2.5 is out. How about those Class Reps!?

[HoboWithAStick]

While I agree with the sentiment of your post, your facts about the extent of classes being changes is well, wrong.

 

In essence, both guardians and sentinels were tweaked to some degree.

Both shadows and sages were changed and DoT protection added.

Scoundrels were changed, albeit they were minor alterations, but changed.

 

Plus the re-working of cleanses, which affects 3 ACs in principle as well.

 

5 ACs altered, Arguably the only class that wasn't changed was Trooper.

 

-Guardians got a root in their middle tree on ravage, helps slightly in pvp but nothing else.

- All the reworking of dots is good for those classes it doesn't change their numbers in anyway shape or form

 

Things that needed to be addressed that weren't

 

-Marauders over performing in pve and pvp

- Snipers greatly over performing in pve

-Jugg tanks need slight buff

-Op heals need nerf

-Concealment ops need buff

-Powertech dps greatly over performing in pvp

- Sorcs need their survivability totally reworked or at least need a better damage to survivability ratio

- Mercs need something for pvp, I don't know what by they do.

-Sin dps still sucks and so does lacerate

 

Agree or not but these changes are all very minor, nothing really game changing here. Most of the changes made were pvp focused and don't address any of the issues players are having in pve.

[Icebergy]

PT/VG's were tweaked. Merc/'Mando was the ONLY AC not touched.

 

Guardian/Juggs say hi.

[Hell_Kaiser_Fett]

In PvE, our DPS is fine (heat could use tweaking as well as a group cleanse).

 

But I'm curious, how many Commando healers do you run HM Ops with? I haven't run with a Commando healer since maybe around the time TFB was released.

 

I don't think I've run with many, maybe one or two Merc healers. That was from fleet recruiting. In my guild I have only grouped with Sorc and Op healers. Also my Merc is pyrotech incase I forgot to mention it.

[Icebergy]

In PvE, our DPS is fine (heat could use tweaking as well as a group cleanse).

 

But I'm curious, how many Commando healers do you run HM Ops with? I haven't run with a Commando healer since maybe around the time TFB was released.

 

Seriously? Commando healers are far and away the best tank healers. Pair one up with either a Scoundrel or a Sage and you are golden. I would kill to have a reliable Commando healer or two on my raid team.

 

The only PvE healers that have any right to complain are Sages, as they are quite a bit behind both the other two healers.

Edited December 3, 2013 by Icebergy

[DAMossimo]

-Powertech dps greatly over performing in pvp

 

And greatly under performing in pve. I shelved my dps PT because a sniper/marauder is better in every way for endgame raiding.

[gorstram]

Seriously? Commando healers are far and away the best tank healers. Pair one up with either a Scoundrel or a Sage and you are golden. I would kill to have a reliable Commando healer or two on my raid team.

 

Except in movement fights. Bacta infusion, hammer shot, and kolto bomb (just the initial burst, since everyone's moving, they may get one tick of the cloud). Also, the only time we can keep up with op/scoundrel and sage/sorcs is when we pop our supercharged gas. That increases our heals by 5%, but it's actually only 2% considering we lose our 30 (3% bonus) stack of support cylinder immediately following our 15 second burst.

 

Commando heals need to be evened out. If our heal doesn't crit, it's a LONG time before we get another one off, and 1.84 seconds is an ETERNITY in a boss fight.

[Luckygunslinger]

Eric, the Juggernaut Class Rep has been MIA since we submitted our questions back in September. Is there anything the Jugg community can do in regards to electing a new representative?

[Transmet]

Seeing as how Scoundrels/operative dps hasnt really been touched other than Overload Shot finally being correct, has there been any discussion as to how to help out operative viability in pvp and making the lethality spec less of a lottery in pve?

Have you looked at redesigning the laughable pve 4 set tier armor bonus for dps in this class?

[wainot-keel]

Eric, the Juggernaut Class Rep has been MIA since we submitted our questions back in September. Is there anything the Jugg community can do in regards to electing a new representative?

More like electing one, there's more to keeping one.

I remember one of those threads, with the jugg questions, where a couple of guys kind of hijacked the thread and polluted it to no end back and forth trolling and attacking each other for pages and pages.... Who wants to deal with that crap ?

[Luckygunslinger]

More like electing one, there's more to keeping one.

I remember one of those threads, with the jugg questions, where a couple of guys kind of hijacked the thread and polluted it to no end back and forth trolling and attacking each other for pages and pages.... Who wants to deal with that crap ?

 

No idea. I filed reports on the forums so those posts would be removed, they weren't. Those two nerf herders have been fighting non-stop in many of the Jugg threads but the Moderators of the website don't do anything about it. In the end we got our 3 questions to the Devs and got satisfactory answers. As for those two, I have no comment, nor can I do anything more than file reports on the posts.

