Companion Nerf, Who is leaving/unsubbing poll

[PallyHk]

Wow, I never get enough. When I have nothing better to do I make some popcorn and check out the boards to see what the complaint of the day is. No matter what changes are made, some will not like it. No gaming company will be able to make everyone happy all the time. Everyone's idea of what the game should be is different. Just because someone's opinion is different than yours, it doesn't make them wrong. Just as what Bioware did here. The changes don't make them wrong, some people just don't agree. All games are a work in progress and will never be perfect. Some people need to learn to get over it.

 

The biggest complaint now is that people feel they have lost their "GOD MODE" status. I have to admit, 4.0 comps were a bit over the top. I was killing golds 3 lvls above me and not getting below 50% health. We complained that the 4.0 companions were OP. Now we're complaining their too weak. If you don't like it, and can't work with it, leave. If you like it, or can work with it, stay. It's that simple. I haven't had the opportunity to see the changes, but I am looking forward to seeing the changes. I'm sure the majority of people complaining are the ones that need to LTP. You created a FOM toon, maxed lvl as fast as you could, and never learned how to play it. People now days want simple, they don't want to think or work for it because it hurts too much and requires effort. As soon as some people have to use more than 2-4 skills they can't handle it. When they actually have to work for something, they just quit and blame everyone and everything but themselves. This is my opinion and it doesn't make me right, but it's mine, and I could care less if you agree or not.

 

I've been playing SWTOR since beta and have played RPGs and MMOs for a while. I still have my complete 1st edition AD&D library, and have been playing numerous MMOs since 1997 with UO. So, I believe I know a little something about this.

 

Now, for all of you that think you can do it better, please do. Show everyone how you think it should be done. Go make that perfect game that will always be liked by everyone. Good luck, you will fail.

 

Your stupid old DnD books sure gave you a lot of insight about computer games, lol.

 

Let me give you the prestigious "Smug old grognard elitist snob" reward. You earned it , sempai!

Edited November 18, 2015 by PallyHk

[NeuroticCupcake]

The biggest complaint now is that people feel they have lost their "GOD MODE" status.

It's hilarious how the only people saying that are people like you.

 

Whereas the majority of other people are saying that the ~75% nerf was simply too much. A reasonable, incremental decrease would not only have made more sense from a game design point of view, but would also allow players to adjust to the changes in a more reasonable matter.

 

But nope. BAM! From really good to all-but-useless in the span of one patch.

 

As a side note, I was toying around some this morning until my subscription runs out, and I was getting healed for 0 by my companion. Over and over, he kept trying to heal, but the result was always 0. At level 65 (level synced to 52), with me at about half health. Mmm, useful!

[Zanriel]

I went all the way to the subscription section on my account, selected options from the drop boxes, and had stuff typed out... but I couldn't do it. Not yet. My subscription runs out in about a month (I get 6-month blocks). I really want to cancel just to send a message, but I've been a loyal subscriber non-stop since pre-release.

 

But dangit, I was having so much fun, I couldn't get enough. I didn't care about any other games, hardly ever looked at Steam, all I wanted to play was SWTOR. But now? Meh. I'll play when I can get my friends or family to play with me, and maybe a little here and there, but I'm going to be thumbing through my Steam library again it looks like. 4.0 was so shiny, but now it's got mud splattered on it.

[Shwarzchild]

Unsubed.

To the people saying everything is fine, could I get some video proof? Say a 100% clean H2 SF run?

 

I guess my question to you is why do the runs have to be 100 percent clean to be considered a success? If you kill the exarch regardless of how many times you wipe shouldn't that be considered successful? The star fortress heroic 2 mode is meant to be a challenge where by you will need to have higher influence with your companions, the buffs from your alliance terminal at the beginning, and also use of the alliance hacks for the special abilities. This whole notion that every heroic needs to be face roll is just boggling to me. Lower level planetary heroics should be far easier than higher level planetary ones. If the player is struggling just take a step back to those (they give the same rewards as the higher levels so you're not missing too much while you unconsciously get more and more comfortable). Star Fortress specific: It's stated as such that the heroic mode will be harder. It brings me to the conclusion that some want all content in the game to fit their mold, and when you're dealing with a population like we have that's diverse that simply isn't going to be achievable. The star fortresses are an example of end game content that's directed at as many slices as possible of the population: solo players with solo mode, group players with heroic, players wanting challenge in heroic, achievement people with achievements that are harder to come by (after all if you could just blow through why even consider something an "achievement" when it defies the definition of the word)

 

