The REAL Most Powerful Force Users

[Darkondo]

Concerning Exar Kun, did he not have an amulet on him at all times which allowed him to perform the Force blast? Regardless Vitiate once eliminated an entire dark council while not even present with a blast of Force energy. Ritual assisted? Probably. But are Exar Kun's powers not bolstered by amulet and ritual?

 

Both are clearly very knowledgeable and powerful in Sith magic. But Vitiate has had 1000+ years to study it. As for Vader blocking lightning, we're forgetting those Jedi were rendered unconscious. Vader would suffer a similar fate.

 

Vader's strong enough to kill Sidious as stated by Sidious himself if they were ever to fight. Vader is also arguably the greatest TK user of all time (pre.Luke anyway). I don't think Vader would fall quickly to anyone in combat, that isn't Luke or a force god or anything divine.

[Wolfninjajedi]

Vader's strong enough to kill Sidious as stated by Sidious himself if they were ever to fight. Vader is also arguably the greatest TK user of all time (pre.Luke anyway). I don't think Vader would fall quickly to anyone in combat, that isn't Luke or a force god or anything divine.

 

Where was this stated?

Edited June 16, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi

[Beniboybling]

Vader's strong enough to kill Sidious as stated by Sidious himself if they were ever to fight. Vader is also arguably the greatest TK user of all time (pre.Luke anyway). I don't think Vader would fall quickly to anyone in combat, that isn't Luke or a force god or anything divine.

I'm not sure with was ever stated. I do know that its G-Canon that Vader has 80% of Sidious' power.

 

Note here that we are not talking about potential, but actual power. Simply put Vader fell short of his potential. Sidious made sure of that, in fact on one occasion Sidious subdued Vader with Force lightning to show this.

[Aurbere]

I've got to be honest here, post-ROTJ characters are not my specialty. I've read most of the books, but the abilities of the characters are not fresh in my mind like other characters.

 

Plus they are pretty inconsistent. So I don't know where to rank them. I'm sure if I knew more, I would be able to make a moredefinitive statement, but at this time, I can't.

 

But that's going to happen. I don't think we can make a definitive top 10 list at all. Way to many characters to consider.

[Darkondo]

Vader has a defense against Nihilus' drain too, learning from Ulic to withstand the Dark Reaper which was nothing more then a Force draining weapon.

 

 

 

Yes, but the JK and that one Jedi Master(forget his name) were able to block and resist his Lighting. Vitiate had to actually charge it to bring them down, during Vitiate's duel with the JK the JK was blocking his Lighting. Lets not forget that Vader does also have Force Barrier to shield himself.

 

Well then that would make Vader the only one that could defeat Nihilus alone if his defense is sound (it sounds sound, but Vader's never met Nihilus while the others have.)

 

Those jedi were most likely dealing with his Voice (at that time) since Act 2 JK takes place before Act 3 SW kills the Voss Voice who was trapped by Sel-Makor and the Emperor cant leave the body he resides in until it dies (at least at that point in time he couldn't)

 

[Darkondo]

I'm not sure with was ever stated. I do know that its G-Canon that Vader has 80% of Sidious' power.

 

Note here that we are not talking about potential, but actual power. Simply put Vader fell short of his potential. Sidious made sure of that, in fact on one occasion Sidious subdued Vader with Force lightning to show this.

 

No, Sidious did state that Vader was strong enough to kill him in DE, just never surpass him in power. And ROTJ Sidious is only eclipsed in power by DE Sidious, and GM Luke.

[Wolfninjajedi]

No, Sidious did state that Vader was strong enough to kill him in DE, just never surpass him in power. And ROTJ Sidious is only eclipsed in power by DE Sidious, and GM Luke.

 

Huh really? Hmm...don't suppose you have a scan? That is rather quite interesting.

Edited June 16, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi

[Darkondo]

Huh really? Hmm...don't suppose you have a scan? That is rather quite interesting.

 

Don't have one atm, am working on finding th quote.

[Beniboybling]

I've got to be honest here, post-ROTJ characters are not my specialty. I've read most of the books, but the abilities of the characters are not fresh in my mind like other characters.

 

Plus they are pretty inconsistent. So I don't know where to rank them. I'm sure if I knew more, I would be able to make a moredefinitive statement, but at this time, I can't.

 

But that's going to happen. I don't think we can make a definitive top 10 list at all. Way to many characters to consider.

Not with that attitude!

 

But no, I agree that the post-ROTJ has its ups and downs. But its fairly easy to tell who can even qualify for being considered the in a top ten. Really I can't see the likes of Kyp Durron and Mara Jade cutting in. Certainly not No.4 Darth Caedus seems the only memeber of that era who should be considered.

 

Really, for No. 4 its between Exar Kun and Vitiate.

 

Though I would think lists for Jedi and Sith would be easier, and the selection is a lot more narrow.

