Collections feature is a joke.

[spectreclees]

It is pretty terrible. It's what I always wanted a legacy wide unlock for things. But I have to pay for every single item I want to be legacy/account wide. Another game we won't speak about let's me use every mount and pet I ever acquired on all characters for FREE.

 

It's money grabbing at it's finest. Please do not defend them on this one. I love Bioware and all their games but you can't hide from the truth of things. I'm not unsubbing for this but I can clearly see money grabbing.

[Calarand]

Apparently, if you chose to break up am armor set among multiple characters you can't get credit for the full set in your Collection. Gee, thanks!

THIS, so much! I lost three different sets that way... seems utterly not fair.

[Red_goon]

It is a joke. The collection menu focuses on what you don't have rather than what you do have, which makes it much harder than it needs to be to find the items that you want. It's just a big advertisement for the cartel market.

 

It's by far the worst update they've had thus far.

[Uldihaa]

Not that hard really, and the payback is really high if you do. Typically if I am missing pieces, it's belt, wrist, maybe gloves. Those are easy to come by compared to chest, legs, boots. But it is going to get more difficult as people figure it out.

 

I have actually been bottom fishing the GTN the last week in preparation for this feature. I picked up almost all the odds and ends for the sets I am interested in for cheap and now I can unlock the collections feature whenever I am ready to use them on other characters.

 

It's a great system, with some constraints, all easy to work with. People that don't get it either are not trying, or they just want everything for free.. no credits, no coins, probably no scubsctiption either. I have no sympathy for those that cannot figure out how to properly use the new system.

 

I'll be frank, I'm disappointed. I was under the impression that it would be individual pieces, no matter what they were. I was not expecting it to require the entire set.

 

Now the prices on the GTN will skyrocket, if they haven't already. So I can pay absurd prices on the GTN, or gamble with packs.

 

I'm not nearly as happy as I'd hoped. Looks like I'll be needing to get the rest of Thana Vesh's set (chest, belt, bracers and gloves) AND the rest of the Troublemakers set (legs, boots, bracers, belt).

 

It was a great idea. Too bad they weren't as clear as they should have been about it. Or at least I missed where they said you'd need the entire armor set to 'register' it in the Collections.

[WarsTrek]

Again, this is great if you have all the sets on one characters or have magical insight into the future (I doubt you were sitting there at the time thinking that it would be full armor sets; psychologically we like to tell ourselves we predicted the future when we make the correct decision in hindsight). This is great for a number of items. What I don't like is the deceptiveness and the misleading of the player base. I don't think you understand what deceptive or misleading is. Not telling people something is deceptive or misleading when you know about it and withhold part of the information.

 

If I told you I was awesome at PvP because I won every duel against players I challenged but I didn't tell you that I was a level 50 who had challenged all level 25s and below, I wouldn't be lying but that doesn't mean that I wasn't deceptive or misleading in my comments. As you say their chose for an example was a poor one, so was all their wording. If they had said "If you have Revan's armor set on one character you can get it on another" that would be accurate and truthful, but what they said was that "If you have Revan's mask, you can get it on another character." This was not true (whether they knew it then or just decided to change it recently, I don't know), making it at best misleading and deceptive.

 

As you said, it would not change the end result if they had said that it would be sets only, but it would have changed the feeling behind the implementation and the sense of betrayal that is surging around the forums. If they had been forthcoming, some people might have raged, but most would have accepted it as decent, albeit flawed, system. People came in with a false impression which was generated by the misleading statements; that is what is upsetting many people. There is a reason people dislike puggers who go into hard mode FP's and say they have done it before (but don't say that they've only done it on story mode 2 times). If you are open about what you are doing, you will leave people feeling better than if you misled or deceived them.

 

Oh and I agree the sets WOULD have been logical, IF the devs had not put so much out there about items being unlocked and had been more forthcoming about the way collections would work. The way they represented it made it seem as though it would not be armor sets but individual items (I don't appear to be the only one who thought that). It's not like everyone who though that were naive sheep who can't think logically. When the devs give a general impression of the system through countless interviews and FAQ's, then I take them at their word. In the past, I would not have sat there and said "Hmmm... well maybe they aren't telling us the whole truth so I better think about how they would implement this in a way different from how they represented it that would still make sense."

Edited May 14, 2013 by WarsTrek

[WarsTrek]

I'll be frank, I'm disappointed. I was under the impression that it would be individual pieces, no matter what they were. I was not expecting it to require the entire set.

 

Now the prices on the GTN will skyrocket, if they haven't already. So I can pay absurd prices on the GTN, or gamble with packs.

 

I'm not nearly as happy as I'd hoped. Looks like I'll be needing to get the rest of Thana Vesh's set (chest, belt, bracers and gloves) AND the rest of the Troublemakers set (legs, boots, bracers, belt).

 

It was a great idea. Too bad they weren't as clear as they should have been about it. Or at least I missed where they said you'd need the entire armor set to 'register' it in the Collections.

 

That's the reason everyone is up in arms and the reason I called their earlier responses misleading/deceptive. They never said you would need the armor sets registered on one character until today after the patch hit. Up until now, they had said you would be able to "register items" from the Cartel market and packs.

[Andryah]

That's the reason everyone is up in arms and the reason I called their earlier responses misleading/deceptive. They never said you would need the armor sets registered on one character until today after the patch hit. Up until now, they had said you would be able to "register items" from the Cartel market and packs.

 

In fairness, they also never said the opposite. People just assumed.

 

Personally, I'm a skeptic.. so I assumed the opposite of most people, and began making plans accordingly.

 

I get that people are up in arms about it.. but the only thing Bioware is guilty of is imprecise communications, leaving room for amiguity and where ambiguity exists.. most MMO players will assume what's in their favor. Personally, I learned years ago in MMOs not to do that.

[ZayneDraay]

Once again -- would you prefer they never put this into place?

 

I'll "defend" them if I please. I'm HAPPY with the collections system. If you aren't -- don't use it.

 

I'm with you Kilora, these guys are just whining about anything they can find. It's typical to see this stuff the day a patch is implemented, and yet they won't close their accounts if they have a real problem with how the game is being run.

[Shingara]

In fairness, they also never said the opposite. People just assumed.

 

Personally, I'm a skeptic.. so I assumed the opposite of most people, and began making plans accordingly.

 

I get that people are up in arms about it.. but the only thing Bioware is guilty of is imprecise communications, leaving room for amiguity and where ambiguity exists.. most MMO players will assume what's in their favor. Personally, I learned years ago in MMOs not to do that.

 

I dont even want to start trying to add up how much it would cost in CC to unlock the new stuff if we were doing all our chars and the unlocks, i mean seriously 600cc for a mount. But there is an easy answer for bioware, answer our questions when they are asked not just cherry pick the ones that are obvious.

 

Im still puzzled to high hell why the kiosk costs cc when we arnt even considering changing race. This game has changed from normal mmos, instead of currency sinks we now have cartel coin sinks.

Edited May 14, 2013 by Shingara

[jgoldsack]

In fairness, they also never said the opposite. People just assumed.

 

Personally, I'm a skeptic.. so I assumed the opposite of most people, and began making plans accordingly.

 

I get that people are up in arms about it.. but the only thing Bioware is guilty of is imprecise communications, leaving room for amiguity and where ambiguity exists.. most MMO players will assume what's in their favor. Personally, I learned years ago in MMOs not to do that.

 

It really is too bad that most players are obviously not as smart as you are. Of course, we only have your word to go on that you planned ahead of time, and didn't simply luck out...

 

Bioware is 100% to blame on this. After all they were the ones who had all the power to let players know what the system required, how it would work, yet they did not. Players fully have the right to be upset. You constantly telling players they were stupid to assume it worked one way (it is what is said between the lines of your comments) when Bioware had plenty of opportunity to explain the system and sets beforehand.

 

Thinking that the system would work on a per item basis was logical, based on the information provided by Bioware. thinking that the system would work on a set only basis was logical, if you went by the information Nioware didn't provide. Problem is, human nature goes by the information we are provided, and Bioware failed to provide.

[Andryah]

It really is too bad that most players are obviously not as smart as you are. Of course, we only have your word to go on that you planned ahead of time, and didn't simply luck out...

 

I've actually found something finally to spend cartel coins on, while I wait for dyes to saturate the GTN and people to be posting Cathar unlocks in a couple days here. I've unlocked 4 armor sets, two mounts, and 4 weapons today and now I'm settling in to do a lot of upgrades to my characters using this collections feature tha some people insist is a joke. Best guess.. I got a windfall in equipment today that would have cost me 10-15M on the GTN to aquire the old way.

 

And no, it was not luck. I had to cherry pick 6-7 pieces of gear over the weekend to complete sets and get ready for the new feature.

[Uldihaa]

In fairness, they also never said the opposite. People just assumed.

 

Personally, I'm a skeptic.. so I assumed the opposite of most people, and began making plans accordingly.

 

I get that people are up in arms about it.. but the only thing Bioware is guilty of is imprecise communications, leaving room for amiguity and where ambiguity exists.. most MMO players will assume what's in their favor. Personally, I learned years ago in MMOs not to do that.

 

Well, lesson learned here, I'll tell you. From now on, I'll treat everything said by a Bioware spokesman as if said by a politician. I'll carefully dissect it and try to find how and where they could be trying to deceive me while telling me the literal truth.

 

And if any Bioware rep is reading this thread, I can think of fewer descriptors more demeaning (in my opinion and without accusing someone of a crime) than calling someone a "Politician". So congrats, I guess. I now rank you at the very bottom of my "Trusted Statements" list.

 

 

 

P.S. So... Anyone got some Thana or Troublemaker parts to sell on Ebon Hawk? For Cheap?

[Andryah]

Im still puzzled to high hell why the kiosk costs cc when we arnt even considering changing race. This game has changed from normal mmos, instead of currency sinks we now have cartel coin sinks.

 

Totally different topic though Shingara.

 

Personally, I don't figure I'll be visiting the kiosk anytime soon. I'm happy with the appearance of my characters and will roll a new character when I unlock Cathar from a token off the GTN.

[WarsTrek]

It really is too bad that most players are obviously not as smart as you are. Of course, we only have your word to go on that you planned ahead of time, and didn't simply luck out...

 

Bioware is 100% to blame on this. After all they were the ones who had all the power to let players know what the system required, how it would work, yet they did not. Players fully have the right to be upset. You constantly telling players they were stupid to assume it worked one way (it is what is said between the lines of your comments) when Bioware had plenty of opportunity to explain the system and sets beforehand.

 

Thinking that the system would work on a per item basis was logical, based on the information provided by Bioware. thinking that the system would work on a set only basis was logical, if you went by the information Nioware didn't provide. Problem is, human nature goes by the information we are provided, and Bioware failed to provide.

 

I agree. And to the people who get on here and act like they were the only smart ones because they saw this coming weeks before (see my comment on psychology of the human mind above) or who say the people complaining are just whiners who will always find something to whine about; BioWare (and indeed many of the MMO's I have played) have not given me a reason to distrust what they were saying and because of that I don't normally complain. In fact, I normally support the devs who work on games because they do a tough job and have to face constant criticism for every little thing they do.

 

But this is one case where I cannot support their decision. If they knew it was going to be based on sets, and yet purposely did not tell players and picked misleading examples (such as Revan's mask on its own), then they deserve to get this criticism. They should own up to what they did. It's one thing to be vague, it's another to use concrete examples when in reality those examples are not true.

 

I think that allowing people to port over pieces of sets would make sense. I understand making them bound (no exploits), I understand having to pay for that even as a subscriber, I understand not having some things go in the collections. If they had come out outright and said "You need to have the sets," I would have no problem with them. It's these vague, misleading statements that have me irked. I expected (given their example) to be able to port my Revan's mask over to all my character. I went in today to find out that wasn't true. There was nothing ambiguous about their example. You can't do what they described in their example. If they knew that at the time, they were being deceptive/misleading. I simply don't see how someone who sold two pieces of their set shouldn't be allowed to carry the other 3 pieces to their other characters (not my case). I also don't see why people who can't afford (either because of the credit cap or just not having the time to grind out credits) one or two pieces of a set should be prohibited from unlocking the pieces they do own for all their characters without having to pay out the nose for new sets for each one.

[Shingara]

Totally different topic though Shingara.

 

Personally, I don't figure I'll be visiting the kiosk anytime soon. I'm happy with the appearance of my characters and will roll a new character when I unlock Cathar from a token off the GTN.

 

it went with the context of my post though. i just ended up there for some reason.

Edited May 14, 2013 by Shingara

[SilentKitty]

Hmm... at least all those bracers and belts I have in my cargobay might have some kind of value now. Those who wish to unlock a set might buy them now. At the moment they don't really sell for anything.

[reagan_youth]

I like the concept of the collections, but find it to be insulting to subscribers. I can go back to WoW and get all of my mounts account wide for my $15 a month. It's like others have stated before, we are no longer being treated like the supporters we have been, we are just being milked for more money. The sad thing is, I don't mind to spend some extra cash every month to support the game further if there is something I like, but now I feel like I have to pay extra to fully use the product I'm already paying a monthly fee for.

[SilentKitty]

I like the concept of the collections, but find it to be insulting to subscribers. I can go back to WoW and get all of my mounts account wide for my $15 a month. It's like others have stated before, we are no longer being treated like the supporters we have been, we are just being milked for more money. The sad thing is, I don't mind to spend some extra cash every month to support the game further if there is something I like, but now I feel like I have to pay extra to fully use the product I'm already paying a monthly fee for.

 

Well yes, I don't see myself buying pieces of armor that I don't intend to use just so I can unlock an item. However that is my choice, there are other things that are singular that I can unlock luckily. Being able to change colors is something that I am very happy with, I see this feature getting a little less use from me. At least as far as whole sets of armor are concerned.

[Raansu]

My issue isn't even with the set / single piece reclamation right now. The real issue here is the fact that subscribers have to PAY to unlock items in the collection menu for the entire account. Subscribers should NOT have to pay for such a feature...

 

The fact that there are subscribers in this thread that see nothing wrong with the way this business is treating its customers is sickening. This right here is 100% why EA was voted two years in a row to be the worst company ever (yes I know the devs are BioWare but the parent company is still EA.)

 

Forcing subscribers to pay extra for a feature that should be included as a benefit for subscribers is borderline robbery. This whole "but its optional" argument is nothing more than excusing a company for practicing terrible business tactics and gouging its customers at every turn.

 

I can understand making F2P players pay for the unlocks and of course if a sub switches to F2P then the item becomes greyed out on the copies of the item until they either resubscribe or purchase the unlock, but to out right charge us for an item we already own...

 

That's like you going to burger king and ordering a cheeseburger and them charging you $5 for the patty and then if you want the bread its another $5. You want some cheese on it? That's $5. Ketchup? Another $5 please. "But it's totally optional!!!"

Edited May 15, 2013 by Raansu

[decoyofham]

I don't get what the big issue is. So, people are complaining because they dont get something for free out of this game?

 

Ok so maybe the wording on the release notes perhaps could have been clearer, but once I got in game and played with the Collections system, I saw how nice this is...

 

One such example: I bought the Clandestine armour set on my Operative at one point, as the Clandestine armour is adaptive, and it meant I could dress Kaliyo up in imperial uniform also (she is heavy armour, other imperial uniforms are medium). Before this patch, I would have to buy a second set if I wanted to also dress Vector in clandestine (he is light armour).

 

Now for that toon, I can dress Vector up for free, as well as the others in exactly the same uniform instead of closely resembled uniforms.

 

The Clandestine armour in the Cartel store is ~1000 CC's. The option to unlock it via Collections for ALL toons is ~600 CC's.

 

Before the patch, I would have to spend ~1000 CC's per toon or companion that I wanted to use this outfit... That or try to find it on the GTN (Didnt always find it there, maybe its a popular item, and bought quickly). With the new model, I buy it once, then pay an additional 600 CC to unlock it across ALL toons and be able to claim it multiple times for every companion.

 

That is already an improvement on what was in place before, and people are complaining because this wasnt freely available straight up? Take the silver spoons out of your mouths people!

 

I wasnt sure about the toys binding to character at first, because I have a Revan holostatue I have been mailing between toons. At first glance, this seemed to be an issue for me, but now I realise for a certain amount, I can guarantee every toon on my account can have a Revan statue, not just one to pass around. That's pretty awesome too.

 

For about 700k credits, I was able to piece together the Recovered Triumverate armour set for my vanguard toon. I had resigned myself to finding some crappy piecemeal trooper armour sets for my companions, but now Havoc squad is rocking the Recovered Triumverate armour set, and look like a kick *** Boss Squad. This made me happy

[decoyofham]

Also, as I suggested, before the patch you would have to buy an armour set twice from the Cartel store everytime you wanted it for toon or companion.

 

We know that before the patch buying an armour set once from the Cartel store was never an account wide unlock, why should this change now? They have just given you a discount to allow you to unlock it across all your toons. Why don't you see that as a bonus in its own right instead of demanding more free **** everytime a new update is released?

[Killance]

http://420yolo.com/

[decoyofham]

My issue isn't even with the set / single piece reclamation right now. The real issue here is the fact that subscribers have to PAY to unlock items in the collection menu for the entire account. Subscribers should NOT have to pay for such a feature...

 

The fact that there are subscribers in this thread that see nothing wrong with the way this business is treating its customers is sickening. This right here is 100% why EA was voted two years in a row to be the worst company ever (yes I know the devs are BioWare but the parent company is still EA.)

 

Forcing subscribers to pay extra for a feature that should be included as a benefit for subscribers is borderline robbery. This whole "but its optional" argument is nothing more than excusing a company for practicing terrible business tactics and gouging its customers at every turn.

 

I can understand making F2P players pay for the unlocks and of course if a sub switches to F2P then the item becomes greyed out on the copies of the item until they either resubscribe or purchase the unlock, but to out right charge us for an item we already own...

 

That's like you going to burger king and ordering a cheeseburger and them charging you $5 for the patty and then if you want the bread its another $5. You want some cheese on it? That's $5. Ketchup? Another $5 please. "But it's totally optional!!!"

 

The option here, is that you don't have to buy the burger if you have issue with it.

[LordArtemis]

I'm ok with having to pay more to unlock for all characters. I think that's a deal.

 

What I don't personally like is the idea that the system does not seem to count items you already have if you have not purchased them directly from the market. Still, it's a start IMO. It just needs to be explained better.

 

 

It's not bind to legacy like we asked for IMO, but it's better than nothing.

[decoyofham]

I'm ok with having to pay more to unlock for all characters. I think that's a deal.

 

What I don't personally like is the idea that the system does not seem to count items you already have if you have not purchased them directly from the market. Still, it's a start IMO. It just needs to be explained better.

 

 

It's not bind to legacy like we asked for IMO, but it's better than nothing.

 

Not entirely true... My Recovered Triumverate set I got mostly from friends and GTN. I think I got 1 maybe 2 pieces from Cartel packs, and yet the entire outfit is correctly displayed in the collections screen.

 

And yet... Some other items I have bought are not. I think the Collections system still has a few bugs or kinks to work out. Some of the pets and toys I have gotten from Cartel Packs are not showing as obtained, despite the toys being in my inventory and bound to me. I will wait to see if this is fixed.

 

Theres only one other issue I have with the Collections system, that I have seen others post about. And that is that I have to pull bound cartel crystals from my weapons to my inventory before they are marked as obtained. While its not the end of the world, thats like 8k per crystal to pull off toons, even your lowbie toons who might not be rich. But hey, like I said, not the end of the world.