20 bucks for a one use dye, REALLY?

[Andryah]

You have no point. That is being proven to you.

 

Actually.. everytime one of you comes here and whines about the injustice of what is being allegedly done by Bioware.. I get to remind you that they are actually doing exactly what players have been asking for since dyes were patched in.. and even pricing it at CC rates people said in this very forum they would willingly pay if they would just make them direct buyable. I also get to point out the real downward pressure on the price of B/B and W/W dyes that players will actually realize from this move by Bioware. The cost to equip a B/B or a W/W has effectively been nerfed by ~80% by this one simple move on their part. Most sensible players can see this and embrace it as progress.

 

But.. no worries.. unlike you.. I don't lose patience in the discussion and I can continue to point out the logical fallacy of your complaints for as long as you and a few others care to present them. I can do this for as long as you like, and never get impatient or angry about it (hint hint.. adjust your outlook and style pal.. it's a game.. not real life:) )

Edited September 6, 2013 by Andryah

[Kurgun]

As opposed to a CK response.. which is always sarcastic, hyperbolic, and hateful toward the game and anyone who presents reason in the face of emotionally based rants.

 

Yes, we should all just bow to your wishes and accept having bioware bend us over and squeeze as much cash out of us. How many times have I seen you post you don't care for either of these dyes? A lot. Yet here you are constantly trolling for us to just accept it because you say so. We get it, you want to buy this up for 20 bucks to become rich in game. Because there is no other sane reason for you to defend this crap unless you actually work for bioware and would benefit in real life for defending it.

[Andryah]

Yes, we should all just bow to your wishes and accept having bioware bend us over and squeeze as much cash out of us. How many times have I seen you post you don't care for either of these dyes? A lot. Yet here you are constantly trolling for us to just accept it because you say so. We get it, you want to buy this up for 20 bucks to become rich in game. Because there is no other sane reason for you to defend this crap unless you actually work for bioware and would benefit in real life for defending it.

 

How ironic of you. I'm not asking you to bow to my wishes or anyone's wishes. I am simply pointing out that this is actually a good move, in a progressive way, for all players that are actually interested in less expensive access to these two dyes. It is ALSO almost exactly what players have asked for with respect to these two dyes. I don't need to like the dyes to see the logic and sense in what they have done here. I am actually able to be objective on the topic as I have no emotional stake or tie to the dyes at all. You clearly appear to be way too emotionally attached to these dyes.. given your rage at the pricing in the CM.

 

And as if to further demonstrate your lack of grasp of reality.. you accuse me of buying and selling CM content. Anyone here who actually knows me and follows my posts knows that the only thing I spend CCs on is Collections unlocks. I purchase all CM content from other players off the GTN. It is the most sensible economic approach for me as in game credit wealth is extremely easy to come by where as CCs are limited to what I am given freely from Bioware as a subscriber. Perhaps because I follow this personal business model.. I can actually see and appreciate the player economy and economics as they relate to CM content.

Edited September 6, 2013 by Andryah

[ImperialSun]

Yes, we should all just bow to your wishes and accept having bioware bend us over and squeeze as much cash out of us. How many times have I seen you post you don't care for either of these dyes? A lot. Yet here you are constantly trolling for us to just accept it because you say so. We get it, you want to buy this up for 20 bucks to become rich in game. Because there is no other sane reason for you to defend this crap unless you actually work for bioware and would benefit in real life for defending it.

 

I see all you whiners are willfully choosing to ignore the fact, as pointed out by myself and Andyah that the PLAYERS are the ones who wanted the dyes to be made available as single purchase CM items and the PLAYERS have said they would be willing to throw down this sort of cash to acquire them...

 

You do get that right?

 

Bingo

 

Driz

[Kurgun]

Feel better now?

 

Did you win enough with that bingo to buy yourself a B/B dye in the CM?

 

But hey.. at least this time you did not quote your own post and yell bingo. So there is some progress here.

 

Oh look, you think you're a witty one. Have you noticed that you are in the minority of people who agree with bioware's gouging of customers? That should tell you something, but sadly you refuse to see that.

