Will Bioware explain WHY they chose to take things away from us?

[Haruen]

Remember how Bioware promised multiple times over the years on how they would never removed anything?

 

No, I don't. Could you link a reference? I'm sure it would be on YouTube. Maybe that was from the development team that was fired?

 

But really, promising to never do a thing is a pretty stupid thing to do. For the game to evolve, some things will go away. It's inevitable.

[Shikyo]

Thought I'd point out that BioWare did this once before when the codex was replaced by the achievement system in place today.

 

Most of the removed ones were broken any way and unable to be achieved but not all.

 

Not defending anything, just pointing out that the premise of this is a bit flawed as it was done once before on a grander scale.

 

This time it is simply because companions got re-worked and overhauled into a new "Alliance" system we have yet to see in action.

 

Not 100% but the "They said they would never take anything away from us!" I believe was said when talking about your items and armor when answering about "what is going to happen to all my companion stuff."

 

Another time I remember hearing it recently was when talking about the questing changes in KOTFE in regards to going back to old planets. Was something like, "We don't want to take anything from you guys. You will still be able to go back to the old planets and quests. Heroics will all still be there. Daily areas will still be daily areas. But as soon as you start KOTFE you will not be able to go back and complete any one time quests on those planets that you may not have done such as class Story and Planet story."

 

If it was said sooner than the above then I'd need some links to remember it. Been here since Beta.

 

I totally understand for the achievement junkies that this bites, but are we talking 1000 kills per companion (not planet specific)? Because if we are I can see why they didn't think too hard about the change implications. I got the 1000 kills with companion X already with no added effort. Simply from doing things I was doing already such as dailies and leveling. Even with this, I still get why this is annoying to those achievement junkies.

 

As for the crafting changes a few things kind of raised my eyebrow that was listed in here that they addressed and one thing they didn't address but is a simple fact of how the game has operated since they increased the level cap the very first time.

 

1. Those schematics, such as enhancements, are moving to a different crafting class. The crafting classes are no longer level based as in, locked out from crafting anything of any level like it is right now in live game. On top of that they are giving you ALL the schematics for FREE from your trainer for EVERY crafting class. Yes, you may have to reverse engineer them again but they even made that easier with some cases being a guarantee no longer a chance. Please reference the dev blog on crafting changes for this information.

 

2. All of those HARD earned, HIGH cost schematics you are referring to, such as from raid content, let me ask you: Are you currently crafting the level 50 ones? The level 55 ones? Because being here since beta for all of those level caps, and one who has all of those schematics, EACH AND EVERY TIME THE LEVEL CAP HAS INCREASED THOSE BECAME POINTLESS! All that time and money I spent and they are currently on my list collecting dust. Are we REALLY bringing that up as a point of contention with KOTFE? Heck shadow of revan literally made the ops gear we had JUST gotten pointless by handing you 186 rated gear. Better yet, after shadow of revan where that 186 was meant to get you to 192 they handed us 190 gear on ziost after many of us spent all our coms on the 186 we may not have had.

 

Ultimately my point is it seems we are making a federal case out things as a crime against the entire community to try and justify our pleasure or displeasure with changes when in reality, the honest truth is:

1. I simply like it or don't like because it does or doesn't benefit me specifically in some way shape or form.

2. I'm too lazy to be bothered.

3. I already did that, why do I have to do it again?

 

I will say that for the first time the SWTOR forums have been absolutely entertaining with all of these debates going on. Again, been here since beta and for the first time in over year I've posted something on the forums and really read them. I am thankful for that for SURE.

[Uruare]

They might reply with an answer, but I will not be the truth.

 

Pretty much this. Whether you're from the Confederation of American States, the Japanese Imperial State or anywhere in between, a smart runner never forgets that the Johnsons aren't your friends.

 

When a suit points, a Johnson scurries to make something happen, and expendable resources of completely deniable association like us?

 

We're nobody to them. We're a means to ends in their wars between themselves. They like to try to put pretty faces and sterilized names on it all, but the truth is apparent for anyone that pays attention to anything other than what the shills and propaganda machines spew.

 

You want to make it here in the shadows, you better learn this fast and well - the Johnsons are not your friends. Even when the Nuyen are in your hot little hands and they're fading off down their ubiquitously badly lit alleyways, you're still not safe.

 

Whatever they tell you, double check it if you can.

 

Whatever they try to sell you, question it.

 

If a payday seems too good to be true... well, we all know about things that seem too good to be true, right?

 

Don't wind up like Franzik.

 

Never heard of him?

 

... Exactly.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Uruare

[jstankaroslo]

after reading only the thread title: because they think it'll make a better game.

After all. you'll only lose a game you play if the changes don't work out.

They'll lose their jobs.

 

So they care more than you, probably. They have more data. More knowledge (probably). More experience.

I for one welcome the changes. All in all they're likely to make me play more of this game. was getting bored lately

[Princess_Chibi]

after reading only the thread title: because they think it'll make a better game.

After all. you'll only lose a game you play if the changes don't work out.

They'll lose their jobs.

 

So they care more than you, probably. They have more data. More knowledge (probably). More experience.

I for one welcome the changes. All in all they're likely to make me play more of this game. was getting bored lately

 

Because no one goes to work without actually caring about the success of the overall business and individual contribution to each and every customer.......

 

It's not like they'll just pick up their check as long as they keep coming in, right?

