Final Boss of HM Manaan.

[Reno_Tarshil]

Everytime we get this HM we tend to struggle getting the fight finished because of the 5 minute fight timer which if you don't complete auto resets the fight.

 

We've defeated the fight before on HM but sometimes during the fight when we drag him under the fire his health barely drops and sometimes it drops a lot. Coupled with some high damage going around towards the end of it, are there any friendly tips you can provide me so I may pass along to my group to make the fight less taxing.

 

Again we eventually get lucky and get it done but it takes several attempts and the right stars to align it feels like.

[Izrin]

Welcome to Hardmode

[Reno_Tarshil]

Welcome to Hardmode

 

Okay... We've been doing the new Level 60 HMs since release, that welcoming part is far behind us.

[rantboi]

tell the healer to dps whenever they can. i know healers do **** damage but it does make a difference in that fight

[Danylia]

sometimes during the fight when we drag him under the fire his health barely drops and sometimes it drops a lot.

If this is the main issue, then I'm afraid I can't help. However, here are some general tips:

 

1) Cleanse the stacking DoT appropriately. Tank should do this in the "non-aggro" moments after Spinning Kick, DPS according to situation - tank can possibly drag the boss to a kolto barrel to enable a DPS to cleanse without having to stop doing damage.

 

2) Get the boss under fire as much as possible (that is, always when there's fire).

 

3) Don't DPS the adds. The adds should be only hit by the tank to get aggro on them (or by a DPS if the tank is unavailable and the adds are going after the healer) and then dragged under fire, where they die pretty fast. Don't be afraid to stand in the fire until the adds are dead - compared to all other damage, the fire one is neglibile.

[wainot-keel]

 

3) Don't DPS the adds. The adds should be only hit by the tank to get aggro on them (or by a DPS if the tank is unavailable and the adds are going after the healer) and then dragged under fire, where they die pretty fast. Don't be afraid to stand in the fire until the adds are dead - compared to all other damage, the fire one is neglibile.

 

Any pattern on how the adds spawn ? When doing this fight with my guildies there were no trouble at all. They spawned, tank grabed them and got them into fire. Done.

 

But when I pugged this a couple of times, the adds were a massive pain. Sometimes there was no fire to bring them to and they can melt a dps in a few seconds if one of them picks the three up. Also bad having to dps them instead of using the fire, since they have around 28k hp each, which makes the dps requirement on boss even higher.

[venomlash]

Got a fairly good group for this one (killed Sairisi pretty fast, 1shotted Ortuno) and it took us three tries to down the sonofagun. The problem we had was the adds coming in from some weird direction and eating the healer. What eventually worked was grouping them under the fire, a quick AoE (Mortar Volley or Plasma Grenade depending on cooldowns) and boom, problem solved.

 

The real problem is that sometimes the adds spawn while the tank is still punted and can't pick them up. I guess SOP for that is for the healer to just stand in the fire. How counterintuitive!

Edited December 20, 2014 by venomlash

[Jambajobo]

does the timer start immediately after the cutscene? I think so but dont know for sure.

[Danylia]

Any pattern on how the adds spawn ?

To be fair I don't know, though it indeed seems to be independent on the fire. My personal guess is that the adds spawn based on timer, while the fire appears based on % health of the boss.

 

But as said, that's just a guess. Hopefully someone will be able to answer this properly.

[Loc_n_lol]

To be fair I don't know, though it indeed seems to be independent on the fire. My personal guess is that the adds spawn based on timer, while the fire appears based on % health of the boss.

 

Actually I think it's the other way around. Case in point, if you do not engage the boss, fire will still appear continuously, but no adds will until the boss hits about 50%.

 

Either way, this can all add up to the very unpleasant situation where the tank has the kick debuff, the fire has just been used to hit the boss and is now gone, and adds spawn... What do you do then ? I have no answer.

[Ardarell_Solo]

Actually I think it's the other way around. Case in point, if you do not engage the boss, fire will still appear continuously, but no adds will until the boss hits about 50%.

 

Either way, this can all add up to the very unpleasant situation where the tank has the kick debuff, the fire has just been used to hit the boss and is now gone, and adds spawn... What do you do then ? I have no answer.

 

In those rarce cases have the tank establish good AoE aggro first, then have DPS quickly focus down the adds one after another with sinlge target dps (e.g. from right to left), so they die before tank loses aggro. If healer gets add aggro initially, he needs to drag them to the tank so he can AoE aggro them.

 

While this is a dps loss on the boss, it will still work if you kill the other add groups in fire.

 

With a competent and well geared group (186+) you can either simply AoE down the adds, though, or have them die in AoE splash damage (dot spreading from boss, force storms etc.) eventually, no matter when and where they spawn.

[TACeMossie]

In those rarce cases have the tank establish good AoE aggro first, then have DPS quickly focus down the adds one after another with sinlge target dps (e.g. from right to left), so they die before tank loses aggro. If healer gets add aggro initially, he needs to drag them to the tank so he can AoE aggro them.

 

While this is a dps loss on the boss, it will still work if you kill the other add groups in fire.

 

With a competent and well geared group (186+) you can either simply AoE down the adds, though, or have them die in AoE splash damage (dot spreading from boss, force storms etc.) eventually, no matter when and where they spawn.

 

If you have the kick debuff, your aggro is ignored on the aggro table and your threat gen is reduced by 99%, so the issue is probably still gonna be there.

[Ardarell_Solo]

If you have the kick debuff, your aggro is ignored on the aggro table and your threat gen is reduced by 99%, so the issue is probably still gonna be there.

 

Oops, shame on me, that completely passed me by, don't know how our guild tank handled that. I assume it's applied by the Spinning kick metioned earlier? Is that one on a timer?