[Icebergy]

Except in movement fights. Bacta infusion, hammer shot, and kolto bomb (just the initial burst, since everyone's moving, they may get one tick of the cloud). Also, the only time we can keep up with op/scoundrel and sage/sorcs is when we pop our supercharged gas. That increases our heals by 5%, but it's actually only 2% considering we lose our 30 (3% bonus) stack of support cylinder immediately following our 15 second burst.

 

Commando heals need to be evened out. If our heal doesn't crit, it's a LONG time before we get another one off, and 1.84 seconds is an ETERNITY in a boss fight.

 

If you aren't ahead of every Sage/Sorc you come across, then you are doing something wrong. Commandos are better at just about everything than Sages, other than the golden puddle.

[Glower]

Also, I am going to prioritize classes who did not receive many, or any changes to the front of the top 3 schedule so they can have their questions answered first.

 

 

Please, do not forget that smuggler quickshot buff... is not a buff at all.

[MajikMyst]

I'll make it easy for you..

 

The changes to the shadow tank are horrible...

 

To fix spikiness you take away our heals?? I suppose fixing my boat will somehow fix a problem with my car as well??

 

This new thing with Shadow Protection is awful.. Whoever thought this up needs to stop playing their guardian and actually play a shadow..

 

You should have never messed with our heals.. All you should have done is increase our armor bonus from our Combat Technique.. That is it.. That is all you had to do.. Nothing more..

 

You increased it a little and then took our heals.. The point of that was??

 

How many years are we going to have to wait before you fix this mistake??

[MajikMyst]

. Also, I am going to prioritize classes who did not receive many, or any changes to the front of the top 3 schedule so they can have their questions answered first.

 

-eric

 

Are you nuts?? Wrong answer.. Where did you learn customer service?? How about you address the people that had their characters changed first???

 

Wow.. That is really sad Eric.. You never give priority to those that do not have a problem.. You give priority to those that do.. You screwed up the Shadow tank and Assassin tanks.. Those two classes got the most changes.. Those are who should go first.. While you are deciding when to help those that actually need it.. I'll decide if I want to continue being a subscriber..

[Luckygunslinger]

Are you nuts?? Wrong answer.. Where did you learn customer service?? How about you address the people that had their characters changed first???

 

????

 

So.... if I don't get many changes or any, I should wait longer because you got yours first and as such deserve more attention? That makes no sense.

Edited December 3, 2013 by Luckygunslinger

[LydMekk]

So...you wanted to "fix" Vengeances lowish dps...and introduced a bind on ravage...(ya, that helps PVE...) But, WTH!!!! ddi you have to bind it to a specific talent for? No way I am taking from another NEEDED talent to Place 2 Points in that crap.

 

GG BW...

 

You don't listen to us at all do you?

[Elyx]

couple of questions on that Eric:

 

1) you indicate that you will give preference to those classes that haven't been changed yet. What about those that may have had a single, almost impacting change, but yet have had none of their original questions dealt with? and example would be the scoundrel/Op. lots of questions and concerns about energy and sustainable damage, yet they ended up getting a nerf to their cover.

 

2) how are the questions going to be structured? im sure theres a few classes that are frustrated with a lack of information on their first 3 questions....are they going to have to waste their new questions asking about the old ones? are the devs going to continually provide info on the first 3 questions, or are we going to need to ask them again to make sure the issues that are critical to players are getting handled?

 

I personally feel that if Those in charge of this process feel that it's important to "professionally" structure their communication with the players, then I feel that they should professionally deal with the questions. giving people ambiguous responses like 'we really want to work on X classes DPS/heat/whatever" don't really answer a question. As an example...it's good to recognize that the merc is squishy in PvP....what are the devs thoughts on it? if you know about it, what are some of the brainstorm ideas? why would you think that X class has OK DPS, when players really don't think they do? the "answers? probably need more detail in them....or at least a structure so we can expect certain things from them.

 

When I deal with issues at work. we structure our conversations. we include 1) the issue 2) the details 3) the possible resolutions, and 4) the challenges/resources needed for those solutions. perhaps doing something like this for the answer sections would help? if players new what to expect on the answers, I honestly think that they would be more direct and forward in their questions, and also be more accepting of the answers.

 

And in all honesty, there needs to me more information given at times then I think the Dev's are "comfortable" with. in my business, we hold people accountable for resolving difficult issues, and we expect communication from the in that regards. half the time I feel like the answers given by the dev's are based on what they want to say....not what the player base needs in regards to information.

 

you posted a thread in the scoundrel/Ops forums that was a great idea...the DPS brainstorming thread. it TOLD players that you were interested in making changes. Merc's haven't gotten anything like that yet. we just need some more communication on those things. same with Jugg/guard. we got a root that impacts about .0005% of your average players gameplay. that isn't a change...

