Why so much hate?

[Sokars]

I am just curious to why on sites such as mmorpg.com there seems to be so many discussions on how SWTOR days are numbered and the game is dead when clearly this is not the case and I and a lot of others are really enjoying the game why do people feel the need to slate it? Opinion is one thing but clear lies about the state of the game are ridiculous. Just don't understand! thoughts??

[Tom_Hulces_Dog]

I am just curious to why on sites such as mmorpg.com there seems to be so many discussions on how SWTOR days are numbered and the game is dead when clearly this is not the case and I and a lot of others are really enjoying the game why do people feel the need to slate it? Opinion is one thing but clear lies about the state of the game are ridiculous. Just don't understand! thoughts??

 

The thought = if it doesn't have WoW's subscriber numbers, it's a failure.

 

The truth = 1) WoW was lightning in a bottle that will never happen again, at least in the MMO market as we know it, 2) people have WAY too much committed to their characters and guilds in WoW after nearly a decade to abandon them to anything but that next "lightning in a bottle" MMO that, as mentioned, won't happen, 3) this game has some problems that people like to exacerbate.

Edited August 13, 2013 by Tom_Hulces_Dog

[Lionflash]

Haterade's on sale, 2 bottles for $5?

[Darth_Moonshadow]

Because you must let the hate flow through you.....

[Kilora]

I am just curious to why on sites such as mmorpg.com there seems to be so many discussions on how SWTOR days are numbered and the game is dead when clearly this is not the case and I and a lot of others are really enjoying the game why do people feel the need to slate it? Opinion is one thing but clear lies about the state of the game are ridiculous. Just don't understand! thoughts??

 

 

The MMO consumer base is hideous?

 

Really, I have no idea why. People LOVE to prophesize about the "end of days" for specific games. If I don't enjoy a game (*cough* Aion *cough*) -- I wouldn't go on talking trash about it. In fact -- I've recommended Aion to quite a few friends, because I think they'd enjoy the style. Just isn't my thing.

 

If people are enjoying a game -- more power to them! I think here, we get the worst of the MMO world mixed in with the worst of the SW universe.

 

Both are bad. Mix them together? -- time to run and hide.

[Suntaru]

mmorpg is run by a bunch of losers that never even verify the articles that other people have written on games. Case in point STO had a bad Article written by some nobody saying that STO days were numbered and that STO did not have certain items added to the game. The funny point is every item that Person had said was not there was actually added by Cryptic to the game 2 months prior to that article being published by mmorpg. So now I don't even go to that losers website for any info for any game.

[CosmicKat]

I am just curious to why on sites such as mmorpg.com there seems to be so many discussions on how SWTOR days are numbered and the game is dead when clearly this is not the case and I and a lot of others are really enjoying the game why do people feel the need to slate it? Opinion is one thing but clear lies about the state of the game are ridiculous. Just don't understand! thoughts??

 

Because... it's true?

 

Not even a Star Wars license could save the WoW clone from failure. It's dead Jim. The format, not necessarily the game. Probably enough die-hard SW fans to keep it running indefinitely.

[ImpactHound]

On that note, kotaku's a really bad site as well.

[curtkram]

3) this game has some problems that people like to exacerbate.

 

i think this part is a pretty accurate summation.

 

i don't think it's because mmo players and star wars fans are bad people. i don't think it's because bad people are attracted to this game. i think it's more likely that the bad people quit dwelling on this game and moved on a long time ago. the people still complaining, even after the exodus and all, probably really wanted to like the game but just couldn't, or it otherwise fell far short of expectations. there is a lot of untapped potential both in the brand and the game's core structure.

 

the game was released with a subscription model and that failed. i think it's fair to say under those specific terms there was a failure. you can blame the 'changing industry' if you want, or you can blame the rain. the game is still here in the form it's in. to say the game is dead is hyperbole (used in the way that word is supposed to be used, not in the new definition that applies to everyone who says something bad about bioware or EA). hyperbole is a thing people use in language and that's not necessarily bad. likely, someone is upset with a decision made by the developers and that's how they're expressing their view. the developers have given people plenty of things to be upset about.

[AlienEyeTX]

[JediCahlwyn]

It's simple really... just refer to Wizard's First Rule: People are stupid.

