Sarova Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 "But the long and short of it is that Quinn is loyal to an absolute fault. And unfortunately his loyalty to Baras long outdates his loyalty to you, even though the bond you've forged with him may be more real and based on deeper things. Baras literally saved Quinn's life, and, even more important to him, his career, at a time when he was only just starting out really, and all his dreams and hopes and great potential we're about to be dashed. So when you and Baras begin to cross swords, it's a truly awful crisis for him. In my mind, therefore, there was no need for Baras to use the force to make Quinn betray you. I tried to leave it open to interpretation that Quinn could have secretly programmed the war droids so the SW would be able to defeat them, and sprang the betrayal otherwise faithfully. He'd then be able to have honored or seemed to have honored his duty to Baras, while being "faithful" to you. And he'd of course be willing to pay the ultimate price for this conflict of interest he's responsible for. In my mind, he would not expect to survive the event, and would never divulge his true intentions. He is a man who understands sacrifice for integrity and principle. Even if he has to live now estranged from the one he admires, respects and even loves most." Brilliant, especially I tried to leave it open to interpretation that Quinn could have secretly programmed the war droids so the SW would be able to defeat them, and sprang the betrayal otherwise faithfully. He'd then be able to have honored or seemed to have honored his duty to Baras, while being "faithful" to you. It must have been a relief to Quinn that his SW survived the attack and that his debt to Baras had finally been paid - even though Baras said back on Balmorra that it had - when, in fact, it hadn't. I always thought Quinn was initially "freed" by Baras from his service on Balmorra to be planted in the SW crew, with the ultimate goal of killing the SW since Baras knew the she/he was a threat to him, but (in my head fantasy) Baras never factored in Quinn falling in love with the Warrior. I often thought he may have programmed the Droids badly on purpose so that makes me happy that the writer left it "open to interpretation" And people wonder why there is so much Quinn worship Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grania Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 (edited) Well put~ I don't have any insights on the Theron betrayal that haven't already been made by other people, and very well. But he does speak to all my characters with the same tone regardless of their relationship. Just an alternate line inserted here and there, just like Quinn's betrayal. Ok, Mr Teverson is off the hook! There are other kinds of warriors he needs to speak to than just mine, I guess. *kicks dirt* And people wonder why there is so much Quinn worship Seriously Edited October 13, 2017 by grania Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightfrogger Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 Nice to read his thoughts on it...but I am sticking with my story It is cannon enough for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cawyden Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 Yes.....because I don't think either of us wanted to try to type everything out in Twitter's 140-character limit. I know I would've gone insane. And...here we go. Had to leave out a little at the beginning at his request, but gave me the impression that the whole betrayal scenario/conversation that was changed had made more sense with the "kill" option that got taken out.... (Everything in the spoiler tag is C&P straight from his message to me, so it's straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak.) "But the long and short of it is that Quinn is loyal to an absolute fault. And unfortunately his loyalty to Baras long outdates his loyalty to you, even though the bond you've forged with him may be more real and based on deeper things. Baras literally saved Quinn's life, and, even more important to him, his career, at a time when he was only just starting out really, and all his dreams and hopes and great potential we're about to be dashed. So when you and Baras begin to cross swords, it's a truly awful crisis for him. In my mind, therefore, there was no need for Baras to use the force to make Quinn betray you. I tried to leave it open to interpretation that Quinn could have secretly programmed the war droids so the SW would be able to defeat them, and sprang the betrayal otherwise faithfully. He'd then be able to have honored or seemed to have honored his duty to Baras, while being "faithful" to you. And he'd of course be willing to pay the ultimate price for this conflict of interest he's responsible for. In my mind, he would not expect to survive the event, and would never divulge his true intentions. He is a man who understands sacrifice for integrity and principle. Even if he has to live now estranged from the one he admires, respects and even loves most." Hey that is awesome - thank you so much for reaching out to him and sharing with us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jagaimee Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 Yes.....because I don't think either of us wanted to try to type everything out in Twitter's 140-character limit. I know I would've gone insane. And...here we go. Had to leave out a little at the beginning at his request, but gave me the impression that the whole betrayal scenario/conversation that was changed had made more sense with the "kill" option that got taken out.... (Everything in the spoiler tag is C&P straight from his message to me, so it's straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak.) "But the long and short of it is that Quinn is loyal to an absolute fault. And unfortunately his loyalty to Baras long outdates his loyalty to you, even though the bond you've forged with him may be more real and based on deeper things. Baras literally saved Quinn's life, and, even more important to him, his career, at a time when he was only just starting out really, and all his dreams and hopes and great potential we're about to be dashed. So when you and Baras begin to cross swords, it's a truly awful crisis for him. In my mind, therefore, there was no need for Baras to use the force to make Quinn betray you. I tried to leave it open to interpretation that