 

Now go back to stroking your ego some more.

[Andryah]

Oh look, you think you're a witty one. Have you noticed that you are in the minority of people who agree with bioware's gouging of customers? That should tell you something, but sadly you refuse to see that.

 

Now go back to stroking your ego some more.

 

More attempt at irony and humor on your part I see. I am not in the minority view on this. There have been plenty of others in this thread (and other threads) who have acknowledged essentially what I am expressing here. We differ a bit on what we think the final stable prices in game will be.. but we agree that it's good for the players and means more dyes, at cheaper prices, and that's what players wanted and asked for.

 

And unlike you.. when I see something released in game.. rather then cry about it then think it through.. I sit back and analyze what they did to see if it makes sense and then figure out what it means for players as a whole (rather then be griped in self-involvement). Stop being so emotionally locked up in the CM price and actually think this through. I know you probably wanted them for ~$2 but that is not very realistic if you think about it. It would destabilize the entire dye segment of the economy and would crush Artifice crafters in the process. ~80% reduction in price to acquire is completely reasonable as the first step here.. and that is exactly what they did.

 

Big picture pal.. not self-portrait. Try it.

Edited September 6, 2013 by Andryah

[Angelshooter]

Yet another monument to Bioware's insufferable greed. How do they sleep at night?

[ImperialSun]

Oh look, you think you're a witty one. Have you noticed that you are in the minority of people who agree with bioware's gouging of customers? That should tell you something, but sadly you refuse to see that.

 

Now go back to stroking your ego some more.

 

You do understand that forum posters make up a tiny percentage of the playerbase right? So how are you claiming to be a majority exactly?

 

Oh thats right...you made it up

 

You have no way of knowing what most players think about the price. The proof will be in how many dyes sell....THAT will tell you whether the majority thinks the price is worth it or not.

 

Driz

[Andryah]

Yet another monument to Bioware's insufferable greed. How do they sleep at night?

 

o'rly?

 

So they institute direct sale of these two precious dyes, at player request (and at a price range players freely declared they would be willing to pay)... and by doing so they reduce the "cost to acquire" by around 80%, while undermining their own sales of dye packs (since let's face it.. most of them were bought to get these two dyes).... AND it's them that are being greedy here? Really?

 

You might want to ponder a bit and give it some more thought.

Edited September 6, 2013 by Andryah

[Angelshooter]

o'rly?

 

So they institute direct sale of these two precious dyes, at player request (and at a price range players freely declared they would be willing to pay)... and by doing so they reduce the "cost to acquire" by around 80%, while undermining their own sales of dye packs (since let's face it.. most of them were bought to get these two dyes).... AND it's them that are being greedy here? Really?

 

So if the dyes were worth 8 million creds in the GTN, what then? Would you throw $80 at Bioware for a single-use dye? I don't think so. Maybe you need a reality check to really comprehend the value of $20.

 

Your logic is flawed, chump. Go ahead and continue spewing your dreck all over this thread, you're not convincing anyone.

[ImperialSun]

o'rly?

 

So they institute direct sale of these two precious dyes, at player request (and at a price range players freely declared they would be willing to pay)... and by doing so they reduce the "cost to acquire" by around 80%, while undermining their own sales of dye packs (since let's face it.. most of them were bought to get these two dyes).... AND it's them that are being greedy here? Really?

 

You might want to ponder a bit and give it some more thought.

 

Exactly...

 

I'm wondering...why DO the whiners keep choosing to ignore this fact?

 

Single item purchase of dyes WAS a player request.

 

Players DID state they would be prepared to pay these sorts of prices to obtain them. Thats a fact

 

Driz

[Ratajack]

Exactly...

 

I'm wondering...why DO the whiners keep choosing to ignore this fact?

 

Single item purchase of dyes WAS a player request.

 

Players DID state they would be prepared to pay these sorts of prices to obtain them. Thats a fact

 

Driz

 

Because the "have to have it now" crowd wants it NOW and for as little effort as possible, whether that be in game effort or effort in RL.

