Top 3 issues: Your opinion

[LordKantner]

For the love of Jar Jar, now that we've established its 5 targets and most definitely not unlimited.....

 

Don't you think Pulse cannon should be unlimited targets? This could go under a broken abilities issues along with adrenaline rush. Having unlimited targets would greatly bridge the gap between DPS commandos to gunslingers and sentinels in PvE. Most boss fights have add phases that are greater than 5 mobs, and I am marginally close to their DPS until that dreaded add phase. I am actually able to catch back up slightly as time progresses, in both specs. Commando single target DPS is at the very least a percent or 2 off of the best gunslingers in fights like Vorgath and Soa where there is only 1 target.

 

But there's nothing we can do about those dreaded adds.....

[LordKantner]

as assault needs a complete face-lift, i dont have a suggestion for that spec. but for gunnery, would making Demo Round auto-crit on targets <30% health give a big DPS boost? that is basically a 3rd of every fight, so i think it would make a difference.

 

I find the increased dot damage sub 30% stacking with the increased 9% damage to burning targets enough to at least keep up in assault spec. This comes from using the spec in various burn phases such as Titan 6 or Kephess 2, or the multiple boss fights like Dread Guards or Cartel Warlords. I'll even prioritze plasma cell and sometimes use explosive round to make sure that dot is always up. It ends up doing more damage than if I went the usual bolt spam rotation that doesn't always keep the dot up at all times.

 

I agree that demo would be a nice choice for gunnery given the cooldown is the same as quick draw and spinning strike. Or they could add another ability where we pull out a 2nd assault cannon Or maybe this can finally be the way to bring back Explosive Round into the mix by making it salvo another 3 or 4 times sub 30.

[oaceen]

Don't you think Pulse cannon should be unlimited targets? This could go under a broken abilities issues along with adrenaline rush. Having unlimited targets would greatly bridge the gap between DPS commandos to gunslingers and sentinels in PvE. Most boss fights have add phases that are greater than 5 mobs, and I am marginally close to their DPS until that dreaded add phase. I am actually able to catch back up slightly as time progresses, in both specs. Commando single target DPS is at the very least a percent or 2 off of the best gunslingers in fights like Vorgath and Soa where there is only 1 target.

 

But there's nothing we can do about those dreaded adds.....

 

i didn't mean to derail your suggestion. i just wanted a clarification because i rarely used it, and it was suggested me recently that i was just being a silly commando by not using it, the reasoning that it hit unlimited targets.

 

as for your suggestion, i don't play a sentinel, but i hear from a lot of people that their AOE dps is not very high except for focus, but focus is generally not recommended for raiding, so i'm not sure if it would have a huge impact with regards to them.

i could see how it would change in comparison to gunslingers since flyby is a pretty big attack, but again i'm not entirely sure. their massive aoe ability has a 3s cast-time, then targets have to stay inside the AOE for 9-12s to get the full damage.

versus mortar volley is a channel that hits instantly, and does all of its damage in 3s.

[ArchangelLBC]

ok how do you propose they buff our damage without breaking us in pvp? as it is i can pretty much burst down anyone at the moment and if i got a damage boost it would be ridiculous... just saying if we are gona propose a damage buff then atleast explain it in a way where it wont make them laugh or nerf us right back harder than before

 

Explain to me how better and easier ammo management, possibly achieved through the return of the old PVE 4 piece set bonus in some form would break us in PVP? Further the only other DPS increases anyone is seriously asking for is more consistency, which makes you more consistently dangerous in PVP without raising your potential danger.

 

All you've seen is "ZOMG GIVE US DMG BOOST PLZ", and it seems you haven't paid much attention to our actual suggestions, or haven't thought through the implications of what we've said and what it means. I, and pretty much everyone else who has been suggested as a rep isn't likely to forget the need for proper moderation in requests, and the fact that any suggested changes have to be made with an eye towards not overbalancing and breaking us for good or ill in either PVP or PVE.

 

Finally to Katner, yes pulse cannon should definitely hit unlimited targets, I agree wholeheartedly. Also MV should be an 8m radius again.