[Kaedusz]

Exar Kun being equal to Vitiate?Darth Vader having a chance vs Nihilus and Sidious?You are out of your minds.

Have fun.

Edited June 16, 2013 by Kaedusz

[LordQordisz]

Since you said the most powerful Force users, regardless of any affiliation I would throw in Kar Vastor who Mace Windu compared to Anakin and Yoda in terms of power.

[Wolfninjajedi]

Not with that attitude!

 

But no, I agree that the post-ROTJ has its ups and downs. But its fairly easy to tell who can even qualify for being considered the in a top ten. Really I can't see the likes of Kyp Durron and Mara Jade cutting in. Certainly not No.4 Darth Caedus seems the only memeber of that era who should be considered.

 

Really, for No. 4 its between Exar Kun and Vitiate.

 

Though I would think lists for Jedi and Sith would be easier, and the selection is a lot more narrow.

 

I think we need to look beyond Kun and Vitiate Beni...neither of them haven't done anything impressive in regards to Force Usage, outside of either gauntlets(Kun and Force Blasts) or rituals(Vitiate immortality/draining of planet). I mean I guess you could say the Children of the Emperor thing is a good feat, but then...he pretty much took them over as infants and even then he is only able to do that because of the ritual granting him that power, to put portions of his essence into them.

 

Were not using amps or help for this correct? Given how Vitiate needed the help of other Sith Lords to achieve his immortality, we can't really count what he has done as far as him using the power that was given to him from the ritual.

 

So taking him at base without his ritual what do we have?

Edited June 16, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi

[Beniboybling]

I think we need to look beyond Kun and Vitiate Beni...neither of them haven't done anything impressive in regards to Force Usage, outside of either gauntlets(Kun and Force Blasts) or rituals(Vitiate immortality/draining of planet). I mean I guess you could say the Children of the Emperor thing is a good feat, but then...he pretty much took them over as infants and even then he is only able to do that because of the ritual granting him that power, to put portions of his essence into them.

 

Were not using amps or help for this correct? Given how Vitiate needed the help of other Sith Lords to achieve his immortality, we can't really count what he has done as far as him using the power that was given to him from the ritual.

 

So taking him at base without his ritual what do we have?

I think we need to remember that 'ritual' is not just a button you can press to get insta-powers. It does require a high level of affinity in the Force and for that reason I would not call it an amp. It is no different than tapping into the dark side normally, it just requires more time and more preparation.

 

However I would say it should be noted that Vitiate used the power of 8,000 Sith help with his ritual. But he dominated their minds first and then proceeded to consume them and the planet which no doubt made him even stronger. Regardless of how he achieved that power, he still achieved it.

 

Kun on the other hand did rely on amulets to bolster his Force blast, which was not as powerful without it. (Though it still is a blast of pure dark side energy.) He also used what Wookieepedia refers to as 'alchemical apparatus' to drain the life of all those Massassi warriors. On the other hand he did kill a Sith wyrm with an outburst of power, something only Sidious has shown himself able to do.

 

Vitiate has also perfomed impressive feats without rituals i.e. rendering a whole team of Jedi, including the Hero of Tython, unconscious by conjuring a Force storm. Then dominating their minds.

[Wolfninjajedi]

I think we need to remember that 'ritual' is not just a button you can press to get insta-powers. It does require a high level of affinity in the Force and for that reason I would not call it an amp. It is no different than tapping into the dark side normally, it just requires more time and more preparation.

 

However I would say it should be noted that Vitiate used the power of 8,000 Sith help with his ritual. But he dominated their minds first and then proceeded to consume them and the planet which no doubt made him even stronger. Regardless of how he achieved that power, he still achieved it.

 

Kun on the other hand did rely on amulets to bolster his Force blast, which was not as powerful without it. (Though it still is a blast of pure dark side energy.) He also used what Wookieepedia refers to as 'alchemical apparatus' to drain the life of all those Massassi warriors. On the other hand he did kill a Sith wyrm with an outburst of power, something only Sidious has shown himself able to do.

 

Vitiate has also perfomed impressive feats without rituals i.e. rendering a whole team of Jedi, including the Hero of Tython, unconscious by conjuring a Force storm. Then dominating their minds.

 

Kun drained the life of the Massassi Warriors because he was in the area of his dark side temples, so that was an amped feat even if it was a ritual itself, he did it within his place of power. The Sith wyrm was in the temple with the gauntlets yes? If so that was when the gauntlets were charged by the power coming from the temple.

 

I think we should get rid of the gauntlets here, and other things that Kun has used to amp his power.

 

On that note then by Kun vs Vitiate then Vitiate takes it, due to his mind control and his immortality. Though we should also look at others for the 4th spot, because Vitiate still is lacking in other areas.