Honest question here, because I think I've lost track of what type of player is so upset about this nerf, which type of player is this effecting the most or who is the most upset by it? Is it solo players? Solo players have solo mode to fall back on as well to add to their experience. I'm just confused at the outcry that star fortresses should be totally ok to solo when they are meant to be completed in heroic mode with work put in. For some it's a lot of work, for others it's not. But, work none the less. It reminds me a lot of flashpoint recommended gear levels back in 3.0 that said 178, and really that meant highly skilled players could go through on 178 but others needed a little juicing gear wise. They were possible, but hard, in 178 gear. When you got to 192/198 they were cake walks. This entire debate seems so....emotionally charged and out of the realistic expectation realm. And, i can't just say sure unsub when I feel there's a lot these unsubbing players are leaving on the table that could potentially end up totally changing their view point.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Shwarzchild

[Sweetiepies]

Unsubbing until it gets re-tuned. It needed addressed for sure, but an on average of -70% efficiency decrease is too fu*king drastic. There are at least 5 other MMO's I have accounts with that I can throw 15 bux at and have fun playing in the meantime.

[Arlon_Nabarlly]

I haven't had a chance to play this patch yet do to problem downloading the patch. However, this patch may be the only thing that stops me from unsubbing. 4.0 sucked with OP companions.

[Majirayan]

Sorry, I'm staying subbed simply because this game does not revolve around companions. Yes they made solo easier, but that is not the intent. You are supposed to group, get social and complete events together. Get off your high horses and stop acting like old farts who think they are entitled to easy content.

[Quessiro]

Well... I planned to cancel my subscription after having finished KoTFE story.

• I've seen cutscenes and I got bored watching my demi-god bot killing stuff for me between cutscenes.
  
• I've got soooo pissed of with people joining group content and being unable to play basics of their class. A simple thing like tactical flashpoint became an issue, because people got used to bots playing game for them. And suddenly not having their bots they were unable to do anything.
  

Yesterdays patch made be believe that maybe there is some hope for this game. Maybe developers realized they've gone too far removing gameplay from the game. Actually it changed my plans and I want to prolong my subscription now.

 

I don't want to be an "elitist", but reading forum thread and folks complaining that they're forced to pop defensive cooldowns while doing HEROIC quests makes me sick... The same for people complaining about unconfirmed, datamined numbers, but haven't tried the game yet. Oh, 75% companion nerf, the game has been killed. Have you tried it? Not so much difference TBH...

 

And another thing. It should NEVER EVER be possible, that bots are easily outperforming well geared player. For me, it was VERY serious issue with SWTOR 4.0.

[sunsplode]

Yup cancelling too. Left my previous main game too (D3) after 3 years because the developers thought they could ride roughshod over players.

[Swedguy]

I'm unsubbing. Not just because of Companions being nerfed, but for the stuff you wrote about in your open letter (ESPECIALLY the Companion Romance Bug)

[Arlon_Nabarlly]

Well... I planned to cancel my subscription after having finished KoTFE story.

• I've seen cutscenes and I got bored watching my demi-god bot killing stuff for me between cutscenes.
  
• I've got soooo pissed of with people joining group content and being unable to play basics of their class. A simple thing like tactical flashpoint became an issue, because people got used to bots playing game for them. And suddenly not having their bots they were unable to do anything.
  

Yesterdays patch made be believe that maybe there is some hope for this game. Maybe developers realized they've gone too far removing gameplay from the game. Actually it changed my plans and I want to prolong my subscription now.

 

I don't want to be an "elitist", but reading forum thread and folks complaining that they're forced to pop defensive cooldowns while doing HEROIC quests makes me sick... The same for people complaining about unconfirmed, datamined numbers, but haven't tried the game yet. Oh, 75% companion nerf, the game has been killed. Have you tried it? Not so much difference TBH...

 

And another thing. It should NEVER EVER be possible, that bots are easily outperforming well geared player. For me, it was VERY serious issue with SWTOR 4.0.

 

Well said and agree 100%

[PallyHk]

Well... I planned to cancel my subscription after having finished KoTFE story.

• I've seen cutscenes and I got bored watching my demi-god bot killing stuff for me between cutscenes.
  
• I've got soooo pissed of with people joining group content and being unable to play basics of their class. A simple thing like tactical flashpoint became an issue, because people got used to bots playing game for them. And suddenly not having their bots they were unable to do anything.
  

Yesterdays patch made be believe that maybe there is some hope for this game. Maybe developers realized they've gone too far removing gameplay from the game. Actually it changed my plans and I want to prolong my subscription now.

 

I don't want to be an "elitist", but reading forum thread and folks complaining that they're forced to pop defensive cooldowns while doing HEROIC quests makes me sick... The same for people complaining about unconfirmed, datamined numbers, but haven't tried the game yet. Oh, 75% companion nerf, the game has been killed. Have you tried it? Not so much difference TBH...

 

And another thing. It should NEVER EVER be possible, that bots are easily outperforming well geared player. For me, it was VERY serious issue with SWTOR 4.0.