[MSchuyler]

It's partly because there are no consequences to expressing the hatred, no penalty. It's easy to express hatred from the basement where there's no one to fight back at you. There you can pretend that because you can PLAY a game, that makes you an expert DESIGNER of games. It's kind of like learning to browse the web and beginning to believe that makes you a computer expert. If people acted in the Real World like they act in and about the game, they would be shunned, beat up, or laughed out of the room.

[shadowrouge]

Because... it's true?

 

Not even a Star Wars license could save the WoW clone from failure. It's dead Jim. The format, not necessarily the game. Probably enough die-hard SW fans to keep it running indefinitely.

 

You feel this way and yet here you are. This is the one that surprises me more than other sites that hate the game. Some one paying for the game that hates on it. Tells you all about it yet is still paying the sub.

 

That is a mystery to me.

[TheNahash]

You feel this way and yet here you are. This is the one that surprises me more than other sites that hate the game. Some one paying for the game that hates on it. Tells you all about it yet is still paying the sub.

 

That is a mystery to me.

 

lol

wait until you get the answer "because it's the only Star Wars MMO"

...and they truly believe that answer is rational

[Monthigos]

Because it's the internet and everyone wants attention? What better way to get it than to start trash talking? People love drama. Also the greater the IP, the greater the expectations. Many people were expecting certain things, and when they didn't get it, they /ragequitted. My favorite reason for people getting upset at Bio is not enough content. Some people don't seem to realize that the content that took them hours to blaze through took months to develop.

[Ebazinam]

I don't really understand playing a game, while at the same time, writing about its doom in a forum. I tend to believe that a few of the haters are actually involved in some way with competitor games or have a competing interest. All it takes is a few bad words based on half truths or flat out lies too get a mob frenzied.

 

Now who would have motive?

 

WOW?

GW2?

Game box makers?

SWTOR does a pretty good job of keeping the gold farmers out, maybe gold farming websites that are losing money because people are playing SWTOR instead of WOW?

 

I think some of it is legit issues that people bring up in forums, but once they cross the line into flaming the game or predicting doom, I really think their is more to it than just simple hate.

[curtkram]

It's partly because there are no consequences to expressing the hatred, no penalty. It's easy to express hatred from the basement where there's no one to fight back at you. There you can pretend that because you can PLAY a game, that makes you an expert DESIGNER of games. It's kind of like learning to browse the web and beginning to believe that makes you a computer expert. If people acted in the Real World like they act in and about the game, they would be shunned, beat up, or laughed out of the room.

 

if there are people who think they're better designers than bioware staff, i think bioware could talk more about their design decisions to give them something more to think about. i still want to know why i couldn't get my characters put on a single server when they did the big merge. they won't talk about it. they won't discuss why they made the decisions they did. they chose to make the game less enjoyable for players like me. i think that side is clear. i don't think abandoning the characters you start is considered 'fun' or 'entertaining' in any game. i don't know what their side is. i don't know if they had a good reason to make that decision. they won't communicate. for me to be shunned, beat up, or laughed at, there would ultimately have to be a second party involved in the communication, and bioware refuses to involve themselves. so i complain and hope someone hears my concerns and hope in the future they make better decisions. the other side of the conversation ends up being white knight trolls, who are largely really dumb people that readily resort to making things up instead of basing their opinions on things that happen in real life.

 

i don't know if this game is a financial failure. i don't know if fp2 really saved the game, or if merges would have been enough. i don't know if they really need to charge so much for transfers and ewoks, and i don't know if they were really unable to work on actual content while they were developing customization and half a dozen cartel packs. i certainly don't think spending money on the cartel market means more money will go towards developing game content. they don't release financial information either. you've seen the long threads on here whenever EA releases quarterly reports because a lot of people really want to know how bad the game is doing, or how successful it is, and what direction that suggests they'll go in the future. but those reports don't tell us anything. bioware doesn't tell us anything. we get complainers and idiot forum trolls who prance around with their white knight crowd that just make stuff up as often as not.

 

in real life people communicate. there is a dialogue. in this environment, there are still a few topics the devs refuse to discuss. i don't know why they won't discuss those things; they won't communicate that. whether the people you're envisioning are in a basement, or the second floor, or starbucks, or on a laptop in a well-lit park, it's still one-way communication. there is a good chance their concerns come from something real, and they would much prefer to have an adult discussion about it, but bioware has refused to provide that opportunity. crying and pouting isn't the mature thing to do, but apparently that tends to happen when some people get neglected.