[wadecounty]

When I have the debuff and adds spawn, I use my stuns/mezzes/kb's etc to give my healer and DPS space.

 

Example, on an Assassin tank you can Overload the adds (if spec'd for the root even better), you can insta-whirlwind one, electrocute one, and spike another.

 

On a Jugg tank you can fear the whole group, push one, choke one, backhand another.

 

On a Powertech tank you can carbonize them all, electro dart one, oil slick the group to slow them down.

 

So yeah, all 3 tanks have quite a few tools up their sleeves even without holding aggro to help keep the adds off your teammates.

[CrazyGreggy]

On a Jugg tank you can fear the whole group, push one, choke one, backhand another.

 

Are they not droids and therefore immune to Awe/Intimidating Roar?

[wadecounty]

Are they not droids and therefore immune to Awe/Intimidating Roar?

 

You might be right, can't quite remember. Regardless, still plenty of options as a Jugg.

[Nkya]

They can be CC, my operative throw them a stun grenade if the fire isn't here yet.

[Distracted]

Actually I think it's the other way around. Case in point, if you do not engage the boss, fire will still appear continuously, but no adds will until the boss hits about 50%.

 

Either way, this can all add up to the very unpleasant situation where the tank has the kick debuff, the fire has just been used to hit the boss and is now gone, and adds spawn... What do you do then ? I have no answer.

 

Stuns, the adds are not immune to these.

[SBR_QuorTek]

It is doable as long as you follow the mechanics well enough... likewise being geared for it... its easy.. remember to put him into the fire circles and the likes... and it is all fine from there on.

 

Also if people know what they are doing then most of these FPs can be done in like 15minutes or so... maybe even less.

[NogueiraA]

Everytime we get this HM we tend to struggle getting the fight finished because of the 5 minute fight timer which if you don't complete auto resets the fight.

 

We've defeated the fight before on HM but sometimes during the fight when we drag him under the fire his health barely drops and sometimes it drops a lot. Coupled with some high damage going around towards the end of it, are there any friendly tips you can provide me so I may pass along to my group to make the fight less taxing.

 

Again we eventually get lucky and get it done but it takes several attempts and the right stars to align it feels like.

 

The timer starts when you ENTER THE ROOM. Weird, I know. Bugged? I think so.

[DogEyedBoy]

The timer starts when you ENTER THE ROOM. Weird, I know. Bugged? I think so.

 

Any proof of this? I've stood in front of the boss for a fair while talking, explaining, and whatnot; I still got the text pop ups on cue and noticed nothing untoward with the timing when killing him.

[DawnAskham]

I've not had any problems with this boss, though in all honesty I refuse to pug at this point, so have only done these fights with guild members or friends.

 

The only tips I can offer are these - make sure the tank puts the boss in the fire, just being close won't cut it (you should see a stacking debuff on the boss if he is positioned correctly); if the tank gets tossed or isn't near the adds when they spawn, kite them to the tank / fire (I've seen dps / healers with add aggro run away from tank many times); save damage cool downs for when the boss is at 5 stacks of the fire debuff.

 

If you are doing all of this and still having problems, it could well be that the timers are getting out of whack - that is things which should line up are not and things which should not line up are (e.g. when fire comes, adds come, and tank gets kicked / loses agro).

 

This could be due to some events being on a hard timer from entering room, others on a timer from boss engagement, and others based on boss HP percentages - but in any event could lead to a very easy combination or a very difficult combination.

 

This would also be consistent with the way other encounters seem to have a bit of annoying RNG - such as the first boss on Tython dropping the big single orbital on the tank / melee and then immediately doing his mass grapple or having the idiot wookiee in Rakata get the death circle and leap to the major at the same time a player with the circle gets grappled.

 

While all of the current content is very simple and easily beatable, IMO it is much less polished than previous content and seems to have a high number of buggy or cludgy mechanics that don't always work correctly (assuming the design intent isn't to have RNG simply wipe you some percentage of the time).

Edited December 23, 2014 by DawnAskham

[fire-breath]

The timer starts when you ENTER THE ROOM. Weird, I know. Bugged? I think so.

 

Shouldn't be a bug. Storywise it makes much sense. Very much. You are in a sinking lab, there is no time to doddle around. Explain the fight outside next time. BEFORE the whole lab is sinking to its doom. Treat it as Raptus where you need to tickle him slightly to get to the real fight.

 

Anyways regarding the fight a few tips:

Firstly the fight is very much doable without any fancy stuff besides trapping him in the fire. If someone still has issues you could try the following to help out a bit:

 

- If there is a dps with a taunt let the tank guard him and let the dps use his taunt when the tank get kicked in the balls.

- pro option .... let the dps taunt just before the dirty kick happens.

 

- Tank the boss close to healing kolto station to help out with healing and/or cleansing the dot. This will mean less healing needed so the healer can dps more.

 

- DPS down the adds. Their HP isn't that high and almost every DPS has upgraded AoE since 3.0. Last time we wiped several times and a commando who didnt attacked the adds ragequitted. We got a sage as reinforcement who did attack the adds and they melted instantly with the combined Serenity + 'whatever spec the sage was' AoE power

 

- Get the adds in the fire but don't go out of your way for it. Many times its better to just kill them fast.

 

- Make sure raidbuffs are being used when the boss is below 30% HP for optimal damage.

[Danylia]

DPS down the adds. Their HP isn't that high and almost every DPS has upgraded AoE since 3.0.

Concealment Operative here. Did HM Manaan three times so far, the other DPS were 1)Vengeance Juggernaut, 2)Deception Assassin, 3)Lightning Sorcerer. We indeed decided to kill the adds instead of dragging them into fire in one of these cases.