 

Great bait mate, I'll bite.

 

Heroic 2+ quests are the new dailies. You need to do them. They are too cumbersome to team for and teaming is too slow in this game.

 

You know, the challanging content in this game was Ops and Hardmodes, where companions were useless anyway, since they could not do simple things like interrupts, running out of AOEs , and the like.

 

So this did not effect you as an elite hardcore player.

 

Nobody even forced you to use companions. You could have just dismissed them, turned them to passive mode, or just put half of their abilities off.

 

But no, you have to ruin it for everybody else.

[Phaedrynn]

When I came back to the game I got a 2-month non-recurring sub. It expires the day after tomorrow. It will not be renewed.

[dangadget]

Unsubscribing, but not because of the companion "nerf"

It's because of the dismaying lack of professionalism demonstrated by this whole 4.0 debacle.

 

The initial buff to companions was not well thought out, and definitely not adequately tested

How could BW have missed the glaringly obvious fact that they had made companions strong enough to trivialize the game?

 

Now we have the "fix", which is again, was not well thought out nor adequately tested.

Why would you fix this before fixing the bugs that are also related to this???

I am referring to lv65 comps losing almost all defensive stats, and the unclear relationship between equipped comp weapons and actual comp effectiveness.

There are several threads pointing these bugs out, and these should have been addressed before attempting a balance pass.

A balance that should not have been needed if adequate testing had been done on 4.0 in the first place.

[JouerTue]

i'm L2Ping and grouping with complete strangers, does it count for the poll?

[Arlon_Nabarlly]

Heroic 2+ quests are the new dailies. You need to do them. They are too cumbersome to team for and teaming is too slow in this game.

You don't 'need' to do dailies and you never have.

Heroics were always a part of every single daily area they have ever made. Usually they had at least one H2 and one H4. Grouping for them was not difficult while that area was the end game, doing older ones was though.

The fact that they didn't bother making solo daily quests like they always have was just a poor and lazy design choice that enabled them to reuse content rather than make new ones. Reusing content and calling it dailies shouldn't be applauded...

[Antareo]

Unsubbed.

[bseefeldt]

Unsubscribing, but not because of the companion "nerf"

It's because of the dismaying lack of professionalism demonstrated by this whole 4.0 debacle.

 

The initial buff to companions was not well thought out, and definitely not adequately tested

How could BW have missed the glaringly obvious fact that they had made companions strong enough to trivialize the game?

 

Now we have the "fix", which is again, was not well thought out nor adequately tested.

Why would you fix this before fixing the bugs that are also related to this???

I am referring to lv65 comps losing almost all defensive stats, and the unclear relationship between equipped comp weapons and actual comp effectiveness.

There are several threads pointing these bugs out, and these should have been addressed before attempting a balance pass.

A balance that should not have been needed if adequate testing had been done on 4.0 in the first place.

 

Well said

[Arlon_Nabarlly]

At 65, they weren't. Not even remotely close. Unless YOU were the ****** player. (Hint: You most likely were and are.)

 

The devs admitted this in their yellow post...

 

...

What we saw in those instances is that Companions, simply put, were just way too good. Their healing and damage output could be greater than that of a very skilled player with a fully maximized character.

...

-eric

 

L2Read then L2Play, L2Debate might be worthwhile as well...

Edited November 18, 2015 by Arlon_Nabarlly

[Stephanielynn]

Well... I planned to cancel my subscription after having finished KoTFE story.

• I've seen cutscenes and I got bored watching my demi-god bot killing stuff for me between cutscenes.
  
• I've got soooo pissed of with people joining group content and being unable to play basics of their class. A simple thing like tactical flashpoint became an issue, because people got used to bots playing game for them. And suddenly not having their bots they were unable to do anything.
  

Yesterdays patch made be believe that maybe there is some hope for this game. Maybe developers realized they've gone too far removing gameplay from the game. Actually it changed my plans and I want to prolong my subscription now.

 

I don't want to be an "elitist", but reading forum thread and folks complaining that they're forced to pop defensive cooldowns while doing HEROIC quests makes me sick... The same for people complaining about unconfirmed, datamined numbers, but haven't tried the game yet. Oh, 75% companion nerf, the game has been killed. Have you tried it? Not so much difference TBH...

 

And another thing. It should NEVER EVER be possible, that bots are easily outperforming well geared player. For me, it was VERY serious issue with SWTOR 4.0.

 

Most of the posts I am reading are people that are dropping their sub because BIO can't seem to figure out what they want to do with the game because of all the damn changes they keep doing. I think most people would say the bots were OP and needed to be fixed but by how much?? Seems they went from OP to worthless.. so I think that's what have people upset. Now BIO has made so many changes the game won't even download for some and if it does it's VERY slow.. then you get it downloaded and the game crashes at start up, or the game won't load at all.. this almost reminds me of SWG.

