Lots of juicy info from Unnamed SWTOR Podcast from NY Cantina Tour

[PavSalco]

<Bioware makes The Foundry>

"Nooo, how could you make Revan lose to 4 random nonames"

<Bioware makes the operation that requires 8 or 16 full–fledged elite warriors>

"Nooo, I'm solo. I can't trust anyone. Dis sux!"

<Bioware makes the solo version of the fight>

"Nooo, you ruined Revan!"

 

Mark my words.

[Gleneagle]

I totally agree with you there, but expecting all of the content to be soloable in a MMO is just an unrealistic (and somewhat silly) expectation IMO.

What makes it unrealistic and silly in your view?

 

Compare it with life. You journey through life only experiencing what you experience. There are billions of people with you yet your experience is individual. You cooperate with others to accomplish things you cannot do alone but you don't 'group' for all those things, you simply cooperate. Why is such cooperation between individuals encumbered by the 'group' mechanic in an MMO?

 

Granted, in the military you are designated part of a unit, but that is to simplify administration. A leader generally can efficiently manage only so many direct reports, who in turn can effectively manage only so many direct reports, and so on down the line to the sergeant or chief and their unit. But a soldier or sailor in each squad is still an individual able to decide for themselves how to proceed even if alone.

 

There isn't an intrinsic grouping mechanism in life, there is willing and sometimes practiced cooperation between individuals... except for codependency, a social illness.

 

Codependency appears to differ from interdependency and cooperative independence in the degree to which a codependent member personality needs codependent partners. The alpha needs the neediness of the betas to bolster their self-esteem. The independent and interdependent are fine, whether alone or while cooperating.

 

In conclusion I find it quite supportable that the artifice of grouping is psychologically less than optimal. It would be far better to facilitate and nurture interdependence and independence.

Edited October 15, 2014 by Gleneagle
better paragraphs

[Clarian]

I totally agree with you there, but expecting all of the content to be soloable in a MMO is just an unrealistic (and somewhat silly) expectation IMO..

I've never said that I expect it. But I want it, and no harm letting Bioware know that.

Nearly all of the group content is repeatable and you'll eventually get to see the dialogue for your preferred choices. That's the compromise one has to accept when starting to play any MMO IMO.

I would never run content in a group multiple times to do that. Far too much hassle, for me. The compromise I accept is: When there's no more content left that I can do solo, leave the game and just never do any of the group-only stuff at all...and Bioware gets no more of my money.

 

Having said that - the longer the game is around, and the higher the level cap continues to go, the more old group stuff presumably becomes solo-able. So, I hope it's around for a long, long time.

[Oyranos]

• Togruta is the next race they're working on, but not for 3.0 of course (Not interested)
  
• they're looking into options/working on separating gear stats from fashion (some form of costume manager);
  this includes the issue of color crystals, if/when they separate the rest of the gear's stats from looks, crystals would be included in the new system as well; POSSIBLY in 3.0 (what is the purpose of that?
   
  
• they did pod-racing prototype but abandoned it due to technical issues (server lag being cited as the problem with determining race winners) (excuses)
  
• current 55 top-level ops gear = entry level 60 ops gear (we knew that without telling us, same as MAKEB)
  
• no world boss in 3.0, but we will be seeing one after 3.0 next year (pffF)
  
• they're talking internally about possibly increasing EC up to level cap again, not for 3.0 though (pffff)
  
• they may look into faction-change in future (pffff)
  
• they are definitely working on the next Stronghold, but no definitive info which planet it will be on; working on combat dummies for strogholds; if they can improve performance they will up NPC limit from 25 (what about interactive decos, crafting decos, more decos, decos decos... ) Event for strongholds? I made a suggestion for it, anybody reads? My suggestion for a stronghold event, involves a kind of hide and seek, you give us some items and we hide them inside the house, or some of our items turn automatically eligible for searching, so we have to search as many homes as we can, get clues, get rewards, etc...
   
