Keep Bubblestun as on live.

[dcgregorya]

Ok well if the bubble stun is being nerf. lets nerf all the tech stuns to make this fair. This means no more flash bangs/sleeper darts or dart stuns. and lets buff all the dps powers. then we will be able to pvp the way it was suppost to be

 

How can you not tell the difference from giving YOUR ENTIRE TEAM a free AOE hard stun every 20 seconds...and a once per minute mez?

 

Bubblestun is ridiculously broken and more over, its presence negates a number of different short range classes from being viable (leading to everyone complaining about derp smash...trying playing a carnage marauder when you're stunned every 5 seconds).

[foxmob]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Fact for you smart arse. Said guild I called out was in fact super queuing. After the one I faced them another team of eight from their guild were in another match where 3 more of my own guild were in moments after we were blown out in CW. You want to call me and six other people liars? You go right ahead. You're still wrong. As for healing myself, I healed myself during that confrontation between you and me. You’d have noticed that if you were paying attention. However, I guess you didn’t because you didn’t believe I would put you down.

 

I know exactly what my class has and its capabilities. The Static Barrier is the one true defensive talent the Sorcerer has available with the stun attached. Maybe you should start learning more about what you face. Knockback on Overload with a root is a delaying tactic to aid in breaking contact. However, now that is even overcome with the new "we don't get rooted anymore" talent available to the Sentinels and Marauders. Force Speed for Lightning, Madness, or hybrid for both does not have any protection against being rooted or slowed. That is only available in the Corruption tree. It is too far up to spec into to do a Hybrid any good or pure spec’ing in the other trees. You'd know this if you really understood and played the Sorcerer/Sage exclusively. Cleansing rarely works when rooted by a leaper, when you're leaped on by 2, forget it. You're not going any where unless you're specced heals. Again, you'd know this if you actually spent time playing the class.

 

Force Armor & Static Barrier are important defensive abilities for these light armor wearing, no damage mitigation ACs. Now to make matters worse, 2.0 cuts in half the amount of damage these bubble will stop. I could go on, but I know it will fall on deaf ears because "I'm a baddie, I don't know anything, and I’m a clicker and keyboard turner." You on the other hand, are the elite of the leet! You know it all just like all those elitist professionals you hang out with in your elitist clique. Professional PvPers are the bane of MMO's existence and ruin the fun for casual players because of their self-centered, self-righteous, egotistical delusions of self-importance as Gods in gaming.

 

Just so you know we are putting together a team for ranked. We will join in, take our lumps, get face rolled, obliterated, and have our arses handed to us. And I’ll be there with my hybrid Sorcerer too. I don’t care how bad you and others think this AC is I’ll be there to support my team in achieving our objectives and goals to win. The difference between us and the rest of you, we do not live and breathe PvP as the ‘only’ thing this game has to offer. Win or Lose were there to have fun, regardless of the outcome. And you know something; we won’t be super queuing in the normal WZs like the other professional guilds to do complete their dailies and weeklies. We won’t subject PuGs to same thing those guilds do. So you keep on doing what you like to do with your ‘leet’ brothers and sisters. How very noble of you.

 

/facepalm

 

first of all, you called out THREE guilds:

Prime Defense is no better than LD50 or QQ super queuing in a normal WZs.

none of whom superQ.

 

you faced the same ppl in b2b WZs because you were in the same rotation as them. 8 ppl finish and re-Q on both sides, everyone else is in a WZ, the same 8 face each other in new WZ. it happens all the time.

 

when a mara leaps to you, you PUNT HIM. he's not a jugg. he just burned his closer. punt. turn. root is over (it's only 1s) sprint away. there you go. 2 maras leap to you? all the better. that's 2 leaps burned. done. escaped. no bubble stun. you ARE not good. you don't heed advice. you jump to conclusions. be honest, how many assassins/shadows have you reported for hacking because your stun didn't work when they weren't full resolve? (pst: it's a rhetorical question. don't answer. )

Edited March 12, 2013 by foxmob

[thefishdude]

I however can see that from a healers perspective, the ability to put a stun bubble on your healing target just might be very strong giving those healers some extra time to get another heal in.

 

Here's where the argument falls apart. The bubble (in Live) is in the DPS tree and isn't meant for a Healer, unless they go a crazy hybrid spec; so, making the argument that it's for healers is just plain twisting the facts.

 

Before the change that created the bubble fiasco we currently have, players could bubble everyone. It's just that those bubbles weren't HARD STUNS. Someone at BW mistakenly thought adding another HARD STUN, which barely filled your resolve, was a good idea and they NEVER thought about the unintended consequences.