 

tl;dr if the people complaining are wrong, a little communication from the devs could go a long way.

[MillionsKNives]

[IzzyMac]

I think some folks are still sore over SWG and what happened to that so they instantly want any other SW online game to fail.

[captpickles]

It is pretty simple.

 

1) A large chunk of player attitudes in this game just sucks. About 1/3 of the user base, (as sampled in game and in this forum) are a bunch of elitist snobs, and outright *it is my way our your a idiot l2p hurrr duurr* attitude. Newbs come to the server, go to general chat and ask a question and get but-raped with rude comments... way to promote the game and the (lack of) community ..

 

2) bugs ... really BAD bugs. plenty of really odd why the hell was this never fixed bugs.

-post to quickly to the gtn, oops gtn lock up requiring a full log out and log in.

-weird issues joining fp, ops.. people with healthy normal machines and comcats/timeW/qwest get bumped.. and are forced to do a full logout and in.. to *try* to rejoin

-GCD bugs

-clipping .. the most basic of all things... i love to see my trenchcoat .. pass through my scooter, my chairs. or the tip of my barrel out my ***

-A overwhelmed dev team. people ***** and blame stwor dev... it is not their fault per say.. but more a issue of too many issues for the current team to fix effectively. resulting in poor 1st timer experiences.

-nobody wants a 100% wow clone, no.. but there are things that should have made it in like sorting gtn by stack size, or sort by cost per unit

-the slowest loading levels i have ever seen in a mmo, which also combine with zone issues and instance issues.. on a true 6 core 4ghz stripped m-4 set..

 

3) lack of mods/addons. (queue the aforementioned people with S%^&tty attitudes to tell you and me to 'l2p', and that no addons keeps the 'game pure, and this isn't wow and the list goes on) gtaz elitists, if you prevent enough people from subbing, the game will collapse. you win. thanks for letting us all know that you are the only one who knows how to play right, and to quit if we dont...

 

4) re-skinned content. same content in a new area.. easy to win content and faceroll content. there have been a number of threads about this on occasion and they are right. the same scooter re-skinned is the same scooter, or rifle, or head slot, or chest piece.. i mean really there is -0- challenge to the game except for hard stuff, which is still face-roll unless your pugging. and nightmare mode, which was made because everyone was face rolling hard mode.

 

all in all it goes like this :

 

new guy comes in:

learns the basics on the start world. not to bad. all new content easy to hook up and do groups.

gets free and goes to fleet, if he is really new, asks question and gets his *** reamed for asking a question.

he puts up with that and carries on. only now hes seeing the bugs as he tries wz, fp, ops groups and pugs.

if he keeps going, he then hits the reused content ... before hes 50.

if he presses on he guilds up, does raids and then sees that some things he can buy ourtight are better than grinding. so now hes thinking whats the point.

lastly now hes grinded it out or bought it for cc.. and now hes bored.

last phase, if he is a huge starwars fan, he stays until he cant stand it anymore. if not he unsubs and the devs and bioware loose income to build new content.

 

with new mmo's all over the damn place, the bored player shakes his head and spends his time and money on another mmo.

 

So to agree with a previous post, the hype outweighed the game. Wow is a once in genre phenom. its done and not another game will ever top that.

 

swtor will never equal even 1/4 of it and wont get the magic lighting in a bottle success.

 

but there are many levels of success. As long as Bw is making a profit by whatever margin they need to make then it is a success and it will go on until it is not a success. but that only gets swtor so far. as another post mentioned, belonging to a active a great guild for 10 years far outweighs the loyalty of swtor. if someone has only played for 6 months to a year them leaving and not coming back or unsubing to play other games is what is going to be the real killer. right now, once the content is conquered the mass unsub will begin. can swtor survive on only 600k subs until the next major content patch? dunno... will the ongoing quality issues and unmet enhancment requests nible away at the base of the subs ? dunno ...

 

imo, the next 9 month will decide the fate of swtor. if i were a betting man swtor (even though i really do like it) will end up like a low priority turbine lovechild... like ddo... which is unfortunate because that game you cant even log into 1 out of 3 days...

 

flame away:

Edited August 13, 2013 by captpickles

[captpickles]

After thought : if i had to place a bet. I believe that 40% of the players are dissatisfied with the handling of the game and its content and fixes/enhancements. they like the game itself... management of it however....

 

this is not where you want 40% of your possible income....