Quinn could have secretly programmed the war droids so the SW would be able to defeat them, and sprang the betrayal otherwise faithfully. He'd then be able to have honored or seemed to have honored his duty to Baras, while being "faithful" to you. And he'd of course be willing to pay the ultimate price for this conflict of interest he's responsible for. In my mind, he would not expect to survive the event, and would never divulge his true intentions. He is a man who understands sacrifice for integrity and principle. Even if he has to live now estranged from the one he admires, respects and even loves most." Quinn: ...oh. I...er...apologize, then... Ahh...I see. Well, for those who don't like the explanation, there's always headcanon, working bits of "canon" into imagination, or just discarding it outright - but it's really nice to finally find out just what Quinn's real motivation was. And that does make sense, given his character. It's awesome that the writer responded and actually gave us a full, detailed explanation Thank you, feylyndiira, for asking him in the first place and relaying his response to us Quinnmancers! (Out of curiosity, did he ever answer the "hey, so do you know about the giant Quinnmancers thread on the SWTOR forums" question?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feylyndiira Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 Quinn: ...oh. I...er...apologize, then... Ahh...I see. Well, for those who don't like the explanation, there's always headcanon, working bits of "canon" into imagination, or just discarding it outright - but it's really nice to finally find out just what Quinn's real motivation was. And that does make sense, given his character. It's awesome that the writer responded and actually gave us a full, detailed explanation Thank you, feylyndiira, for asking him in the first place and relaying his response to us Quinnmancers! (Out of curiosity, did he ever answer the "hey, so do you know about the giant Quinnmancers thread on the SWTOR forums" question?) Yeah, I had figured that what he said was the case. I decided to try a different path for my story, but I haven't gotten to the betrayal yet in it, so now I'm pondering how things might change knowing what I do now. I was at kind of a crossroads where I was debating between continuing on with my head-canon or veering it more towards what I thought canon might be (and actually turned out to be).So yeah....it's given me lots to think on. And no, he hasn't mentioned it yet. I fired off a couple of non-Quinn questions to him this morning (but mentioned the thread again), but haven't heard back yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunafox Posted October 13, 2017 Author Share Posted October 13, 2017 Yes.....because I don't think either of us wanted to try to type everything out in Twitter's 140-character limit. I know I would've gone insane. And...here we go. Had to leave out a little at the beginning at his request, but gave me the impression that the whole betrayal scenario/conversation that was changed had made more sense with the "kill" option that got taken out.... (Everything in the spoiler tag is C&P straight from his message to me, so it's straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak.) "But the long and short of it is that Quinn is loyal to an absolute fault. And unfortunately his loyalty to Baras long outdates his loyalty to you, even though the bond you've forged with him may be more real and based on deeper things. Baras literally saved Quinn's life, and, even more important to him, his career, at a time when he was only just starting out really, and all his dreams and hopes and great potential we're about to be dashed. So when you and Baras begin to cross swords, it's a truly awful crisis for him. In my mind, therefore, there was no need for Baras to use the force to make Quinn betray you. I tried to leave it open to interpretation that Quinn could have secretly programmed the war droids so the SW would be able to defeat them, and sprang the betrayal otherwise faithfully. He'd then be able to have honored or seemed to have honored his duty to Baras, while being "faithful" to you. And he'd of course be willing to pay the ultimate price for this conflict of interest he's responsible for. In my mind, he would not expect to survive the event, and would never divulge his true intentions. He is a man who understands sacrifice for integrity and principle. Even if he has to live now estranged from the one he admires, respects and even loves most." I just woke up, still groggy, but hit this thread first thing! And wow, that was really great of him to give such a detailed answer and great of you to seek that answer out! Thank you, and please relay our thanks to him as well. It's funny, I'd rather suspected these things, like the droids, and he was right, in the way he left it, it was up to interpretation and that's pretty much how I interpreted it, but it's different knowing that was what was in his mind, and not something I'd made up in my own mind to feel better about things. I guess I'd always worried that I was reaching, or seeing something that wasn't there, but given that's what he intended, I feel a lot better about things. I can now tell my hubby to 'stuff it' lol when he teases me about him actually betraying and trying to kill me. I had a couple of different theories about why things were the way they were, and I'm relieved and happy that this doesn't change my headcanon at all. It works quite nicely with everything I had going on in the noodle. Thanks again for this, absolutely brilliant! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damask_Rose Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 :D:D Yes! Yes! Yes! I was on the nose! Take that naysayers who think we were making up excuses! :D:D @rachetsw The guild should make top 10 if anyone wants to jump in and do some Alderaan heroics for encryptions. I've donated some personnel & monkey lizard decos, but I'm not sure what I should focus on for needed decos for the ship and stronghold. If you could set the "Fangirl" permissions so I can donate decorations directly there are more things I can get. Do we want to stick with Yavin for the stronghold or switch to another? I'm not sure if I have permission to donate credits and then unlock rooms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lammia Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 Well... I theorised with friends that he subconsciously sabotaged the droids to make sure you survived, so a possibility he did it on purpose, not subconsciously, is even better imho; we didn't go that far in our guessing. Being loyal to Baras until it became complicated is actually reflected in one of betrayal versions (dialogue resulting from your warrior's path), so not surprising, even if not very obvious (especially if you don't get that line from him) or open for speculation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rachetsw Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 Yeah I need to do the heroics and everything. Been writing a lot lately. I have four chapters written but they aren't linear so I haven't posted them yet. I will change permissions when I get home. Sorry, I didn't even think about bank access. :/ I like the Yavin stronghold because of the amount of centerpiece hooks. But we could change it to Manaan or Tatooine and still have enough centerpiece hooks for hot tub parties. 😜 I wish you could donate companion decos. *sigh* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orangenee Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 I'm close, just a couple of hours and Quintastic will be in my ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarova Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 I'm close, just a couple of hours and Quintastic will be in my ship. Woohoo! Enjoy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunafox Posted October 14, 2017 Author Share Posted October 14, 2017 I'm close, just a couple of hours and Quintastic will be in my ship. Gzz! Hope you enjoy him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightfrogger Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 I'm close, just a couple of hours and Quintastic will be in my ship. Your ship will be in good hands then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feylyndiira Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 Okay....my last question to Neil wasn't about Quinn, but Zylixx (the Jedi on Jaesa's ship that you can try to turn to the Dark) because well...I liked him! (I think he would've made a good flirt option to actually "seduce" to the dark side.) But, anyway....I asked what might have happened to him afterwards if the warrior tried to turn him and he gave some interesting insight into his outlook on the Force as well as answering the question: I think Zylixx's story could be very interesting. To me, the traditional light side Jedi is flawed, just as the dark side sith is flawed. Extremes are flawed. I think Star Wars intended to explore the shortcomings of both sides with Luke, who is essentially "good" but at odds with the light side's aversion to emotion. Their fear of feelings. To me Luke was meant to be a new paradigm, a grey Jedi. One who can walk close to the flame of his feelings, gain strength from them, without becoming dark. As a writer, and especially writing a sith class story, it's really easy to poke holes in the light side credo, and that's what the zylixx encounter was supposed to demonstrate. Zylixx is already walking the line between light and dark. He might not even know it, but the warrior can smell it on him and can seize on it. What becomes of zylixx would depend on how honest he is with the Jedi (and himself) after the brush with the SW. But I'd love it if he dared to risk falling and found a way to reconcile the two sides. That would be his "success" story in my mind. But equally interesting would be the story of him going insane. Trained as a Jedi and indoctrinated into the light side belief system and not able to escape the shame of impurity that the SW exposed in him. Even if he returns to the order and trains again and tries to rededicate himself, a seed will always be there. And I could see him growing to despise himself, but not allow himself to fall. And the last possible outcome would of course be that he tries not to but ultimately gives in to the dark side. That's kind of a high level exploration of the character moving on from that moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asmodesu Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 That's interesting. In my fic I had him track my warrior down again, joining my warrior like Jaesa had, as a second apprentice. Since my warrior is played as toeing the line of light/dark. My warrior tried to point out how he was going a bit dark. I really liked the Jedi encounters with a light-leaning sith warrior. There was quite a few of them and they jogged my thoughts about the force, jedi and sith. As well as approaching the sith hierarchy, and imperial military exploring how it all worked. Having characters like Quinn, Vette and Pierce on board (Officer, soldier and slave backgrounds). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feylyndiira Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 That's interesting. In my fic I had him track my warrior down again, joining my warrior like Jaesa had, as a second apprentice. Since my warrior is played as toeing the line of light/dark. My warrior tried to point out how he was going a bit dark. I really liked the Jedi encounters with a light-leaning sith warrior. There was quite a few of them and they jogged my thoughts about the force, jedi and sith. As well as approaching the sith hierarchy, and imperial military exploring how it all worked. Having characters like Quinn, Vette and Pierce on board (Officer, soldier and slave backgrounds). Yeah, I asked the question because I'm planning on a branch-off story following him and what his thoughts/experiences are after his encounter with my warrior. I also planned on having him join her at some point in the future (probably after the vanilla story is done). My preliminary thought was that he ended up in Korriban eventually and started training as a SIth. When Hyperia arrives to face Baras, she encounters him and takes him on as her second apprentice after she defeats Baras. Hyperia tends to skirt the line between dark and light herself since she was a Jedi initiate before being "rescued" by the SIth during the fall of the Jedi Temple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunafox Posted October 14, 2017 Author Share Posted October 14, 2017 Okay....my last question to Neil wasn't about Quinn, but Zylixx (the Jedi on Jaesa's ship that you can try to turn to the Dark) because well...I liked him! (I think he would've made a good flirt