  
• multi-phase plan to revitalize GSF, increased requisitions being the first phase pff
  
• 2 new tactical FPs are 55-60 leveling FPs, both brand new thats nice
  
• 4 HM FPs are Tython, Korriban, Manaan & Rakata (if you maintain them as tactical as well, because I love 1 drop from these and I want to farm it, then cool).
   
  
• there is either a solo-mission or FP equivalent of the second operation, the finale of the expansion story (a choice if you prefer to do the solo/FP or Ops version of the story?), Unnamed podcast didn't remember correctly if it was solo-mission or FP, possibly locked behind Reputation grind level (the equivalent, not the actual Op itself!); WOW's Wrath of the Lich King example of this feature was cited; NPCs possibly to "fill-in" for missing group members (pfff)
  
• engineers are working on improving queue-times for PVP, not cross-servers but something "way better"
  
• new WZ maps and game-mode next year, they haven't decided what the game-mode will be yet though
  
• working on improvement for open world PVP, not on previous Ilum scale but on a "Conquest" scale (?)

(thats nice, but make it global map, not in 1 spot... I ve made a suggestion about it a month ago...

 

Here is my suggestion in the suggestion box, but make it global, not in 1 planet... http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=761735

Edited October 15, 2014 by Oyranos

[Warrgames]

Am I the only one that noticed this....

 

 

 

Unnamed SWTOR Podcast brings lots of juicy info from Cantina NY Tour chat with Bruce Maclean:

http://gaddockgaming.com/2014/10/11/episode-57-nyc-cantina-qa-spoilers/

[*]there is either a solo-mission or FP equivalent of the second operation, the finale of the expansion story (a choice if you prefer to do the solo/FP or Ops version of the story?), Unnamed podcast didn't remember correctly if it was solo-mission or FP, possibly locked behind Reputation grind level (the equivalent, not the actual Op itself!); WOW's Wrath of the Lich King example of this feature was cited; NPCs possibly to "fill-in" for missing group members

 

This theory is based off what the podcast said and not directly from BW. The podcast may have miss spoke and its both op or all op.

 

This smaller scale is for the second operation. Which leads me to believe the second op is where you face Revan. Since it a huge story moment that they want everyone to see it. I think Revan bipolar kicks in again and he swaps side yet again. Or you learn its not really Revan its one of his crazy followers pretending to be him. Either way I don't believe we are going to see that*********************** Revan die. If he was simple killed than there would be no need to create a smaller version to let people see it. Or they would other these smaller version for other op too; where the big bad guy dies.

 

[Knorlac]

What makes it unrealistic and silly in your view?

 

Compare it with life. You journey through life only experiencing what you experience. There are billions of people with you yet your experience is individual. You cooperate with others to accomplish things you cannot do alone but you don't 'group' for all those things, you simply cooperate. Why is such cooperation between individuals encumbered by the 'group' mechanic in an MMO?

 

Granted, in the military you are designated part of a unit, but that is to simplify administration. A leader generally can efficiently manage only so many direct reports, who in turn can effectively manage only so many direct reports, and so on down the line to the sergeant or chief and their unit. But a soldier or sailor in each squad is still an individual able to decide for themselves how to proceed even if alone.

 

There isn't an intrinsic grouping mechanism in life, there is willing and sometimes practiced cooperation between individuals... except for codependency, a social illness.

 

Codependency appears to differ from interdependency and cooperative independence in the degree to which a codependent member personality needs codependent partners. The alpha needs the neediness of the betas to bolster their self-esteem. The independent and interdependent are fine, whether alone or while cooperating.

 

In conclusion I find it quite supportable that the artifice of grouping is psychologically less than optimal. It would be far better to facilitate and nurture interdependence and independence.