Edited June 16, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi

[Aurbere]

To be honest, Vitiate may have more power than Exar Kun, but I don't think he could defeat Exar Kun. Regardless, since we aren't saying who would beat who, I guess Vitiate is the more powerful. I'll throw you a bone there.

 

But then, there are other contenders for the number 4 spot. Really, the only thing Vitiate has going for him is mind domination. He's lacking in most other areas.

[Aurbere]

Though I would think lists for Jedi and Sith would be easier, and the selection is a lot more narrow.

 

I still don't think it can be done. Top 5? Maybe, but 10 is incredibly difficult. Look how difficult it's been to get a Top 5 going. Top 10 has a ton of characters to choose from.

 

But back to number 4, I think Thon or Nomi Sunrider should be options, they can both use some of the most powerful abillities out there.

[Wolfninjajedi]

I also wouldn't count Vader out of being number 4, he has too shown mind domination, inducing fear, attacking mentally, reading minds and so forth. Rare instances, but he has the capacity...plus if what is true about Palps saying that Vader could have beat him in a fight then that tears it and he is 4, though still waiting on confirmation.

 

Also yes, Vader did used Force Choke light years away on Xizor over hologram. He also did mind dominate a Toydarian, like Watto.

Edited June 17, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi

[Aurbere]

I also wouldn't count Vader out of being number 4, he has too shown mind domination, inducing fear, attacking mentally, reading minds and so forth. Rare instances, but he has the capacity...plus if what is true about Palps saying that Vader could have beat him in a fight then that tears it and he is 4, though still waiting on confirmation.

 

Also yes, Vader did used Force Choke light years away on Xizor over hologram. He also did mind dominate a Toydarian, like Watto.

 

I believe Vader choking Xizor was in Bounty Hunter Wars, and he wasn't even using his full power I think.

 

See this is what I'm talking about. There are so many candidates for a single spot that making a definitive list is nigh impossible. But if I must then I must. I personally think Thon or Nomi Sunrider would beat Vitiate for the spot.

[Wolfninjajedi]

Wait are we doing this, by what Force Users know? Or their applications of Force Usage? Because while some may know a technique or whatever, that is all fine and dandy but the application of it is what should be looked at. Though if its just by what Force Users know, then I guess this makes it a little easier though also unfair for some because they don't know such abilities and yet are still very powerful. Edited June 17, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi

[Aurbere]

Wait are we doing this, by what Force Users know? Or their applications of Force Usage? Because while some may know a technique or whatever, that is all fine and dandy but the application of it is what should be looked at. Though if its just by what Force Users know, then I guess this makes it a little easier though also unfair for some because they don't know such abilities and yet are still very powerful.

 

Seems based on feats to determine their power.

[Wolfninjajedi]

Oh lets also not forget, that Vader became a Force Ghost without any knowledge of how to do so. Also willing himself back to life, surviving for days buried under rubble via the darkside, being able to heal himself(if only for a moment), among other things.

 

Dark still waiting on that quote(though he maybe gone now, so no pressure on him.)

Edited June 17, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi

[Aurbere]

Oh lets also not forget, that Vader became a Force Ghost without any knowledge of how to do so. Also willing himself back to life, surviving for days buried under rubble via the darkside, being able to heal himself(if only for a moment), among other things.

 

Dark still waiting on that quote(though he maybe gone now, so no pressure on him.)

 

I don't know about number 4. He's a strong contender, but I think he would fit in at number 5.

 

I could probably counter that quote with a quote from Jedi vs. Sith. Or supplement it. Depends on the context. In Jedi vs. Sith, Sidious states that Vader was able to kill him, but was not powerful enough to succeed him. I'll post the actual quote in just a hot second ()

 

Edit: Here it is.

 

Yes, Vader remained strong in the Force, but strong enough to succeed me? Never. Granted he was strong enough to kill me. But that only lasted for so long.

Edited June 17, 2013 by Aurbere

[Wolfninjajedi]

I don't know about number 4. He's a strong contender, but I think he would fit in at number 5.

 

I could probably counter that quote with a quote from Jedi vs. Sith. Or supplement it. Depends on the context. In Jedi vs. Sith, Sidious states that Vader was able to kill him, but was not powerful enough to succeed him. I'll post the actual quote in just a hot second ()

 

Hmm...alright, though I still think he is good for 4 if he was powerful enough to kill Sidious. Not succeed but powerful enough to kill him.

Edited June 17, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi

[Aurbere]

Hmm...alright, though I still think he is good for 4 if he was powerful enough to kill Sidious. Not succeed but powerful enough to kill him.

 

The quote is in the previous post. What do you think?

[Wolfninjajedi]

The quote is in the previous post. What do you think?

 

Its nice, and actually it does kinda fall in line with Vader being 80% of Sidious' power. So it stands to reason, that Vader was at least strong enough to kill him at some point.

Edited June 17, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi