Hotwireds "I know what I'm talking about" rework of Commando/Merc Utilities + Talents

[Gyronamics]

Hello,

 

Many things happened in 3.0 to the ranged trio and what I'm broadly seeing is Sorcs being made extra frisky with unreal health regeneration, Snipers still being snipers with stacks of cheese potential and then there's mercs who still have this "heavy ranged" role with new and improved "impossible to heal to full" as a dps.

 

The heavy ranged part actually became more true with us being able to select a passive aoe reduction as a heroic utility. Finally gave us one up on Snipers who can get gibbed if they take AOE damage while walking about not in Entrench. Mind you when they are in Cover+Entrench their defences are freaky good.

 

Anyway, I'm primarily a DPS who can offspec heal and I raid at maximum difficulty level in 8m and 16m modes.

 

I'm also a 100 valor casual PVP player who likes a good WZ and while I am aware a merc isn't the best class for it it doesn't take me forever to do the weekly solo ranked mission.

 

From this position I think some of the failings of our class can be easily remedied mostly by having a better utility selection. So with intelligent choices we can spec for any area of play and be competitive.

 

Not everything is about utilities however and while the main theme of this thread is "beefing up merc survivability" I am aware that one spec is a healer and therefore an "unkillable super-tank-healer" can be created which is not a desired effect. Hence many changes being utilities with the key point being you can't have them all.

 

 

Pushback

 

 

Upgraded Arsenal: Reduces the pushback suffered while activating Power Shot, Tracer Missile, Concussion Missile, Fusion Missile and Serrated Shot by 75%

 

It's not funny but very unpleasant to be taking constant damage in a burn phase and getting your casts jolted thus reducing your output. Pushback is an outdated mechanic which for a twisted reason applies to 2/3 ranged specs. Prior to 3.0 our pushback resistance was 100%, make it so again and don't forget Sorcs either.

 

 

Getting outranged by ranged....

 

 

35m Sorc

35m Sniper

30m Merc

 

Why is there a 30m range which is exactly the engagement range of melee gap closers applicable to Mercs then +5m on that available to the other two ranged classes thus allowing a headstart on both melee AND mercs. I'd let this go in exchange for a good explanation but I'm really not seeing a good justification for it. Obviously I'd like merc to have the same 35m engagement range so they aren't in this weird position of being unable to fight while the other two can.

 

 

A specific change to the DPS trees

 

Arsenal: Decoy causes Chaff Flare to absorb 1 direct Tech/Force hit.

 

Innovative Ordinance: Degauss causes Chaff Flare to increase defence chance by 25% for 6s

 

Really isn't good enough in the current meta of "focus the merc, their defences are trivial" when competitive play comes around. Change to a SERIOUS anti-focus CD like this:

 

Arsenal: Decoy causesChaff Flare to provide Tech/Force immunity for 6s

 

Innovative Ordinance: Degauss causes Chaff Flare to increase defence chance by 50% for 6s

 

Note that because this is dps tree specific it cannot apply to the healer branch.

 

 

Now lets move onto the utility selections, trim the junk and put in meaningful choices which players can tailor to their specific combat scenario.

 

 

Utilities - Skilful

 

Gyroscopic Alignment Jets: Vent 10 heat when stunned, immobilised, knocked down or otherwise incapacitated.

This is fine.

 

Improved Vents: Vent Heat vents 15 extra heat instantly and grants 10% alacrity for 6 seconds.

This is fine

 

Power Barrier: Power Shot, Tracer Missile and Rapid Scan generate a Power Barrier that increases damage reduction by 1% for 15 seconds. Stacks up to 5 times.

This is fine.

 

Jet Escape: Reduces the cooldown of Jet Boost by 5 seconds and Determination by 30 seconds.

This is fine.

 

Afterburners: Rocket Punch immobilises the target for 4 seconds. Direct damage caused after 2 seconds ends the effect. The target has its damage reduced by 50% for 4s. Damage reduction will not apply to Operation bosses. In addition, Jet Boosts knockback effect is stronger and pushes enemies 4 meters further away.

Improved. Here's the deal, a melee root is utter junk on a ranged class so how about we keep the penalty of it being a melee root and give it a reason to be penalised like a 50% damage reduction for great counterplay opportunity.

 

Custom Enviro Suit: Increases Endurance by 3% and all healing received by 3%.

This is fine.

 

Boresights: Increases the damage dealt by Sweeping Blasters by 25%.

This is weak. But fine.