 

While what you say maybe true for real life, this is still a game, a MMO to be specific with all the mechanics that are traditionally associated with said genre. When I buy a game that's advertised as a single player rpg, I fully expect all the things people are demanding here to be present. When I buy a MMO though, I fully expect there to be content that rquires a group, as in bringing down a foe that is far to powerful to tackle on your own.

 

And while I'm not opposed to soloing content on principle, making all content including OPs soloable would mean that BW would basically have to design every OP twice as it couldn't contain any kind of puzzle bosses or mechanics that require coordination between multiple players. IMO it would result in an unreasonable spending of resources and probably an even slower production cycle.

[MisterBlackJack]

Did you not see how utterly terrified Musco was whenever anyone came close to discussing anything that wasn't planned? And how adamantly he insisted that all discussion is confined to the topic at hand? It certainly doesn't seem different. Frankly, I felt frustrated for him - looked like the higher ups are instituting a policy that he doesn't agree with.

 

Anyway, listening to this thing now. Essentially, the live answers are the same nitpicky bullplop questions as usual, followed by all these amazing answers from a private conversation that he didn't record for some reason. Pardon me for not taking it as the Gospel truth.

 

If the podcast guys are reading this, don't take this personally, but I just don't trust this kind of information. A lot of it even seems plausible, but anyone who hangs around the forums could put together a list 90% similar to what they're reporting.

 

I'll wait for official word.

 

This isn't the first time this has happen. In previous cantina, devs spilled beans how only Guild Leaders will have the ability to invade planet. Also they dropped the hint of player housing in the private ones before even the teaser came out in the livestream.

[Foambreaker]

This whole thread is a troll, the statements made up, stop bumping it.

 

The best way to handle a thread like this is just let it sink to page 2349876423.

[Knorlac]

This whole thread is a troll, the statements made up, stop bumping it.

 

The best way to handle a thread like this is just let it sink to page 2349876423.

 

Well even if none of it is true, this thread at least serves the purpose of letting BW know that a lot of those features are desired by the community(well the part of it that responded here anyway).

[MisterBlackJack]

I dunno, cause everyone I know thinks it was one of the worst ops they put out. with a rediculas difficulty curve compared to other ops. I mean... these days no one does it for the most part because they can get the same rewards more or less for doing eternity vault

 

WHAT!!!!! ITS by far the Best Operation they ever made. Its a true test for Raid members coordination and ability to work together. The fact that its still difficult at 55 makes it even greater than any op they made

[MisterBlackJack]

This whole thread is a troll, the statements made up, stop bumping it.

 

The best way to handle a thread like this is just let it sink to page 2349876423.

 

You know this isn't the first time they spilled info like this in a private setting after QnA

[Knorlac]

WHAT!!!!! ITS by far the Best Operation they ever made. Its a true test for Raid members coordination and ability to work together. The fact that its still difficult at 55 makes it even greater than any op they made

 

Agreed. Not saying that every OP should have this lvl of difficulty, but it it really stood out and was a lot of fun to tackle. Same goes for the Lost Island FP pre nerf.

[LordArtemis]

Most of the good information on Legacy changes, GSF, Tacticals and Housing came from sideline comments like this. In fact, I don't remember any comments taken from the current dev team, in a sideline convo, that turned out to be false, nor do I remember recently any comments posted by the community coming from the current devs that turned out to be false.

 

That lends credence to the idea, considering the reliability of the source, that this is valid information....but then again, I have seen folks even accuse Duffy of posting false information when they obviously did not care for the information being reported.

[Darth_Wicked]

<Bioware makes The Foundry>

"Nooo, how could you make Revan lose to 4 random nonames"

<Bioware makes the operation that requires 8 or 16 full–fledged elite warriors>

"Nooo, I'm solo. I can't trust anyone. Dis sux!"

<Bioware makes the solo version of the fight>

"Nooo, you ruined Revan!"

 

Mark my words.

 

^^ I'm gonna frame this.

