raelimar Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 "This is a team game. You shouldn't be able to survive 1v1 on your own, unless you play DPS, in which case you'll probably be fine." That said, the argument that healers should tank an entire team is equally stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aghar Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 *** does "PERFECTLY TIMES" mean? Is it hard for you to press your interrupt on a 2 second cast or something? MAN, THAT SURE REQUIRES PERFECT TIMING. Are you that slow? wow your ability to comprehend proper sentence structure is so bad I am surprised you can even figure out how to log in. Ignore obvious and terribad troll.....now!!!!. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHRISGG Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 wow your ability to comprehend proper sentence structure is so bad I am surprised you can even figure out how to log in. Ignore obvious and terribad troll.....now!!!!. You can barely type in english and you just used the term "proper sentence structure." This is after complaining about having to "perfectly time interrupts" on 2 second long spells. Slothlike in more ways than one, I see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fiontar Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 30% was too harsh, first of all. When developers balance anything post launch by more than 5% to 10%, it shows a flaw in game design, ham handed balancing, a reactionary response to people moaning on the forums; or some combination of the three. It never, ever speaks well of an MMO developer to be ham handed when it comes to balance and nerfs. The second point I'd make is that if a skill, or a type of skill, is deemed overpowered, before nerfing it, an eye has to be cast as to what the balance of effected classes are on the whole, how the nerf will effect them and what may be done to offset the nerf to keep the effected classes balanced and fun. Healers were not over powered pre-nerf. One can argue that their healing was overpowered, but with healing taking a major nerf, most healing classes are now underpowered as a result. There should be something to offset the nerf. If my heals can't keep my team mates alive and I can't win 1 vs. 1 fights because my heals are too weak and my DPS too ineffectual, then what is the point of playing those classes in PvP? Keeping oneself alive for an extra 15 seconds or allowing one team mate to take three or four more hits before going down does not make playing a healer in PVP worthwhile. I think that when the trauma debuff is in place, to balance the 30% loss in healing per cast, your force pool and force regeneration rates should be boosted, so that a healer can heal the same amount as they used to be able to before running out of force, while the debuff means that it takes 30% more casts (and thus 30% more time) to accomplish. Even that may not be enough. Some combination of force regen boost and damage boost may be more warranted. In the end, if healers become easy to kill, can't keep team mates alive and have trouble killing anyone, what is the point? (No one likes nerfs, but extreme nerfs, when fine tuning should have been enough, signal problems that are worrisome). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aghar Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 30% was too harsh, first of all. When developers balance anything post launch by more than 5% to 10%, it shows a flaw in game design, ham handed balancing, a reactionary response to people moaning on the forums; or some combination of the three. It never, ever speaks well of an MMO developer to be ham handed when it comes to balance and nerfs. The second point I'd make is that if a skill, or a type of skill, is deemed overpowered, before nerfing it, an eye has to be cast as to what the balance of effected classes are on the whole, how the nerf will effect them and what may be done to offset the nerf to keep the effected classes balanced and fun. Healers were not over powered pre-nerf. One can argue that their healing was overpowered, but with healing taking a major nerf, most healing classes are now underpowered as a result. There should be something to offset the nerf. If my heals can't keep my team mates alive and I can't win 1 vs. 1 fights because my heals are too weak and my DPS too ineffectual, then what is the point of playing those classes in PvP? Keeping oneself alive for an extra 15 seconds or allowing one team mate to take three or four more hits before going down does not make playing a healer in PVP worthwhile. I think that when the trauma debuff is in place, to balance the 30% loss in healing per cast, your force pool and force regeneration rates should be boosted, so that a healer can heal the same amount as they used to be able to before running out of force, while the debuff means that it takes 30% more casts (and thus 30% more time) to accomplish. Even that may not be enough. Some combination of force regen boost and damage boost may be more warranted. In the end, if healers become easy to kill, can't keep team mates alive and have trouble killing anyone, what is the point? (No one likes nerfs, but extreme nerfs, when fine tuning should have been enough, signal problems that are worrisome). This 30% debuff was not added post launch, it was in beta, about 2 of the beta weekends had it. And pretty much the same reaction, ZOMG WHY YOU HATE HEALERS SO MUCH. It is there to prevent healers being able to take on huge groups of people alone, and by alone i don't mean kill everyone, but 1 healer and 1 dps should not be able to kill 3 or more people with little to no effort. It allows healers to be able to out hps raid bosses, but not be totally unstoppable in a pvp environment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fiontar Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 This 30% debuff was not added post launch, it was in beta, about 2 of the beta weekends had it. And pretty much the same reaction, ZOMG WHY YOU HATE HEALERS SO MUCH. It is there to prevent healers being able to take on huge groups of people alone, and by alone i don't mean kill everyone, but 1 healer and 1 dps should not be able to kill 3 or more people with little to no effort. It allows healers to be able to out hps raid bosses, but not be totally unstoppable in a pvp environment. The force pool is pretty limited. In the heat of a pitched battle, it's easy to run out well before the engagement is decided, which leaves me to spamming my no cost, puny light saber strike until I have enough to heal, or running away, if possible, then waiting forever for the "in combat" to end, so I can meditate and regain force. It's entirely possible that 30% is fine, but there should be an offset to balance the reduced healing rate; most appropriately a boost to force regen and/or force pool while the debuff is active. (The game has no equivalent of "mana potions". There is something wrong with PvP in a game where, as a healer, you frequently face the circumstance where when you are out of force and surrounded by foes, you actually want someone to quickly kill you, so you can respawn with a full force pool)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scelerant Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 The force pool is pretty limited. In the heat of a pitched battle, it's easy to run out well before the engagement is decided, which