina]

^ This is probably the most clever post of the year in the GSF forum. Good job Ramalina. The bad news is that sports references are lost on Verain. I did not know this until he said so himself last night in Drak's stream.

 

Oh, they're mostly lost on me too. It's just that baseball is sunk deeply enough into rural America's culture that I know the basic outline of the feeder structure from preschool to the pros, even though I'd be totally incompetent to ref a playground pickup game for 4th graders. [i [i]may[/i] have checked with Wikipedia to make sure T-ball was really a thing and that I wasn't mixing up baseball and golf]

 

 

My grandmother was from Minnesota though, so I was hoping to sort of skate past my sports ignorance on the strength of Midwestern Mom expertise.

 

 

Edit:

 

@ Despon. All good points, and I do try to remember to praise you for being extra good in my view (for outreach and mentoring). I'm not entirely clear on why Mr. Mom isn't railing about the inability to send you cookies.

 

I incline more toward the techno-introvert end of the personality spectrum, and in a lot of ways I find taking on a stack of mastered minelayers in a stock starguard to be more appealing than going up to a stranger and saying, "Hi." I mean, I'd rather greet strangers than shovel up 40 pounds of fresh dog s**t, but at 10 pounds I might have to think about it.

 

For me there's a tug-of-war between, "I should be more like Despon, Drako, and Zuck and reach out to mentor," and the amount of, "Ugh, do I have to," factor of pretending to be at least slightly extroverted, even through a pseudonym on an internet chat window. Which is why you see me writing guides and theorycrafting a lot more than anything involving real time social interaction with people I'm not already acquainted with in some form. Once in the "acquaintance" category you may not be able to get me to shut up, but that first contact moment, my reflex is to run for the hills.

 

I'd sort of like to get all the sides of the sportsmanship squabble to be at peace and at worst slightly unhappy, but that's not really possible unless the devs address underlying problems that they have clearly stated in the past that they aren't interesting in addressing, even in the event that resources become available for GSF.

 

Hm, on the silly ideas front, we could have GSF themed pets. The Nuubcuddle Rancor and the Nuubstomp Rancor. What's Star Wars without rancor after all (and terrible nerd puns)? If the rancor over this isn't going to go away, they could at least make it official right?

Edited February 11, 2017 by Ramalina

[FlavivsAetivs]

Once in the "acquaintance" category you may not be able to get me to shut up, but that first contact moment, my reflex is to run for the hills.

 

I just want to point out you're not alone in this regard.

 

~ Eudoxia

[rylanadionysis]

Solution - Tier levels.

 

0-10 matches legacy wide = Tier 1

11-100 matches legacy wide - Tier 2

101-500 matches legacy wide = Tier 3

501+ Matches = Tier 4

 

Each tier has the option of playing the tier above it or below it optionally, BUT, T4 could go down to t2 only if they use stock unupgraded ships, since most actual noobs with less than 100 matches under their belt would never have a fully mastered ship, and many might not even have one component mastered yet.

 

Keeps the noobs out of ultra competitive super games, keeps the strongest players in their own tier fighting people on their own level of experience, and gives some of the junior varsity the option of bumping up (i.e. optional ranked WZ queue format)

 

Not all that different from the level tiering system for ground. Hell a lot of us ground players reroll to play on lowbies all the time, its more balanced at low levels w/bolster than at 70

 

Also, id reckon it could even be 1000 or 2000 matches for tier 4 access and most of you would never know the difference. The only complaint I bet i see is that there wont be easy kill noobs around to farm.

Edited February 11, 2017 by rylanadionysis

[LilSaihah]

Solution - Tier levels.

 

0-10 matches legacy wide = Tier 1

11-100 matches legacy wide - Tier 2

101-500 matches legacy wide = Tier 3

501+ Matches = Tier 4

 

I don't think this does anything. When you have servers which only have maybe two dozen people with skill levels across the entire range, this just increases the time it takes to get into an ultimately unenjoyable game.

