Shadows - Top 3 Questions

[Aelanis]

Hopefully it's because you suffered a mini-stroke from all the laughter.

 

It was a mix of that, and the dreadful feeling that I can totally see them giving that answer .

[ArchangelLBC]

More like this:

 

"We need to debunk the shadows, what do we do boss?"

 

"RUN EVERY METRIC WE HAVE AND FIND ME A NUMBER THAT IS GOOD SO WE CAN GIVE THE METRIC AWNSER"

 

**Bioware intern spends one week running numbers**

 

"Bossy, we just dont have numbers to throw the metrics response, shadows suck on each and every area of the game, whats our next step?"

 

"WERE NOW BUSY BUFFING VENGEANCE JUGGS AND GIVING A NEW DAMAGE COOLDOWN TO SNIPERS, PUT THE SHADOW AWNSERS IN THE BOTTOM OF THE TO DO PILE"

 

**Shadows class reps questions stay for more 2 weeks in the to do pile**

 

"Ok boss we successfully developed root on ravage for vengeance juggs and gave sniper an improved damage cooldown, what about the shadow awnsers? The players are already demanding it."

 

"WHAT? SHADDOES? WHAT IS THAT? DO THEY HAVE STEALTH? ITS DECEPTION?"

 

"Yes boss, they do have stealth, deception is only one of their skill trees, but they also have a tank spec and madness spec"

 

"SHADOWS, STEALTH, DECEPTION, LONE WOLF, L2P, YOLO."

 

"Thanks boss, ima go put up in the forums, love your ingenuity!"

 

merc/commandos too =(

[DarthSylar]

Anyone else worried that they seemed to know what changes were going into 2.5 before we submitted our questions? I mean if they paid attention, there are hundreds of suggestions (many of them crappy, but likely a few good ones), so it's possibile they were inspired by something here, but I get the feeling that they gave us a fix they think will balance the class.

[Leafy_Bug]

Shadow Nightmare adventures part deux .

 

 

1. Dashie : nice boss. Guardian tank died on our successful kill and not me. Damage on my shadow was interesting and i was brought back from the dead (very low hp) a few times. Flipping knockbacks making us not receive heals when we need them

 

2. Titan 6 : after changing the grenade mechanics, BioWare made this boss a joke for a Shadow tank. The grenade hit me once for 9k (i guess no proper mitigation done there) but other than that I had no issues to survive. The droid lasers killed me because of a derp we did as a group. So on this boss in 8M, shadow is fine.

 

3. Thrasher : I main tanked it and died a few times. The healers worked overtime but could not keep me alive. Put a guardian in my place and I went up. After a few hours we gave up but tanking thrasher on my shadow is difficult . Those hits in a row are just butchering me.

 

 

4. Operations chief : Probably one of the easiest bosses in the whole game. Terminate, with its modifications, hits like a wet noodle and we ran a test. In our success full attempt, the guardian had a non mitigated terminate and ended up with 1000 hp from the hit. I had no issues with it, go figure

 

 

5. Olok the shadow : Bodyguards hit me for 10k sometimes. When I tank bodyguard+olok+artilery things are not good. I use most of my cooldowns to stay alive. When we get down, all I can say 'defeated by ranged attack : 14000. 'Defeated by ranged attack' 12000. Some of the droids down there hit like a truck. I had to save my cooldowns for the final row but out of 15 pulls only 3 attempts actually worked. This is because we used 1 sentinel, 3 gunslingers all spec-ed to reduce the accuracy on the droid i was tanking.

 

 

Bottom line : what is broken stays broken, even if some bosses are modified to accommodate the shadow tank. My guardian is 51

[TralyanSavo]

So do we get our answers this week or what? It's kind of disheartening that certain classes get their answers before a class with performance bordering on game breaking.

[Aelanis]

If the last set of answers is anything to judge by, I'd say that if we don't have them by 19:00 GMT, then we're going to wait until tomorrow or next week, the latter being the more likely.

[BIG_M]

If the last set of answers is anything to judge by, I'd say that if we don't have them by 19:00 GMT, then we're going to wait until tomorrow or next week, the latter being the more likely.

 

check the dev tracker they already said they are going to have them for us next week.

[T-Assassin]

I do not think they have an answer for these questions, 2 and 3 specifically.

 

There is no way the metrics can show anything positive and I am not completely sure they have an immediate fix to make Shadow/Assy DPS competitive anytime soon.

 

DPS leaderboards are all the metrics I need to see.

 

Until DPS specs are ~5%, or bring an absolutely vital buff/ability to a group or raid, there is no excuse to continue to ignore, or do nothing about, the large disparity among top performing AC's.

 

How difficult is it to look back at when these underperforming classes were viable (1.2 and 2.0 nerfs) and scale them accordingly with 2.4 top performing AC's?

 

Shadow/Assy nerfs, Assault/Pyro nerfs, Scoundrel/Op nerfs...and what are top performing AC's now? none of these...un-nerf the nerfs.

 

Looking forward to, "the combat team feels... metrics show... is performing as expected...we'll monitor performance...and possibly correct in the future..."

 

When actual numbers show otherwise.

[Grumpftard]

I'm going to persist in my pathetically optimistic and jaded view of life and hope that this is actually a good thing that the answers are taking a while.

I see their delay being for one of three reasons:

1) They are bashing their heads to finish 2.5 first so they can say "Oh yeah, sure, we are already ahead of you, we fixed all that already in 2.5. See?"

2) They're scared because they've been threatened that the next developer that releases a H2F answer gets fired, so every employee from the entire company is previewing and editing the answers for correctness.

3) They are still out shopping to try and find a calculator that can handle KBN math

[valeita]

I'm going to persist in my pathetically optimistic and jaded view of life and hope that this is actually a good thing that the answers are taking a while.