leaves me to spamming my no cost, puny light saber strike until I have enough to heal, or running away, if possible, then waiting forever for the "in combat" to end, so I can meditate and regain force. It's entirely possible that 30% is fine, but there should be an offset to balance the reduced healing rate; most appropriately a boost to force regen and/or force pool while the debuff is active. (The game has no equivalent of "mana potions". There is something wrong with PvP in a game where, as a healer, you frequently face the circumstance where when you are out of force and surrounded by foes, you actually want someone to quickly kill you, so you can respawn with a full force pool)! Considering that I on my assassin more or less have the "Not enough force" message burned into my monitor, that's not a healing only issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golbez Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 I want and am entitled to a THOROUGH explanation as to why this is necessary. NOW. Not later. NOW. Yes, sir, Sgt. Eversman! ******* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kainsec Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 There was a point in beta where there was not trauma and healers where way way OP irc. Current healing is fine our healing operative has no problem healing she posts quarter million+ every warzone. The real issue with healing is the stupid raid health display. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapuchinSeven Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 Being subpar for a long time is not to your credit FYI. Senefera is well known across a number of EU MMO servers as being a quality competitive PVP healer. Senefera heals as well as you forum rage, so as you can see Senefera heals pretty well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHRISGG Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 Senefera is well known across a number of EU MMO servers as being a quality competitive PVP healer. Senefera heals as well as you forum rage, so as you can see Senefera heals pretty well. rofl "known" no ones heard of that guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leiloni Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 Senefera is well known across a number of EU MMO servers as being a quality competitive PVP healer. Senefera heals as well as you forum rage, so as you can see Senefera heals pretty well. I have no idea who Senefera is but CHRISGG is not the only one who thinks healing in this game needs some serious fixes. And "this other dude is awesome because I say so" is not a great argument as to why you think healing does not need fixes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweaq Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 Really? In that case let's see what would happen to the forums if damage was reduced by 30%. I'm sick and tired of mmo devs favouring dps players. This is one of the worst cases I've ever seen of it though. pass this guy some tissues Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zingas Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 *** really? This doesn't bode well. I don't nor have I played a healer in this game in a Warzone, but I've never considered the current healing to be overpowered, I just see no one getting on healers or CC'ing ever. Way too many bad players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reenolols Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 A healer will not be able to heal through one GOOD(I've seen zero of these besides myself) dps. Two healers are generally not even a problem. It definitely needs some fixes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baltman Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 (edited) I just see no one getting on healers or CC'ing ever. Way too many bad players. Wish I was on your server. A healer will not be able to heal through one GOOD(I've seen zero of these besides myself) dps. Two healers are generally not even a problem. It definitely needs some fixes. Exactly. The amount of CC and interrupts make it very hard even 1 on 1. My shield is broken instantly and a 300 hp hot doesn't do anything when getting hit for 3k over and over. Try casting the big 2.5 sec cast for 3k hp and you usually wont get it off. Try running and you'll be slowed or CC. People that say its fine must be on bad servers or run with a coordinated group. Edited December 26, 2011 by baltman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allmightyprom Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 i think its pathetic how i heal for less in BGs...kinda rediculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pSyToR Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 Is it me ... or half the people posting sounds like trolls ? And worst the OP... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SundialX Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 (edited) Once other areas of PvP are ballanced (such as brackets) then I think we can realistically take a look at healing. To be honest though, I would say its too early to make a call yet. Fix raid frames... that alone is huge. Edited December 26, 2011 by SundialX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spoe Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 Definitely trolls. definitely. I can't believe any of you are trying to argue with someone who thinks they should be able to heal through an entire team's damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enveryn Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 (edited) I am definitely okay with healers in PvP now (playing shadow), situation when healer gets full hp when I miss single break is common and acceptable, but that shield... What a ridiculous amount of damage it absorbs? I mean Sorc (cloth armor?? ) gets 3 Shadowstrikes (that crit for 3k+ dmg) and some white strikes and walk out with shield still up... seroiusly ***? Edited December 26, 2011 by Enveryn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHRISGG Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 I am definitely okay with healers in PvP now (playing shadow), but that shield... What a ridiculous amount of damage it absorbs? It literally only absorbs 2k damage aka 1 hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enveryn Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 It literally only absorbs 2k damage aka 1 hit. Can't belive, sry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jooji Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 Healing seems fine to me. As an operative level 50 medic spec I can easily solo most ACs. I can also handle 2 DPS on me most of the time by using kiting, los, stuns, etc. I also out-heal the highest dps any warzone where I'm not going for DPS medals. I'm glad us healers aren't absurdly OP in SWTOR. In WoW it was kinda a joke. I never had to LOS to keep myself up, and that was in 2200+ RBG play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Repefe Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 With strong heals healers are the dumbest role in instances. You need zero skill to be big asset for your group. Healing in TOR is more challenging and I like it as sawbones scoundrel. That being said good healer in TOR is still borderline game breaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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