 

 

The changes in 2.0 are just fixing a mess that shouldn't have been here in the first place. Goodbye bubble stuns.....you won't be missed.

[_Pryor_]

 

the changes in 2.0 are just fixing a mess that shouldn't have been here in the first place. Goodbye bubble stuns.....you won't be missed.

 

^^^This^^^

[Rynis]

And you know something; we won’t be super queuing in the normal WZs like the other professional guilds to do complete their dailies and weeklies.

 

Can't tell if serious.

 

 

On topic:

 

Bubble stun as it is on live needs to have resolve adjusted.

 

Being "slightly inconvenienced by a stun" is an understatement. Playing a match and being stunned for half of it is not fun. Good riddance to it in 2.0.

Edited March 12, 2013 by Rynis

[Joesixxpack]

Keep Bubblestun as on live.

 

My thoughts.

[islander]

Once again, nobody wants to take away the ability for the caster to use the bubble on himself (or herself). It's just the caster's ability to bubble the entire Op's group with a HARD STUN that barely fills up the resolve bar.

 

The fact it doesnt fill resolve properly, and the fact its clickable off for instant stun on demand, are the real problems with group bubblestuns imo.

 

Don't get me wrong, I don't mind seeing it gone as a group cast. I'm more annoyed smash was all but kept as it is in live on 2.0, in light of the critical hit/damage nerfs coming in 2.0

Edited March 12, 2013 by islander

[JediMasterSLC]

Play a melee DPS in rated and be CCed for 75% of the game, then tell me it shouldn't be removed (except for the person placing bubble obvi). Edited March 12, 2013 by JediMasterSLC

[Lelvannia]

/

when a mara leaps to you, you PUNT HIM. he's not a jugg. he just burned his closer. punt. turn. root is over (it's only 1s) sprint away. there you go.

Great plan. Except, when you try to sprint away you get choked. Or intimidating roar'd. Or obliterate'd. Either way you watch force speed expire while you're unable to act. You're now out of your 2 survivability cooldowns, 18s to go on one and 20s on the other, while the mara is some 6 or 7 meters away, closing fast, free to navigate, and possibly with one leap still off cooldown. What do I do next?

[Joesixxpack]

You know what's great:rak_02: The NC South node zerg when my GS is wearing a stun bubble.

 

Jog around behind the bunker, pop bubble on reds, drop flyby and an incendiary nade, then FB and snare anyone who breaks out of the stun and watch them burn. Or substitute NC South with any key area on any map, it works nicely at all of them.

 

Team Stunbubble is obviously a vital tool for healer survival as so many have mentioned, and should be kept as is on live.

Edited March 12, 2013 by Joesixxpack

[cycao]

Team Stunbubble is obviously a vital tool for healer survival as so many have mentioned, and should be kept as is on live.

 

My assassin disagrees.

[Neoforcer]

Bubble stun should be nerfed sorry guys sung it as a tactic by clicking the bubble off to stun some one is not a intended use that's why it getting nerfed. No amount of you QQ will change that

[Joesixxpack]

My assassin disagrees.

 

Pssst...

 

 

That post was facetious.

 

[cycao]

Pssst...

 

 

That post was facetious.

 

I'm going to invent a sarcasm font because when I am tired at work I just cant tell the difference.

[Joesixxpack]

I'm going to invent a sarcasm font because when I am tired at work I just cant tell the difference.

 

The coherence and quality of my posts degrades as the day goes on. And not because I'm at work braindead and staring at the clock.

 

Edit: Actually it is.

Edited March 12, 2013 by Joesixxpack

[cycao]

The coherence and quality of my posts degrades as the day goes on. And not because I'm at work braindead and staring at the clock.

 

Edit: Actually it is.

 

See I took down my clock about a year ago.

[Fearo]

So it would seem some of you don't understand the severe impact bubblestun has on organised pvp, you can do nothing as a melee who needs to maintain the close proximity to do damage, in conjunction with the Seismic grenades, it provides a team with endless CC and cannot be stopped in anyway, it needs to be put under control and there for the simple way of doing it would indeed be of moving bubblestun far up the tree or simply removing it.

[_Kayko_]

No. Bubblestun needs a nerf. Sorry.

get used to it working like it is supposed to....

Bubblestun was the stupidest thing ever put into this game. Nothing else even comes close.

Bubblestun needs to be nerfed, I like the way Bioware is taking it.

Bubble stuns are the most asinine thing they have ever implemented in this game (when it comes to stuns).

No need to get used to it. Its going away in 2.0. Get used to not having it.

its much needed nerf

A poorly designed mechanic.

Bubblestun is ridiculously broken and more over, its presence negates a number of different short range classes from being viable

Bubble stun should be nerfed sorry guys sung it as a tactic by clicking the bubble off to stun some one is not a intended use that's why it getting nerfed. No amount of you QQ will change that

........................Oh my, these are all such compelling arguments on the reasons that bubblestun should have been changed. I can now see the error in my judgement and understand exactly why Bioware is making the change....................

 

Umm, ya.... Ok then. Well, I do enjoy reading on how people complain that it is an extra stun for the entire team yet miss that whole "team" word. You do understand that you can has bubblestun too? Though really, does a bubblestun spec player mean it's an auto win against a team with out it?

 

Even better, the mention that it is a counter against melee. So, it is ok that melee continue to have very high mobility on targets to keep doing damage vs a target that has to eventually STOP MOVING to CAST to do any sort of damage or attempt to keep their entire team alive. Melee vs Melee, this isn't an issue since the target would normally remain in position to continue to attack. Lets add that the bubble when broke by an at range attack has absolutely no effect and is wasted all together. Last I checked, Melee classes have a ranged attack that is often does a high enough amount of damage to break a bubble. So perhaps when you see a bubble go up, you move out of range to break the bubble and run back in? I don't know, just a thought.. ya know, learn the mechanic, learn to defend against it, learn to react to the player.. aka l2p?? It's one mechanic that can be rendered useless if treated correctly, bubblestun can be avoided. Also, if players want to manually remove the bubble for the stun, in those 4 seconds ( assuming not a single attack or DoT goes out) do you really think that you will be capped on? A single smash is going to have a much larger affect on a warzone if your team is all grouped up to eat a bubblestun.

 

Without the ability to place bubblestun on your team, there is virtually no reason to have a choice in the middle talent tree for a sage/sorc. The damage output by the talents is not enough to make them a reasonable target. Allowing them to free cast takes the focus of perhaps half a healer.

 

To bring back the whole "team" word. It takes multiple players to be able to lock down a single melee class with the bubblestun/cheap grenade combo. Even in a 2v1 situation, you come out ahead for your team by creating a player advantage for the rest of the team

The bubblestun argument has never been about team play, it is all about melee play. Melee already gets additional damage coefficients due to expected travel distance and downtime, getting increased movement abilities, though that isn't good enough. Spending months of complaining using the same reasons as quoted above to get an ability that was avoidable removed. I believe that Bioware simply got fed up with the sheer lack of actual argument towards the ability and have made the changes to clean up the forums a little bit.

[foxmob]

Great plan. Except, when you try to sprint away you get choked. Or intimidating roar'd. Or obliterate'd. Either way you watch force speed expire while you're unable to act. You're now out of your 2 survivability cooldowns, 18s to go on one and 20s on the other, while the mara is some 6 or 7 meters away, closing fast, free to navigate, and possibly with one leap still off cooldown. What do I do next?

choke doesn't work beyond 10m (same with roar and, iirc, oblit). I punt them away all the time, on both a sin and a mando. punt and sprint works just fine.

 

edit: you're on a sorc/sage. you can cleanse his stuff. if you're watching force speed expire while you sit there, you're doing it wrong. he has one abil, force choke, that you can't cleanse (cuz you're stunned), and frankly, you shouldn't be caught inside of 10m right out of a punt anyway.

Edited March 13, 2013 by foxmob

[Crujido]

Since everybody plays marauder/sin lets just make it so sage/sorc has no kiting ability and no way to run away.

 

How much more does melee need? lol.

Squishiest class in the game and melee classes are having a hard time fighting them?

[pyradius]

Making it apply the stun to self only would have been enough really, the breaking on dmg is simply weak and unlike the bulk of stun abilities in the game.

 

In any event, I don't care personally, as I will be going back to full Seer (vs. the 23 / 18 Seer hybrid spec currently running) in 2.0, where it would appear I will have even more survivability than this hybrid build.

 

Upon switching builds, I think I'll miss losing the immobilize on my knockbacks more than stun bubble personally.

Edited March 13, 2013 by pyradius

[LanceCorporalDan]

........................Oh my, these are all such compelling arguments on the reasons that bubblestun should have been changed. I can now see the error in my judgement and understand exactly why Bioware is making the change....................

 

Umm, ya.... Ok then. Well, I do enjoy reading on how people complain that it is an extra stun for the entire team yet miss that whole "team" word. You do understand that you can has bubblestun too? Though really, does a bubblestun spec player mean it's an auto win against a team with out it?