 

This whole thread is a troll, the statements made up, stop bumping it.

 

The best way to handle a thread like this is just let it sink to page 2349876423.

 

And you know this... How exactly?

Edited October 15, 2014 by Darth_Wicked

[DarthDymond]

<Bioware makes The Foundry>

"Nooo, how could you make Revan lose to 4 random nonames"

<Bioware makes the operation that requires 8 or 16 full–fledged elite warriors>

"Nooo, I'm solo. I can't trust anyone. Dis sux!"

<Bioware makes the solo version of the fight>

"Nooo, you ruined Revan!"

 

Mark my words.

When you have a million players logging in each month? Yeah, you're going to scrape up three different opinions on how Revan should be handled.

[darkov]

So... its been a few days and there is NOTHING to verify what has been said in the OP.

 

Smells like a troll post to me.

[Jadescythe]

So... its been a few days and there is NOTHING to verify what has been said in the OP.

 

Smells like a troll post to me.

 

Clearly BW feels obligated to respond to posts on the forums within 48 hours and doesnt wait until they already planned to release the information

[darkov]

Clearly BW feels obligated to respond to posts on the forums within 48 hours and doesnt wait until they already planned to release the information

 

You would think for such a sizable amount of information there would be someone that could verify it, either from BioWare or more likely, another Cantina attendee?

[Foambreaker]

Well even if none of it is true, this thread at least serves the purpose of letting BW know that a lot of those features are desired by the community(well the part of it that responded here anyway).

 

No it isn't, since it starts on a false premise the only BW staff that will be reading anything in this thread will be the mods editing, deleting and suspending

 

"A good place to discuss" is in a thread about one of these topics, not all, and where the thread starts with facts, not flame bait.

[DarthDymond]

No it isn't, since it starts on a false premise the only BW staff that will be reading anything in this thread will be the mods editing, deleting and suspending

Thread's been up for three days now and on page one for the majority of that time, if they were going to do any deleting or suspending, pretty sure it would have happened by now.

[LordArtemis]

So... its been a few days and there is NOTHING to verify what has been said in the OP.

 

Smells like a troll post to me.

 

Fair enough, but the source is reputable IMO.

[Nickious]

You would think for such a sizable amount of information there would be someone that could verify it, either from BioWare or more likely, another Cantina attendee?

 

Maybe they don't want to outright confirm because if **** happens and somethings have to be canned, there will be riots on the streets.

 

You promised BW, I hate you biofail

Edited October 15, 2014 by Nickious

[Nydus]

Unnamed SWTOR Podcast brings lots of juicy info from Cantina NY Tour chat with Bruce Maclean:

http://gaddockgaming.com/2014/10/11/episode-57-nyc-cantina-qa-spoilers/

 

 

• Togruta is the next race they're working on, but not for 3.0 of course
  
• they're looking into options/working on separating gear stats from fashion (some form of costume manager); this includes the issue of color crystals, if/when they separate the rest of the gear's stats from looks, crystals would be included in the new system as well; POSSIBLY in 3.0
  
• they did pod-racing prototype but abandoned it due to technical issues (server lag being cited as the problem with determining race winners)
  
• current 55 top-level ops gear = entry level 60 ops gear
  
• no world boss in 3.0, but we will be seeing one after 3.0 next year
  
• they're talking internally about possibly increasing EC up to level cap again, not for 3.0 though
  
• they may look into faction-change in future
  
• they are definitely working on the next Stronghold, but no definitive info which planet it will be on; working on combat dummies for strogholds; if they can improve performance they will up NPC limit from 25
  
• multi-phase plan to revitalize GSF, increased requisitions being the first phase
  
• 2 new tactical FPs are 55-60 leveling FPs, both brand new
  
• 4 HM FPs are Tython, Korriban, Manaan & Rakata
  
• there is either a solo-mission or FP equivalent of the second operation, the finale of the expansion story (a choice if you prefer to do the solo/FP or Ops version of the story?), Unnamed podcast didn't remember correctly if it was solo-mission or FP, possibly locked behind Reputation grind level (the equivalent, not the actual Op itself!); WOW's Wrath of the Lich King example of this feature was cited; NPCs possibly to "fill-in" for missing group members
  
• engineers are working on improving queue-times for PVP, not cross-servers but something "way better"
  
• new WZ maps and game-mode next year, they haven't decided what the game-mode will be yet though
  
• working on improvement for open world PVP, not on previous Ilum scale but on a "Conquest" scale (?)

