Appearnace Tab Is Needed....Badly

[boobaffet]

Right... so if you had an appearance tab, you wouldn't have to worry about just equipping oranges, you could wear other gear for stats even if it's not modifiable, because it might be better than the mods you have, and you could still have an appearance you like. See my point?

 

How can you make us choose beetween the two bioware .

We should not have to make choice, just give us everything all the time.

 

 

Seriously tho, when i find a piece of gear thats an upgrade but it looks really ugly i might not equip it depending on the stat difference.

 

So what if i loose a bit of stat to look bad ***? its not as if my dps is parsed or anything,i am not level 50 and raiding , no need to maximise my stat. It just makes the game more challenging.

 

Sure its fun to have everything you want in life but rpg makes you choose beetween something or something else a lot. No choice make it no fun

Edited December 21, 2011 by boobaffet

[Volion]

I would also like to see an appearance tab, hopefully it will be added.

[Negivv]

As much as I loved the A-tab in every other MMO I played, I believe that what is needed here is improve the curent system that allows for visual customization. Mesh wise, and I repeat, MESH wise (for those who don't know tech speak is the shape of the model) there is really a low variety when it comes to crafted gear. I have armortech on one of my toons and from level 11 to 50 gear I only have 3 different meshes available for crafting (blueprints from the trainer). The only thing that differs is the color pattern. Which is what makes the difference on a good 75 to 80% of the gear ingame. And is something I really believe needs improvement from the Devs.

 

Coming to moddable gear. It's true, it requires some work to get what you want and sometimes it can be a guessgame, but I believe in general works. What doesn't work, is the fact that color patterns are locked and do not mix up together on a good 60% of cases, lowering the appearance customizability a lot. If I want to create a certain look, I shouldn't be forced to wear what the Devs created as a set, to have a nice looking set. I've tried mix-matching stuff between crafted stuff, some loot and PvP armors (Yeah it was a pain running around all the time with the dressing room up on screen to not loose the apperances) and what I found out is that as much as with mesh models things would lok good together, most of the time color patterns were completely off and few times slightly asimmetrical but still decent, going down to really very few mixes that were really good looking overall. That is something I believe can be easily solved by implementing a colour costumization system, and since it's something BW is working on "in some form" we only will need to wait.

 

And on the long argument of "you peeps just want everything handed to you from the start" against "I don't want everything at the start, I want something simple" I just want to remember everyone this: on SWG (since it's being called for comparison many times) post-NGE you werent able to wear armor until lvl22, but then apart from some armor that was level or class restricted because of the stats or game design decisions (like the Boba Fett style Mando armor for the latter), from lvl22 on you could wear any mesh variation of armor your class allowed you to from that level until cap. The great thing was, you could mix and match as you pleased because there were armor coloring kits (crafted, so making crafters needed and a plus source of income for them) allowing you to look cool whenever.

other MMOs don't do that and keep the armor mesh variations hard-linked into lvl ranges, so you would still need to level up to wear a specific appearance (meaning waiting to look exactly as you wanted to) but on the road to that, since you can dye the armor as you want to you can still look good and not like you dressed up hastily in the morning with the lights off without looking. Which is something lacking in TOR. Doing any possible colour variation for items is a really daunting task for the devs, not to mention it requires an absurd amount of resource files put into the game because each variation would need to be a standalone item. With a dye system one has the same result, if not better, since the files are a lot fewer and the players have almost complete control on the look.

 

So to make a long story short: an A-Tab would be cool, but improving on the currernt moddable system by combining it with a type of dye system would make visual customization a lot more interesting and enjoyable for everyone (yes, even those who claim they don't care).

 

Sorry for the wall of text, but I love SW, I love this game, and am an Hardcore RPer, so character customization is something I keep to my heart.

Edited December 21, 2011 by Negivv

[darthgroond]

I'm going to add my approval for this. I'd quite like to continue wearing my epic chest piece because the armour I have with better stats is essentially a tight t-shirt, like a football player would wear under his jersey. Hideous. The epic is exatcly that, epic. It looks good and also like something a Sith might wear, not a Hummell training top.