 

Even better, the mention that it is a counter against melee. So, it is ok that melee continue to have very high mobility on targets to keep doing damage vs a target that has to eventually STOP MOVING to CAST to do any sort of damage or attempt to keep their entire team alive. Melee vs Melee, this isn't an issue since the target would normally remain in position to continue to attack. Lets add that the bubble when broke by an at range attack has absolutely no effect and is wasted all together. Last I checked, Melee classes have a ranged attack that is often does a high enough amount of damage to break a bubble. So perhaps when you see a bubble go up, you move out of range to break the bubble and run back in? I don't know, just a thought.. ya know, learn the mechanic, learn to defend against it, learn to react to the player.. aka l2p?? It's one mechanic that can be rendered useless if treated correctly, bubblestun can be avoided. Also, if players want to manually remove the bubble for the stun, in those 4 seconds ( assuming not a single attack or DoT goes out) do you really think that you will be capped on? A single smash is going to have a much larger affect on a warzone if your team is all grouped up to eat a bubblestun.

 

Without the ability to place bubblestun on your team, there is virtually no reason to have a choice in the middle talent tree for a sage/sorc. The damage output by the talents is not enough to make them a reasonable target. Allowing them to free cast takes the focus of perhaps half a healer.

 

To bring back the whole "team" word. It takes multiple players to be able to lock down a single melee class with the bubblestun/cheap grenade combo. Even in a 2v1 situation, you come out ahead for your team by creating a player advantage for the rest of the team

The bubblestun argument has never been about team play, it is all about melee play. Melee already gets additional damage coefficients due to expected travel distance and downtime, getting increased movement abilities, though that isn't good enough. Spending months of complaining using the same reasons as quoted above to get an ability that was avoidable removed. I believe that Bioware simply got fed up with the sheer lack of actual argument towards the ability and have made the changes to clean up the forums a little bit.

 

"My spec is fine, l2p nubz"

 

Bw has already acknowledged that bubble isn't working the way as intended. It working on the faster is fine, on everyone else.. Just no..

Edited March 13, 2013 by LanceCorporalDan

[dcgregorya]

Since everybody plays marauder/sin lets just make it so sage/sorc has no kiting ability and no way to run away.

 

How much more does melee need? lol.

Squishiest class in the game and melee classes are having a hard time fighting them?

 

The problem most certainly isn't the sorc. The OP seems to neglect that he can cast his bubble on a marauder - so that once you do defend yourself from said marauder, his bubble pops and now you are stunned/rooted.

 

No one has a problem with lightning sorc having bubble stun for themselves, they have a problem with the entire enemy team having it every 20 seconds. It makes that spec mandatory to have on your team and makes it so that various specs like scrapper and tactics vanguard just aren't viable because the bubble pops break the rotation.

[BobyDigital]

no for the love of god i wont even play on live right now lol, we dont want to hold our eyes every 3 seconds sorry esp in ranked when its coordinated

[Harsisus]

In a particular stream, someone put up the argument that bubblestun is "OP" then continued on with a video link. So, with that, I present this evidence of how "overpowered" bubblestun is.

 

For those who do not wish to watch the video, it is of a 4's premade mostly against what appears to be primary pug groups. 2 healers (one member BS spec) and 2 dps. These people are actually using bubble offensively and manually removing the bubble for the stun along with doing good target switching to allow the full stun effect to work.

Only once during the entire video (multiple clips of different warzones) does this team actually take an objective. Multiple occasions they out number the people they are against and still do not manage to make a kill or complete an objective with this tactic.

In fact, other videos that they show that do not use BS spec, they seem to be performing better. So with that, BS spec appears to be handicap for the teams that have it.

 

I know many people will continue to go with the "OP" argument, though really, you just want to QQ cause you are slightly inconvenienced by a stun, I propose that Bioware puts in a hacky sack or perhaps a dance dance rev style warzone for you that don't wish to actually have to fight or perhaps having your character die in a warzone.

 

In conclusion, Bubblestun as it stands on live is not overpowered. It doesn't need to be changed. It is not a free win in the slightest for teams that have it. It takes a lot of work to maintain bubblestun and should remain as it stands for those who are skilled enough to use it as effectively as possible. Changing the ability in the manner that they are just deters people from having a choice in their play style. No point in herding more people into specific cookie cutter specs because the majority can not differentiate between strong and annoying.

 

As long as Rage Smash continues to put out 7-10k crits, I will continue to use Bubblestun.

 

Deal with it.

Edited March 13, 2013 by Harsisus