[Andryah]

So if the dyes were worth 8 million creds in the GTN, what then? Would you throw $80 at Bioware for a single-use dye? I don't think so. Maybe you need a reality check to really comprehend the value of $20.

 

Your logic is flawed, chump. Go ahead and continue spewing your dreck all over this thread, you're not convincing anyone.

 

You know what.. pre-direct sale.. you know what the actual "cost_to_acquire" a B/B is via dye packs? It's between 80-100 dollars... and hence GTN prices of 4-8Mcredits. That is the average to spend buying dye packs before you hit a B/B. Which is why many players were begging for a direct purchase... "even if it was a couple thousand CCs"

 

You know what it is after they start direct sales? About 20% of that cost to acquire..and corresponding price drops in game on the GTN.

 

Think about that for more then a nanosecond.. actually think it through logically. I'll wait.

Edited September 6, 2013 by Andryah

[Reno_Tarshil]

Because the "have to have it now" crowd wants it NOW and for as little effort as possible, whether that be in game effort or effort in RL.

 

QFT. Srsly, they need to knock these shenanigans off.

[hadoken]

Think about that for more then a nanosecond.. actually think it through logically. I'll wait.

 

You're going to be waiting a while. These guys keep harping on how expensive it is without even looking at the market value. It's a deal, and if it isn't for them it will be on the GTN soon enough when those prices plummet. It's a win-win for everyone but the guy who's got a black/black dye in game right now. If he doesn't sell it soon, he loses. Just that guy.

Edited September 6, 2013 by hadoken

[Vinak]

EA/Bioware needs to learn that consumer friendly business practices generate far more good will and ultimately more profits than its current nickel and dime screw over the consumer as much as they allow us policy they currently run.

 

I highly suspect they would have a lot more players and subsequently more income if they ran a business model more closely resembling GW2's, or several other f2p mmos.

[Palar]

EA/Bioware needs to learn that consumer friendly business practices generate far more good will and ultimately more profits than its current nickel and dime screw over the consumer as much as they allow us policy they currently run.

 

I highly suspect they would have a lot more players and subsequently more income if they ran a business model more closely resembling GW2's, or several other f2p mmos.

 

But if it's not an artifical status symbol, how are we going to know who ran amok with Daddy's credit card?

[Laendser]

You know what.. pre-direct sale.. you know what the actual "cost_to_acquire" a B/B is via dye packs? It's between 80-100 dollars... and hence GTN prices of 4-8Mcredits. That is the average to spend buying dye packs before you hit a B/B. Which is why many players were begging for a direct purchase... "even if it was a couple thousand CCs"

 

You know what it is after they start direct sales? About 20% of that cost to acquire..and corresponding price drops in game on the GTN.

 

Think about that for more then a nanosecond.. actually think it through logically. I'll wait.

 

What the apologists don't understand, is that the dye system has been broken since DAY ONE. The way that the dye system was implemented was chosen to maximize BW/EA's profits at players' maximum expense, in ALL aspects, such as credits, cartel coins, and time.

 

Time is something that nobody seems to be discussing. How long till all possible dye combinations are graciously (for huge profits) dolled out?

 

How many of these outrages would exist if the dye system was truly and simply just a customization aspect of players game experience, rather than a cash grab? A novel concept I'm sure, but imagine a feature added to SW:ToR that is for the players of the game, not the masters. You know, the ones that actually keep this rotten hulk afloat.

 

Primary, Secondary, and Tertiary Dye Slots or bust! That is the real "2.1 Customization".

[Vinak]

What the apologists don't understand, is that the dye system has been broken since DAY ONE. The way that the dye system was implemented was chosen to maximize BW/EA's profits at players' maximum expense, in ALL aspects, such as credits, cartel coins, and time.

 

Time is something that nobody seems to be discussing. How long till all possible dye combinations are graciously (for huge profits) dolled out?