[Negivv]

And I actually forgot...about the blueprints you can get through the GTN: I actually don't remember a single MMO where you could know how an item actually looked like unless you already learned the recipe for it (speaking of loot/drop onse ofc). The difference here is that despite all the long beta there are still very few of those blueprints about so almost nobody know what the items coming from them look like, wether in other MMOs that have been running for years almost everyone does. Edited December 21, 2011 by Negivv

[Kashaan]

Yup. We thought their "mod system" would work in place of an Appearance tab (mostly because it was described to be such). However, it doesn't offer nearly enough choice.

 

Now, if they added an "Appearance mod" to equipment, that could work. But yes, an appearance tab is direly needed.

[VisionStorm]

I thought this thread had been burried into oblivion and fogotten already

(sorry if I missed a lot of stuff cuz Its too many pages back to when I last posted )

 

just gonna quote this I found while trying to catch up for now:

 

I sit here and watch my wife playing rift today. She spent HOURS doing nothing but arranging her wardrobe items recoloring them and making her toon look just the way she wanted..

When i ask her if she wants to play swtor with me she say NO. She has watched me for months in beta and says since she cant make a character look like she wants here she has zero interest.

People can make fun of this type of player all they want but to ignore a large part of the market is silly.

 

Oh and she is no where close to alone in her views. She was in vent doing this with about 20 other players. All of them helping her out with dye's and stuff. She went nuts when one of them directed her to a vender that had a bikini top! that would match her bottoms style wise.

 

You bring a good point here. I play Champions Online regularly and I spent hours working on different costumes for my character. Its like an extra layer of the gameplay itself. Some people PvP, other people make costumes.

 

I tried WoW for a while years ago and never "clicked" with that game precisely because of the limited customization. I simply didn't stay long, then went off looking for games that specifically had "appearance customization" (making google searchs for appearance customization MMO's), till I found City of Heroes and never went back to WoW. Later Champions Online was release, and it had even more extensive appearance customization options than CoH, so I went there instead.

 

Now I play Champions Online regularly and I'm mostly here taking a vacation to play a different game for a while. But I continue to play CO, and will return there because it currently offers the best appearance customization of any MMO.

 

Adding more/better appearance customization features to this game will subtact nothing from the game experience of those that don't want it, but it would add a lot to those that do. And those of us that are trully interested in appearance customization will not remain in a game that doesn't have it. So there is no way adding more customization could possibly hurt this game, and it will help it in the long run.

Edited December 21, 2011 by VisionStorm

[AeonWeapon]

No choice make it no fun

 

Which is why I want more choice for appearance customizing lol

[boobaffet]

Which is why I want more choice for appearance customizing lol

 

this is not about more choice, this is about getting those choice faster.

 

the choice is lose some stat to look bad *** (who cares at low level) or min max your stat and look ugly

 

or find a moddable armor you like ( i know it may take till late 20 but hey.. you can always wear a normal chest that looks alright in the mean time)

 

 

Also (lol) for someone who can only play 1 or 2 hours a day you sure spend a lot of time on the forum:rolleyes:

[AeonWeapon]

Adding more/better appearance customization features to this game will subtact nothing from the game experience of those that don't want it, but it would add a lot to those that do. And those of us that are trully interested in appearance customization will not remain in a game that doesn't have it. So there is no way adding more customization could possibly hurt this game, and it will help it in the long run.

 

Exactly how I feel. Some people just refuse to see that this is very important to many of us.

 

At the very least for now I would at least like to have a way to change/match colors. Mismatched colors literally annoy me so much i grind my teeth looking at my character lol.

 

Also (lol) for someone who can only play 1 or 2 hours a day you sure spend a lot of time on the forum:rolleyes:

 

Yeah because I can stop into the forum now and then while at work

 

Also right now I'm on lunch break

Edited December 21, 2011 by AeonWeapon

[Vodalus]

Ok, I'm still two pages behind on catching up with this thread, but, I just can't stand it any longer.

 

Random does not equal "work".

 

Maintaining your orange gear once you have it is "work", as the holier-than-thou's love to toss about, but getting the an orange item that you like is random. The schematics for the appearances of the green items (blue and purple appearances are still an unknown; possibly unattainable) drop, at random, at some low-drop-rate interval from Underworld Trading.