option to actually "seduce" to the dark side.) But, anyway....I asked what might have happened to him afterwards if the warrior tried to turn him and he gave some interesting insight into his outlook on the Force as well as answering the question: I think Zylixx's story could be very interesting. To me, the traditional light side Jedi is flawed, just as the dark side sith is flawed. Extremes are flawed. I think Star Wars intended to explore the shortcomings of both sides with Luke, who is essentially "good" but at odds with the light side's aversion to emotion. Their fear of feelings. To me Luke was meant to be a new paradigm, a grey Jedi. One who can walk close to the flame of his feelings, gain strength from them, without becoming dark. As a writer, and especially writing a sith class story, it's really easy to poke holes in the light side credo, and that's what the zylixx encounter was supposed to demonstrate. Zylixx is already walking the line between light and dark. He might not even know it, but the warrior can smell it on him and can seize on it. What becomes of zylixx would depend on how honest he is with the Jedi (and himself) after the brush with the SW. But I'd love it if he dared to risk falling and found a way to reconcile the two sides. That would be his "success" story in my mind. But equally interesting would be the story of him going insane. Trained as a Jedi and indoctrinated into the light side belief system and not able to escape the shame of impurity that the SW exposed in him. Even if he returns to the order and trains again and tries to rededicate himself, a seed will always be there. And I could see him growing to despise himself, but not allow himself to fall. And the last possible outcome would of course be that he tries not to but ultimately gives in to the dark side. That's kind of a high level exploration of the character moving on from that moment. More interesting insights! I had almost forgotten all about that guy (Zylixx), but I can see how he would fascinate, and especially given the options that Neil spoke of in his answer to you. This is really great, I'm really enjoying getting a glimpse into his mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarova Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 Okay....my last question to Neil wasn't about Quinn, but Zylixx (the Jedi on Jaesa's ship that you can try to turn to the Dark) because well...I liked him! (I think he would've made a good flirt option to actually "seduce" to the dark side.) But, anyway....I asked what might have happened to him afterwards if the warrior tried to turn him and he gave some interesting insight into his outlook on the Force as well as answering the question: I think Zylixx's story could be very interesting. To me, the traditional light side Jedi is flawed, just as the dark side sith is flawed. Extremes are flawed. I think Star Wars intended to explore the shortcomings of both sides with Luke, who is essentially "good" but at odds with the light side's aversion to emotion. Their fear of feelings. To me Luke was meant to be a new paradigm, a grey Jedi. One who can walk close to the flame of his feelings, gain strength from them, without becoming dark. As a writer, and especially writing a sith class story, it's really easy to poke holes in the light side credo, and that's what the zylixx encounter was supposed to demonstrate. Zylixx is already walking the line between light and dark. He might not even know it, but the warrior can smell it on him and can seize on it. What becomes of zylixx would depend on how honest he is with the Jedi (and himself) after the brush with the SW. But I'd love it if he dared to risk falling and found a way to reconcile the two sides. That would be his "success" story in my mind. But equally interesting would be the story of him going insane. Trained as a Jedi and indoctrinated into the light side belief system and not able to escape the shame of impurity that the SW exposed in him. Even if he returns to the order and trains again and tries to rededicate himself, a seed will always be there. And I could see him growing to despise himself, but not allow himself to fall. And the last possible outcome would of course be that he tries not to but ultimately gives in to the dark side. That's kind of a high level exploration of the character moving on from that moment. I'm in the process of levelling another light sided warrior - I did not realise there was an option I could take in which Zylixx lives. Unfortunately, I've only managed to choose options that lead to a death fight - even on my previous light sided Jedi. I know Zylixx is a little bit off the Quinn thread, however had you not posted that I would never have found about choosing options that let him live, as I quite liked that he was on the cusp of the dark side. I wonder what the crew would have been like if warriors had been able to have Zylixx as a companion instead of Broonmark? Well, apart from the double eye candy that is - the warrior and Jaesa would never have got any work done with Quinn and Zylixx around & Vette stirring the pot. Pierce would have despaired! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grania Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 Was he the orange haired guy? Sorry I barely remember him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarova Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 Was he the orange haired guy? Sorry I barely remember him Yes I love red heads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grania Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 That's what I thought! Orange haired Quinn So many Quinns in the warrior story, someday I'm going to catalogue them all.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orangenee Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 Yes I love red heads As do I, but not dudes. Unless it's Mr Quinn. Hence my being drawn to Shae Hotstuff, I would make a topic on her but there's too much of that already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pazzakey Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 Yes I love red heads Kira's better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grania Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 Kira's better I realized not too long ago that all my warriors have Kira's face Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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