"All gold NPCs now grant 1 Command Experience point (down from 10)."

[Andryah]

Sent a message to Eric Musco. I know he's only a messenger, but I figured it was the best way to get my voice heard.

 

The best approach to take probably. Rational, objective, focused... and without all the childish tantrums.

 

I'm in no way surprised by the magnitude of the nerf. Why? Because they have a pattern of over nerfing rewards in this MMO. Players over use something... gain more out of it then expected/intended by the studio, and the studio feels compelled to take action.

 

I am in no way defending the action they took here (I disagree with the magnitude of the change)....

 

....That said...here is what I think their core methodology is about nerfing rewards on the fly like this: they observe a problem (either directly, or reported by players, or both) and they take a very superficial assessment of how to stop whatever it is quickly. The simple way to do this is to just dial a knob waaaay back on their lookup tables. That fixes the immediate issue, but of course introduces a chain of side effects. Next, they spend a bit more time to actually figure out a correct balance point and adjust the knobs back up to some middle ground. >>We watched them do this same exact thing last year with companions in 4.0.

 

Some players here are giving good feedback, but a lot of players are in fact being hateful, spiteful, and exhibiting bad temperament. Feedback from the players is always good, but it needs to be objective feedback, not spite filled drive by insults like a lot of you are doing in this thread. We as players will get more response and respect for the studio if we all stop the childish rants, threats, and insults... and stick to an objective statement of the issue/concern, offer potential objective solutions, and politely ask the studio to take a closer look at the issue/concern. Behaving like petulant children on a playground rage is not productive. I encourage players to ask themselves... do you want to encourage positive change.... or just rant and rage and vent and thus encouraging the studio to just disregard you? We, collectively, as a player base can and need to do better in the feedback department.

Edited December 3, 2016 by Andryah

[Pirana]

EAWare wasn't happy with the current rate of canceled subscriptions, something had to be done.

[Theeko]

EAWare wasn't happy with the current rate of canceled subscriptions, something had to be done.

 

But to bait and switch almost everything in game from promotions to in game material doesn't seem to healthy

[JediAkemi]

To quote Kilran; "Lying or incompetent? No matter"

 

Whether they meant to screw us or if things have just gone horribly wrong, we're still screwed.

[Alloou]

Friendly advise.

Uninstall,take a long break and let the dust settle.

 

I uninstalled after nearly 3 years, cancelled my sub which expires on 18th.

I will check the live stream in January to see this group content (which i have a feeling will be another 4-8 uprisings...).

I will check regularly the forums and Dulfy when/if next expansion will have anything noteworthy and then decide whether i will come back for next expansion.

 

I did 2 uprisings, and did the story on my warrior, reached lvl 7 on Galactic and have 1 mainhand to show for it. I decided that the RNGrind is not my cup of tea,got no time for such lame system so i pretty much did all the content of this expansion.

[Pirana]

But to bait and switch almost everything in game from promotions to in game material doesn't seem to healthy

That was sarcasm, next time I'll spell it out.

[DarthTreize]

I've posted on threads about what they dislike severely about the new expansion and I felt that this was another good thread to post on. First and foremost, I've been playing this game since 2011, it's release. I was in high school when they dropped the first "trailers" in 2009 so safe to say I am bit older and wiser now. I also come from WoW (like many others) and that started for me in 2006-07. So roughly a decades worth of MMO/online knowledge. With that out of the way I have to say Bioware had made really dumb, and really good decisions over the past 4-5 years. This by far is one of the worst which indicated the poor quality of talent left on the team. By the way, I want to recognize that it must really blow to have your work criticized so harshly by the community you created but that's what this industry has become. Not only here but everywhere, poor quality games, poor devs, poor business choices, all because people continue to buy crummy products. It's pretty simple.

 

To get on track, the command system, while I personally don't see the merit in it, has potential to work. The problem however is the fact that everything is random. If the drops from the crates are truly "by chance" then there is equal opportunity for person A to get all their gear in lets say 14 crates, whereas person B may require 50 crates. As you get higher in ranks, the more CXP you need for each crate. Which means you really want to make sure you get good ish early as possible otherwise, that last piece may take months. Literally. Which is is stupid imo. With the way the system works now, it severely limits the capability of individuals who play multiple characters to do so. A game that is story driven, the whole point is for people to have access to multiple characters. MMO's like WoW aren't necessarily designed the same way but the systems they have in place allow for people to have multiple characters and gear said characters appropriately. I'm not even talking about the best of the best, I am simply stating low level-mid level end game gear should take some time to get, but not this long.

