Slicing post-nerf, please look at the numbers BW

[imabeasto]

Are you insane?

 

Running level 50 missions as level 26 character.

 

Do you not see the innate problem?

 

Nobody else can(could) power-level their skill for no cost and/or profit.

 

In fact...

 

Everyone else lose much, much, much more than you, sending their companions away on missions.

 

as long as you're having to WAIT for your companions to be DONE...then you're doing SOMETHING. I guess looking at it your way playing games is doing NOTHING. you're not WORKING...you're playing so you're doing NOTHING.

[Seifz]

You are right, because the crafting skills don't do anything at all anyway.

 

Hey I have a THer too, and guess what those lockboxes don't have in them? Credits.

 

It isn't the same skill, stop making up lies to justify this nerf.

 

What? Of course they do! In fact, almost every lockbox that I've ever got through TH has only credits in it, and usually at a loss.

 

EDIT: You're right, though. They aren't the same skill. Slicing also has world nodes, but TH doesn't.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Seifz

[Dubhsidhe]

Because I didn't think people just wanted handouts.

 

Because that's pretty much what lockbox missions were. It was just the game giving them money for doing absolutely nothing.

 

Like everything else in game Slicing is a gamble NOT a handout. When you fight a MOB it's a gamble, bigger badder MOBS = Costlier in repair bills, med kits etc., Slicing is the same bigger and potentially more costly mission MIGHT = bigger rewards. BUT JUST like a MOB there is the potential for failure. NOT every mission returns a profit and there are outright FAILURES that return nothing, JUST like some MOB fights. YOU simply have no perspective on the risk vs, reward aspect. Like everything else in the game Slicing IS NOT free money, it is simply credits with BETTER odds.

[Zennshi]

Because I didn't think people just wanted handouts.

 

Because that's pretty much what lockbox missions were. It was just the game giving them money for doing absolutely nothing.

 

Did you stop to think that maybe people picked up more than just slicing?

 

The whole point of slicing was to generate money and it is sacrificing one crew skill slot to gain a sort of sustainability.

 

Nothing stopped you from getting it, and nothing stops you from avoiding it.

 

It really does sound like you are being a hating fascist, which is a poor reason to do anything drastic.

 

 

I feel like UWT is giving people money for nothing, all they have to do is put it on the GTN. Does that make it better?

[Anticasper]

STOP BEING LAZY AND WORK FOR YOUR CREDITS.

 

I do not want to work!! I want to play a game!! >.< what's up with all these people who think we need to suffer in a virtual world as well as many people already do in the real world.

As stated before slicing was fun and it allowed me to purchase stuff without too much work, this is fun because its is different from the real world.

Now the game is less fun and more work, cant you see this is a bad thing ?

[Zennshi]

This is why I'm laughing at all the tears on this thread. These slicers obviously have no CLUE how difficult it is to even break even with any real crafting profession.

 

If it's so easy, then why don't they all just take up a crafting profession and they can make millions.

 

Wait... the answer is, they know it's not that easy, and now that the golden goose has been killed they are shedding rivers of tears because they no longer have the unfair advantage they had before. People always complain the most bitterly when their overpowered abilities get nerfed back into balance. It's just like when rogues lost their ability to stun-lock everyone to death every time they fought in WoW... you should have seen the tearful armageddon. But most of us who were rogues knew we were getting over on the game, that it was too easy, and the system was flawed.

 

I have one of every profession, way to make an *** of yourself.

 

I am very well aware of how expensive it is, wanna throw something else at me?

[KalenDarkmoon]

This is why I'm laughing at all the tears on this thread. These slicers obviously have no CLUE how difficult it is to even break even with any real crafting profession.

 

If it's so easy, then why don't they all just take up a crafting profession and they can make millions.

 

Wait... the answer is, they know it's not that easy, and now that the golden goose has been killed they are shedding rivers of tears because they no longer have the unfair advantage they had before.

 

I have to wonder how many of the pro-nerfers are government employees? Do you actually consider it economically viable to keep giving someone $2000 to only get $1400 back in benefit? Really? If so, I have some real-estate I'd love for you to invest in. Having a gathering skill that gathers money is useless if it rarely, if ever, gives back a positive return on investment - especially accounting for the time involved. 5 to 10k credits at best assuming good luck opening the boxes for 4 hours of crafting (slicing) at level 50 is utterly worthless.

 

It's a simple concept. Lockboxes only have credits in them. Thus, Lockbox missions are to gain credits. Just like Archaeology is to gain artifacts or crystals. If you don't GAIN credits from Lockbox missions then they are useless.

 

Come on people. Credits are just another resource like the metals/artifacts/gems/etc that are necessary for creating items and the economy as a whole. Slicing for profit was necessary if you wanted to have anything beyond drop gear because the skill costs and repair costs are so high that one can afford little else.

 

Did you whiners/nerfers stop to think that MAYBE your crafted items on the GTN were not selling because there are too FEW credits in players hands rather than too many? That your lack of profits isn't because there is TOO MUCH money in the game but rather TOO LITTLE? Get a clue. If people had money you'd be making your profits because most everyone wants better gear. If you take sources of money out of the game then expect to sell even less. Most people were unaware or unwilling to put the time into slicing to earn the credits for better gear. Now it will be even worse. Enjoy your now equally useless crafting skills because even fewer people can now afford to buy your crafts.

Edited December 28, 2011 by KalenDarkmoon

[Grayly]

This entire argument is stupid.

 

If the missions don't make money, then what is the point of even taking slicing in the first place? None.

 

A nerf like this is just insulting. I'd rather they remove slicing from the game than pretend that people are going to continue to use a useless profession.

[VioletZero]

Violetzero you need to just stop talking. Seriously. I try and take your words as just an opinion that is different from mine... but at this point you are borderline trolling and showing just how badly you are the elitist folk we fled WoW from when we came here.

 

Go away, and take your earning of credits in the snow, uphill, both ways, with you.

 

Everything I am saying here is with the quality of the game in mind.

 

I come from a school of thought that handouts are not a good thing. And that's what they were. Lockbox missions were completely devoid of costs 99% of the time. And yet you got money for it. The game just giving you money, for nothing.

 

This is why I say we get rid of lockbox missions, and then increase the yield of slicing nodes. Because then, at the very least, you have to put in the time necessary to get the nodes. You can't just log into an alt, put all of your companions on lockbox missions and then come back later with a profit.

[Kwyn]

Because I didn't think people just wanted handouts.

 

Because that's pretty much what lockbox missions were. It was just the game giving them money for doing absolutely nothing.

 

And now you can be proud. Now the game is just taking money and giving back absolutely nothing.

 

Why not scavenging, bionalysis and archaeology? How about every time you send a companion out they always bring back something worth less than you paid for the mission?

 

Sound like a plan?

[Contumelious]

This entire argument is stupid.

 

If the missions don't make money, then what is the point of even taking slicing in the first place? None.

 

A nerf like this is just insulting. I'd rather they remove slicing from the game than pretend that people are going to continue to use a useless profession.

 

If only I got 1800 worth of crystals every time when I sent my companion on that archaeology mission...

[Dramatic]

Truth be told, I am actually not selling any of my mats on the GTN. I'm doing Bioanalysis and I am not selling my mats on the GTN. Broke, and I prefer it this way over having money coming out of my ears. Because money management is actually a challenge and I have to actually prioritize what I want to buy and such. Including training and the basic costs of getting your gear repaired.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Are you for real! This is a game! It is for entertainment, you should not base this like its real life, you should be having fun and not managing money, you sound like you play on a RP server.

[Benk]

You are right, because the crafting skills don't do anything at all anyway.

 

Hey I have a THer too, and guess what those lockboxes don't have in them? Credits.

 

It isn't the same skill, stop making up lies to justify this nerf.

 

Your right, they don't. However, the majority of the time they have items that can be sold to a vendor for a profit. Amazing concept, selling something for profit, eh?

Edited December 28, 2011 by Benk

[Contumelious]

Everything I am saying here is with the quality of the game in mind.

 

I come from a school of thought that handouts are not a good thing. And that's what they were. Lockbox missions were completely devoid of costs 99% of the time. And yet you got money for it. The game just giving you money, for nothing.

 

This is why I say we get rid of lockbox missions, and then increase the yield of slicing nodes. Because then, at the very least, you have to put in the time necessary to get the nodes. You can't just log into an alt, put all of your companions on lockbox missions and then come back later with a profit.

 

Really, don't buff those.

 

Reach level 25 and you'll be pulling 1.5k and more from each node while everyone else get 2 solid crystals or whatever.

 

Slicing is still very much viable, if people actually also count gathering the nodes.

[airdog]

To the people who say sell your augments to make money argument. Ok Im only level 34 & ive yet to get 1 item that has an augment slot. Ive tried selling some augments on AH with not 1 sell even got purple augments on sell for cheap & havent sold crap. Augments seem worthless unless end game gear has augment slots which ive yet to see.

[Sinadu]

Well now... If everyone had slicing...

[Donger]

Did you stop to think that maybe people picked up more than just slicing?

 

The whole point of slicing was to generate money and it is sacrificing one crew skill slot to gain a sort of sustainability.

 

Nothing stopped you from getting it, and nothing stops you from avoiding it.

 

It really does sound like you are being a hating fascist, which is a poor reason to do anything drastic.

 

 

I feel like UWT is giving people money for nothing, all they have to do is put it on the GTN. Does that make it better?

 

+1

Slicing isn't the end all be all like the elites make it out to be. UWT makes a whole lot more money on my server than slicing. Diplo is a close second. Don't see anyone crying over that and it is the same process. Push 2 buttons, go walk the dog, come back to blues and purples... toss on the AH and profit.

[OklahomaSooner]

This entire argument is stupid.

 

If the missions don't make money, then what is the point of even taking slicing in the first place? None.

 

A nerf like this is just insulting. I'd rather they remove slicing from the game than pretend that people are going to continue to use a useless profession.