 

As far as I can tell, the population problem has two answers- either you condense all regional servers into a single megaserver, or you implement cross-server queuing. And I am not certain why they would not work towards either of these seeing as they benefit all multiplayer forms of content, not just GSF.

[Toraak]

I don't think this does anything. When you have servers which only have maybe two dozen people with skill levels across the entire range, this just increases the time it takes to get into an ultimately unenjoyable game.

 

As far as I can tell, the population problem has two answers- either you condense all regional servers into a single megaserver, or you implement cross-server queuing. And I am not certain why they would not work towards either of these seeing as they benefit all multiplayer forms of content, not just GSF.

 

I've seen many people discussing cross server queu's, and I've mentioned in the past, but will repeat it here. I've played WoW before and after cross server queu's. When they implemented it the community went to ****. whenever people did a cross server queu it meant they could treat each other as badly as they wanted. If you were a complete *** before X-servers you could be put onto a do not raid list, for a player/guild or if they behaved badly enough eventually many groups would black list the person. With x-server queu's this went out the door, so people were terrible to each other, and made for truly bad experiences for everyone.

 

I'm glad Swtor doesn't have cross server queu's, and hope they never will.

Edited February 11, 2017 by Toraak

[caederon]

Each tier has the option of playing the tier above it or below it optionally, BUT, T4 could go down to t2 only if they use stock unupgraded ships, since most actual noobs with less than 100 matches under their belt would never have a fully mastered ship, and many might not even have one component mastered yet.

Tiers or ranked play of some kind makes sense, but only (as noted in the post above) if the population was big enough to support it... which it probably would be at this point if the servers were condensed.

 

The actual matchmaking system in the game now does function reasonably well when there are enough people of varying skill level around. When I flew the

matches, I was largely pitted against new or intermediate players. Out of 50 matches, I had only one 'veterans rolling a team of new players' match, and a handful where I saw known veteran players sorted into very mixed teams. It is worth pointing out that veterans in stock ships still significantly outperform new players because experience is a far bigger advantage than gear in GSF, so if you had such a Tier system as you propose, I'm not sure even flying stock would make matches vs. veterans palatable for your Tier 2 players.

 

Star Conflict matches teams of beginning players against AI bots until they advance out of the lowest level of ships (their progression system is different from GSF's) and graduate into full-on PvP vs. humans. This seemed like a reasonable system to me, but implementing it in GSF would be really costly in terms of development time, so it seems very unlikely.

 

I still think that the most cost-effective and least asset-hungry sort of system to help new players (and indeed help veteran players) is adding a custom match lobby... one like internet games have used for decades. You could queue into the general pool and take whatever comes your way, or you could post a public (or private!) match in the lobby that people could join as they please. Such matches could have easily selected parameters, like allowing or disallowing ships, time limit, match type, etc. This would allow for creation of training arenas where you could teach people, it would allow for events like Super Serious to be conducted outside the regular queue (vastly speeding up getting the matches you want) and tournaments would be a breeze to run and organize. It would also allow for 'fun' _____-only matches or whatever conditions you enjoy. It also wouldn't involve them having to extensively re-code how the game currently operates.

 

- Despon

[Xoelloe]

I usually don't encourage spawncamping or triple capping. I also try and give out basic controls if I see a bunch of new pilots in a match.

 

But there's no way I will LET someone win.

 

~ Eudoxia

 

I seriously don't understand the problem with triple capping. Is it better when the whole team is defending the one sat they can for the whole game? Triple capping just makes it go away faster. There is no problem with triple capping.

[OscarDivine]

I seriously don't understand the problem with triple capping. Is it better when the whole team is defending the one sat they can for the whole game? Triple capping just makes it go away faster. There is no problem with triple capping.

 

I for one am in agreement with this.

 

Don't draw it out, it's like torture. It wastes everybody's time, the team holding their one sat that was practically handed to them on a silver platter is being pandered to. They are getting their "Participation Trophy" and told, "Great Job, have a tiny smidge of requisition."