 

MY PROPOSAL

 

If I am not mistaken, OPs and WZ's offer the best CXP but I am not sure how the loot system now works in the ops (do they drop crates or gear?) if they don't they should. Completing the weekly challenges (like 10 story mode uprisings) should grant you 1 crate. The reason I am saying this is because it doesn't eliminate the need to grind for the CXP but it allows people to have attainable goals. Real goals. Like I said, it could take a month to get the gear needed, it could just as likely take until next halloween depending on how the gear drops. I want to kind of bring back something from BIOWARES past with the Illum dailies and the Champion Gear Grind. For those who never did them, be thankful, but also realize that this system is very similar, but far, far worse. When the game launched there was a need to create a bagillion servers. The eventual result was when subs declined, the servers basically had zero population. If you weren't in a guild that raided/did flashpoints, you weren't even getting blues/Tionese (tier 1) gear. The only way to circumvent this was to PvP (which was difficult because the servers literally had like 100 people on it, both empire and republic) or to go to illum and hunt for these obscene crates in the center of the pvp zone (see a theme here?). The servers were dead enough you could complete the daily requirement and weekly requirement in one day (as long as no one was trying to kill you!). In essence, you would be able to get a good chunk of your centurion (tier 1 pvp gear) and a piece of your champion (tier 2, ilvl 136) per week. It still required one to grind and grind and grind to get the gear but it was an attainable goal. It took time, but not some crazy absurd amount of time, plus you were GARUNTEED to at least get an "purple set" of gear to use after a few weeks which weren't optimal for raiding but it was better than blues/greens.

 

If the command system changed at least to be akin to that, where there were more chances for hardcore and casuals to obtain said crates, the system would immediately be more optimal. To recap:

1. Have crates drop from bosses (ops or master level, even at the veteran level, if they don't already)

2. Have weekly missions give a crate

3. Create dailies that give access to crates

If something like this isn't done than there needs to be a change to drastically reduce the points per level as well as increase the points earned per daily/weekly anything. If that can't happen then the crates need to be similar to the pvp crates granted from Illum dailies that GARUNTEED a piece "x" lvl gear. This needs to happen because this grind system is ludicrous and is a total spit in the face of the community, while not always grateful, has supported you and YOUR FAMILIES for the past half decade.

[Helfen]

Probably the worst progression system I've ever seen in a game to start with. The grind increased still more one day after it drops.

 

I've spend hundreds on this game until now, but will never spend another penny until this system disappears.

 

Unsubbed

[TheSeer]

Another stupid move to add to an already ugly system. Ugh, it wouldn't be so bad if it was legacy bound (still hate the random chance aspect of getting armor), but at least it would be more acceptable as all my character would be helping push up my rank, yet no we can't have that. No you need to grind, grind, and grind some more. I highly doubt this will keep any players from leaving. Heck, they could have even made it at least started at level one, so you can start building up your rank on a new characters right from the start.

 

I think this system in the end is going to harm this game far more by making many different types of players mad- causals, pvper, free players, preferred player, raider (those few that remain), etc. and just as many probably wouldn't care such as me (story players, role-players, etc.). Meaning the system has far more chance of driving off players then bring back new ones or retaining old ones. Smart move, really smart move.

 

You know it is funny, they could have used this system to help reward the player for their time, by making them want to play rather then simply dreading the grind they must endure.. Take for example, each time you get rank you get so many point toward all you companion influence (to less another grind). Or you could get a choice in type of reward you want like (like say light/dark token, legacy points, a decoration, companion influence, etc.). This would make it extra reward system for playing the game.

 

I just don't understand it, you want people to feel rewarded so they stay, not look at it and go well that's never happening, so forget it which does nothing to keep/win players.

[demotivator]

Unsubbing, I can't take it anymore. The grind was already bad and you are actually making it worse? Are you guys for real?

 

I can find more entertaining activities for $15 a month.

Edited December 3, 2016 by demotivator

[PallyHk]

This is definately an overnerf in my opinion. Either they should revert, or ease the grind.

 

Remember we are supposed to gear with this RNG mess.

[GabbyMe]

I'm not a raider. I did all my hardcore raiding back in Wrath of the Lich King, playing WoW. I also hate pvp. I'm purely casual now, and play swtor for the story, and whatever I can solo. Sometimes duo when my husband gets the urge to play as well. But seeing as he's deployed... I play alone. Be that as it may, I don't want to be part of the vocal minority. But I'll add my voice anyway.

 

I actually didn't mind doing the heroics. I did it in KOTFE. Killing mobs and doing them would be the only way I'd be able to grind for CXP, along with the solo uprisings. I don't like the RNG crate boxes gaining command levels whilst grinding for points. I still play WoW a bit... when the urge strikes me. And I like the way they implemented world quests, and don't really mind the grind for artifact power. Even though it got old pretty damn fast. This is worse then that. At least I'm guaranteed a piece of okay gear from those world quests.

 

I've advocated and defended you for YEARS, Bioware. ME3 endings, DA:I... the big companion thing when KOTFE dropped. I hope you'll see reason eventually. They usually do.

Edited December 3, 2016 by GabbyMe

[Forcespawn]

Bioware went too far this time! There's no way in hell im staying subbed for this hell grind - RNG gearing system. I have 16 alts that i love to play. This new system killed the game for me. I 'm going to unsub after this post.