I see their delay being for one of three reasons:

1) They are bashing their heads to finish 2.5 first so they can say "Oh yeah, sure, we are already ahead of you, we fixed all that already in 2.5. See?"

2) They're scared because they've been threatened that the next developer that releases a H2F answer gets fired, so every employee from the entire company is previewing and editing the answers for correctness.

3) They are still out shopping to try and find a calculator that can handle KBN math

 

1. don't expect that

2. see 1

3. according to them all classes are at a 5% dps difference so i think that they need first to take some 1st grade math class and after that start looking for a calculator.

[Pizzel]

The suspense is killing me either way. I log in here a few times a day checking for the answers...

[facesofderek]

The suspense is killing me either way. I log in here a few times a day checking for the answers...

 

You can stop, next week at the earliest: Link

 

Bet it's still a H2F answer for all three.

[RandomNobody]

Optimistic answer- Well, as long as the answers are thorough, the wait will be worth it.

 

Cynical answer- Figures that the Shadow answers would take the longest, either due to all the issues or they really have no idea about Shadows.

 

So basically Monday is the earliest we might get answers? But then on Monday we'll hear that the dev team is too busy with 2.4, as that launches Tuesday. Then Tuesday they'll be too busy launching 2.4. Then Wednesday they'll be too busy rushing out a patch to fix whatever breaks in 2.4. Then by Thursday it'll be discovered Shadows will have another six problems after 2.4 with no improvements. Then Friday they'll be writing the 2.5 patch notes for PTS.

 

I really hope that's just an improbable scenario. But we'll see. I had wondered if the Shadow question and answer were a bit close to 2.4, but didn't think it would end up this close. Just hope the 2.4 launch doesn't take away too much attention from the Shadow issue. Planning for 2.5 might be nice if it works out well, but its hard to hope.

[Pizzel]

You can stop, next week at the earliest: Link

 

Bet it's still a H2F answer for all three.

 

Thanks. Now i can stop.

 

Really this is ridiculous. But with bioware there's no surprise.

[bdatt]

I feel they'll address #1 by citing content changes to terminate and huge grenade (I think someone mentioned too but I only do HM and resilience hasn't failed in a while**) addressing spikiness. May not fully address all issues but they've done something and in the case of terminate becoming many small hits I believe they took a suggestion from the forums.

 

**Edit: Resilience hasn't failed *me* on huge grenade in a while so I don't have firsthand data if that attack has changed or not.

[Aelanis]

I can show you gobs and gobs of times that resilience has failed, very specifically against the huge grenade. Between my co-tank and I, it'll fail at least twice to three times a night, sometimes resulting in some spectacular, if failed, heroics by our healers to try to make us survive.

[kennethdale]

I can show you gobs and gobs of times that resilience has failed, very specifically against the huge grenade. Between my co-tank and I, it'll fail at least twice to three times a night, sometimes resulting in some spectacular, if failed, heroics by our healers to try to make us survive.

 

It definitely does fail and it not usable on terminate. Only deflection works for Terminate so instead we have our Sin pull and use Deflection for the first terminate then I (Juggernaut) taunt and take it while cycling CDs Saber Reflect > Saber Ward > Invincible > Saber Reflect > Adrenal+Endure.

[SalvorHardin]

I feel they'll address #1 by citing content changes to terminate and huge grenade (I think someone mentioned too but I only do HM and resilience hasn't failed in a while**) addressing spikiness. May not fully address all issues but they've done something and in the case of terminate becoming many small hits I believe they took a suggestion from the forums.

 

**Edit: Resilience hasn't failed *me* on huge grenade in a while so I don't have firsthand data if that attack has changed or not.

 

2 weeks ago: Resilience fails

[DarthSpekulatius]

2 weeks ago: Resilience fails

 

HM or NIM? I don't think it is hitting that hard in HM I'm healing that fight regularly

and in NIM it has been changed to weapon damage to increase the Challenge.

 

 

 

quote is from page 38 of the Bug report Forum btw

In the following particular instances, it is not a bug:

 

In Nightmare Mode, Huge Grenade does in fact deal weapon damage (rather than the spell damage it deals in Story and Hard Modes). This was an intentional change for Nightmare Mode, done to make the encounter more challenging.

 

As for Terminate, it has always been a weapon damage attack in any difficulty mode that it appears, and it would have never worked to Force Shroud it - any such luck to the contrary is a mere coincidence (though probably not uncommon).

 

[tacito]

Short question: Are the answers scheduled to be posted today, or do we have to wait another week?

[Panzerfire]

Short question: Are the answers scheduled to be posted today, or do we have to wait another week?

 

A dev said that the combat devs need another week to work on them, expect monday as the earliest possible options, tuesday/wednesday will be the 1 week period, and end of next week/later if they screw up.

[tacito]

Well, since they don't want to "drop the mic" anymore (where they post on friday and then just... leave), I guess we can expect our answer no later than thursday.

 

Still, damn. Was really looking forward to the answers. Thank you for the update though.

[SalvorHardin]

HM or NIM? I don't think it is hitting that hard in HM I'm healing that fight regularly

and in NIM it has been changed to weapon damage to increase the Challenge.

 

 

 

quote is from page 38 of the Bug report Forum btw

 

 

It was HM, it's hitting for less in NiM (and I wouldn't have used Resilience in NiM )

[toyfanatic]

I know shadow tank spikiness is a old subject. But when most people are calling for a 2-3% more DR, i would like to suggest a simple fix. Make the four piece PVE set bonus 4-5% instead of 2 % . Would that be a fix?

[ConCube]

Im optimistic now and say that they only wait that long to put the SinFixes in 2.5 already

 

I believe in you BioWare - please dont **** things up again because then I would be done with that game ...