Solo Play is dead !

[huggaa]

I sure do miss the old days when gear came in 3 forms and everyone was happy with that because you got and used which level you could access with your play style.

 

1. Raid gear (best Gear in the game stat wise)

2. Crafting gear ( long drown out process to gather the items needed to make but had stats just under raid gear)

3. Grinding gear ( Gear that had a small chance to drop off very hard and rare mobs and had stats just under crafting gear)

[Alssaran]

I sure do miss the old days...

 

I guess people are just bend on the idea that better gear means that they are better as a player, and that this is the reason they need to obtain it. Let's be honest here: Even as a HM Ops person, you don't necessarily "need" 198 at the moment. One tier below that is just fine. I'm currently farming 192, in both SM Ops and FP, and I don't see a reason to panick getting it.

 

In the end, it all boils down on what you want to achieve in this game. I sure as hell don't play a Bioware game to listen to the epic bossfights or be part of a progressive raid community. I play it for the story.

 

Now, having the HM FP/SM Ops gear is enough for that. You'll usually be able to get all the story done with that gear. Even when a new Patch hits (introducing a new FP/daily area like Oricon or CZ-198), you'll be able to start there with that gear.

 

So, I don't see a reason having access to 198 gear at the moment. At all. If you are a progressive raider, it sure as hell is a nice perk to get. As everything else, it's not necessary a must have. So, why get all worked up over it?

[LanceCorporalDan]

Do ops to get ops gear... like do pvp to get pvp gear?

 

I fail to see the problem here. The risk/reward is appropriate for what we get now. We can go into SM ops and get ops gear for next tier. This is called progression. You can't just jump from one end of the spectrum to the other.

[NSStember]

The expansion was made with the solo player in mind.

Give them some time to flesh it out.

 

Exactly. If anything, this expansion was group "unfriendly" as just about all mission instances were "personal" and not "group".

[Kalfear]

I sure do miss the old days when gear came in 3 forms and everyone was happy with that because you got and used which level you could access with your play style.

 

1. Raid gear (best Gear in the game stat wise)

2. Crafting gear ( long drown out process to gather the items needed to make but had stats just under raid gear)

3. Grinding gear ( Gear that had a small chance to drop off very hard and rare mobs and had stats just under crafting gear)

 

LOL not sure what "old" days you referring to

 

but I do miss the old days when there was NO Raid/OPS gear and NO PVP Gear

You got your gear from quest lines and random drops and had to form real connections in MMORPG to be able to complete these group content. When getting a new level was actually exciting and not something just assumed is owed to you. Where player skill and knowledge played a bigger role then gear ever would.

 

This concept that any minor play style should be the best rewarded will always be disliked and shot down because Devs are putting a emphasis or bias on 5% of the player base (as metrics have shown out for the progression raiders). That means 95% of the player base has no desire to do that style of content (just like PVP only rewards).

 

Its bad design

 

What the devs need to do is make the normal content that the majority do play challenging and time consuming (which it is not right now) so there is a feeling of accomplishment when you finally succeed.

 

Pitting playstyle against play style against playstyle as EA (and other companies) have been doing since WOW came out is just bad, lazy, shortsighted development.

[Citruzz]

Thats the old same discussion. This old: "if u dont play ops u dont need it"-argument is dead. Sry !

And i said: i play ops. But i cant afford id many times. Id like to have another source of hard content and adequate reward. And the gap between ops and FP is tooo big ! U want skilled people to get skilled gear ? Ok ! But if u dont keep in mind that there are different people, having different time to invest, being on different servers (e.g. i wait half an hour for a FP pop, but i said that in another thread), what do u want ?

Only the hardcore-community that also is perma-playing like having no job getting the best gear all time ?

Or is there a "tiny" way to get the rest of the community in that too ? And WHY NOT ?

 

bring the player, not the gear

[Alssaran]

What the devs need to do is make the normal content that the majority do play challenging and time consuming (which it is not right now) so there is a feeling of accomplishment when you finally succeed.

 

No, that's exactly what Bioware can't do if they want to keep the game available for a broader audience.

 

You might not believe it, but there are actually people who can't afford to play multiple hours each day to get that next item in line. And that behaviour shouldn't be ignored. What you're suggesting with that sentence is to make the game a place where only the people with the most skill and the most spare time can succeed at. That's a good way to annihilate a good part of your playerbase.

 

You do FP's / SM Op's or PvP if you don't have much time at your hands each week. Once a week, twice a week. You do HM Ops when you want a bigger challenge. You do NiM Ops when you're really interested in progressive raiding.

 

Bioware doesn't need to make the game more "time consuming" to make you feel like you have just accomplished the impossible.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Alssaran

[Orizuru]

U only want people in game that only play OPs all time ? So only the kiddies/students that dont have a job and family ?

 

I find this to be insulting.

 

I work more than full-time, I'm a father with a fiance who is in grad school, I'm helping to plan our wedding, I'm planning a move for my family into a new home and I still find plenty of time to play a few nights a week while also doing SM and HM Operations 2-3 nights each week with my guild.