[KuraiJorus]

*** is this crap. Farming gold mobs is something people do in MMO.... get a group together and sit on chat for a few hours farming.

 

Now with the drop from 10 to 1 it kills farming... next they will drop the cxp from mobs in operations as people will try farming them.... next they will say wait your farming flashpoints and uprisings, lets nerf them...

 

Stop the nerf if people are getting cxp too fast drop the cap not the rate which they can get it.. The old rate was crap, but if gave the sometimes player a chance. Dropping the cap not the rate returns that chance but hurts the high end gamer.

[Sshodan]

I really have no words for this... In all this time I never was tempted to unsub and be DONE with this game but now? Now I am. I mean when they started this gear system I thought "ok, not bad, I do heroics anyway for money and now I can get some other loot out of it and eventually get geared up even if I don't have time for major group content. May encourage me to actually do more group stuff once my gear is up to date..." And now this.

If people where abusing it? Put a cap on xp one can gain from killing golds in a week. But let people who just want to do some solo content still get their fair share. Because right now? I think I'm quitting - the time it will get me to get end game gear without doing war zones all day (and I HATE PvP) is worse than Korean mmos, and I know what I'm talking about - I played one for more than 6 years. Wait... At least there I could BUY the gear from other players... Here? I'm just DONE.

[Rolodome]

But to bait and switch almost everything in game from promotions to in game material doesn't seem to healthy

They are probably hoping that in this low attention span world, people will just forget.

[Silko]

What truly bothers me about this change is the fact that Eric challenged the player base to try to reach the cap they declared reachable only through exploits. You can't change the rules of the game because people beat you at it. The grind is already long enough for casual and hard core players. The individuals who did reach that cap do not represent the SWTOR community in any shape, form, or manner. To then punish the community based off the actions of an extreme few is a regrettable and foolish act that Bioware needs to correct as soon as possible.

[Ryenke]

I already unsubbed before this: the RNGgoRound has me at about 20 command crates and all inside have been junk. Set pieces, hell even a usable 230 purple would be cause for celebration. But no, just one purple 230, and it isn't a set piece, isn't a usable piece (a CLICKY relic, c'mon! TRASH)...

 

Now most of those levels are due to the incidental Golds I went out of my way to kill. I wasn't a farmer or anything, but doing CZ dailies for instance, I made sure to kill the golds I was near.

 

So Bioware, you had a window, between my unsub (due to RNGgoRound) and the time my sub expires. So what change do you make? - you make it harder to even get on the RNGgoRound to get f^&*ed by the Command Trash Crates. You wanted me to get my first set bonus piece no earlier than 2017 - I guess the joke is on you, I won't get a 5.0 set bonus ever. Bye Bye

 

No one at Bioware will read this, and no one at Bioware would even care. It is such a shame that the players liked and cared about the game more than the devs/company.

Edited December 3, 2016 by Ryenke

[AlaecusMcFly]

Bioware Austin is perfectly analogous to that co-worker who only does the bare minimum of his job every day, takes overly long breaks, eats someone else's lunch in the office fridge, and always clocks out at day end regardless of how many people need him to stay later.

[DenariusJay]

Keep this threading going... it needs thousands of views and 50+ pages of responses to maybe hit BW front office and address this garbo'!

 

5 would be more tolerable, but I suggest going back to 10 - OR make heroics payout more then 20 (maybe like 40/50 per turn in, to help make up for the gold nerf, and you can only do these once a week anyways...)

[JabbaWabbA]

What truly bothers me about this change is the fact that Eric challenged the player base to try to reach the cap they declared reachable only through exploits. You can't change the rules of the game because people beat you at it. The grind is already long enough for casual and hard core players. The individuals who did reach that cap do not represent the SWTOR community in any shape, form, or manner. To then punish the community based off the actions of an extreme few is a regrettable and foolish act that Bioware needs to correct as soon as possible.

 

this.

[Diefenbaker]

The one thing the devs will pay attention to is dropping subs. When the money flow gets smaller, that's when heads perk up and people start realizing "whoops, we did something wrong, people don't like it."

 

A pity, really. I've been in this game since beta. We had a ****** guild that moved from beta into live. Dozens of people.

 

Now, a few years later, I'm the only left. And I'm done too.

 

Unsubbed.

[demotivator]

And they're doing this at the start of the weekend (so no hotfix till next week if that ever happens) when the large bulk of people are available to play. Just making sure to piss off as many players as possible, I guess. Edited December 3, 2016 by demotivator

[cardmonkey]

IDK if they will fix it the are huffing their own fecal matter and and saying "epic..."

[Gwena]

I'm pretty laid back when it comes to gearing speed, but this nerf is kind of depressing to me.

 

It sounds to me like a more moderate nerf was perhaps in order, though it seems that Bioware does not know how to "moderately" nerf things. Or maybe they could have also increased CXP gains from other solo-able (but not infinitely repeatable) sources.

Edited December 3, 2016 by Gwena