 

How many of these outrages would exist if the dye system was truly and simply just a customization aspect of players game experience, rather than a cash grab? A novel concept I'm sure, but imagine a feature added to SW:ToR that is for the players of the game, not the masters. You know, the ones that actually keep this rotten hulk afloat.

 

Primary, Secondary, and Tertiary Dye Slots or bust! That is the real "2.1 Customization".

 

Have to agree with this. The dye system is poorly implemented and is indeed designed to squeeze the consumer for maximum profit for minimal effort on there part.

Maximizing profit in of itself is not wrong. but the way EA chooses to do it is anti-consumer in my opinion.

[displaynamee]

You're going to be waiting a while. These guys keep harping on how expensive it is without even looking at the market value. It's a deal, .

 

are you insane? yet just ANOTHER fanboi who will defend EA's greed at all cost. i play Monopoly and give my competitor 100 real dollars for park place because its cheaper after the conversion factor...lol. WHAT A DEAL!. do you realize how absurb you sound?

 

whats the red speeder called ingame that's worth like 4 mil atm? whats the conversion on that? 80$? with your argument you shouldn't have a problem with BW charging that much right? *hangs head in sadness* and when that time comes, and it will, there will still be people buying said item and defending BW. ohh how the MMo industry has changed in the last 10 years...

 

 

people say it is a high price, BUT after conversion its a deal.. so they rationalize and are ok with it. .what they don't seem to realize is that CC's are powered by the dollar, but its value is directly controlled by BW thus the conversion factor you defend makes no sense. the CC's are not a living breathing economy henseforth could directly control the value of said item by adjusting the prices of CC's

 

 

people have totally lost sight and totally blind as they get there wallets bled thinking they are getting a good deal from BW.. they will keep jacking up prices under the guise of "CONVENIENCE" do you really think they are out to cut us deals?...ha!..they are out to make money plain and simple but keep thinking that. hope that mindset treats you well

 

to everyone else!..now you all finally see what ive been saying about BW/EA and there CM. im sure you will see higher prices in the CM in the next coming year as well. this dye issue is just the beginning. they are testing the waters to see how much they can get away with. now that they have shown you a high priced item. we as players will not be so much in uprising the next time. just like what happened with the gas prices. the first time it went up after 9/11 it was almost civil unrest..it went down for a while then came back up and continued to rise to this day, but as you can the upheaval isn't as bad as it was in the beginning because people were used to it.

 

ps..this is what wiki states about gambling and MMo's (CM packs could be construed as gambling)

 

Gambling regulation[edit source]

 

Conversion between in-game and real-world currency has led to direct comparisons with other on-line games of chance as 'virtual winnings'. This is why gamers and companies engaged in this conversion, where it is permitted by a game, may fall under gambling legislation.

Edited September 6, 2013 by displaynamee

[Callaron]

This is the key for me. If it costs 2600 (2000 for initial, max 600 for collection unlock) to have it to use on demand, that's fair IMO.

 

Yep.

That's the only way I'd ever consider buying one, as it stands now I'll give it the same treatment as I do the gamble dyes - completely ignore their existence.

[ImperialSun]

are you insane? yet just ANOTHER fanboi who will defend EA's greed at all cost. i play Monopoly and give my competitor 100 real dollars for park place because its cheaper after the conversion factor...lol. WHAT A DEAL!. do you realize how absurb you sound?

 

whats the red speeder called ingame that's worth like 4 mil atm? whats the conversion on that? 80$? with your argument you shouldn't have a problem with BW charging that much right? *hangs head in sadness* and when that time comes, and it will, there will still be people buying said item and defending BW. ohh how the MMo industry has changed in the last 10 years...