 

 

Utilities - Masterful

 

Torque Boosters: Increases the duration of Hydraulic Overrides by 4 seconds.

This is fine.

 

Suit FOE: When you activate Cure on yourself, a Foreign Object Excisor reduces all periodic damage taken by 30% for 12 seconds.

This is annoying. But fine.

 

Protective Field: Increases all healing received by 20% while Energy Shield is active.

This is fine.

 

Power Shield: Energy Shield now further decreases ability activation pushback by 30% and makes you immune to interrupts.

This is fine.

 

(Pyro Shield) Kolto Shield: When activated, your Energy Shield heals you for 2% per second. Taking damage increases the duration of Energy Shield by 2 seconds to a maximum duration of 30 seconds.

Improved. Pyro Shield is utterly unimportant as a damage or defensive ability. Adding healing and shield duration is far more of a threat especially when combined with other shield talents.

 

Heat Damping: Eliminates the heat generated by Jet Boost, Concussion Missile, Cure and Electro Dart.

This is fine.

 

Infrared Sensors: Increases stealth detection level by 2, melee and ranged defences by 2% and reduces the cooldown of Stealth Scan by 5 seconds. All controlling effects which break on damage are immediately broken while standing in your own Stealth Scan.

Improved. Node guard? Now you can without being utterly useless against stealth.

 

Utilities - Heroic

 

Energy Rebounder: When you take damage, the active cooldown of Energy Shield is reduced by 3 seconds. This effect cannot occur more than once every 1.5 seconds. In addition, when taking damage, you have a 20% chance to emit an Energy Redoubt which absorbs a low amount of damage and lasts 6 seconds. This effect cannot occur more than once every 10 seconds.

This is fine.

 

(Jet Rebounder) Kolto Rush: Kolto Overload now activates at 50% and will heal for 40% over 6s. In addition, taking damage reduces the active cooldown of Kolto Overload by 1 second. This effect cannot occur more than once every 1.5 seconds. Furthermore the cooldown on Hydraulic Overrides is reset when Kolto Override triggers.

Improved. Who really takes a more frequent bad aoe plus resolve builder as a defensive talent? A more usable Kolto Overload combined with Hydralic Override reset for escape and survival is a far more practical thing.

 

Kolto Jets: Jet Boost heals you and up to 7 other allies within range.

This is fine.

 

Thrill of the Hunt: Allows Unload and Blazing Bolts to be activated while moving.

This is fine.

 

Stabilized Armor: Reduces damage taken from area effects by 30%. Additionally, while stunned, you take 30% less damage from all sources.

This is fine.

 

Supercharged Reserves: Reduces the cooldowns of Cure and Disabling Shot by 3 seconds each. In addition, you build up to 10 stacks of Supercharge over the course of using Recharge and Reload. This effect cannot occur more than once every 30 seconds.

This is incredibly niche. But fine.

 

Power Overrides: Reduces the cooldowns of Concussion Missile and Power Surge by 15 seconds each. In addition, Power Surge grants a second charge, making your next two abilities with an activation time activate instantly.

This is fine. Not for me personally but some people like it.

 

 

 

 

So in short, we keep the "cant heal to full" that we were given, let sorcs keep that meme to themselves and reinforce the "heavy ranged" role with substantial passive and active defensive choices we can make to suit all areas of combat.

Edited January 13, 2015 by Gyronamics

[Ryuku-sama]

About your Kolto Rush... It's nice but you should reformulate.. Saying it will ONLY heal 30% is a huge nerf.. KO can heal you twice over when you're taking damage but won't go over 35%. A correct formulation would say : Can be activated under 50% and will heal you to a maximum of 30% over the activation amount.

[cs_zoltan]

• Gyroscopic Alignment Jets IS useless. In PVE it barely ever "procs" and in PVP it's unreliable and not needed. (If someone overheats in PVP with all the stuns, pushbacks and LoS is bad and should feel bad). Over the duration of a stun you vent 20 heat anyway (+ alacrity +4 heat if arsenal) or 10 heat if knocked down, and when the enemy wants to root you you are already running for your life so who cares about 10 heat.
  
• Heat Damping is mostly useless as well. Reduced heat on situational abilities that barely cost anything to begin with? Ewww....Move the relevant parts to Kolto Jets and Suit FOE and scrap the rest.
  
• Jet Rebounder is actually pretty neat (especially combined with Kolto Jets) so I don't want to see it gone. But also it doesn't worth a heroic utility point, more so because almost all of the rest outclasses it. Move it to Masterful in place of the scrapped Heat Damping.
  

