Pysces Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Will AP drop the front loaded burst into someone that Pyro does if it got buffed? No, I don't propose or want that at all, because then it would be the same problem all over again. "NERF AP! TOO MUCH BURST!". No. I propose a simple increase in damage output, that is all. Simple. And yes, that would seriously make it a more viable spec. I do well, but not well enough to compete with the output Pyros/Maras/SIns/Juggs dish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyDragonflame Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Pyro powerful and strong class, but dont OVERpowered - snipers, sins, rage juggs, rage maras kill them 1 vs 1, and lucky good cons operative and probably good madness sorc can kill too, cuz flame dots can easy cleanesed and (except 1x 4x secound stun and 1x 2.5 sec aoe stun) they have not any control - no any stuns/mezzs/roots and no defensive abilities except only one 25% damage reduction shield. No push. No speed buffs. No self-healing. No stealth. So, just simply stun them and kill them. Their prime role is tank-killers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycao Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Pyro powerful and strong class, but dont OVERpowered - snipers, sins, rage juggs, rage maras kill them 1 vs 1, and lucky good cons operative and probably good madness sorc can kill too, cuz flame dots can easy cleanesed and (except 1x 4x secound stun and 1x 2.5 sec aoe stun) they have not any control - no any stuns/mezzs/roots and no defensive abilities except only one 25% damage reduction shield. No push. No speed buffs. No self-healing. No stealth. So, just simply stun them and kill them. Their prime role is tank-killers. Why does everyone go to 1v1 when talking about any class balance issues? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyDragonflame Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Why does everyone go to 1v1 when talking about any class balance issues? Cuz 1 vs 1 or 2 vs 2 pretty often happens on wz. Big zerg fight in one place and little fights in others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invictusthetaru Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 And for those complaining about survivability for the class, they don't have more defensives because they get 2 hard stuns and do great damage from 10m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Never_Hesitate Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Cuz 1 vs 1 or 2 vs 2 pretty often happens on wz. Big zerg fight in one place and little fights in others. Do you play other wz's than I do? In the wz's I play there are rarely 1vs1 maybe a bit more often 2vs2 but to look at the balance from that point of view to balance a wz is completely wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Never_Hesitate Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 And for those complaining about survivability for the class, they don't have more defensives because they get 2 hard stuns and do great damage from 10m. They still have way more def cd's than the sorc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsmymillertime Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 For people thinking that powers/vangs are not overpowered I suggest you roll a sage/sorc and duel with one of them. Either successfully kite them at 12-17m or agree into this that the sage does not stop moving and the vanguard even if he has the chance of coming closer to 10m he won't. Come back and post your results. The only reason they are overlooked is because smash and bubble stuns are much worse at the moment. When and if these are fixed, don't worry the attention will come back to powers/vangs. just because 1 class is better in 1v1 versus another class, does not mean they are OP. Snipers own Juggers and have enough CD to take out a PT. Some classes are great 1v1 specs while others are great AOE or control specs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vimm Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 So...by tweaking the AP tree to increase output would not help...with damage output? Are you trolling? Clearly, by increasing damage output in a tree that needs an increase for viability would help it, and a help that those interested in or play AP would be pleased with. Lmao. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyDragonflame Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Do you play other wz's than I do? In the wz's I play there are rarely 1vs1 maybe a bit more often 2vs2 but to look at the balance from that point of view to balance a wz is completely wrong. You are never defend/attack node/door/pylon/bunker, when all other team fight in other node/door/pylon/bunker? Never left 1 after attack, when from stealth appears new enemies? I dunno what game do you play dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Never_Hesitate Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 You are never defend/attack node/door/pylon/bunker, when all other team fight in other node/door/pylon/bunker? Never left 1 after attack, when from stealth appears new enemies? I dunno what game do you play dude. But most of the fights are done in the middle, so why should it be balanced around this special situation? Some classes/speccs are better in fighting 1vs1 and some are better in mass zergs. (With my Vengance Juggernaut I do often guard the outer turrent/bunke/pylon) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danapa Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 i play one indeed its the only character i have at lvl 50...im min/maxed and NO i dont crit all the time for 5k on good geared played i hit for 4,5k+ more with HIB and 4k or so with plastique my crit chance as i stack power/surge its pretty low so doble crits barely happens even with the +25% crit buff so stop lying and saying that we crit all the time for 5k with all our abilities also as i stack power surge thus my accuracy is nule my High impact bolt my strongest move its oftenly dodged or parried specially by sorcerors wich have 5% more chance than other classes and my dots are cleansed making me waste ammo....i recomend anyone who think the class is OP to play one at lvl 50 it can even be frustrating since you jusy have one sad defensive cooldown and have no utility all you can do is damage and if the other team is good they wont let you do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megatfx Posted January 21, 2013 Author Share Posted January 21, 2013 Stream is backup!