BuriDogshin Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 What content are you talking about? Clearly NOT NiM content, since i fail to see where people are facerolling through NiM content, currently (except for a very, very few guilds). I know several players who are bored with NiM DP. It may not be as rare as you think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sindariel Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 I know several players who are bored with NiM DP. It may not be as rare as you think. Those are the very few guilds i was mentioning. I know some of them, too. But, compared to the rest of the playerbase, the are a very tiny percentage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veeland Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) - I should just quit and thus get over the changes that break the system... Edited November 1, 2014 by Veeland :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hikaru_Kuma Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Increasing the CD of cleanse and interrupt isn't a good move. A very large number of players doesn't cleanse or interrupt at all, and now BW makes it harder for those who do it? IDK if that makes sense. Also, what's with that 186 - lvl 55' dps = dps of the hightest level of gear - lvl 60. So basically I bought the xpac to lower my dps. Those who struggle in NIM prolly won't beat it at all because they will do less dps when the xpac hits. Old content are supposed to be easier as the time goes on. Again, it doesn't make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kissakias Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Increasing the CD of cleanse and interrupt isn't a good move. A very large number of players doesn't cleanse or interrupt at all, and now BW makes it harder for those who do it? IDK if that makes sense. Also, what's with that 186 - lvl 55' dps = dps of the hightest level of gear - lvl 60. So basically I bought the xpac to lower my dps. Those who struggle in NIM prolly won't beat it at all because they will do less dps when the xpac hits. Old content are supposed to be easier as the time goes on. Again, it doesn't make sense. reading the yellow part, im thinking that thoese that didnt buy the expansion will have oricon sets with higher dps than me that i bought the expansion ?:eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transcendent Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 From what I understand from the stream, they are lowering our damage to be more in line with how long they want fights to be. So every DPS gets hit with the nerf bat. All at once. As soon as 3.0 hits. Someone remind me NOT to go anywhere near Oricon or any of the new content until i've got to level 60 and have at least BiS comms gear, I don't enjoy being face-rolled by the content. [insert expletive here] stupid idea on how to re-balance the game. Oddly, now i'm not looking forward to 3.0 hitting. Can the expansion be delayed to Soon™ BioWare? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarathAnno Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 reading the yellow part, im thinking that thoese that didnt buy the expansion will have oricon sets with higher dps than me that i bought the expansion ?:eek: No everyone is having there damaged reduced when the expansion hits. Those who level up to 60 and grind new gear will be ale to get back to roughly the same damage they are seeing now assuming max gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 They have to do it. Otherwise performance becomes an issue. Don't forget this game runs on Hero engine, heavily tweaked, and I'd daresay they really didn't do good job with tweaking. So any increase in calculations, bigger numbers means more strain on PC's, and this game is notorious for it's instancing, poor performance, and total sub optimization, even with best PC's. That's not how computers work.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kissakias Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 No everyone is having there damaged reduced when the expansion hits. Those who level up to 60 and grind new gear will be ale to get back to roughly the same damage they are seeing now assuming max gear. but those that dont get the expansion will keep their stats intact without do anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drockter Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 but those that dont get the expansion will keep their stats intact without do anything? No... everyone gets the expansion, although if you didn't order/pre-order, you dont get access to the new content. All players will go to disciplines, and all players will see the damage reduction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Well, the only thing that was directly said was that those at level 55 with 186 gear will notice a slight DPS decrease. There was no mention as to a decrease for any other gear level or character level. So my guess is that they tuned down the stats on the 186 gear, and put similar stats on the top level gear instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sindariel Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) but those that dont get the expansion will keep their stats intact without do anything? No, they'll get nerfed and do less DPS as they are doing now with the same level of gear, which means that lvl 55 players without the expansion will have a much harder time to engage the current NiM content. Q: Can you explain lower damage at level 60 A: If you are at 186 gear at 55, when you login your DPS will come down. If you equip the 198 gear and be level 60, your DPS will be similar to current 55s with 186 gear. Edited October 31, 2014 by Sindariel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwena Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) Thinking about this more, I am liking it less. For me, one of the biggest appeals of a level cap increase is that my characters will be stronger, as it essentially opens up more existing content for me. I don't really do endgame grouping, and content myself with 156ish gear. Which is perfectly fine for my purposes, as I can still gleefully zoom through level 50 dailies, solo sub-50 content for fun/coms, and participate in events. But . . . I was looking forward to being able to gleefully zoom through level 55 dailies, and solo some of the higher level content that I couldn't manage before. And yes, I realize that some content is meant to be challenging. But the thing is, I'm pretty sure they're going to add new areas that are just as challenging as pre-nerf Makeb and/or Oricon, so I don't think it is unreasonable to hope for the level 55 hard stuff to seem less murderous when the level 60 hard stuff comes out. Mind you, if Bioware is actually doing a full-on "squish" with the stats and power of everything in the game, then I have no problem with it at all. But I don't think there is enough information yet to really know what they're planning. Edited October 31, 2014 by Gwena Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) A month after the expac, nobody will ever think about this...... Its a meta change guys. Post 3.0 55s will do less damage than level 60s, thus leveling up is still a power increase. Edited October 31, 2014 by Zoom_VI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drockter Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 No, they'll get nerfed and do less DPS as they are doing now with the same level of gear, which means that lvl 55 players without the expansion will have a much harder time to engage the current NiM content. Regarding the emphasized statement above. I believe it would be more accurate to say that players at 55 will have the intended experience of nightmare