Edited October 11, 2015 by Princess_Chibi

[Max_Killjoy]

I don't exactly find anything very tedious at the moment. For example no reason to really make companions all of the same and not have gear like they do now. It's making the game for noobs and lazy people.

 

It's kinda funny, some of us opposed to certain changes have been pointing out that they'll increase tedium and nuisance for a while now... and suddenly you see a claim from the guy who left the game 9 months ago (and lied and said he left 4 months after launch) and just now came back, that the game will be made "less tedious" by the changes.

 

Either he's incapable of coming up with his own arguments, or he actually is a complete troll and enjoys doing the "copycat" game to try to piss people off.

[Max_Killjoy]

after reading only the thread title: because they think it'll make a better game.

After all. you'll only lose a game you play if the changes don't work out.

They'll lose their jobs.

 

So they care more than you, probably. They have more data. More knowledge (probably). More experience.

I for one welcome the changes. All in all they're likely to make me play more of this game. was getting bored lately

 

 

They only care about the quarterly returns -- nothing more.

 

And now they're pulling the classic video-game industry move of chasing the customers they don't have, at the expense of the customers they do have. See also, every TPS and FPS trying to become "the next" HALO or CoD.

[Transcendent]

Level sync is either all in or not. That should be obvious. It has to be global or there is no point in doing it.

 

Stop and think where else in the game does BioWare have level sync. Certain events already have it in, take the Rakghoul Caves for example.

 

So we already know that BioWare have the ability to have instanced level sync, regardless of what actual level the player is, and the mobs level sync to the player who pulls them.

 

Now take the exact same event.

 

When you arrive from the space port, you may have a random mob of rakghouls spawn and chase you. Level sync also works in this scenario. So BioWare already have level sync mechanisms in the game, instanced, as well as instanced.

 

So what would stop BioWare creating seperate instances on each planet, one with level sync active, and one without it active? Nothing.

 

The only reason for it, is to prolong the grind involved in the Alliances system. So for one system to work, they have to have it active everywhere? I'd say that was an ill-thought out design process, with complete disregard for every single player in the game, and not supported by metrics (correction - it probably was, but we all know how well they read their metric data *cough merc / mando balance*)

 

So no, it's sloppy development time at BioWare Austin if level sync is a forced mechanism.

[Bakakiba]

They only care about the quarterly returns -- nothing more.

 

So is every other publicly traded business.

[JumperPenn]

And I just want to point out that my major complaint and the reason I am dropping down to preferred after 4.0 launches is not the changes themselves (I mean I did stay even though they took away my trees) but BW's attitude that it is OK to take away things loyal customers have earned.

 

level-sync: Very hotly debated and the conversation seems to have turned to the reason it has to be mandatory. There is an assumption by some that there is a long term plan where l-s needs to be mandatory. Is that true because as far as I know when I go to a low-level planet BW is taking away levels I have earned while there.

This is NOT to discuss level-sync good/bad. There are other threads for that. This is to discuss if BW will answer WHY being de-bolstered has to be mandatory.

 

achievements: Why do we lose achievements we have earned? Today it is companion achievements we have spend time and credits to earn? What will it be tomorrow? How can we trust to spend time and credits on ANY achievements knowing BW will erase them like they never existed.

 

crafting: If I understand it correctly, my articifer will lose all of the enhancements that I have spent time and credits to train, creaft and RE for blues and purples. Ditto for my cybertech and armor (Question, can I even craft armor now?) Why, WHY, WHY??!!! What purpose does this even solve?

 

Maybe there is a purpose for level-sync but heaven forbid we get any information from BW as to why. But the last two? C'mon! No purpose and just punishes those that have been playing the game for years.

 

The only explanation you'd get to the 'biased' question of 'why do you take things away from me' would be a pr dodge about them actually adding more for/to your experience.

 

Their mandatory debolster/level sync would likely say something of the effect that it is done to be fair to all without discussing if they considered other alternatives, or they were possible or that it just makes their content relevant forever (well until people get sick of the same things over and over). They'd probably just talk about how awesome ti is and now groups are available for heroics with instant weekly heroic travel, more vibrant planets, play with your friends no more outleveling content and that's super awesome, nothing bad, nothing to see, move along.

 

They might say they are taking away achievments because they are changing the process that allowed them to be granted so no one would be able to obtain them and so to 'be fair' they will remove them for those that earned them BUT I think in those cases they 'give' you something for your effort, points/deco I don't keep track of them all so maybe there are achievements they are removing that will convert or grant nothing.

 

Crafting changes are probably to combat how some skills were less useful so to 'balance' (YAY everyone loves that word) they have chosen to spread some useful/needed things to more crafting professions. You'll keep your OLD enhancements and armor but they get put into 'archive' so you can still make them but new stuff you have buy/rev eng to learn.

I was under the initial impression that our old aim/skill/resolve armoring would be converted to the new mastery ones but then they said all old schematics would go into archive so it seems we'll have to buy all new mastery schematics for those old attribute focused gear and re-do the reverse engineering to get better schematics. But they said the new schematics we buy in 4.0 would in most cases be better than our old archived schematics.

Here's the devblog on crafting changes if you missed it.

http://www.swtor.com/info/news/blog/20151006

 

Again some things bw won't answer and most they'll have a company line to push while ignoring or deflecting questions they just don't want to answer or are not allowed to discuss.