 

The rest I agree with.

Edited January 12, 2015 by cs_zoltan

[venomlash]

I like it...especially the change to Infrared Sensors. I don't PvP much, but I've got some traumatic memories of being left to solo node-guard as a Commando and getting jumped by stealthers. (Happened to me on two doors in a row one Voidstar match despite calling for a guard buddy, true story.) I mean, currently ALMOST EVERY OTHER class has some kind of special defense against the sap cap:

-Vanguards can use Shoulder Cannon and can also talent Adrenaline Rush to act as an extra CC breaker.

-Scoundrels have stealth and can lurk until the enemy unstealths to cap.

- Gunslingers have super stealth detection if they've been camped out, and can also Hunker Down to be immune to CC with pretty good uptime.

-Sentinels are screwed too. Meh.

-Guardians can talent Focused Defense to act as an extra CC breaker, and can also talent Freezing Force to be free, allowing them to spam it while guarding and thus pull into combat anyone coming within 8m of them.

-Sages have the godbubble, enough said.

-Shadows have stealth, just like Scoundrels, and can also talent Deflection to give them 12s of stun immunity.

But Commandos are left out on the cold; all they can do is some crude area denial, forcing stealthers to zoom in quickly to mez before they're unstealthed. Allowing Commandos to be functionally immune to soft CC while guarding with 75% uptime would give them a very nice defense against stealthers trying this.

 

Supercharged Reserves, I'd say, is NOT fine. All it really is is a slight cooldown reduction to our cleanse and our interrupt, because you can build stacks out of combat with Med Shot/Kolto Shot spam just fine. (The only argument I've seen made against doing this is "...but then you're wasting your relic procs! what if you get jumped by a stealther before the ICDs on those procs are up???") Maybe people would take it if it caused exiting combat to build stacks (after the fashion of Preparation for the Guardian), or if it caused Med Shot to build an extra stack or something, or if it caused Demo Round/Assault Plastique/Successive Treatment to build a stack or two for slightly faster supercharging. But as is, it's 3s shorter cooldown on cleanse and interrupt. Bada boom, that's it, and it's useless for all reasonable purposes.

[Gyronamics]

About your Kolto Rush... It's nice but you should reformulate.. Saying it will ONLY heal 30% is a huge nerf.. KO can heal you twice over when you're taking damage but won't go over 35%. A correct formulation would say : Can be activated under 50% and will heal you to a maximum of 30% over the activation amount.

 

No. KO can heal you for about HALF your health.

 

e.g. grabbed aggro from random mob, stood in fire with 54785hp, activated KO well under 35%, received 28182 healing.

 

A rapid 40% guaranteed heal triggered at a base of 50%hp is far more useful than the "maybe" 50% you can get from KO while staying vulnerable to burst.

 

I read through after posting and was changing it to 40% while you posted in case you're wondering why its 40.

[BarronWasteland]

One heroic change that needs to be made is HO gives immunity to not only movement effects but CC as well. I mean EVERY other class has this. When I see a Mando or Merc use it the first thing that happens is a stun. HO is just made useless. Fix KO, Shields to 50%-60% and HO makes immune to all CC and we have a spec that can get out of the first initial burn down that happens in PVP, especially ranked.

[Gyronamics]

One heroic change that needs to be made is HO gives immunity to not only movement effects but CC as well. I mean EVERY other class has this. When I see a Mando or Merc use it the first thing that happens is a stun. HO is just made useless. Fix KO, Shields to 50%-60% and HO makes immune to all CC and we have a spec that can get out of the first initial burn down that happens in PVP, especially ranked.

 

No that's over the top to stack on one ability with a long duration and low CD.

 

If you check the Chaff Flare changes I suggest that in effect is a stun/damage/focus counter. Arsenal simply won't take a stun with tech/force resistance up and IO will be too resistant to all damage to kill if a stun gets through.

[Zoom_VI]

Arsenal: Decoy causesChaff Flare to provide Tech/Force immunity for 6s

 

Erm, as much as I like buffs, this would be a bit much. Its essentially shroud but longer and on a 45 sec CD. A better one might be "causes Chaff Flare to absorb all Tech/force damage for 6s"

[Gyronamics]

I'm seeing this as either we take a lot less damage and control or we get a LOT more healing potential.

 

And frankly our resources were not up to the H2F role even when we could. Therefore the side of not taking the grief in the first place by using "free" cooldowns is quite appealing.

