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lol bolster

LegendaryQuan

By LegendaryQuan
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Devlonir

Devlonir

Posted
Posted (edited)
No disagreement here. We now only have to wait for such a system - maybe after this patch?

 

I am surely hoping so. Though I'm also sure we will still see a myriad of complaints from people seeing PVEers in 30k+ gear running around saying that is imba, without ever bothering to look at their Expertise ratings and understanding where their huge crits come from.

 

This change will take a while before everyone understands it.. I still feel any non Partisan/Conqueror gear should just be given the same stats for each Advanced Class, that's the only real way to make Bolster fair in the long run, and also make sure new PVE items don't remove the balance that is now created again.

Edited by Devlonir
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Devlonir

Devlonir

Posted
Posted (edited)
Is Bolster being fixed in 2.0.1

 

Also my definition of fixed is PvE Gear no longer being better than PvP

 

Patch Notes say the following concerning gear abuse with Bolster:

 

  • Bolster will no longer grant an increased amount of stats to gear when certain mods are removed while others are left in place.
  • Decreased the amount of Expertise given via Bolster on Underworld and Arkanian gear.

 

I'd say those are fixes to Bolster concerning the major remaining flaw: non PVP gear beating PVP gear, depending on how much the Expertise will be decreased and how "underworld and arkanian" is defined (I hope it's just one other way of saying: 69 and 72 mods).

We will only know when the patch actually goes live though.

Edited by Devlonir
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cripito

cripito

Posted
Posted
Is Bolster being fixed in 2.0.1

 

Also my definition of fixed is PvE Gear no longer being better than PvP

 

By definition.. PVE gear... PVP gear... mutually exclusive.... NO ONE should be using PVE gear IN PVP enviroment.. the bolster is a mistake.AS no one should be using PVP gear in PVE

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Riggz

Riggz

Posted
Posted
By definition.. PVE gear... PVP gear... mutually exclusive.... NO ONE should be using PVE gear IN PVP enviroment.. the bolster is a mistake.AS no one should be using PVP gear in PVE

 

I agree with you 100%

 

 

Glad to see Bioware understands this and is fixing it... I think

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Devlonir

Devlonir

Posted
Posted (edited)
By definition.. PVE gear... PVP gear... mutually exclusive.... NO ONE should be using PVE gear IN PVP enviroment.. the bolster is a mistake.AS no one should be using PVP gear in PVE

The whole problem that caused Bolster to exist is because this isn't true.

 

Recruit MK2 was the best entry level PVE gear at level 50 until Tionese was given away for free. The activities aren't mutually exclusive, and neither is it's gear.

 

It is important that each progression branch has their own progression though, and Bolster needs to be fixed to make sure that Partisan gear still beats any form of PVE gear in level 55 PVP.

 

This is also why Conqueror, with Expertise no longer part of item budget, is item level 66 on their mods, while this is entry level endgame gear for PVE. That way top grinded PVP players can't own PVE with their gear as well.

 

So that means: With top endgame gear of one activity, you can start doing entry level stuff of the other activity. That is the best way to do it. But until Bolster fixes top endgame PVE gear in PVP, that is not the case right now. I am keeping my fingers crossed 2.0.1 fixes that, but I don't entirely believe it until smarter people than me actually tested it.

Edited by Devlonir
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LanceCorporalDan

LanceCorporalDan

Posted
Posted
One of the first things we want to address are concerns about how our change has affected players in WH and EWH in the open world. The simple explanation is that due to the way our itemization works, we had to make the choice that WH gear would either be good in open world (and not viable in Warzones) or viable in Warzones (but lacked Expertise in open world situations). We decided that since a large majority of the PvP that occurs in our game and the place where players worked to receive the gear is Warzones, that we would side with Warzones overall.

 

We completely understand that the desire from everyone would be that WH/EWH was viable in both open world PvP and Warzones, but unfortunately that just was not a possibility in this case.

 

-eric

 

 

Where is the logic behind this? It was possible before... why not now?

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cripito

cripito

Posted
Posted
The whole problem that caused Bolster to exist is because this isn't true.

 

Recruit MK2 was the best entry level PVE gear at level 50 until Tionese was given away for free. The activities aren't mutually exclusive, and neither is it's gear.

 

It is important that each progression branch has their own progression though, and Bolster needs to be fixed to make sure that Partisan gear still beats any form of PVE gear in level 55 PVP.

 

This is also why Conqueror, with Expertise no longer part of item budget, is item level 66 on their mods, while this is entry level endgame gear for PVE. That way top grinded PVP players can't own PVE with their gear as well.

 

So that means: With top endgame gear of one activity, you can start doing entry level stuff of the other activity. That is the best way to do it. But until Bolster fixes top endgame PVE gear in PVP, that is not the case right now. I am keeping my fingers crossed 2.0.1 fixes that, but I don't entirely believe it until smarter people than me actually tested it.

 

The bolster needs to go.. the fact that they are allowing people to pve to start doing pvp is wrong.. if you at you own risk desire to do pvp in ur PVE gear you deserve to be hammered. In SWTOR is not really that hard to obtain pvp gear is just put some efford.. This is a MMO not a mama and papa give me a hand game. Keeping the bolster in PVP as broken as it's is just alienating the entire pvp community,

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L-RANDLE

L-RANDLE

Posted
Posted
*snip

So, conclusion, your numbers actually prove my point more than they disprove them.

 

Not really. It's fuzzy logic. Sorry but its a "made up" number without any real calculations to back up... It's a guess more or less.

 

Even if you added my numbers would you say a Guardian AC has a "42% deficit" if they don't augment(:rolleyes:) their recruit gear? Well then so does my Sage, Sniper, et. all because all the stats available are virtually the same for each class tier to tier. The problem comes in when you take a recruit Sage versus a WH Guardian. That "42%" transforms into "100%+" deficit, strictly by AC choice. I can almost guarantee the most QQ about gear in PvP comes from classes that are very limitied in output, even at top levels.

 

Plus I was not ignoring any stats.. I was showing the ones that matter... I was talking BiS on both cases (less not augmenting my recruit gear. My crit was within 1-2% on each build. On the probability scale, that's peanuts..

Multiplier was less, but I was WAY over the Surge DR (because there is not much you can do about that since the BiS Power ENH hasSurge on it).

 

Again those deficits would disappear if people actually chose to give themselves the best performance possible by augmenting their Recruit gear. The "money" issue? If you PvP til 50, you should not even be in recruit gear, and if you are a newcomer/PvE player, credits are easy to come by (even assuming you don't craft anything). 20 min(max) on Ilum netted you a kit and an augment, with some cash left over (on average). That is assuming you were broke @ 50. That's less than 5 hours of game time for all 14 kits/augs, and 2.5 hours to replinish kits for your WH/EWH gear...

 

 

The only reason people see gear as being an issue is because they just don't know how to play or where to find info...

 

 

Gear in PvP has never been an issue in PvP from a performance or attainability perspective...

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Astarica

Astarica

Posted
Posted
I'm not sure why people are overreacting so much to PvE gear when it really should be UW MH and possibly OH is better and that's it. UW full set is said to be 1322 or so Bolster, which is roughly 40% damage modifier. If you look at the pieces side by side you can tell having a full set of UW isn't going to let you do 20% more damage. Further there's no way this is true on average. 40 more mainstat gets you less than 1% damage and the average piece doesn't have 40 more mainstat. Now this is not true on the MH and possibly OH slot, but this is something that shouldn't surprise anyone because Expertise is generally given out assuming each piece's contribution is equal (MH contributes to 1/10th of your expertise). It is rather obvious that MH contributes for significantly 1/10th of your total DPS/HPS, so of course here taking an Expertise hit for a significantly more DPS is possibly in your favor.
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L-RANDLE

L-RANDLE

Posted
Posted
Maintenance was postponed.

 

I guess I will stay out of PvP (already @ cap) :rolleyes:

I'll keep getting low amounts or wrong mats for my crafting missions:rolleyes:

This patch got tested prior to anouncement that its going to happen? :rolleyes:

Might as well keep eating Flaming-Hot Cheetos and drinking Fat Tire, while mostly using only my right hand to do PvE content. :rolleyes:

 

 

 

:o:(:mad::o:(:mad::o:(:mad:

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T-Assassin

T-Assassin

Posted
Posted (edited)
I guess I will stay out of PvP (already @ cap) :rolleyes:

I'll keep getting low amounts or wrong mats for my crafting missions:rolleyes:

This patch got tested prior to anouncement that its going to happen? :rolleyes:

Might as well keep eating Flaming-Hot Cheetos and drinking Fat Tire, while mostly using only my right hand to do PvE content. :rolleyes:

 

 

 

:o:(:mad::o:(:mad::o:(:mad:

 

whatcha doin with dat left hand? :eek:

 

EAWare QUALITY ASSURANCE, where are you?

 

I guess I just don't understand what the point of a PTS server is, if EAWare pushes live without listening to feedback and QA.

 

America....F YEAH!

Edited by T-Assassin
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Yeochins

Yeochins

Posted
Posted
Me too. I'm afraid we may be waiting for a while though. They've been given "mathy" proof of the bug

 

This is how the conversation is going to go:

 

CM: Can we get forum post on the bolster formulas?

Developer Manager: Great Idea, can we get it done?

Developer A: Uhm.... I'm pretty sure the code is a ****-show....

Developer B: Implementation wise I don't think we could even give working formula's cause of this magic here, here and here....

Developer Manager: Well can you at least give something?

Developer A: If it doesn't have to be right then yeah... but ur not gonna like it.

Developer Manager: Just do it

*** Developer A delivers formulas ***

Developer A: I was right.... **** show, u probably shouldn't post that

*** Developer Manager delivers formulas ***

*** CM posts formulas ***

*** Insuing community outrage at stupidity of bolster formulas ***

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KhalDrogoe

KhalDrogoe

Posted
Posted
One of the first things we want to address are concerns about how our change has affected players in WH and EWH in the open world. The simple explanation is that due to the way our itemization works, we had to make the choice that WH gear would either be good in open world (and not viable in Warzones) or viable in Warzones (but lacked Expertise in open world situations). We decided that since a large majority of the PvP that occurs in our game and the place where players worked to receive the gear is Warzones, that we would side with Warzones overall.

 

We completely understand that the desire from everyone would be that WH/EWH was viable in both open world PvP and Warzones, but unfortunately that just was not a possibility in this case.

 

-eric

 

Because afterall, Partisan is just EWH with expertise now.... :rolleyes:

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