Boansaw Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 (edited) If you honestly watched this video and don't agree with any of his points it only proves your incompetence. I thought there would be some i disagree with, but they were all VERY basic, must knows, for any pvp'er. Sorry but there isn't an alternative option to what this guy shows as mistakes. yeah, because stims don't go on cooldown right, you should always have those on! Good video, but it assumes a lot of stuff without context. The capping examples were good, and the protection example was good. Guarding points is good. That's about 4 of the 15. The others are small errors that are situational at best. You aren't losing a match because your stim was on cooldown. Also in a PUG, if you're alone at a point, unless you have that incoming pretyped up, you're almost better served keeping the other team off the point - I type fast, but not 8 seconds fast. I rather see a 15 things to do right in a WZ. Edited January 28, 2013 by Boansaw wanted to add something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelodicSixNine Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 yeah, because stims don't go on cooldown right, you should always have those on! Stim on CD? What? You know he's talking about the stim which gives you main stat + power/defence, which lasts 2h? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carter_Mathis Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 #15- While I don't recommend it, you can do just fine unstimed in reg wzs, especially if you aren't Biochem. Additionally that Marauder was wearing a Saber Form....... it was Juyo Form..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
POPsi Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 +1: in hypergates, if you have at least 2 stealthers and you'd need a double cap don't go to the enemy pylon please because everyone and their mother will go back to defend making it close to impossible to cap. Let the stealthers deal with it if they are somewhat competent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCVAN Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 +1: in hypergates, if you have at least 2 stealthers and you'd need a double cap don't go to the enemy pylon please because everyone and their mother will go back to defend making it close to impossible to cap. Let the stealthers deal with it if they are somewhat competent. This so much. A random pug asked me to cap the enemy pylon and I said ok, let me wait until the last few seconds and I will sap and cap it with sleep dart and flash bang. He insisted that i needed to do it at the start of the round, and got so upset that him and a couple others came and tried to cap it themselves. Of course the enemies responded and came back to defend their pylon. My teammates kept coming back to feed the enemies points while i waited in stealth hoping they would go away. At the end of the match i got called the worst player ever and continued to get L2P whispers after the match was over. I dont think he quite understood how points are gained in AH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt_Beers Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 This so much. A random pug asked me to cap the enemy pylon and I said ok, let me wait until the last few seconds and I will sap and cap it with sleep dart and flash bang. He insisted that i needed to do it at the start of the round, and got so upset that him and a couple others came and tried to cap it themselves. Of course the enemies responded and came back to defend their pylon. My teammates kept coming back to feed the enemies points while i waited in stealth hoping they would go away. At the end of the match i got called the worst player ever and continued to get L2P whispers after the match was over. I dont think he quite understood how points are gained in AH. I was trying to mezz someone while in AH (I believe we were trying to recover a lost node) but I had my instant lift ready but I could use it because 2 sages and one smuggler were AoEing the living crap out of the whole area. That kind of makes it worse because anyone of those others could have also mezzed but they were so concerned with killing him with their lame AoE's that we didn't recover before his buddies showed up, there was only one guy there to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ybini Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 This so much. A random pug asked me to cap the enemy pylon and I said ok, let me wait until the last few seconds and I will sap and cap it with sleep dart and flash bang. He insisted that i needed to do it at the start of the round, and got so upset that him and a couple others came and tried to cap it themselves. Of course the enemies responded and came back to defend their pylon. My teammates kept coming back to feed the enemies points while i waited in stealth hoping they would go away. At the end of the match i got called the worst player ever and continued to get L2P whispers after the match was over. I dont think he quite understood how points are gained in AH. I think thats probably the main issue, they don't know that they recap it, the gain is lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rendolphe Posted January 28, 2013 Author Share Posted January 28, 2013 (edited) #15- While I don't recommend it, you can do just fine unstimed in reg wzs, especially if you aren't Biochem. Additionally that Marauder was wearing a Saber Form....... it was Juyo Form..... You seriously need Stim for Warzone. The bonus damage you get from it is important. Why spend to much time gearing and optimize your character, but not use a Stim that give you easily 35-40 more Bonus Damage and almost 1% more crit ??? Gaining 35 to 40 Bonus damage (Force damage on my Sorc for this exemple) take few upgraded piece. Why being so cheap and not use the Stim ? Imagine if all your team don't have a Stim how less damage and Healing will be done ... Normal WZ : Use Rakata or the cheapest lvl 48 blue if you don't have Biochem Ranked WZ : Exotech Stim !!! BTW use of Adrenal and Warzone medpack is another thing that is important. If you have extra credit, buy few V-1 Seismic Grenade . All theses + can change a 1 vs 1 situation. And sometimes this 1 vs1 at node is crucial for the game ... ---- Mara speed buff (Transcendance / Predation). 50% without the skill tree or 80%. This speed buff is needed no matter what for Huttball and Alderaan. Huttball : Get the first ball ASAP Alderaan: Get position faster at mid and give possiblity to intercept oposite node or cap your node faster. 