[brandonvi]

Finally to Katner, yes pulse cannon should definitely hit unlimited targets, I agree wholeheartedly. Also MV should be an 8m radius again.

 

I would love to have the larger MV again it has really sucked for a good while now

[ArchangelLBC]

I would love to have the larger MV again it has really sucked for a good while now

 

Made obvious everytime I try to kill adds on Titan 6 >_<

[EFSoupy]

but for gunnery, would making Demo Round auto-crit on targets <30% health give a big DPS boost? that is basically a 3rd of every fight, so i think it would make a difference.

 

I run my commando PvE, so there may be some gearing differences, but :

Autocrit on demo round <30% health would make it (barring any defensive mitigation) an instant kill in PvP. I think that's a bit over powered. I know some smash monkeys are getting those kinds of numbers on smash, but a ranged guaranteed gib is a bit OP if you ask me.

 

On another note, I would like to see ammo management get a bit of a tweak. When the proc gods smile upon me, it's just a little disheartening to know I have to hold back because I will run into ammo problems. A bit better ammo regen and it means I get to just throw my head back and let out a maniacal laugh and a melt some pixels. It would just be nice.

[cashogy_reborn]

I run my commando PvE, so there may be some gearing differences, but :

Autocrit on demo round <30% health would make it (barring any defensive mitigation) an instant kill in PvP. I think that's a bit over powered. I know some smash monkeys are getting those kinds of numbers on smash, but a ranged guaranteed gib is a bit OP if you ask me.

 

On another note, I would like to see ammo management get a bit of a tweak. When the proc gods smile upon me, it's just a little disheartening to know I have to hold back because I will run into ammo problems. A bit better ammo regen and it means I get to just throw my head back and let out a maniacal laugh and a melt some pixels. It would just be nice.

 

not sure how you think demo round being an auto-crit <30% would be OP on PvP... i can already get lucky and crit on 100% of my Demo Rounds in a match (i have had this happen just 1 time. it was fun )

 

taking someone down the final 30% is arguably the hardest in PvP b/c people use their defensive cds, they get focused with heals and tank attention. w/out crits, commando damage is easily healed through. no crits = no burst = no killing (at least in RWZ).

 

if i get a crit demo round on someone <30% health right now, is that OP? its not a request for more overall damage, its a request for more overall consistency in the same damage output we can do now.

[Luckeyduckey]

Make Pyro/Assault the PvP tree. With BURST. Or increase it's sustained and make it for PvE. I love the playstyle, and now that PTs are trash, I have to play my merc.

[cashogy_reborn]

Make Pyro/Assault the PvP tree. With BURST. Or increase it's sustained and make it for PvE. I love the playstyle, and now that PTs are trash, I have to play my merc.

 

better yet, make both DPS specs viable for both PvE and PvP.

 

you shouldnt be pigeon-holed into one spec based on your gameplay preferences.

[ArchangelLBC]

better yet, make both DPS specs viable for both PvE and PvP.

 

you shouldnt be pigeon-holed into one spec based on your gameplay preferences.

 

Amen to that. And variety makes things more interesting in both.

[Gyronamics]

not sure how you think demo round being an auto-crit <30% would be OP on PvP... i can already get lucky and crit on 100% of my Demo Rounds in a match (i have had this happen just 1 time. it was fun )

 

taking someone down the final 30% is arguably the hardest in PvP b/c people use their defensive cds, they get focused with heals and tank attention. w/out crits, commando damage is easily healed through. no crits = no burst = no killing (at least in RWZ).

 

if i get a crit demo round on someone <30% health right now, is that OP? its not a request for more overall damage, its a request for more overall consistency in the same damage output we can do now.

 

Not even a monkey attacking someone being choked by another monkey can be so sure someone will die at sub30%

 

This is all a plzsantacanIhas list but a instant, ranged, guaranteed crit (cannot shield) of 9-11k that will happen when someone is below 30% is going to gib them pretty consistently not least of all being no warning when a Gunnery commando opens on you.