 

And you have the gall to make snide comments how only kids and students with no job or family have time to play this game?

[Lotharofxev]

Tdamaha's post on everything in the game being "dead" did make me LOL. One wonders how, for such a "dead" game, EA made over 150 million last year from SWTOR.

 

ZOMBIES! ZOMBIES EVERYWHERE!

[DOHboy]

Thread above yours claims Raiding soon to be a thing of the past...your thread solo play is dead.

 

 

Game is DED folks we can all move on to other games now the forums have spoken. 3 years strong and will be dead before Christmas.

[LyraineAlei]

I find this to be insulting.

 

I work more than full-time, I'm a father with a fiance who is in grad school, I'm helping to plan our wedding, I'm planning a move for my family into a new home and I still find plenty of time to play a few nights a week while also doing SM and HM Operations 2-3 nights each week with my guild.

 

And you have the gall to make snide comments how only kids and students with no job or family have time to play this game?

 

Lies. Gamers only live in their mother's basements, everyone knows this. *eye roll*

 

I love the claim that we need to get "real lives" when people get into a discussion that happens to be, pretty darn nerdy (Just last night on PubFleet, we had a debate going on as whether or not Khan from Wrath of Khan and Original Series was a super human because he was genetically engineered to be the best, based on points made in DS9, ENT, and OS, followed by a comparison between Original Khan and Cumberpatch Khan).

 

People play video games to escape real life; get a power trip; have fun being someone else; have fun being an overpowered version of themselves; enjoy a story; waste time they would other waste in other ways; hangout with friends; be able to talk about the games they actually like with their own "peeps"; and many other reasons.

[DreadtechSavant]

Your thread makes little to no sense.

 

Why do you crave for operations gear, if you have no interest in running operations? 186 and 192 should be enough for Solo play.

 

Assuming it's the armor shells you want, either get to it or wait a couple of years or so, which is the time by which they'll -- probably -- hit the Cartel Market.

 

Except on PvP severs as player with 186 gear cannot compete with 192 gear. so on that point alone the OP has a point. As players can attack players now waiting is an issue. Before anyone says well why play on a PvP sever, well why should we give up 22 characters slots? or 66 if you use all English speaking severs and you can add more in you take into account the German and French severs.

 

As for the rest well I'm still playing solo always have and always will.

Edited December 12, 2014 by DreadtechSavant

[Foambreaker]

If you don't do ops you don't need ops gear.

 

/thread

[Foambreaker]

Except on PvP severs as player with 168 gear cannot compete with 192 gear. so on that point alone the OP has a point. As players can attack players now waiting is an issue. Before anyone says well why play on a PvP sever, well why should we give up 22 characters slots? or 66 if you use all English speaking severs and you can add more in you take into account the German and French severs.

 

As for the rest well I'm still playing solo always have and always will.

 

Or they could get PvP gear

[Transcendent]

Um, needing the same gear that drops in the op, to do that op is not how it works.

186's are the entry to the SM's. You earn 192's in SM to prepare for HM, you earn 198's in HM to prepare for NiM(when it gets released in a few months.)

So the requirements are:

SM: 186

HM: 192

NiM: 198

 

So that excludes the [Weekly] Classic Operations as they are now HM content, unless ofc you *pray* to the gods of RNG that the one piece of loot at the end of a HM flashpoint is for your character and you actually manage to win it.

 

So if you actually want to do one of the new operations in *semi - decent* gear (it's comms gear which has poor stats anyway) that doesn't one shot you because the healers can't keep up, what options are there? Run HM flashpoints for the next 6 months? Sure okay.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Transcendent

[Candor]

Listen:

1. I had full 186 before early access was done.
   
2. The HM FPs only drop basics.
   
3. Therefore, not a lot of reasons to log in if you're a hardcore soloer. That's the OP's point.
   

 

This really didn't have to be an "ops vs. solo" discussion. Give ops another tier of gear for all I care.

 

Better yet, make a set of 198 gear that can only be earned and used in solo content. (Like this: give every mob except ops mobs a new defense stat. Then add a new offense stat to the game that only appears on very expensive basic-comm mods. Do the same for ops mods and ops gear and you can keep those pesky soloers from taking your good American jobs.)

[asbalana]

LOL not sure what "old" days you referring to

 

but I do miss the old days when there was NO Raid/OPS gear and NO PVP Gear

You got your gear from quest lines and random drops and had to form real connections in MMORPG to be able to complete these group content. When getting a new level was actually exciting and not something just assumed is owed to you. Where player skill and knowledge played a bigger role then gear ever would.

 

This concept that any minor play style should be the best rewarded will always be disliked and shot down because Devs are putting a emphasis or bias on 5% of the player base (as metrics have shown out for the progression raiders). That means 95% of the player base has no desire to do that style of content (just like PVP only rewards).

 

Its bad design

 

What the devs need to do is make the normal content that the majority do play challenging and time consuming (which it is not right now) so there is a feeling of accomplishment when you finally succeed.

 

Pitting playstyle against play style against playstyle as EA (and other companies) have been doing since WOW came out is just bad, lazy, shortsighted development.