50% or 80% speed buff, I expect this speed should be pop at start. Edited January 28, 2013 by Rendolphe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordExozone Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Good video, except for the stim part. While they do provide an advantage and ideally you should use them, when not biochem they cost a significant amount of credits. The advantage they bring is not game changing either. I'd call not using stims a calculated risk by the player, and not a mistake. One mistake I would add but is a bit hard to show in a video, is people not using the warzone medpacs. I run into this regularly on my operative when I duel a node defender in Civil War so I can capture it; they go down without popping their medpac, which would have helped them hold out long enough for help to arrive. Another very obvious and easily remedied mistake is people guarding nodes standing too close to it. This allows stealth classes to CC & cap (as both the CC and the capture duration is 8 seconds). If the defender stands a bit further away, the stealth class will have to spend time moving to the node after he CC'ed the defender, which prevents him from capturing the node before the CC runs out. This so much. A random pug asked me to cap the enemy pylon and I said ok, let me wait until the last few seconds and I will sap and cap it with sleep dart and flash bang. He insisted that i needed to do it at the start of the round, and got so upset that him and a couple others came and tried to cap it themselves. Of course the enemies responded and came back to defend their pylon. My teammates kept coming back to feed the enemies points while i waited in stealth hoping they would go away. At the end of the match i got called the worst player ever and continued to get L2P whispers after the match was over. I dont think he quite understood how points are gained in AH. I've had this exact same situation occur on my operative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tekhiun Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 #17 PLaying heals without numbers on health bars #18 Seeing that there is a 2v6 fight and stay on node to get a kill instead of going to help the other node. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rendolphe Posted January 28, 2013 Author Share Posted January 28, 2013 #17 PLaying heals without numbers on health bars Numbers on health bar doesn't change anything or either the %. I did 1200 HPS one game without theses number UI mistake ... I rather call this preference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Any chance you can just list the 15 with the video for those who want to watch it? They aren't even listed in the video...you may explain them, but I don't have the ability to listen to it while at work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoFishing Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 (edited) Nice vid overall, loved the examples of tunnel vision! Your example for mistake #2 (failing to call incoming) was bad though. The mistake wasn't on the part of the defender, who was probably fighting for their lives at that point....it was on you and the other defenders on right who were fighting 5v2. Since on that map there is no spawn door for attackers, if you EVER outnumber the attackers, YOU are almost certainly making a mistake. Even if you are a defender in the spawn area, and want to know which way to drop down, you can use your map to identify who is on the side node and your raid frame to determine if they are taking damage. IMO, there should never be a need to call inc on that map. EDIT: And yes, 5 defenders v 2 attackers on any map means 2 should probably start heading to the other node...but this is particularly true in VS with no spawn door and quick run from spawn to node. Edited January 28, 2013 by NoFishing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master_Nate Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 (edited) I thought this video was a great tutorial for players who are always wondering how they can do better in a WZ. I am in total agreement on all points, including the use of a stim. I understand their cost too, it comes with time invested to have an alt to be able to craft this stuff but as with all things in MMOs that's part of the grind, at least for me. I have stim crafter, grenade crafter, and all buffs but that's how I play my sub. I work on getting anything and everything available to me in order to help get that win. Most experienced players use them and you should want to be equal to them at every available possibility, if not at an advantage...meaning those that neglect to go above and beyond. If you and your opponent are at equal level of skill and base stats and he has a stim on and you do not, then he is at a slight advantage. It may not make a difference but it also could so I think the OP is right, it is a "mistake" to not use one in a WZ. To me, and this is just my opinion, you should use a stim any time you feel like you are doing something you want to perform your best at whether it be an Operation, PvP, FP. By not using a stim you are limiting yourself some. Will it change the game?? Not always but it CAN make a difference. I think the problem people are having is the word "MISTAKE". While it's not necessarily a mistake, it definitely is one factor in putting your team lower than they could be. I wouldn't call anyone out for not having one but this stuff shows who on your team puts emphasis in their PvP performance. Do grenades make a difference? That is debatable but I have saved more caps and stopped/slowed more opponents with them than without. With a combination of ALL of these things, stim, grenades, medpacs, adrenals...you are putting yourself out there for a great game. Now think if everyone on your team used all of these things....now think about the outcome if none of them did. I'd rather be on a team of stim using, grenade throwing, medpac/adrenal poppers than not. For the record, this is just my opinion and I'm not discrediting anyone here who says not to use stims etc but as a competitive player I will use anything available to me to win, except hacks Great VID OP. I enjoyed the Bradley scenes too Edited January 28, 2013 by Master_Nate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daxy Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 re the buffs and stims... been doing a lot of lowbie pvp on alts and the "not buffing" out of the respawn is rampant as far as the stimming is concerned - sometimes (i have the purple skill stim just below the level of the rakata 2 hr) i hit my stim and it doesnt work-- i have to do it several times for it to take; and there are times (especially in voidstar when i have to race to stop a door cap after respawn) where i have to "not be stimmed" in order to have my "pewpew door cap stopper" ready to go the main point is someone who doesnt even buff or stim (at 50 for sure) is not cognizant enough for all the commotion in a pvp environment nice video Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rendolphe Posted January 28, 2013 Author Share Posted January 28, 2013 Any chance you can just list the 15 with the video for those who want to watch it? They aren't even listed in the video...you may explain them, but I don't have the ability to listen to it while at work. I will add today in description. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 I will add today in description. Thank you!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tekhiun Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Numbers on health bar doesn't change anything or either the %. I did 1200 HPS one game without theses number UI mistake ... I rather call this preference. It does make a difference, 50% on a health bar is very different to players based on gear and spec , and not to mention that you cant really tell if a player is above or below the critical 30% . If you dont have numbers you wont know who to prioritize, also doesnt really matter the numbers you got , what matters is if they are done effectively. Those hps could just have been you self healing yourself or focus healing only 1 player, which could be either detrimental or actually beneficial to your team depending on the situations you faced, so numbers only is not really a good metric of how well you did in a wz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebado Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Stims are not expensive. Looking at the GTN right now on The Bastion, there are blue Hyper-Battle stims of all variations except fortitude for 8k or just under. These last two hours. They persist through death. They cost less than a single quest. And this is at 9 a.m. server time. That seems like a good deal for 104 main stat and 43 power. I don't expect Exotech in normals, but even then those are only about 15 to 17k. I find it funny when people in warzones complain, "They are more geared then us" and they didn't even bother to use a cheap stim. Buffing is one of the more annoying issues. It's one of the reasons I treasure having all four buffs. Re: calling incs - It is absolutely the responsibility of a person guarding to call it out. Yes, there is time to do so. Further though, it is important to recognize obvious disadvantages as they are unfolding. The worst of this is Alderaan or Novarre, when you show up at mid only to have a 7 on 2 or 6 on 2, and your entire team spends valuable time chasing around a tank and his healer buddy. The other person should absolutely call inc in these cases, but the people in mid should also recognize that their huge advantage here is a huge disadvantage somewhere else. One important mistake is not knowing how the warzones work. I can understand this for a bit with newer players, but there's too many 50s who think Novarre operates like Alderaan (or the opposite), or think that AH operates like either of those. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rendolphe Posted January 28, 2013 Author Share Posted January 28, 2013 Any chance you can just list the 15 with the video for those who want to watch it? They aren't even listed in the video...you may explain them, but I don't have the ability to listen to it while at work. Updated in description Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islander Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 mistake #17 not hitting the leave war zone button when faced with premade vs. pug heals vs. no heals people in pve gear on your team you elected to play a merc and havent learned that you are hurting the whole team too many mercs on you team when none of them are heals and many more I probably have forgotten. True story below, happened last night. I solo queue'd and joined a PUG group. Opposing us? 4 guildmates who participate in our ranked team rotation. They were on Mumble. We should've gotten drilled. Right? Lost Alderaan 40-0. The less people who are terrible at their job, the less this'll matter. There was another warzone, same map, where I was in a 4 man, with another 4 man from another guild. We should've wiped the Republic...right? Wrong. The other 4 man were 3 terribads. Grouping together doesn't make you that much better. It improves you, but doesn't prevent good WZ players from using limited text to communicate and win. I do it ALL the time in Ops chat. Just keep it simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAMuttoni Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Not using a stim isn't that bad.... It helps but it won't change much. It's a matter of skill, not more stats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitering Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Buffing after leaving the spawn is a big deal, but also the biggest thing you can do when you get into a fighting zone, unless a CC or interrupt is necessary (like the flamethrower ********s), then there is little you can do more valuable than adding 5% of whatever your buff does to EVERY friendly there. Boom, 20% or more to your teams damage, crit chance, whatever. Far better than your 1 meager attack, and it's instant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dego-harmonium Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 many folks have all of the buffs, myself included you should always flash your buffs when you can if you have them all. But some times we are all guilty of not re-buffing yourself its usually when i am trying to catch a open door after i die. #17 do not stand in front of the console in Novare when its time to cap the node, you should also train yourself to glance up at the warzone scoreboard constantly in NC, I mean its still unaccaptable to get back capped in CW/AC but i think we have all had it happen to us once ;P there is no excuse in NC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black-Cell Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Some of the points are debatable, but overall very valuable information. I find it interesting that this game has been out for slightly over a year and these very basic mistakes still occur (not just with F2P!). I think your video was well done and very tactful, keep up the good work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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