 

Don't forget Demo round is the hardest hitting attack in the game especially since it lands with 55% armour penetration.

 

Smash sometimes looks bigger because monkeys stack surge while commandos still need some accuracy, if there's guaranteed crits dam right I'll trade off all my accuracy for bigger more certain killing blows.

 

I really am not digging these fancy effects people are looking for, you're going off course by miles.

 

1) Assault sucks hind teat in PVP and PVE

2) Pushback why?

3) Alacrity doesn't lower the 6s internal lockout CD on our procs so the faster we cast the worse we line up our 1.5 and 3s casts with the 6s CD.

 

That's my revised ones.

Edited July 23, 2013 by Gyronamics

[cashogy_reborn]

Not even a monkey attacking someone being choked by another monkey can be so sure someone will die at sub30%

 

This is all a plzsantacanIhas list but a instant, ranged, guaranteed crit (cannot shield) of 9-11k that will happen when someone is below 30% is going to gib them pretty consistently not least of all being no warning when a Gunnery commando opens on you.

 

Don't forget Demo round is the hardest hitting attack in the game especially since it lands with 55% armour penetration.

 

Smash sometimes looks bigger because monkeys stack surge while commandos still need some accuracy, if there's guaranteed crits dam right I'll trade off all my accuracy for bigger more certain killing blows.

 

I really am not digging these fancy effects people are looking for, you're going off course by miles.

 

1) Assault sucks hind teat in PVP and PVE

2) Pushback why?

3) Alacrity doesn't lower the 6s internal lockout CD on our procs so the faster we cast the worse we line up our 1.5 and 3s casts with the 6s CD.

 

That's my revised ones.

 

eh, i still dont see how it would be overpowered. its just asking for more consistent finishing power. i quite despise relying on RNG in order to kill people. i can get lucky now and kill them, or get unlucky and probably have my damage healed through (the unlucky is way more likely to occur).

 

its not something i would include in the top 3 issues tho, its a wishlist item for sure. my top 3 are back on page 1 i think, i forget what they were lol

Edited July 23, 2013 by cashogy_reborn

[Moutlael]

What about a Bloodlust/Heroism type utility. Sure it would be mostly PvE releated, but give it to the CM. That would make them desirable!

[ArchangelLBC]

Not gonna happen. Depend upon it. At best we could maybe ask for talented buffs fpr Kolto bomb with a buff to CM's buffs.

[MGNMTTRN]

Lots of good discussion, though I did see a few outlandishly overpowered suggestions. My comments in this post will focus on Gunnery in PVE.

 

Outright bugs with Commandos:

• (applies to all classes) Pushing the keybind for a cast attack A approximately 0.1 seconds before ability A comes off cooldown will result in a GCD being taken, but no ability will be activated. May be related to extremely larget ability action queue window
  
• Decoy in the Gunnery tree only applies 200% resist to single-target F/T attacks; AOE damage like that of the TFB second phase slams or Dread Guard lightning are not applied. Not sure if this is a tooltip problem or an implementation problem
  
• Merc and Powertech basic attacks have 5 mainhand ticks, whereas Commando and Vanguard basic attacks have 7 ticks. Merc offhands make the tick problem extremely complicated. This imbalance in # ticks in ranged attacks (including unload/full auto) change the probability of applying the Plasma Cell/Combustible Gas Cylinder DOT. Powertechs effectively have a much lower chance of proccing Plasma Cell with ranged attacks; not sure whether Mercs or Troopers have the highest chance of proccing PCell, but I know there's a cross-class imbalance
  
• Plasma Cell DOT can be applied by a ranged attack like Full Auto or Hammershot. Call these PCell DOTs of Ranged origin Type A DOTs. Other effects that renew the PCell DOT (Vanguard Ion Pulse, Vanguard Esurge, Trooper HIB on burning target) renew the PCell DOT but bestow a PCell DOT; call these Type B. While a PCell DOT of any type is on a target, a DOT of any type can be renewed on the target... except Type A DOTs cannot be renewed while Type A DOTs are on the target. The easiest way of understanding what I'm talking about this is: p(hammershot renews PCell DOT on enemy | enemy has a PCell DOT from hammershot on him) = 0.
  