 

Aside from boosting the aggro drop to be a major defence the rest is pick and mix utility. It can't ever be a battle immunity utility because one tree is a healer and such a thing is very bad if it's actually the dps who need such a thing.

 

A merc even with HO is not a fast mover. Kiting, LOS and abusing controls are a lot more in favour of the inquisitors and agents. Mercs are not subtle, they can't be. So if we can't be subtle, fast or able to recover easily then yes I absolutely feel an immunity shield to yellow damage (which includes most controls) is a good thing.

 

That is the Arsenal variant of course, the IO version is a 50% dodge vs white or yellow which is differently focus resistant and of course allowing a better result against ranged/melee damage which arsenal won't have.

 

A damage resistant heavy armour caster vs fast moving powerful healing casters vs the "eccentric defence package" snipers doesn't sound so bad to me.

 

If it is a game of balance a merc should be the middle ground where sorcs excel at using LOS, snipers excel at open ground while mercs beat sorcs in the open and beat snipers with LOS. As I see it of course.

Edited January 13, 2015 by Gyronamics

[TezMoney]

The nerf on push back I think is due to the fact it only effects cast abilities now and more of a PVP thing really, also isn't the situation you described exactly what Power Shield is for?

 

Kolto Shield is far too strong for Masterful in my opinion. It should swap places with Kolto Jets which is far too weak to be in Heroic, or take out the duration extension.

 

I'd get rid of Heat Dampening and replace it with an different utility all together.

 

Shield Stabilizers: When Energy Shield is activated, any incoming attack bolsters your defenses with a Shield Stabilizer that grants an additional 2% of damage reduction. Stacks up to 15 times. (This one tickles me to think what a dot class would say when they see a bunch of yellow 0's pop up cuz you also have WZ adrenal + Suit FOE)

 

I would also replace Power Shield with...

 

Calibrated Shield : Energy Shield now further decreases activation pushback by 30%, makes you immune to interrupts, and increases Alacrity by 10% . (Power sheild just doesn't have the oomf it had in 2.0 with interrupts being nerfed, most people cc me when I pop ES anyway. I think the alacrity buff would help both dps and heal specs recover hp or used as offensive CD in rare cases.)

Edited January 13, 2015 by TezMoney

[Gyronamics]

The nerf on push back I think is due to the fact it only effects cast abilities now and more of a PVP thing really, also isn't the situation you described exactly what Power Shield is for?

 

I'm not happy with the idea that our major DCD should be an offensive CD to prevent pushback during burn phases where the raid is being hit in the face.

[TezMoney]

If you're getting in hit the face during a burn phase, that's usually the time to pop defensives anyway. Edited January 13, 2015 by TezMoney

[Gyronamics]

Yes I said that in my guide. But it's not the case really. You don't use your shield to increase damage, you use it to not be dead and thereby not lose considerably more damage.

 

Compensating for pushback using our best defensive ability is extremely wrong. Pushback shouldn't be a thing simply to irritate 2/3 ranged classes.

[TezMoney]

Yes I said that in my guide. But it's not the case really. You don't use your shield to increase damage, you use it to not be dead and thereby not lose considerably more damage.

 

Compensating for pushback using our best defensive ability is extremely wrong. Pushback shouldn't be a thing simply to irritate 2/3 ranged classes.

 

But you're not "increasing damage" you're mitigating pushback. How is that any different from mitigating damage? Again pushback exists for PVP. Just because snipers are immune while in cover, doesn't mean all range should be.

 

Pushback isn't really a major issue in PVE anyway. There's very few fights where a dps would be under constant damage for an extended period of time while they need to output optimal dps. Fights like TFB and Dread Council, the dmg hits very frequent enough for you to fall way behind the sniper in your raid. Only the adds in fights like Ballo cause pushback problems for me. On the other hand, snipers have to deal with positioning dropping their output at times when mercs and sorcs don't. Can you give a specific example where this cost you a significant amount of dps?

Edited January 13, 2015 by TezMoney

[Gyronamics]

From a position of "getting hit and receiving pushback" it is an outgoing damage increase to use your shield while at the same time it may not be necessary to reduce your incoming damage. That's the difference.

 

I can't believe you think it's a meaningful question to ask if my damage drops if I have to move. I can't hard cast while moving and there are a lot of mechanics which demand that I move.

 

On the other hand there are burn phases which turn up like Blaster HM where my log tells me there's a damage tick about every half second.

Let me say it again.

 

Pushback was at 100% resistance for main DPS abilities prior to 3.0, this is not a novel idea. It's been changed to 75% and while a decent explanation from the game team might be nice my preferred position is that pushback should not be a thing.

Edited January 13, 2015 by Gyronamics

[TezMoney]

From a position of "getting hit and receiving pushback" it is an outgoing damage increase to use your shield while at the same time it may not be necessary to reduce your incoming damage. That's the difference.

If you're getting hit enough to actually cause significant push back then you are taking enough damage for it be at least beneficial to use your shield. The situation you described is at the end of a fight, there's no reason to hold back the shield if you have it. This is going to go nowhere if we're not talking about this practically, that's why I asked for a specific example.

I can't believe you think it's a meaningful question to ask if my damage drops if I have to move. I can't hard cast while moving and there are a lot of mechanics which demand that I move.

I didn't ask that, I was asking for specific fights where pushback causes you to lose dps, when you needed optimal output. I'm questioning whether the entire root of your issue w/ pushback actually exists in PVE, since the reason push back immunity no longer exists for mercs and sorcs is definite in PVP. I'm not saying it doesn't, I'm asking to be convinced.

 

My point with having to move was to say you certainly aren't as hindered by it as much as say a MM sniper, who has your vaunted immunity.

On the other hand there are burn phases which turn up like Blaster HM where my log tells me there's a damage tick about every half second.

Okay... what was your dps loss during that interval (I assume you have a parser)? Do you have a sniper in your raid, if so, do you think he lost out the same amount of dps as you having to move during carpet bombings, yellow aoe thing, boss' fire spin, repositioning due to bomb overlap, ect...?

Pushback was at 100% resistance for main DPS abilities prior to 3.0, this is not a novel idea. It's been changed to 75% and while a decent explanation from the game team might be nice my preferred position is that pushback should not be a thing.

Yes, and let ME say it again... Pushback resistance was nerfed as a balance in PVP because pushback immunity was added to channeled abilities. If you want to hear it from a dev, feel free to watch or re-watch either the first or second 3.0 streams with the sorc or mercenary, I know it's in one of them.

Edited January 13, 2015 by TezMoney

[BarronWasteland]

No that's over the top to stack on one ability with a long duration and low CD.

 

If you check the Chaff Flare changes I suggest that in effect is a stun/damage/focus counter. Arsenal simply won't take a stun with tech/force resistance up and IO will be too resistant to all damage to kill if a stun gets through.

 

No its not. It is not even on par with what other classes have. I know from my experience i ranked PVP if I could just stop being chain stunned and globaled right off the bat then I could do well that round.Every other class has long durations of cc immunity and if they are nerfing our heals then make up for it somewhere else dammit.

[Gyronamics]

I'm getting this feeling that I'm discussing pushback in raids with someone who doesn't do the same content and I'm being dragged around like a fool.

 

The bottom line is it's a negative influence and the class would be better off without it. A DPS loss because you take damage as opposed to mechanics, moving or controls is not enjoyable. Many people are not aware of mechanics so I wouldn't expect everyone to care.

 

Pushback has little weight in how well(or not) mercs perform in PVP and come to that the reason why sorcs are ripping up PVP has nothing to do with it either.

 

There is no point of view to change. Mine is it that it should not be so and that removing it is nothing but positive. You can try and convince me that pushback resistant mercs would ruin pvp if you like.

 

No its not. It is not even on par with what other classes have. I know from my experience i ranked PVP if I could just stop being chain stunned and globaled right off the bat then I could do well that round.Every other class has long durations of cc immunity and if they are nerfing our heals then make up for it somewhere else dammit.

 

HO is on a 30s CD or in my case 25s because I kept old PVP set bonuses. It then lasts for 6s or 10s with utility spec.

 

That is a gigantic level of CC and physics immunity.

Edited January 13, 2015 by Gyronamics

[FourPawnBenoni]

 

Arsenal: Decoy causes Chaff Flare to absorb 1 direct Tech/Force hit.

 

Innovative Ordinance: Degauss causes Chaff Flare to increase defence chance by 25% for 6s

 

Really isn't good enough in the current meta of "focus the merc, their defences are trivial" when competitive play comes around. Change to a SERIOUS anti-focus CD like this:

 

Arsenal: Decoy causesChaff Flare to provide Tech/Force immunity for 6s

 

Innovative Ordinance: Degauss causes Chaff Flare to increase defence chance by 50% for 6s

 

 

I stopped reading at this point. How could you possibly think that this would be just as good for I/O as it would be for Arsenal??? Both Disciplines should get the tech/force immunity.