[PallyHk]

You don't 'need' to do dailies and you never have.

Heroics were always a part of every single daily area they have ever made. Usually they had at least one H2 and one H4. Grouping for them was not difficult while that area was the end game, doing older ones was though.

The fact that they didn't bother making solo daily quests like they always have was just a poor and lazy design choice that enabled them to reuse content rather than make new ones. Reusing content and calling it dailies shouldn't be applauded...

 

I need to do them for credits. I know, before KOTFE, they were optional and I never ever done a heroic before KOTFE.

 

But now we are forced to do it, it is the new "thing" that gives credits and commendation crystals and the stuff you need for your alliance stuff. That's the problem. These "heroic 2+ weeklies" are the new solo single player content.

 

If they made Ops or Hardmodes harder, I would not mind. Make the suppsed to be hard content hard. Or...heh... actually make new ops? Oh that would take a lot of effort from BW.

 

And yes, they were very lazy.

 

Most of the posts I am reading are people that are dropping their sub because BIO can't seem to figure out what they want to do with the game because of all the damn changes they keep doing. I think most people would say the bots were OP and needed to be fixed but by how much?? Seems they went from OP to worthless.. so I think that's what have people upset. Now BIO has made so many changes the game won't even download for some and if it does it's VERY slow.. then you get it downloaded and the game crashes at start up, or the game won't load at all.. this almost reminds me of SWG.

 

 

Yeah, they can't decide if they want an elite hardcore game or a casual fun game. They keep swinging between the two, pleasing none.

 

Another problem is influence. It makes grinding companions even harder than before when you just had to give them new items.

 

I dread to see how that effects levelling a character.

Edited November 18, 2015 by PallyHk

[NeuroticCupcake]

The devs admitted this in their yellow post...

1) Nice ninja edit. I still hit the REPORT POST button before you got it off though.

2) No they didn't. Only in certain circumstances were they "seeing" that. And by "seeing" that, they mean reading whine posts on the forums.

3) And no, companions at 65 doing level 65 content were nowhere near the "god mode" people like you keep claiming they were. I regularly killed multiple opponents on my Powertech just before or at about the same time my companion would kill one. That's pretty much right on par with where a companion should be, considering their inability to do simple things like interrupt or move out of area attacks. Another player would always be preferable for those reasons when doing content that was actually meant to be challenging.

 

That said, I doubt very many people would be upset about a sane reduction of companion's abilities, especially for things like healing. Incrementally lowering it until the developers found a sweet spot (as opposed to caving in to whiners like yourself) makes far more sense and would have given the players time to adapt to the changes as they slowly and reasonably rolled in.

 

It's the BAM 75% nerf that has so many people irritated. Not that ANY of it has ANY impact whatsoever on actual hardcore content in the game, just solo grindy stuff that, for whatever inexplicible and unreasonable mentality people like you have, somehow "ruined the game."

Edited November 18, 2015 by NeuroticCupcake

[DirtyDiggler]

I unsubbed and deleted the game from my pc.

 

I was enjoying the solo content don't know why they screwed it up.

[bseefeldt]

Most of the posts I am reading are people that are dropping their sub because BIO can't seem to figure out what they want to do with the game because of all the damn changes they keep doing. I think most people would say the bots were OP and needed to be fixed but by how much?? Seems they went from OP to worthless.. so I think that's what have people upset. Now BIO has made so many changes the game won't even download for some and if it does it's VERY slow.. then you get it downloaded and the game crashes at start up, or the game won't load at all.. this almost reminds me of SWG.

 

And this is a death sentence to low pop servers that were seeing a slight increase finally in player base.

[Velgar]

You don't 'need' to do dailies and you never have.

Heroics were always a part of every single daily area they have ever made. Usually they had at least one H2 and one H4. Grouping for them was not difficult while that area was the end game, doing older ones was though.

The fact that they didn't bother making solo daily quests like they always have was just a poor and lazy design choice that enabled them to reuse content rather than make new ones. Reusing content and calling it dailies shouldn't be applauded...

 

The H2 two weeklies are the new dailies and they are not optional, the whole new story revolves around building up your alliance and the only way to do that is the H2s. Thus they are not optional. The changes only make the grind of how many H2s you had to do to build your alliance even more of a slog. It was alt unfriendly to begin with, now it is even more so. Slogging through them was OK with a good companion. Now it is not fun. I can still do it but it takes significantly longer and is no longer fun as a result. And if it is not fun, I am not going to spend my money on it. It is a game, I do it for fun, not to feed some need for a sense of accomplishment. I get that from real life successes. Relying on a computer game for your sense of accomplishment in life would indicate that you have deeper problems and might want to re-evaluate your life style choices. Unsubbed.