 

Gunnery:

• Lack of cost reductions to Plasma Grenade: The other ranged classes, Slinger and Sage, get incentives to use AOE abilities in their rotation(SS Slinger: -1 sec to Flyby cast and -15 to cd, Sab Slinger: +30% surge on AOE, DF Slinger: Shrap bomb, TK Sage: TK wave, Bal Sage: FIB). Whereas the Commando gets an extremely powerful AOE ability, Plasma Grenade, that 1) does not explicitly contribute to any rotation by building or consuming procs 2) is only marginally bolstered by one spec, and at that only its DOT damage in the execute phase of an enemy. I understand that Plasma Grenade is by design a really great standalone attack rather than being built into a rotation, but I think both the specs need to contribute in some way to its cost reduction, because 4 ammo is still an enormous investment. While Assault does have Ionic Accelerator procs, the only "free" attack that Gunnery has is HIB, and I can't afford to delay my HIB casts to sync up with Plasma Grenade, so... Bottom line, Gunnery needs either a free attack proc or a cost reduction in Plasma Grenade
  
• Lack of instant ranged finishing attack: In PVE when an enemy has ~30k HP and is being focused, I have no incentive to attack it; if I try to channel a Grav Round, it'll die before I can finish my cast. If I try to use Full Auto, HIB, or Demo round on this enemy it's enormous overkill, because I just used one of my hardest-hitting attacks on an enemy that would be dead if I had just hit it with Grav Round. If I use Plasma Grenade or explosive round, I'm spending an enormous amount of ammo. Pulse Cannon and Stockstrike both provide instant damage at a decent cost so there's no way I could waste my time by using one of these attacks, and Pulse Cannon might also hit nearby enemies; but both of these abilities necessitate that I be in melee range near the time when this enemy has 30k HP.
   
  Somewhat related suggestion mentioned bestowing a 100% crit chance on Demo Round for enemies below 30% HP, which seems quite overpowered to me; but then again, Turbulence (effectively 100% crit rate and 30% surge) and Quickdraw (execute targets below 30% HP, surge in SS tree) are both even more overpowered. While this would help in PVP to execute enemies, in PVE it wouldn't help much because we'd still find ourselves in a situation where the Commando has no incentive to cast a Demo Round instead of Grav Round, and Stockstrike or Pulse Cannon would have provided damage quicker
  
• Damage delay in Gunnery, especially in PVP against mDPS: suppose tech override is on cooldown and I am being targeted by one melee enemy; I begin channeling an ability; but he leaps on me. I've been interrupted, but I handle it with poise. Now we're both in melee range, and I begin channeling again. I channel Charged Bolts. He interrupts me with his actual interrupt, but now I know his interrupt is on cooldown so I am free to channel Grav Round. I finish my Grav Round channel, though I suffer pushback to my Grav Round cast. Then the projectile takes ~0.3 seconds to travel to the enemy. Then I have to wait ~0.3 seconds while the game decides whether to give me a Curtain of Fire proc. In all, my leaping enemy is typically dealing damage 3 seconds before I get my first rotation-building Grav Round in... this isn't even considering the trickery that Sentinels can do with Stasis, Awe, and Force Camo. Also note that since I'm ranged and therefore a caster, I obviously cannot use off-GCD abilities during a cast, whereas any mDPS or tank can use off-GCD abilities almost at their convenience. I have high APM, but not high enough that activating an off-GCD ability takes an infinitesimal amount of time.
   
  To repulse this enemy I could have used Stockstrike or Concussion Charge but 1) neither Stockstrike nor Concussion Charge contributes to my rotation 2) if I was fortunate enough to not be rooted because my enemy didn't leap, I can waddle away... except that if I try to gain distance after using Stockstrike or Concussion Charge, now my enemy can charge me from the 10m+ distance between us, and I'm back at square 1.
   