 

There are also HUGE story spoilers for the expansion which I ommitted, if you want to listen to them they start at around 53 minute mark in the podcast. Sorry to Gaddock/Unnamed SWTOR Podcast if I made any mistakes or stepped on some toes, correct me where I made mistakes, but this was a very informative Podcast so I though it needed a thread and bullet points.

 

Disappointed BUT NOT in the context of all the free stuff - in so much as anything is 'free' in this game - content we've got over the past six months. I have to wonder at the wisdom of providing game changing features like GSF and Strongholds for free...

 

I suppose it has helped keep people in the game...

 

- Arcada

[Pietrastor]

The difference with Togruta is that they have head tails that drape over their shoulders which Twileks don't. Head pieces aren't a problem, it's chest pieces since the lower tails will clip through a lot of chest pieces. You also have a number instances in cutscenes where clipping would be pretty bad.

 

Regardless of those things I think it's gotten to the point where players are willing to accept those things.

There's far less stuff to clip at the front than at the back. Just look at all the gigantic Trooper/BH backpacks and jetpacks, assault canons, rifles, sniper rifles etc. Nothing comes close to this at the front

Edited October 15, 2014 by Pietrastor

[Gleneagle]

While what you say maybe true for real life, this is still a game, a MMO to be specific with all the mechanics that are traditionally associated with said genre.

A very, very young tradition, mind you. None of this two-thousand year old traditions like we abandon knowing better every day. But I digress...

When I buy a game that's advertised as a single player rpg, I fully expect all the things people are demanding here to be present. When I buy a MMO though, I fully expect there to be content that rquires a group, as in bringing down a foe that is far to powerful to tackle on your own.

Should a work of what is arguably art always conform to such expectations invariably? Is there room for advancement, for evolution, especially where those changes can be for the betterment of the players? Nurturing some behaviors isn't always a good thing.

And while I'm not opposed to soloing content on principle, making all content including OPs soloable would mean that BW would basically have to design every OP twice as it couldn't contain any kind of puzzle bosses or mechanics that require coordination between multiple players. IMO it would result in an unreasonable spending of resources and probably an even slower production cycle.

Thanks for your response.

 

I'm quite into independence and cooperative social play, but I am not into bonding myself to just any random stranger.

 

There are other models of cooperative play than grouping and those models work well.

 

Further it is not terribly difficult to mechanically calculate the effectiveness of either an individual or group with an algorithm that will return a value, call it a power variable, which in turn can be fed into a flashpoint, an operation, or an instance and refine the difficulty of that, and also inform the loot/drop table(s) fittingly. This power predictability is especially true in SWTOR which is heavily reliant on gear, builds, and buffs and will be moreso when 3.0 (thankfully*) rolls out.

 

Granted, some puzzles will require more than one player, although those may be addressable (if it would be really worth the doing for such rarities).

 

Otherwise, as you may see, I haven't yet a compelling reason to recant my position. Or was there an argument I missed? Can you think of a problem I have overlooked beyond "It ain't broke don't fix it**"?

 

* I assert 'thankfully' because I think the predictability of the power quotient of a group or independent will facilitate some wonderful solutions and usher in new content.

**Were this the ruling mantra of mankind we would be hunting still with flint-tipped sticks for all our short brutal lives.

Edited October 15, 2014 by Gleneagle