DarkSeverance Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 There should be Dual Spec'ing in the game. We are talking about Dual Specs, not changing Advanced Classes. I am completely behind Dual Specs. It doesn't take away from grouping but adds to it. It means that even though I'm DPS, I'll spec to Heal to heal for an instance instead waiting around for that one spot I can fill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syas Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 I have to repeat myself a third time it seems. If you want a game that stays "true to the genre", remove all multi-role classes immediately. Have Tanks and Healers be incapable of soloing content too, since that's as "true to the genre" as you can get. And while we're at it, why not add tremendous death penalties? True to the genre is not true to the past only. Things do evolve. I look at the MMOs on the market now, and I see that all of them offer solo play for all characters, and yet most of them do not offer dual-spec. That to me says solo-content is a genre standard as things are now, dual-spec is not. For the record, I would gladly go back to the days of EQ1, I played it from release through 7 expansions. I doubt the current playerbase would take to things like losing two weeks of work from one death though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bekkal Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Meridian 59 and The Realm Online were the first MMO's that had a graphical aspect instead of just being a MUD, but the only truly old MMO still around is Ultima Online, which was released in 1997. And most of what we are talking about is Western MMO's.... which do not encompass all MMO's which took on board the aspects being talked about. Everquest is still around, and was released in '99. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Meridian 59 and The Realm Online were the first MMO's that had a graphical aspect instead of just being a MUD, but the only truly old MMO still around is Ultima Online, which was released in 1997. And most of what we are talking about is Western MMO's.... which do not encompass all MMO's which took on board the aspects being talked about.that really has nothing to do with whether more than half of those came out after wow or not... which is what I disagreed with, and pointed out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zarovich Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 True to the genre is not true to the past only. Things do evolve. I look at the MMOs on the market now, and I see that all of them offer solo play for all characters, and yet most of them do not offer dual-spec. That to me says solo-content is a genre standard as things are now, dual-spec is not. For the record, I would gladly go back to the days of EQ1, I played it from release through 7 expansions. I doubt the current playerbase would take to things like losing two weeks of work from one death though. The MMO audience now is mostly too casual for EQ1 and they want to be rewarded now and don't like difficult decisions. It really bothers them when another class has a cool ability that they don't access too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Everquest is still around, and was released in '99.Model T fords are still around and they were released in 1908 That doesn't mean that it's still relevant as a car... just that it still exists... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bekkal Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) The MMO audience now is mostly too casual for EQ1 and they want to be rewarded now and don't like difficult decisions. It really bothers them when another class has a cool ability that they don't access too. You are so far off the point that you may as well be in another thread. Model T fords are still around and they were released in 1908 That doesn't mean that it's still relevant as a car... just that it still exists... This guy too. Edited December 28, 2011 by Bekkal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elgreezy Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 He isn't forcing a playstyle on you, he is asking for the developers to stay true to the Genre. He is absolutely forcing his playstyle preference on me. Adding dual-spec will not change his ability to play the game how he prefers (one spec) however demanding that dual-spec not be introduced IS changing my ability to play the game how I prefer. Fewer MMOs have Dual-Spec than do So you're saying most MMOs don't have dual-spec? Well most MMOs suck so let's not use them as blueprints for this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syas Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Model T fords are still around and they were released in 1908 That doesn't mean that it's still relevant as a car... just that it still exists... And yet the car is still a classic, functional, and beautiful without the need of built in satellite radio... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kunitsukami Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Everquest is still around, and was released in '99. True, I was merely posing that WoW is a relatively new MMO when it comes to the gameplay and UI aspects that have been used. The general UI lay out, the spell book and quest setup... and to be absolutely honest literally everything about the game is stolen from a much much older game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) I have no problem healing, use your function keys like you should have been doing in any other game, That's not really helpful advice for the guy I know who has one usable hand, can heal really well in wow due to mouseover healing, but is pretty much out of luck doing so in games without them. Healing skill = knowing what heal to cast and casting it just at the right moment. Healing skill <> overcoming an unnecessarily clunky interface UI issues like this are an accessibility issue, and I really have 0 respect for any game developer that thumbs it's nose at the disabled like that. Edited December 28, 2011 by ferroz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMuehlhausen Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 AOC yes WAR yes EQ1 no (16 March 1999 vs 29 November 2004) EQ2 no (8 November 2004 vs 29 November 2004) SWG no (26 June 2003 vs vs 29 November 2004) DAoC no (October 10, 2001 vs 29 November 2004) 2/6 is less than half Umm, hold your roll for a sec with that. WoW didn't have Dual spec till what Wrath? So that would be like 2008? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syas Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 So you're saying most MMOs don't have dual-spec? Well most MMOs suck so let's not use them as blueprints for this game. "Most MMOs suck" - what you mean is "I don't like most MMOs". That is okay, maybe this isn't the game for your. You can dual-spec in WoW or Rift all day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kunitsukami Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 He is absolutely forcing his playstyle preference on me. Adding dual-spec will not change his ability to play the game how he prefers (one spec) however demanding that dual-spec not be introduced IS changing my ability to play the game how I prefer. So you're saying most MMOs don't have dual-spec? Well most MMOs suck so let's not use them as blueprints for this game. But WoW now sucks.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syas Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 That's not really helpful advice for the guy I know who has one usable hand, can heal really well in wow due to mouseover healing, but is pretty much out of luck doing so in games without them. Healing skill = knowing what heal to cast and casting it just at the right moment. Healing skill <> overcoming an unnecessarily clunky interface Seriously? Your argument with the UI is "a guy I know with one-hand has a hard time using it"? Look, I feel for your friend, I really do, but by virtue of his handicap he is an extreme exception, not the rule. Some games may be more suited to his condition than others, that is not SWTOR's fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elgreezy Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 That is okay, maybe this isn't the game for you Since they've already announced they're going to release dual-spec, maybe this game it's for you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FerrusPA Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 "Most MMOs suck" - what you mean is "I don't like most MMOs". That is okay, maybe this isn't the game for your. You can dual-spec in WoW or Rift all day. You, who expressed his nostalgia about classic EQ a few posts back, dare tell other people whether the game is "for" them or not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kunitsukami Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Umm, hold your roll for a sec with that. WoW didn't have Dual spec till what Wrath? So that would be like 2008? 2009.... http://www.wowwiki.com/Patch_3.1.0 Patch 3.1.0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Some games may be more suited to his condition than others, that is not SWTOR's fault.swtor is just finely suited to his condition... the game itself. The interface? not so much, it's a bit clunky. I'm sure they'll get around to fixing it though, it's just not a priority on like with "OMG the game keeps crashing" sort of stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syas Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 You, who expressed his nostalgia about classic EQ a few posts back, dare tell other people whether the game is "for" them or not? Yes, just like I would if someone told me "I don't like the fact that I can lose levels from dying in EQ". Well, maybe it isn't the game for them. You know what, I hate football games. Madden 2012? Not the game for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zarovich Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 He is absolutely forcing his playstyle preference on me. Adding dual-spec will not change his ability to play the game how he prefers (one spec) however demanding that dual-spec not be introduced IS changing my ability to play the game how I prefer. So you're saying most MMOs don't have dual-spec? Well most MMOs suck so let's not use them as blueprints for this game. You have dual-spec currently in game for a cost..what are you complaing about..the cost? Well thats how Bioware implemented it, you'll just have to deal with it. Because WOW and Rift had dual-specing a certain way doesn't mean SWTOR should. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) Umm, hold your roll for a sec with that. WoW didn't have Dual spec till what Wrath? So that would be like 2008?and this has relevance related to the claim that wow is older than half of those games how? I mean, if you're disagreeing with his usage of the games, or something respond to him, I just pointed out a specific flaw in his statement. Edited December 28, 2011 by ferroz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kunitsukami Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 and this has relevance related to the claim that wow is older than half of those games how? Well firstly: WoW isn't older than half those games.... Secondly: It is related because the discussion has been waving back and fore over Dual Speccing... which is only relevant in regards to it's original instigation into any game it is linked to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Well firstly: WoW isn't older than half those games....That's what I said.... Secondly: It is related because the discussion has been waving back and fore over Dual Speccing... which is only relevant in regards to it's original instigation into any game it is linked to.so, why quote me, since I was only pointing out his incorrect statement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zarovich Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 and this has relevance related to the claim that wow is older than half of those games how? I really don't know why we are comparing a Western game (SWTOR) to an Eastern Game (WOW) anyways. Now before anyone objects remember who makes up 75% of the player base for WOW---> China & Korea now to me this sounds like an Eastern game. Now lets look at the upcoming expansion for said game. It includes Pandas and Kung-fu sure sounds like an Asian setting to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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