 

I don't know...the Q&A thing seems more oriented towards shoehorning the players into a box and keeping them busy than real interaction. I HAVEN'T SEEN ANYTHING NEW OR BENEFICIAL COME FROM THE QUESTIONS THAT WOULDN'T HAVE HAPPENED ANYWAYS.. it's simply silly...the changes you have made are still making players scratch their heads half the time, and I thought the Q&A was supposed to help that? hasn't yet.

 

Imagine trying to manage a relationship where you could only ask them 3 questions...and they would only give 3 replies. not very effective, no? how long do you think that relationship would last? and before people start saying that's a bad analogy....it isn't. MMO games and development ARE about relationships. and ANY relationship cannot survive on stoic Q&A sessions, especially those limited to 3 questions. I feel like im in a legal proceedings for goodness sake. plaintiff....it's your turn to question the witness....

[branmakmuffin]

Class reps? I assumed that bad idea had been scrapped.

[eartharioch]

you posted a thread in the scoundrel/Ops forums that was a great idea...the DPS brainstorming thread. it TOLD players that you were interested in making changes.

 

Well, they were lying, so what's your complaint -- that they didn't tell you the same lies?

[eartharioch]

Seeing as how Scoundrels/operative dps hasnt really been touched other than Overload Shot finally being correct, has there been any discussion as to how to help out operative viability in pvp and making the lethality spec less of a lottery in pve?

Have you looked at redesigning the laughable pve 4 set tier armor bonus for dps in this class?

 

You apparently missed the nerf we got...

[MajikMyst]

????

 

So.... if I don't get many changes or any, I should wait longer because you got yours first and as such deserve more attention? That makes no sense.

 

It makes perfect sense.. If you didn't get any changes or a very little, you shouldn't have much if anything to talk about..

 

People that have had their characters drastically changed, and have issues because of it, shouldn't be brushed aside in favor of those that didn't have any changes or very few..

 

At the very least, it should all be dealt with on a first come first serve.. Nobody should be a higher priority.. But if you are going to make a priority, then it should be those that saw the most change..

 

Shouldn't you be allowed to ask about the new transmission that was put into your car, or should you be forced to wait for those that got new spark plugs or nothing at all to ask questions??

 

This is just an issue of common sense. Bioware knows that the people that are forced to accept their vision of change are going to have issues.. Which is why they want to hear from them last.. They just don't care, and it is a shame to see.. We gave them our input during the beta.. A lot of good that did..

Edited December 3, 2013 by MajikMyst

[GNWP]

Hey everyone!

 

I just wanted to give everyone that quick update, let me know if you have any questions.

 

-eric

 

A serveral quick questions for you Eric. How long will it take to fix:

• GCD without any abilities used if rapidly press key bind;
  
• CC and Force/Tech damage going through Resilience;
  
• leapers falling short on their leap;
  
• Vanguards using Ion Cell in Tactics tree. While threir damage reduction is about 50% their do as much damage as Vanguards that use proper cell. "Pulse Generator" talent MUST be tied to High Energy Cell
  
• Master Strike animation without any damage done and ability used;
  
• Full Auto doing damage without animation;
  

Edited December 3, 2013 by GNWP

[eartharioch]

I think it's ridiculous to assign priorities at this stage. Class [im]balance was what it was, and BW made some changes, and now class [im]balance is what it is now. Dwelling on what changes could (or should) have been made or not made is pointless. Play the game as it is now, see how it plays now, and if classes still appear to need rebalancing, start from where the game is now.

 

I'm not saying to forget what you thought needed work before, but we need to re-evaluate what we thought needed changing before against the background of what is now, not what was then.

 

So, going forward, no class should have priority based on what changes were or were not made. Some changes were made to classes with the intent of resolving problems faced by other classes, so saying Class A got changed but Class B didn't doesn't mean anything when the change to Class A could have been intended to benefit Class B.

 

Imp side, Warriors and Agents got nerfed, Assassins got buffed. Just because no changes were made to Mercs directly doesn't mean that they didn't benefit.

 

(FYI, I think most of the changes were bad, but that is looking before the fact; while I won't change my then-opinion, I will let current play dictate my opinion as to what (if any) changes still need to be made.)

[GNWP]

So, going forward, no class should have priority based on what changes were or were not made. Some changes

Forget about it, mate. Bioware probably have so little resorses that they can make changes for 1 to 3 classes at a time only.

Edited December 3, 2013 by GNWP

[discbox]

Because I want to play a dps operative and scoundrel I can't tell you what I think about the class changes. I would be banned for this.

 

The changes say to me: as soon as there is an other new scifi mmo - leave SWTOR! They still ignore, nerf and hate tech classes, especially smuggler and agents.

 

Overload shot is absolutely useless to a concealment build. I thinks dot builds don't need t too, but I don't know.

 

And why nerfing this little tiny advantage of cover while tabbing an objective? Just to make the jumping smash bobos happy.

 

Your developers need a dirty kick!

 

Btw. BioWares says operatives are not intended to use cover... but the explosive probe still requires cover! Why is this!?

Edited December 3, 2013 by discbox