content. Will it be harder? Yes. Should it be harder? According to the metrics, and design of the game... Yes Per the dev's; damage output at 55 TODAY is higher then they intended it to be for the 55 content. This is why they are adjusting the output. To bring the damage output inline with what was intended for the content. In essence, they are saying that the Nightmare content is easier than it is supposed to be, right now. That being said, I do find the 55 nightmare content to be extremely challenging, as do many... but evidently, not as challenging as it was designed to be. That's perfectly fine... if you earned it once, you can earn it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kissakias Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 A month after the expac, nobody will ever think about this...... Its a meta change guys. Post 3.0 55s will do less damage than level 60s, thus leveling up is still a power increase. if a month after expansion i can not solo the kaon under siege SM means that the degrase was a bad thing and ill be far more pissed than now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 To make it even simpler..... I would guess the majority of players do not have 186 gear at present, nor do most run NM, or ever have for that matter. I would assume they looked at the lower tier of gear, the new tier of gear and Nightmare modes and said to themselves "the DPS output is too high in this gear set, and will be phenomenal in the new top level gear set. Far too high". So, they decided to trim some of the numbers back from 186 gear, which I assume will be available to casual players now using the new universal comm (basic comms) to give room for the new gear tiers up to the top at level 60. I have not seen a direct statement that indicated you would be doing the same exact damage output you are doing now in 186 gear in the new top tier gear at level 60. One could assume by their comments that the top level gear will be higher in DPS than it is now at cap, just not substantially higher. To my knowledge they said "about the same", which could still mean higher. So, my guess would be 186 is slightly lower, to give room so the top level gear set is now slightly higher in DPS. Still a progression, just not as drastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KTap Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 A month after the expac, nobody will ever think about this...... Its a meta change guys. Post 3.0 55s will do less damage than level 60s, thus leveling up is still a power increase. Not sure how you can claim that nobody will think about this. Maybe it's a small number, but there are those of us that will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levram Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) Not sure how you can claim that nobody will think about this. Maybe it's a small number, but there are those of us that will. *hits on the nose with a rolled up newspaper* "Bad nightmare progression raider! Stop obsessing over your parses." lol - I just hope that min/max 198 gear will lean in favour of being "approximately" higher than min/max 186 by a couple hundred DPS. And if the changes I've heard about that affect healers are implemented as I expect them to be, be prepared for the best healers to be absolute beasts, come 3.0! I don't think healers and tanks have a thing to worry about. Edited October 31, 2014 by Levram Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KTap Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 *hits on the nose with a rolled up newspaper* "Bad nightmare progression raider! Stop obsessing over your parses." lol - I just hope that min/max 198 gear will lean in favour of being "approximately" higher than min/max 186 by a couple hundred. And if the changes I've heard about that affect healers are implemented as I expect them to be, be prepared for the best healers to be absolute beasts, come 3.0! I don't think healers and tanks have a thing to worry about. I'm not in NM progression, and haven't been for a while. I'm just not too thrilled about the idea of playing for months to get gear that will output the same dps. Yes it is a meaningless number to some people, I understand that, but it's not to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alec_Fortescue Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Do you really wan't to see damage numbers going as high as 1000000s? I don't. And neither blizzard did ;] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanhedgehog Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Actually, I think this is a good thing. If the devs saw the damage going higher than they expected/planned for; that means that the content was easier than they had intended. So I don't believe that any change to the existing content would be needed. They are bringing the damage numbers down to what was intended for the content. Not many will be pleased with longer fights... but I personally have no issue with it... i prefer a challenge. wildstar catered to people that were wild for "moar challenge"...they just laid 60 of them off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KTap Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Do you really wan't to see damage numbers going as high as 1000000s? I don't. And neither blizzard did ;] This isn't really a viable example seeing as we're about 100 years away from hitting these numbers at the rate we've been going up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanhedgehog Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 For those calling for an equal decrease in the mobs... that defeats the purpose... Devs, based on metrics, see damage output from players is too high for the content (@55). Response, lower the damage output. If they lower the mob strength proportional to the decrease in damage output ... it negates the change... the imbalance still exists. They are fixing a mistake they made. They made gear/stats available that were more powerful than they should have been. Simple as that. This is why I hate seeing new gear come out without new content. Gear should prepare the player for the new content... the problem with new gear without content, is the new gear is generally more powerful... which creates the imbalance (aka powercreep; more powerful player, same mob level). we have no idea exactly what metrics they are using. they say players are putting out too much damage. is this in relation to mob damage or is it an arbitrary limit they set? killing mobs help mitigate their damage. will we find groups wiping excessivly due to increased damage from mobs that just arent dropping? as groups get more and more discouraged, disappointment leads to less players utilizing the content. If df/dp will be gateways to the next 2 ops, are they expecting only a few select guilds will be able to do the next 2 ops? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDX-TWO Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 we have no idea exactly what metrics they are using. they say players are putting out too much damage. is this in relation to mob damage or is it an arbitrary limit they set? killing mobs help mitigate their damage. will we find groups wiping excessivly due to increased damage from mobs that just arent dropping? as groups get more and more discouraged, disappointment leads to less players utilizing the content. If df/dp will be gateways to the next 2 ops, are they expecting only a few select guilds will be able to do the next 2 ops? I haven't thought about that, we have been doing DF/DP for a year and they want us to gear for the 2 new ops with these 2 ops. I am sick and tiered of doing DF/DP com'on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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