 

On the OTHER HAND, apparently some people really LIKE that, so I sometimes think that having the "Sympathy Satellite" is just okay.

 

NOW, IN TDM: How do you handle that? Do you just fly to enemy lines and just hit X and AFK for 10-20 seconds and hope someone kills you? No, so why do that in Domination matches?

 

Here's the other side of the coin in Domination Matches. If you have One team that TOTALLY OUT MATCHES another team, and YOU are on the receiving end, would you prefer:

 

A) you get Pandered to - Have your Sympathy Satellite

B) you get Triple Capped, it's over faster, go try to get your Demolisher Medal

C) The other Team toys with you and lets you cap the sat, they take it back, the sat gets abandoned for re-capture, and so on and so forth.

 

I find A and C to be insulting to the losing team. Sure, we'll all take this gesture differently, I guess nobody is wrong, but at the same time, not everyone can agree with any actions taken in such a situation.

[Verain]

Solution - Tier levels.

 

0-10 matches legacy wide = Tier 1

11-100 matches legacy wide - Tier 2

101-500 matches legacy wide = Tier 3

501+ Matches = Tier 4

 

 

This is a common suggestion. It is terrible.

 

Basically, these ideas are "prevent the noobs from ever having to play with real players", usually with the intention that at some point, experienced players basically don't get queues. In your case you have another problem- people of intermediate experience may actually not even be able to get enough games to ever have pops. "GSF never pops" -> "Are you in tier 2? That stopped popping." -> "My friends and I have accounts in tier 2, we can get you pops, pick a time". Encouraging players to maintain multiple accounts in order to get queue pops is pretty much the worst thing that could happen to GSF.

[Verain]

I've seen many people discussing cross server queu's, and I've mentioned in the past, but will repeat it here. I've played WoW before and after cross server queu's. When they implemented it the community went to ****.

 

Disagree totally. I agree in part for when they implement cross server *dungeon* queues. But cross server pvp was added VERY early, and it was a huge success. Prior to cross server pvp, you could wait almost endlessly for a battleground to pop on some servers- there effectively was no pvp there. You would also have cases where you knew if you queued you would walk directly into an opposing faction's top guild farming. Basically, you had a much worse version of the common GSF complaints (WoW did not, and still does not, have wargames- after cross server, they didn't even need them).

 

If you were a complete *** before X-servers you could be put onto a do not raid list, for a player/guild or if they behaved badly enough eventually many groups would black list the person.

 

Again, I really think you are remembering the later and dubious cross server pve, and confusing it with the early and well received cross server pvp. Prior to cross server pve, malicious players were limited in terms of the total number of pve groups that they could grief, post cross server that number expanded without limit. But pvp never had this issue. Also note that pvp could always be solo queued, whereas no such mechanism existed for much of WoW in pve.

 

I'm glad Swtor doesn't have cross server queu's, and hope they never will.

 

They probably never will, and it's a damned shame as regards pvp.

[Verain]

C) The other Team toys with you and lets you cap the sat, they take it back, the sat gets abandoned for re-capture, and so on and so forth.

 

I've seen this brought up as a serious thing before, usually with the goal of generating req from objective capture. With that as the goal, it doesn't seem insulting as much as it seems exploitative.

 

I don't think that the medals and cheeves and such actually properly represent contribution. Early on, gunships were heavily bribed to barrel roll onto a sat that they had helped clear, because otherwise they would get a lot less req (the solution here was from the devs: they increased the req gain for railgun kills). To this day, a bomber who orbits a white node for a very long time before finally dying to overwhelming numbers, resulting in a win for his team, gains no recognition for this heroic and game winning achievement by the scoring system. The scout who deroosts gunships constantly and scores few kills also is poorly compensated, especially if he dies several times for his efforts, which can easily win a game. There's a whole bunch of situations where knowledge of the scoring system encourages a player to do things that are not really in the interest of the team winning.

[phalczen]

Here is the new information you and Verain seem incapable of assimilating. It's not that they do not like the game. They do not like the environment you are creating within the game.

 

But I don't think you can say that with 100% certainty. There are major roadblocks with the control scheme, with relatively useless stock strikes, trap components like RFL on anything and charged plating on ships without armor ... honestly I think there is a lot going on with a first match that deters new players more beyond any overt elitism or elitist talk within GSF chat.

 

More importantly, the GSF channel is sort of a self-selected group, isn't it? I mean, you've already filtered out people who have zero interest in the GSF mini game. Its not like the pvp channel which you see by default as soon as you log into the game. You have to manually activate the channel, and join it, tasks which aren't difficult but are likely beyond Joe Schmo picking up SWTOR for the very first time ever. Furthermore, you have to know that the channel exists, which means you have to either be on a server where its presence is routinely advertised in ops chat during a match, in a guild with pilots, or a reader of this subforum. In other words, people who have joined the channel are likely to be people who have started to educate themselves about the resources available for getting better.

 

So, Lendul, I've always appreciated your style and your desire to make the GSF environment a more accessible one, but I think you are proceeding from a position that has not yet been empirically validated. I think your assessment is plausible, but so are many other assessments presented in this thread.

 

3) Denying players the opportunity to earn medals/requisition to "level" up their ships.

 

Is this truly possible? I mean, if we're talking about domination, two players being under a sat turning it green do not negatively affect one another. Two players defending a sat earn defense points equally. I guess the only way a player can prevent another team mate from earning requisition is if I'm in a gunship and I snipe all the defense turrets. So, with a fully upgraded, fully charged slug and a lucky crit I think defense turrets can be sniped in what, two slugs? But I still can't cap the sat unless I fly to it within its interaction zone. So, while I may prevent a teammate from getting attacker points from the defense turrets, I can't prevent them from getting attacker points for the actual cap. Regarding TDM, I may not get kills, but I get assists, as long as I'm hitting the target. Don't assists give as much req as a kill? It is possible for a single player to get a large number of solo kills though, in a fully upgraded gunship and getting all the DO's on a map. You can one shot of lot of enemies with that combo and that does deny your teammates some req, I admit. The flipside is if you have someone that skilled on your team, I'd argue you have a decent chance of winning, which gives more requisition, xp, credits, occasionally conquest objectives, CXP, and Unassembled Components than a loss. I guess that a team member could attempt to deny a person the opportunity to level up a non meta ship, but that would be with words alone and not enforceable. The player on the receiving end of the verbal barrage would still have the choice to level up their ship of choice or respond to the needs of the team.

 

I would argue that if an enemy team three caps in a domination match, the only people denied requisition are the players denying themselves of requisition because they don't try and fight for a sat.

 

Or, Akabelleth, are you referring to one side denying the enemy requisition because they are winning, and dominantly so? Is Kephess denying me CXP because he doesn't roll over and die the moment I show up in front of him? Are the Rotworms denying me CXP because they won't just let us Frog-dogs score 6 touchdowns immediately? Requisition isn't an entitlement, its supposed to represent you achieving something within the match.

 

Tiers or ranked play of some kind makes sense, but only (as noted in the post above) if the population was big enough to support it... which it probably would be at this point if the servers were condensed.

[snip]

I still think that the most cost-effective and least asset-hungry sort of system to help new players (and indeed help veteran players) is adding a custom match lobby... one like internet games have used for decades.

 

I agree with a lot you do Despon but I've never felt like this suggestion was right, at least not at this point in the game's life. I fear custom-match lobbies would dilute the GSF queue pool more than help it. Honestly, its the same reason why the Devs won't allow people to take Arenas out of their unranked warzone queuing ... or removing huttball, or having only huttball, or any of the other various warzones people would want to exclude or only include in their personal rotation. GSF suffers from the fact that 40% of its content is essentially akin to ground Arenas, and the devs have been very clear that the easiest way to reduce wait times is not giving people options to exclude things from their queue selections. They seem perfectly willing to allow de-selection for PVE content because, I think its safe to say, that pops more often than any form of pvp. But they've always maintained that for pvp, wait time is of paramount concern and I don't see that changing any time soon. I think TDM is a suboptimal way for just learning GSF for the exact same reasons that Arenas are a suboptimal way of learning ground pvp as a beginner, but unless the benefits of Galactic Command are enough to sustain-ably increase the GSF population long term, I don't see them adding custom lobbies. I also don't think its necessarily a solution to the problem of unsportsmanlike conduct presented by the OP.

[phalczen]

There's a whole bunch of situations where knowledge of the scoring system encourages a player to do things that are not really in the interest of the team winning.

 

At least, post 5.1.1, more unassembled components drop from a win, so at least that player is somewhat rewarded for helping their team win.

 

I'm not sure of the mathematics behind CXP earned though. I know wins result in more CXP than losses.

[caederon]

I also don't think its necessarily a solution to the problem of unsportsmanlike conduct presented by the OP.

It's a solution in that it very directly lets people avoid situations where they are exposed to 'unsportsmanlike' conduct (and defining that is up to considerable debate) by defining their own rules of engagement and who's playing in the match. You'll never be able to control people's behavior in an online game unless they are playing outside the rules, in which case you can ban them. Within the rules, people will act as they please.

 

Let's say that such a lobby did indeed dilute the general queue... well, people would still be playing GSF. If someone was tired of waiting for the general queue, and they saw a match in the lobby that had open slots and looked interesting, they could join it... or they could post one, themselves. Nothing says they couldn't also be in-queue in general while waiting for their custom match to fill up or while looking for one. Whichever pops sooner, they could choose to play.

 

... not that I expect such a thing (or really, anything) to be added to GSF. If I was designing a similar game from scratch, it would have this functionality.

 

- Despon

Edited February 12, 2017 by caederon

[Wildtee]

At least, post 5.1.1, more unassembled components drop from a win, so at least that player is somewhat rewarded for helping their team win.

 

I'm not sure of the mathematics behind CXP earned though. I know wins result in more CXP than losses.

 

Please note: Musco stated that GSF would not be getting a boost to its component drops.

 

-Skell

[dizzyd]

Allow me to say this. I am a very new player in the GSF community on Jedi Covenant. I've been flying actively for about a month. I have zero ships mastered. I have bumbled my way into buying at least one gunship that I don't have the skill with yet to earn req to upgrade. I mostly fly scouts, while learning what the I'm doing and where I can try to help.

 

Yessir, the learning curve is steep. Yessir, I feel like a big fat juicy target most of the time. I have asked questions and been helped, and pointed to the guides and GSF School videos, which by the way were HUGELY helpful to me. I have personally experienced veteran players being very quick to group with me and help me learn, on both factions. I have done ground pvp in both SWToR and laughably, WoW. The matches I have played in GSF are much much much more enjoyable than any ground pvp match I've been in. Caveat: I suck at ground pvp, and as such don't enjoy it. Even having been on the recieving end of 3 caps, and lopsided losses (50-3) in team deathmatch, I personally don't find these to be reasons to not queue back up. If anything, these occurrences spur me to try harder to help the teams I'm on. Do I always find a way to do anything but barrel roll at the wrong time, splattering a rock or manage to get out of the sights of the gunships? No. Still learning! Yet in my experience thus far, after a bad loss, the next few matches end up competetive, and every so often, I even find a way to be helpful!

 

So my view on the short time I've been playing is this: sometimes, I'm gonna be killed, A LOT. Sometimes, I'm going to kill a turret, maybe even a player, and help cap a node. Sometimes I'm going to get a lucky draw and benefit drom having veteran players in my group. I am still clawing my way uphill in terms of upgrading ships, and learning how to fly. But the community makes this a FUN challenge. I feel like the community is full of sportsmanship and mutual respect. So a big thank you everyone for that.