  Compare Concussion Charge to the knockback of a Slinger, whose knockback is 1) off GCD 2) bestows a root and then a slow, whereas Concussion Charge bestows a slow only 3) free. Compare Stockstrike to Leg shot: Leg shot can be used at 35m range, whereas Stockstrike range is 4m.
  
• ICD and CoF delay: The 6 second ICD of Curtain of Fire is completely necessary, but can be hard to work around. Assuming I get a proc, my standard rotation is [Grav Round*, Instant, Full Auto, Grav Round]. Note that I have inserted a "*" character; it's at that point in time, ie at the end of the Grav Round channel, that we get the CoF proc and CoF/Full Auto goes on internal cooldown. I've found this COF proc uncertainty a lot harder to cope with than Assault Vanguard's HIB reset ICD, 1) on my Assault Vanguard I have so much more control Ionic Accelerator proc usage/ICD, because HIB is a 1.5 sec GCD rather than 3 sec, which means I have much more flexibility in how I use those 6 seconds of ICD 2) as a Commando it is imperative that I use Full Auto as frequently as possible, which encourages me to consume ammo to send our Grav Rounds, then cast Full Auto. Note that Full auto is effectively slightly ammo positive (cast time < 3 sec, regen at least 15 ammo in 3 sec) IF you don't have to dip into stage 3 ammo regen; if you do have to dip into stage 3 ammo regen, then you're going to be ammo negative just from Full Auto, which means you're punishing yourself for trying to perform your rotation. Again, this would be rectified if Gunnery had some explicit ammo recovery or free attack.
   
  Additionally this ICD punishes alacrity investment: given that we have approximately +4% alacrity base from buffs and spec, do we divert even more secondary rating from surge to alacrity? Remember, the ICD diagram for COF is [Grav Round*, instant, Full Auto, Grav Round...]. If we had a decent amount of alacrity we'd end up finishing our second Grav Round cast while still within the 6 second ICD, which means we essentially wasted a Grav Round. This could be combated by the player by adding a tiny bit more delay in between each GCD, or by upping his effective lag, but let's at least recognize it as what it is: yet another reason to not invest in alacrity, on top of the various other problems that other classes encountered with alacrity.
  

 

Overall: I do like Gunnery, but it's strictly worse by any comparison (survivability, DPS, group utility) than a Gunslinger in PVE or PVP. If you had to ask a Gunnery question, I'd ask and/or posit community opinions about reducing Plasma Grenade cost, to 1) approach cross-class rDPS AOE parity (which would hopefully satisfy those who were asking for Commando buffs) 2) give Commandos a free proc other than HIB, because they desperately need some form of controllable energy regen. I think "PVP guy: how did this go live?" is also a valid question.

 

I was planning on discussing medics, but I am exhausted. Maybe tomorrow.

[Khalous]

Can we get an execute? as long as it is instant cast, melee range would be fine.

[cashogy_reborn]

Can we get an execute? as long as it is instant cast, melee range would be fine.

 

it absolutely would not be fine

[ArchangelLBC]

Can we get an execute? as long as it is instant cast, melee range would be fine.

 

Absolute veto on a melee ranged execute.

 

 

As I said somewhere else, Plasma grenade needs its cost cut in half right now. 33 Ammo is ridiculous.

 

I really like the idea of a boost in damage to various abilities sub 30%. Autocrit on Demo in execute range would be perfectly acceptable.

 

Alternatively, seriously can we please get Battle Focus?

 

Additionally, please either lower cost of talented Grav Round (the current cost reduction is an insult since it simply lowers cost to what it was in 1.7) or bring back old school 4 piece. Honestly just slightly smoother ammo management will cure a lot of our PVE damage ills.

 

I'm repeating a lot, but some of these points need to be made early and often.

[cashogy_reborn]

i see no reason that the new set bonus cant just add the same ammo reduction to HiB on top of the damage increase.

 

its not like there isnt precedent with other classes' set bonuses.

[ManiacDavis]

Can we get an execute? as long as it is instant cast, melee range would be fine.

 

A RANGED dps with a Melee execute is a horrible idea.

[SpaniardInfinity]

Can we get an execute? as long as it is instant cast, melee range would be fine.