 

 

people say it is a high price, BUT after conversion its a deal.. so they rationalize and are ok with it. .what they don't seem to realize is that CC's are powered by the dollar, but its value is directly controlled by BW thus the conversion factor you defend makes no sense. the CC's are not a living breathing economy henseforth could directly control the value of said item by adjusting the prices of CC's

 

 

people have totally lost sight and totally blind as they get there wallets bled thinking they are getting a good deal from BW.. they will keep jacking up prices under the guise of "CONVENIENCE" do you really think they are out to cut us deals?...ha!..they are out to make money plain and simple but keep thinking that. hope that mindset treats you well

 

to everyone else!..now you all finally see what ive been saying about BW/EA and there CM. im sure you will see higher prices in the CM in the next coming year as well. this dye issue is just the beginning. they are testing the waters to see how much they can get away with. now that they have shown you a high priced item. we as players will not be so much in uprising the next time. just like what happened with the gas prices. the first time it went up after 9/11 it was almost civil unrest..it went down for a while then came back up and continued to rise to this day, but as you can the upheaval isn't as bad as it was in the beginning because people were used to it.

 

ps..this is what wiki states about gambling and MMo's (CM packs could be construed as gambling)

 

Gambling regulation[edit source]

 

Conversion between in-game and real-world currency has led to direct comparisons with other on-line games of chance as 'virtual winnings'. This is why gamers and companies engaged in this conversion, where it is permitted by a game, may fall under gambling legislation.

 

Nice rhetoric...you clearly dislike BW charging for fluff items...do you castigate every other developer that charges for fluff in almost every MMORPG with as much conviction?

 

Prior to this change players had to spend hundreds of dollars to get a chance of obtaining a BB / WW dye. Now they are guaranteed for just 20 dollars. This will equate to a drop in revenue or maybe a nill change at best for BW.

 

Also the guaranteed chance to obtain these dyes will make them more common...in turn reducing their price on the GTN for players not wishing to spend real cash on them.

 

So lets recap....players buying on the CM get a win....players buying on the GTN get a win....wow what a rip off!!

 

Driz

[Mordinn]

20.00 US dollars is absurd, no thanks, I'll pass. Maybe even 9.99 with an unlock considering the fact but again it's just fluff.

[branmakmuffin]

20.00 US dollars is absurd, no thanks, I'll pass. Maybe even 9.99 with an unlock considering the fact but again it's just fluff.

The entire game is fluff. It's all a question of what fluff you like.

 

What the apologists don't understand, is that the dye system has been broken since DAY ONE. The way that the dye system was implemented was chosen to maximize BW/EA's profits at players' maximum expense, in ALL aspects, such as credits, cartel coins, and time.

 

Time is something that nobody seems to be discussing. How long till all possible dye combinations are graciously (for huge profits) dolled out?

What's your point, here, that you have no choice but to buy dyes?

 

How many of these outrages would exist if the dye system was truly and simply just a customization aspect of players game experience, rather than a cash grab? A novel concept I'm sure, but imagine a feature added to SW:ToR that is for the players of the game, not the masters. You know, the ones that actually keep this rotten hulk afloat.

The $15 a month I pay is just a cash grab, too. They should eliminate that while letting me keep all the subscriber perks. Bookstores charge like what, nearly $10 for a paperback book? That is a blatant cash grab. $100,000+ for a high-end sports car? Blatant cash grab. $1 mil for a yacht? $20,000 for a Rolex? Blatant as the day is long.

Edited September 6, 2013 by branmakmuffin

[BlackflameSeven]

I have only one objection to any ridiculous price/item combo on the cartel market. Is creating this item taking away from the production of the actual game, flashpoints, ops, warzones (I hate pvp, never do them, but it's the game), questlines etc etc? If it does, I hate it, if it doesn't, charge whatever you like, I don't care, I just want to play the game. I blow my monthly coins mainly on unlocks, preferably global, that make the game more fun for me. I might buy the odd bit of fluff with spare coins, and I've even bought a few extra to unlock stuff on alts, but all this arguing over what colour you make your toons seems laughable.

 

Are you really devastated by the fact that someone else has black gear and yours isn't? As long as the game itself continues to grow (and being the cynic I am, I believe it must be suffering by the development of cartel stuff, I just keep hoping I'm wrong), let EA charge prices that seem insane. If it doesn't sell, it will get cheaper...