 

Good post. The original post also makes sense.

 

To the argument, if you do not do OPs you do not need OPs gear, all I can say is that is very true. But it misses the basic point of human nature. What you want and what you need are two entirely different things. My wife and I (and three dogs) live in a large three bedroom house, have a large screen TV, two high powered gaming computers, a new very fast car, etc. Do we need any of that? No, not in the least. But we want it and work for it. Our work is not limited by one path or one way to accoumplish our goals.

 

The same is true for gaming. We are solo players that game together. We are both good experienced players and I have done the equivalent of OPs in other games with no issue. Yet, neither of us wants to be in a Guild with the drama and other negitives involved. Our gaming is part of our time together. We have no desire to share it with others to any but a limited extent. By the structure of end game content we are limited in that we can progress our characters only so far. We can never reach close to top. We both can craft everything possible (without picking up FP and OP mats and schematics), but that is limited. So the structure of the game makes us always second rate and limits what we can do.

 

As far as needing OPs gear to do OPs, yup again. But why? Simply because OPs are designed to require OPs gear. The same OPs can be designed to require any level of gear. OP gear progression is simply a mechanic to induce players to play OPs. Otherwise, most players would do OPs once or twice and never do them again. There is simply no reason to repeat OPs other than gear advancemt once done. So to us OPs are a joke, a treadmill at best.

 

One last thought. OPs actually trivialize the game for those who do them. When geared in OPs level gear, what other content in the game is worth doing or any challenge or fun at all? That is self defeating from a design perspective.

 

We liked the solo flashpoints and think that BW has taken a step in the right direction with them. It has brought solo players to content thet they would otherwise not see.

 

MMO devs have never gotten past the concept of FPs and OPs as end game. Until they can develope (part of develope is dev) ideas for end game play beyond that, they will end up with somewhat disaffected solosists and after a shot time bored OPs players. We (the gaming community) need some creative thinking in end game design. We have not seen that yet. Is this really a problem that cannot be solved or are the current crop of game designers / devs just poor and limited in their abilities?

Edited December 11, 2014 by asbalana

[tdmaha]

I tell you what it sure is getting bad in here...

 

QQ I want a refund for credits I spent in game QQ

 

QQ I want raid gear even though I don't raid QQ

 

On and on...

 

Ok it's rather sad a VIDEO GAME needs to teach some of you a valuable life lesson that apparently your teachers forgot to teach you...

 

Just like in the real world...you are NOT entitled to anything. You want something get off the couch and go work for it.

 

You want raid gear go raid!

[Rafaman]

Solo play is dead? Hyperbole thy name is OP.

 

TOR will now cease to exist. Good bye.

[Orizuru]

So that excludes the [Weekly] Classic Operations as they are now HM content, unless ofc you *pray* to the gods of RNG that the one piece of loot at the end of a HM flashpoint is for your character and you actually manage to win it.

 

So if you actually want to do one of the new operations in *semi - decent* gear (it's comms gear which has poor stats anyway) that doesn't one shot you because the healers can't keep up, what options are there? Run HM flashpoints for the next 6 months? Sure okay.

 

The level 55 HM Ops only require 168 gear to complete. Even in 186 gear you significantly outgear the content. And even if your group struggles with the level 55 HM Ops, you can always drop down to SM and still earn a good source of comms. The level 55 SM Ops all reward 4 Ultimates and 6 Elites as long as you do the 16-man version of the Ops. If 186 gear isn't enough for whatever content you want to do, just farm comms until you can buy the 192 gear.

 

And while there are some items in the 186 comm gear that are poorly itemized, you can still get a very nice set of gear put together using nothing but Basic comms. You just have to keep buying the one or two pieces that are itemized the way you need them and move the mod and enhancements into other pieces that aren't itemized correctly for you.

 

I think they made gearing up way too easy. I've never seen an MMO rain gear from the sky like SoR does.

[Andryah]

On one hand, this was a fairly solo-friendly expansion, and it's great that they've added solo mode to FPs -- I hope they expand on that idea to open up the story and content to more players.

 

On the other than, the idea that top-level gear is pointless if you don't "need" it... something smells funny about that one.

 

The purpose for Ops gear is to... wait for it... do Ops progressions. If you do not do Ops progressions within a guild.. then you don't need the gear that comes from Ops rewards.

 

Want it? Maybe. Need it? Not a chance.

 

the OP is completely off base. This game gets more solo friendly with each major patch/expac.

 

TL;DR ---> get over it.

[Andryah]

hardcore soloer. That's the OP's point.

 

LOL....

 

hardcore soloer in an MMO is an oxymoron. It comes from playing too many single player console games.

 

MMOs are tuned for group play at the top end of challenge.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Andryah

[CelCawdro]

SW:TOR has never been this solo friendly, and that's saying a lot given its place in the genre.

[ScarletBlaze]

So, 12 points difference. Not so bad!

 

Also don't forget Makeb gives elites.

 

I haven't checked the weeklies yet on Yavin.

Edited December 11, 2014 by ScarletBlaze

[samhinch]

So are all flashpoints soloable now?