[TezMoney]

I'm getting this feeling that I'm discussing pushback in raids with someone who doesn't do the same content and I'm being dragged around like a fool.

I do 16 HM but I'm a healer, my hps goes up during those raid dmg situations even though have 5% less pushback resistance than you. I'm simply trying to understand your perspective. I have a sorc who's obsessed with his parses and 2 mercs in my group an none of them have ever even mentioned anything about significant dps loss due to pushback, but if you can't provide any proof toward this claim I'll go on thinking as I do. No need to get all elitist about it (Content experience doesn't matters, numbers are numbers.)

The bottom line is it's a negative influence and the class would be better off without it. A DPS loss because you take damage as opposed to mechanics, moving or controls is not enjoyable. Many people are not aware of mechanics so I wouldn't expect everyone to care.

LOL... Okay. I don't really see any difference between them, but I suppose that's a matter of opinion

Pushback has little weight in how well(or not) mercs perform in PVP and come to that the reason why sorcs are ripping up PVP has nothing to do with it either.

Pretty sure that was my point: Pushback has little weight on how well mercs perform in PVE.

There is no point of view to change. Mine is it that it should not be so and that removing it is nothing but positive. You can try and convince me that pushback resistant mercs would ruin pvp if you like.

I was asking you to change my view, I wasn't looking to change yours. I'm not saying pushback resistant mercs would ruin pvp, merely parroting the reason it was changed.

[Gyronamics]

Pushback = lower APM = Lower output = Bad.

 

The desired position is:

 

Casting on rails = Consistency = Good.

 

 

As it says very clearly in the original post.

Edited January 13, 2015 by Gyronamics

[TezMoney]

Pushback = lower APM = Lower output = Bad.

 

The desired position is:

 

Casting on rails = Consistency = Good.

 

 

As it says very clearly in the original post.

 

Yes, but so what? Here's another equation for you: Moving = lower APM = Lower output = Bad; or even Stuns = lower APM = Lower output = Bad

 

By this chain of logic all fights should be vs test dummies to be good, obviously that's not desirable for anyone. So are we done condescending now?

 

What it is on paper is one thing, how it susses out in practice is another, and I contest pushback does very little your output in PVE. The benefits are clear for immunity, that's not what's in question. Isn't the point of this thread to convince the devs to revert this change? Yet you present nothing to counter their position.

 

Obviously we're just going around in circles without specific numbers to go on, like I said earlier, so we'll just have to agree to disagree.

Edited January 13, 2015 by TezMoney

[Gyronamics]

The developers very rarely declare a position and even less commonly take note of community views. When in general forums all you can do is set out your thoughts and feelings on what is and what you'd like with vague hope it gets noticed.

 

The effort required to persuade any dev to change something is enormous, possibly it should be so. Certainly when the available pool of suggestions are from and in general forums you get buckets of junk suggestions.

 

I'd not mention it if I saw a developer line on "we really have a thing for mercs and sorcs having pushback and think the community enjoys it so we added it back in 3.0" but such a line I have not seen and have difficulty believing as second hand news.

[TezMoney]

The developers very rarely declare a position and even less commonly take note of community views. When in general forums all you can do is set out your thoughts and feelings on what is and what you'd like with vague hope it gets noticed.

 

The effort required to persuade any dev to change something is enormous, possibly it should be so. Certainly when the available pool of suggestions are from and in general forums you get buckets of junk suggestions.

So what's the point of this thread, to get your epeen stroked by other members confirming you indeed "know what you're talking about"?

I'd not mention it if I saw a developer line on "we really have a thing for mercs and sorcs having pushback and think the community enjoys it so we added it back in 3.0" but such a line I have not seen and have difficulty believing as second hand news.

No need to be obtuse. I told you were you can source their stance on my pushback is in, if can't be bothered to check for yourself and choose to be ignorant, then so be it.

Edited January 13, 2015 by TezMoney

[Gyronamics]

The point of this thread was for someone to get emotionally trapped into not backing off when they get an answer they didn't like. As a result the thread rambles on for many posts continually being bumped at no use to man or beast.

 

Or maybe it was to put out some considerably better ideas since similar threads are full of mudslinging and really really trash suggestions and grow with increased mudslinging.

 

Pick one.

Edited January 13, 2015 by Gyronamics