Cashal Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 (edited) So I'm only commenting on what I've seen. I'm a long time PvPer, I knew how to get great damage. But it seems to me that Sage/Sorcs seem to be topping the Damage charts way easier. I have an Operative and Jug at 60 I'm currently PvPing with, but I've played with all classes to 55. Operative's I've noticed the biggest nerf. From what I've noticed 2.0 to 3.0: Damage: Flavor of the Month: Powertechs/Vanguards + Sorcs/Sages Medium: Juggs/Guardians, Marauder/Sentinel, Commando/BH, Assassins/Shadow Underpowered - Operatives/Scoundrels, Snipers/Gunslingers (?) Healing: BH/Commando > Sage/Sorc > Op (stolen from another thread, but agree) This isn't a "Waaaabulance, my current class sucks and everyone else is to blame nerf" thread. I'm honestly curious if more people than I are noticing this. I'm humble enough to admit that it could just be me. =) Edited December 11, 2014 by Cashal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maverickmatt Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 All of these bow before the mighty Serenity Shadow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 Commando/merc is definitely not on the same level as a guardian unless they are allowed to freecast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFoxstride Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 It seems you have completely forgotten about a whole class. Maybe you haven't seen them because they are so stealthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cashal Posted December 11, 2014 Author Share Posted December 11, 2014 It seems you have completely forgotten about a whole class. Maybe you haven't seen them because they are so stealthy. Heh, Assassins I have the least experience with. But If I were to put it "IMO" I'd say in the middle too. I'll edit above Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxmob Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 (edited) Classes way out of wack in PvP - Sage/Sorcs topping damage charts way to easy it's funny you say this because while I leveled my PT in pyro, I'm going tactics for my VG, and I've been doing pretty much double the overall dmg of anyone in my grp, while dying less than most and being at the top of the prot list amongst dpsers. I know I'm playing against players that don't have all the discipline talents I do (56-58), but it's pretty wild how easy it is to just faceroll the kb on tactics VG. the shoulder cannon not having an ICD is very noticeable. I also didn't realize this but the aoe taunt only seems to grant "chaff flares" in tactics, giving the spec better survivability than pyro despite having much better burst. I mean...I don't think I had that debuff with pyro, did I? cuz I last a lot longer on the tactics. also...tactics is now a ranged class. I know there are two important melee abilities, but honestly...15m now? and assault plastique is full 30m? and sticky is now a lot more valuable and also at 30m? yeah. I love me some VG, but this spec is going to get knee-capped else it's going to be the new jugg with *******s running all over the place with it. Healing: BH/Commando > Sage/Sorc > Op (stolen from another thread, but agree) healing specs across the board are just fine. none of them are in trouble. if you can't get it done on one of them, I think that's more a reflection of player skill than anything else. as evidence, I offer the fact that I find scoundrels to give me the most trouble, and they're supposedly the worst of the bunch. I mean scoundrels who I was mopping up in 2.x with pyro but now in tactics are often able to escape. Edited December 11, 2014 by foxmob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cashal Posted December 11, 2014 Author Share Posted December 11, 2014 healing specs across the board are just fine. none of them are in trouble. if you can't get it done on one of them, I think that's more a reflection of player skill than anything else. as evidence, I offer the fact that I find scoundrels to give me the most trouble, and they're supposedly the worst of the bunch. I mean scoundrels who I was mopping up in 2.x with pyro but now in tactics are often able to escape. I should have clarified, Survivability I think scoundrels/ops are fine. But the amount of healing they can output comparitively is what I'm speaking too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hei_Atzfel Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 All of these bow before the mighty Serenity Shadow. You clearly haven't seen what an AP PT or lightning sorc can do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexsamma Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 So I'm only commenting on what I've seen. I'm a long time PvPer, I knew how to get great damage. But it seems to me that Sage/Sorcs seem to be topping the Damage charts way easier. I have an Operative and Jug at 60 I'm currently PvPing with, but I've played with all classes to 55. Operative's I've noticed the biggest nerf. From what I've noticed 2.0 to 3.0: Damage: Flavor of the Month: Powertechs/Vanguards + Sorcs/Sages Medium: Juggs/Guardians, Marauder/Sentinel, Commando/BH, Assassins/Shadow Underpowered - Operatives/Scoundrels, Snipers/Gunslingers (?) Healing: BH/Commando > Sage/Sorc > Op (stolen from another thread, but agree) This isn't a "Waaaabulance, my current class sucks and everyone else is to blame nerf" thread. I'm honestly curious if more people than I are noticing this. I'm humble enough to admit that it could just be me. =) Operatives are the worst healers... pebkac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maverickmatt Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 You clearly haven't seen what an AP PT or lightning sorc can do. I have a sorc and have always played lighting. I can clearly see what they can do. AP is busted because of a busted ability. Serenity is just unholy. The more opponents there are, the stronger they get (which is *** backwards). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFoxstride Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 Been playing lvl60 regular wz this week and top 5 overall damage dealers are invariably a mix of sages/sorcs and shadows/sins. Still haven't seen an outstanding PT/VG like so many people say on the forums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustinxDuff Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 (edited) I don't even know why I bother on my GS. Sorcs do more damage and are mobile. Edited December 11, 2014 by JustinxDuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cashal Posted December 11, 2014 Author Share Posted December 11, 2014 This seems to be confirming my theory about Sorcs . . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 You clearly haven't seen what an AP PT or lightning sorc can do. I am yet to see a PT post 3200+ scoreboard DPS for a full 8v8 match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexsamma Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 I am yet to see a PT post 3200+ scoreboard DPS for a full 8v8 match. No one rages at powertechs for their amazing sustained dps... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 No one rages at powertechs for their amazing sustained dps... Complaining about VG burst is so yesterday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teclado Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 I'm not particularly concerned about fluff damage that sages/sorcs get by spreading their DoTs all over the place. Topping the charts doesn't really get you anything. With my Tactics Vanguard, I can burst healers down so fast that his other healer friends don't have time to react and save him. That is what wins objectives - breaking through healing walls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevor_the_Bruce Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 The reason that your seeing such high damage numbers is because of the dot spread. That coupled with the madness sorcs healing for 25% of damage dealt (not a lot really if its one dot, but when your dots are on 6-8 people...) makes the class kinda hard to kill. Its difficult to gage how truly effective a dps class is in pvp because you have burst classes and dot spread classes. My brother who just started playing a Madness Sorc noted that they have little burst but because of the dot spread healing them they can stay in the fight a lot longer than a burst class like the Lightning Sorc. Its easy to be disheartened because of the insane damage that dot classes are putting out now, but usually these classes are no match for a burst class. I do think that the healing from the dots needs to be toned down, because 25% of a crit is a fair amount. BW could fix the problem by going back to how it was before where you'd only heal on crits and only for a % of your health. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hei_Atzfel Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 I am yet to see a PT post 3200+ scoreboard DPS for a full 8v8 match. Who cares if you can't hit 3k when you can kill someone all by yourself in like 4.5s. As for the dps, I've seen many MANY lightning sorcs hitting 2.8-3k dps, people that aren't even in full unranked 60 gear or in new augs (inspected on fleet) and frankly, that's utter insanity and needs to go. I'm not even talking AoE spam, just normal burst with chain lightning procs. Honestly PvP has a lot of crap that needs looking at right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 I'm not particularly concerned about fluff damage that sages/sorcs get by spreading their DoTs all over the place. Topping the charts doesn't really get you anything. With my Tactics Vanguard, I can burst healers down so fast that his other healer friends don't have time to react and save him. That is what wins objectives - breaking through healing walls. Lightning is also push well past 3k scoreboard DPS. Also the VG issue is pretty much tied to the fact that SC is bugged as hell and has no ICD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hei_Atzfel Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 Lightning is also push well past 3k scoreboard DPS. Also the VG issue is pretty much tied to the fact that SC is bugged as hell and has no ICD. Even with the proper 1s rate limit on missile launches that's only going to add maybe 1-2s to the TTK that AP has right now, which is still bloody insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vember Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 You clearly haven't seen what an AP PT or lightning sorc can do. Everybody's on the shadow hate train right now, and its not all that imo. PT/VG and Sorc/Sage are far, far worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlrikFassbauer Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 (edited) Everybody's on the shadow hate train right now, and its not all that imo. PT/VG and Sorc/Sage are far, far worse. Would it be better if it was "The VG / PT first" instead of "The healer first" ? Edited December 11, 2014 by AlrikFassbauer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 Would it be better if it was "The VG / PT first" instead of "The healer first" ? Given the damage taken numbers I pull, I'm pretty sure it already works like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hei_Atzfel Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 Everybody's on the shadow hate train right now, and its not all that imo. PT/VG and Sorc/Sage are far, far worse. To be fair, the sin/shadow hate train is justified. Hatred is too strong and the deflection CC immunity utility is the single most broken thing out of every single utility in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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