[Krixarcs]

to me it read good sportsmanship and why it matters least to me

 

The Kronies have been giving the other team not one but TWO whole entire satellites to the other team just to give them some free points. we also suicide in deathmatches sometimes to let the other team win. tbh it would be a good movement for the community to follow with suits.

 

are you bad enuff to torpedo your winloss records and damage per game numbers? since the kronies started doing this, the king cant post brag numbers anymore but he lets his blasters do all the chatting now

Edited February 14, 2017 by Krixarcs

[MaximilianPower]

Allow me to say this. I am a very new player in the GSF community on Jedi Covenant. I've been flying actively for about a month. I have zero ships mastered. I have bumbled my way into buying at least one gunship that I don't have the skill with yet to earn req to upgrade. I mostly fly scouts, while learning what the I'm doing and where I can try to help.

 

Yessir, the learning curve is steep. Yessir, I feel like a big fat juicy target most of the time. I have asked questions and been helped, and pointed to the guides and GSF School videos, which by the way were HUGELY helpful to me. I have personally experienced veteran players being very quick to group with me and help me learn, on both factions. I have done ground pvp in both SWToR and laughably, WoW. The matches I have played in GSF are much much much more enjoyable than any ground pvp match I've been in. Caveat: I suck at ground pvp, and as such don't enjoy it. Even having been on the recieving end of 3 caps, and lopsided losses (50-3) in team deathmatch, I personally don't find these to be reasons to not queue back up. If anything, these occurrences spur me to try harder to help the teams I'm on. Do I always find a way to do anything but barrel roll at the wrong time, splattering a rock or manage to get out of the sights of the gunships? No. Still learning! Yet in my experience thus far, after a bad loss, the next few matches end up competetive, and every so often, I even find a way to be helpful!

 

So my view on the short time I've been playing is this: sometimes, I'm gonna be killed, A LOT. Sometimes, I'm going to kill a turret, maybe even a player, and help cap a node. Sometimes I'm going to get a lucky draw and benefit drom having veteran players in my group. I am still clawing my way uphill in terms of upgrading ships, and learning how to fly. But the community makes this a FUN challenge. I feel like the community is full of sportsmanship and mutual respect. So a big thank you everyone for that.

 

Hi Sakov! I'm thrilled to see you express these sentiments. This is exactly the kind of attitude a new player needs to have in order to successfully ascend the near-vertical GSF learning curve. And your efforts are paying off; you're clearly improving. We were on opposite sides of a horrific 50-5 shipyards TDM last night, and your performance there was pretty much the only positive thing I was able to glean from it. At one point you hit me with a volley of pods, and I wanted to give you a high-five through my monitor. Bravo.

 

Contrary to the opinions of some, that's what the vast majority of veterans want to see: new pilots - excited about the game - successfully finding, absorbing, and assimilating community resources. I mean, of course I can't speak for anyone but myself...but this is the kind of thing that keeps me going. We need more Sakovs!

[OscarDivine]

Sakov!! You are the model player when it comes to learning GSF. I am so encouraged by your learning, improvement, and your tenacity to keep at it. I wish all the new pilots approached the game as you do.

[phalczen]

Please note: Musco stated that GSF would not be getting a boost to its component drops.

 

-Skell

 

Yes, I am aware of that, and it does not contradict my point. Players are still incentivized to try and win the match, even if a GSF win does not, or will not in a future update, give as many components as a ranked arena win that lasts longer than 2 minutes or whatever the cutoff is. Regardless of its unassembled component yield relative to other forms of pvp now or in a future patch, a win is still more profitable than a loss, by an order of magnitude larger than the benefit to XP, credits, or CXP

[Storm-Cutter]

I usually don't encourage spawncamping or triple capping. I also try and give out basic controls if I see a bunch of new pilots in a match.

 

But there's no way I will LET someone win.

 

~ Eudoxia

My feelings exactly. ^

I want to be feared in the skies, but also respected.

[Lendul]

My feelings exactly. ^

I want to be feared in the skies, but also respected.

Philosophical question. Using your own definition for each what is the difference between those two?