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megatfx Posted January 21, 2013 Author Share Posted January 21, 2013 (edited) i play one indeed its the only character i have at lvl 50...im min/maxed and NO i dont crit all the time for 5k on good geared played i hit for 4,5k+ more with HIB and 4k or so with plastique my crit chance as i stack power/surge its pretty low so doble crits barely happens even with the +25% crit buff so stop lying and saying that we crit all the time for 5k with all our abilities also as i stack power surge thus my accuracy is nule my High impact bolt my strongest move its oftenly dodged or parried specially by sorcerors wich have 5% more chance than other classes and my dots are cleansed making me waste ammo....i recomend anyone who think the class is OP to play one at lvl 50 it can even be frustrating since you jusy have one sad defensive cooldown and have no utility all you can do is damage and if the other team is good they wont let you do it. I'm playing one at 50 right now, and with 1396 expertise I'm so ridiculously tanky. Between Warzone Adrenal, 1396 expertise, and healers I'm night unkillable. This class is *********** OP, watch my stream. I have 643.5 Ranged bonus damage, 999.5 Tech bonus damage with 1396 expertise, I get 5k crits all the time, even on fully geared players. Edited January 21, 2013 by Megatfx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerain Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 No, I don't propose or want that at all, because then it would be the same problem all over again. "NERF AP! TOO MUCH BURST!". No. I propose a simple increase in damage output, that is all. Simple. And yes, that would seriously make it a more viable spec. I do well, but not well enough to compete with the output Pyros/Maras/SIns/Juggs dish. And you probably still won't because it's the burst/spike output that you want for your rated team. It's the ability to kill someone effectively like they do. You use that front loaded burst to pressure people down and put pressure on the healers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerain Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 They still have way more def cd's than the sorc. ****** kolto overload and the 25% damage reduction shield... sprint, knock back, that new self heal, and bubble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycao Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 I'm playing one at 50 right now, and with 1396 expertise I'm so ridiculously tanky. Between Warzone Adrenal, 1396 expertise, and healers I'm night unkillable. This class is *********** OP, watch my stream. I have 643.5 Ranged bonus damage, 999.5 Tech bonus damage with 1396 expertise, I get 5k crits all the time, even on fully geared players. Yeah I don't even bother running full expertise anymore since being light armor aside from shroud and deflection I am the squish on the specs I play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megatfx Posted January 21, 2013 Author Share Posted January 21, 2013 Can you guys hear the music and the commentary? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerain Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Yeah I don't even bother running full expertise anymore since being light armor aside from shroud and deflection I am the squish on the specs I play. What? You should be able to get medium to heavy armor via talents and procs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerain Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 Are you just solo queueing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycao Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 What? You should be able to get medium to heavy armor via talents and procs! Not the specs that I run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlagaNerezza Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 But most of the fights are done in the middle, so why should it be balanced around this special situation? Some classes/speccs are better in fighting 1vs1 and some are better in mass zergs. (With my Vengance Juggernaut I do often guard the outer turrent/bunke/pylon) The reason why powertech is not a problem for me is they can be shutdown. Are they good? Absolutely. Countering them requires you to understand the burst limitations they have. Because its single target burst guards and taunts are far more effective especially when you can see the big armored guy moving in and getting ready to burst. They are very much subject to slows and roots making them soft targets especially if they are closing. They do have a harder time managing heat than a marauder or juggie who seem to have access to a limitless supply of rage. They where more OP when they had more range as it was easier for them to setup and close, but since that nerf it got harder to play. They have to close and in that range melee range. It's not hard to get caught or be brought out of position from the rest of your team. I know many teams that will yank that attacker and push back the enemy healers and they cannot survive like a juggie, marauder, assassin who can escape far more easily from that very troubled and frequently occurring scenario. They lack some of the control of other specs as well. I will say that a guarded, healed powertech will put a hurt on. However, my assassin with force shroud doesn't seem to be overly bothered and you can almost always see it coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pysces Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 And you probably still won't because it's the burst/spike output that you want for your rated team. It's the ability to kill someone effectively like they do. You use that front loaded burst to pressure people down and put pressure on the healers. You keep continually neglecting to acknowledge the point that the Pyro PT is seen and demonstrably is OP with it's output. Yes, I would like to compete competitively in ranked games with AP, hence my points I made about damage being increased to make that happen and the class viable. You really tend to ignore what one says, as evidenced by your responses corresponding with my points...That's not an insult, but an observation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zunayson Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 I think I should roll on pot5 if you don't have smashers in your rwzs. We'd make you all unsub Unsub? No, that's only for the genuinely overpowered classes like operatives. Balanced classes like smashmonkies are well created and have no such ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerain Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 You keep continually neglecting to acknowledge the point that the Pyro PT is seen and demonstrably is OP with it's output. Yes, I would like to compete competitively in ranked games with AP, hence my points I made about damage being increased to make that happen and the class viable. You really tend to ignore what one says, as evidenced by your responses corresponding with my points...That's not an insult, but an observation. But your AP is not going to put out the front ended burst and spike like they can now will it? Even if pyro pt was nerfed do you think AP would replace it? Probably not, after looking at the tree and going over it, def not. AP wouldn't replace pyro at all. If anything will replace pyro pt if/when it gets nerfed it will probably be deception sin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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