 

By any chance, are you one of PVP developers that got fired last year? Because this sounds like one of their ideas.

[CommanderKeeva]

I cannot add anything that wasn't already suggested but since it was asked for, here are my top 3 issues that should be addressed IMO:

 

1. Sustained Ammo management:

 

It was already suggested in many forms but Ammo is currently probably the largest issue with Commandos and especially with Commando healers. In any sustained boss fight that requires a constant, very large amount of damage/healing (e.g. HM and NiM bosses) Commandos struggle to keep up big numbers. It's a downhill battle until Recharge Cells comes off cooldown. Then it's another downhill battle for 120 mins.

 

Healers are especially hard hit, large heals cost tons of Ammo and there is not enough time to regen between casts. Healers universally agree that healing as a Commando is much harder than healing as a Sage or Scoundrel. We're not asking for a resource system, where we never have to watch our resource (a.k.a MM/SS Sniper/Slinger) but we our ammo management should get a bit less intensive.

 

2. Lack of Utility

 

Although Gunnery's damage can approach a Sniper's damage on a good day (mind you it takes infinitely more skill and effort), there is still no reason to pick a Commando over a Sniper in any situation. Although, we have Electro Net now, it only works in a 1v1 situation and only for a very short time. Another melee DPS can still freely charge and shut down a Commando while ENet is ticking on another player. A MM Sniper has fewer casts than a Commando, yet it is immune to jumps and interrupts by default! 95% of the time, we're still very easily shut down by any opponent.

 

Ironically, since 2.0, the Sniper is one of the most mobile classes in the game. For being turret classes, both Snipers and Sages are infinitely more mobile than Commandos. We cannot even outrun the gosh darn rats in the Dash'roode encounter in S&V. Snipers and Sages also have better team utility (Ballstic Shield and Rescue). Commandos offer virtually nothing in the way of team utility.

 

3. Assault Specialist is useless

 

Assault Specialst is worthless since 2.0. Its damage pales in comparison to Gunnery and there is no situation in the game, where I would pick Assault over Gunnery.

 

Furthermore, Commandos lack offensive cooldowns (both Snipers and Sorcerers have them, Snipers have 2!) and have probably the worst defensive cooldowns in the game. Adrenaline Rush is completely rubbish and should be removed or redesigned.

Edited July 26, 2013 by CommanderKeeva

[LordKantner]

The 4 piece set bonus should remain the buff to damage in my opinion, that way its equal to vanguards. You could simply make special munitions have HiB totally free in armor piercing cell.

 

In AS HiB has negative ammo cost so no issue there, but in gunnery its a very small cost now, so that is where I suggest you fix it.

 

Not in the set bonus...

 

Also there is something to be said about how gunnery has higher ammo regen with talents like cell charger. Naturally with higher regen the abilities would cost more, so I think buffing the cell regen on that talent is the key to the ammo issue.

 

In AS it has much lower ammo regen but abilities cost less and at times reward energy cells. The spec itself can run fine while having 3/4 regen ticks because of this, so you aren't held back by the 70 cell regen limit.

[AMightyKnight]

The 4 piece set bonus should remain the buff to damage in my opinion, that way its equal to vanguards. You could simply make special munitions have HiB totally free in armor piercing cell.

 

In AS HiB has negative ammo cost so no issue there, but in gunnery its a very small cost now, so that is where I suggest you fix it.

 

Not in the set bonus...

 

Also there is something to be said about how gunnery has higher ammo regen with talents like cell charger. Naturally with higher regen the abilities would cost more, so I think buffing the cell regen on that talent is the key to the ammo issue.

 

In AS it has much lower ammo regen but abilities cost less and at times reward energy cells. The spec itself can run fine while having 3/4 regen ticks because of this, so you aren't held back by the 70 cell regen limit.

We dont need a knew ammo regen rate, we need our old set bonus back, nothing more. I dont even want the 8% damage buff since its just ridiculous. I have two 72 BIS Commandos, one with the old setbonus and one with the knew one. In bossfights i do more than 100dps more with the old bonus without even trying.