 

THIS.

 

You anti-slicing people need to stop and think what this change did.

 

It didn't just nerf Slicing into balance, it made it USELESS.

 

I am not arguing that Slicing should be brought back to its pre-nerf power. I am saying that the amount it was nerfed by was too much. Reduce the nerfed % by half, and we can go from there.

 

Its unfathomable to me how you people can say that Slicing is fine now and the nerf was good. Whenever you make a profession entirely useless, you did something wrong.

[crowquil]

Because I didn't think people just wanted handouts.

 

Because that's pretty much what lockbox missions were. It was just the game giving them money for doing absolutely nothing.

 

you know what you're right it's not right for people to put money into something and expect to get more money back let ban the stock market loans and banks the people who use these things for income don't work for their money they just put money in then do nothing and make profits this is unfair to the rest of us

[pryt]

Running level 50 missions as level 26 character.

 

Do you not see the innate problem?

 

Nobody else can(could) power-level their skill for no cost and/or profit.

 

In fact...

 

My IA is lvl 32, I got Cybertech on 400, Scavenging (through MISSIONS! since 200) on 360, and Underworld trading on 280. All without the real help of Slicing from a twink. Was spare money from simply playing the game and NOT buying ALL patterns off the trainer, just those I need (skill/patron) for myself and to go up in skill. Otherwise, I would be broke too, yes. I can concentrate on all the other stuff later.

[VioletZero]

Did you stop to think that maybe people picked up more than just slicing?

 

The whole point of slicing was to generate money and it is sacrificing one crew skill slot to gain a sort of sustainability.

 

Nothing stopped you from getting it, and nothing stops you from avoiding it.

 

It really does sound like you are being a hating fascist, which is a poor reason to do anything drastic.

 

 

I feel like UWT is giving people money for nothing, all they have to do is put it on the GTN. Does that make it better?

 

Underworld trading provides a service to someone. It gets them materials that they couldn't get on their own. And you put in the training and the money necessary to get it up to the level of the mat you wanted to sell.

 

Slicing is just free money. For absolutely no cost. As for opportunity cost, fine. Whatever. But at the very LEAST, they should put in something that they won't get a straight net gain from. Like a commendation or something. Or time spent looking for lockboxes.

[Necronym]

Slicing should not have been nerfed this close to the start of the game. players have massive credit sinks when they are levelling their characters and crew skills. slicing is a way to pump credits into the economy while the game is still in it's fledgling stages. the GTN is not stocked and isn't stable, by any means. I would agree with some of these changes to slicing down the road, when players don't have to spend millions to pay for training/crew skills.

 

I propose that Bioware revert the changes for the next 2 months. once people and the market stabilize, implement the changes once again and also reduce some of the mission costs or keep 'rich' missions where they are.

 

As a note, for the most part i've stopped sending my companions out on rich yield missions because the cost is so high for what you'll get back. I've done 3 Rich lockbox missions where it cost 2k and i got back around 1.3k each time (all of the boxes were green in quality). most of the others are profitable. im thinking they didn't scale the costs to go with the reduction in credits.

 

TBH, slicing needed a nerf. however it should never lose you money. All the other crew skills cost so much to maintain and gather with because the market isn't really established yet. once it is established and there are large amounts of credits circulating between players the game will be better off...

 

Credits need to replenish as much as they sink into the game (training, repair bills, vendor prices, etc.) and still have enough to circulate.

[Zennshi]

What? Of course they do! In fact, almost every lockbox that I've ever got through TH has only credits in it, and usually at a loss.

 

EDIT: You're right, though. They aren't the same skill. Slicing also has world nodes, but TH doesn't.

 

I have yet to get credits in my lockboxes, I usually get a blue item.

 

So either you are lying through your teeth, or I am just that 'lucky'.

 

=/

[Tholena]

In all honesty, the problem with most tradeskills is the galactic market. Two main problems really:

 

1 - The UI for the market is so hard to use, people avoid it.

 

and

 

2 - The default price for items is way too low, thus people who don't think are posting items for less than the item cost. (Case in point, a max level augment for slicing cost about 1,200. The default posting price is 530, and many people post them at that price without thinking.) (Another example, a blue piece from armstech requires blue materials, which took underworld missions, and cost lots of creds. But I see these pieces posted on the market for about one quarter of what they cost. You can't expect most people to do math for a game like this. Unless this problem is fixed, tradeskills are doomed.)

 

If these problems were fixed, nerfs like this to slicing wouldn't be as much a deal. Right now, armstech, armortech, artifice, etc... don't make much money because of these problems. (And now slicing is in the same boat.)

[Zennshi]

Your right, they don't. However, the majority of the time they have items that can be sold to a vendor for a profit. Amazing concept, selling something for profit, eh?

 

Yes, it is a novel concept, just like every other crafting/gathering/mission professions don't seem to want to admit. If you sell the stuff you get, it is like you are paying money, to get credits back and hopefully turn a profit.

 

WHAT A NOVEL CONCEPT!