[LordArtemis]

I am just curious to why on sites such as mmorpg.com there seems to be so many discussions on how SWTOR days are numbered and the game is dead when clearly this is not the case and I and a lot of others are really enjoying the game why do people feel the need to slate it? Opinion is one thing but clear lies about the state of the game are ridiculous. Just don't understand! thoughts??

 

One could speculate many reasons why this may be the case, and why such opinions continue to persevere.

 

If I were to do so, I would say it is three factors that keep the negative vibe going...

 

1) Game was a disappointment to a large group of potential players when it launched.

 

It turns out that many folks did not like the narrow draconian restrictions the game had against casual play, the lack of end game against hardcore play, and the lack of polish in some areas where no excuse was acceptable in a modern MMO market.

 

2) The closure of SWG, combined with a lack of SW games in the market AND unreasonable expectations for this game to be the "all" for SW fans. Clone Wars did not fill the void.

 

3) Failure of review sites to properly review the game with unbiased eyes...the ratings the game received at launch were far too lenient on the game for various reasons.

 

 

All of this combined with the lack of ability for gamers to forgive pretty much continues to feed the negative vibe to this day. SWTOR is very different from the game that launched more than a year ago, but few see it that way...even those that play the game now.

 

Just my slant.

Edited August 13, 2013 by LordArtemis

[QuiDonJorn]

I don't really understand playing a game, while at the same time, writing about its doom in a forum. I tend to believe that a few of the haters are actually involved in some way with competitor games or have a competing interest. All it takes is a few bad words based on half truths or flat out lies too get a mob frenzied.

 

Now who would have motive?

 

WOW?

GW2?

Game box makers?

SWTOR does a pretty good job of keeping the gold farmers out, maybe gold farming websites that are losing money because people are playing SWTOR instead of WOW?

 

I think some of it is legit issues that people bring up in forums, but once they cross the line into flaming the game or predicting doom, I really think their is more to it than just simple hate.

 

Im with you on this. There has got to be some underlying interest. People want this game to fail, and fail hard, and I for one would like to know the real reason why. Not just speculation.

Edited August 13, 2013 by QuiDonJorn

[SkunkWerks]

Because many people need to shore up their sense of being justified in playing whatever MMO they are currently in the love half of a love/hate relationship with by enumerating all those mmos which fall mostly into the latter half of that relationship dynamic.

 

Or, in layman's terms, people are galactically insecure about what they do with their spare time.

 

Not speculating here. If you want proof, try standing completely immobile, doing nothing productive in the middle of a very busy place for ten minutes (in fact, don't even think about anything productive if you can manage it). Then tell me how that experience made you feel.

 

Most people- even the least motivated individuals in society- will report feeling awkward. Often guilty. That's it in a nutshell. If you're wasting time, you must at least delude yourself into believing it is somehow justified.

 

"Well yeah, sure I'm playing a silly game, but at least I'm not playing that silly game like those poor saps!"

 

/monocle

Edited August 13, 2013 by SkunkWerks

[Cyberwoman]

You feel this way and yet here you are. This is the one that surprises me more than other sites that hate the game. Some one paying for the game that hates on it. Tells you all about it yet is still paying the sub.

 

That is a mystery to me.

 

I agree. It is utterly bewildering why some people flame the game like there is no tomorrow, and yet still pay to play the game each month. Am I alone in the fact that if I do not like a game, I simply do not play it?

 

Anyway, I have been playing online games for around ten years now, and I can honestly say that I have never played an MMO in which there haven't been people declaring doom and gloom. From Final Fantasy 11 (My first MMO!) to WoW and many others, there have always been a portion of the population against the game. This isn't constructive criticism either, which is actually good for the game, its simply "lol the game is burning ******* ha". Do not take then seriously, look for actual facts rather then hyperbole.

 

I agree with what others have said, and that such doomsayers do this because of many different things. Sometimes they are simply trolling, a lot of the times they are projecting their dislikes on the community (I.E. they hate the game or an aspect of it, so they say/assume that a large portion of the game also hates it as well.) There is also quite a lot of 'armchair analysis', when such prophets present figures which have no support in actual evidence or fact whatsoever.

 

I think SWTOR gets this a little bit more then others games, mostly because of it's wobbly performance after launch. It has become an easy target, despite the fact that now the actual sings are that the game is performing well financially, and with healthy player numbers.

Edited August 13, 2013 by Cyberwoman