Random does not equal choice.

 

All items being modable would be an appearance customization system, as customization requires choice. This system is not one of choice, it is one of random luck, and thus not an effective customization system.

[AeonWeapon]

That all makes perfect sense..... so I'm sure that someone will post against you lol.

 

Just asking for appearance to be flexible guys, to not have it be something to grind for. Should be able to take a few minutes, make a cool look, then get back to playing the actual game.

 

At least let me match the colors so I don't look like a mismatched clown. The argument people had for removing the "match colors" feature is just ridiculous. If you don't like a feature, don't use it, but don't take it away from those of us who DO like it.

Edited December 21, 2011 by AeonWeapon

[JediMasterRyanW]

Ok, I'm still two pages behind on catching up with this thread, but, I just can't stand it any longer.

 

Random does not equal "work".

 

Maintaining your orange gear once you have it is "work", as the holier-than-thou's love to toss about, but getting the an orange item that you like is random. The schematics for the appearances of the green items (blue and purple appearances are still an unknown; possibly unattainable) drop, at random, at some low-drop-rate interval from Underworld Trading.

Random does not equal choice.

 

All items being modable would be an appearance customization system, as customization requires choice. This system is not one of choice, it is one of random luck, and thus not an effective customization system.

 

Couldn't you just go on the GTN and buy orange stuff?

[VisionStorm]

What do you mean picking what you want to look ? Like a vendor giving away every single piece of gear ( with no stat) that you could use on apperence tab? If yes im kinda against that. If not : Then its the freakin same thing , but instead of looking for a regular gear you look for a moddable gear.

 

How do you even get your gear in those other game where there are apperence tab? The same way you will get the moddable gear in this game pretty much.

 

Suggestion: Champions Online, DCUO and City of Heroes are currently free to play (with a subscription option for additional features, such as extra character slots, increased money cap, etc. But you wont need those just to test this out). Star Trek online is on the way to become free to play as well (haven't check if they're done with transition already). Try any of those games and you'll see what we're talking about.

 

In champions online gear is called "upgrades". Its completely conceptual and doesn't affect appearance at all, only gives you stats. City of Heroes is similar, but gear is called something else (dont remember the name right now). In DCUO, gear unlocks additional appearance options, but you may use any appearance you have unlocked for any body secton (chest, gloves, legs, etc.).

 

Here's a break down of how it works I posted in another thread somewhere. Some of these points are relevant to this issue:

 

• Champions Online: Full on customization (including body and facial sliders) during and after character creation with the most extensive selection of costume pieces and custom options, can change anything except your gender. Costume changes require a "tailor" and cost in-game money. Name change available through microtransations.
  
• City of Heroes: Full on customization (including body and facial sliders) during and after character creation with very good (yet not as extensive as CO) selection of costume pieces and custom options, can change anything except your gender. Costume changes require a "tailor" and cost in-game money. Name change available through microtransations.
  
• Star Trek Online: Full on customization (including body and facial sliders) during character creation with very good (yet not as extensive as CO) selection of costume pieces and custom options, can change anything except your gender or race after creation. Costume changes require a "tailor" and cost in-game money. Name change available through microtransations.
  
• DC Universe Online: Fair amount of customization (preset body types and faces/body textures), with a good (yet not as extensive as any of the games above) selection of costume pieces. Can potentially change anything except your gender and body type after character creation. Gear gained from drops unlocks additional pieces that can be changed at any time on a whim (no "tailor/barber" required, free of cost). Starter costume pieces are not available after character creation, but can be gained from drops or bought from in-game stores. Name change available through microtransations.
  

 

In all of these games appearance and gear stats are completely separate from eachother (though, handled differently in each). But essentially you have your character's appearance on one hand and stats gained through gear on the other.

Edited December 21, 2011 by VisionStorm

[Syas]

Equipment

[boobaffet]

Ok, I'm still two pages behind on catching up with this thread, but, I just can't stand it any longer.

 

Random does not equal "work".

 

Maintaining your orange gear once you have it is "work", as the holier-than-thou's love to toss about, but getting the an orange item that you like is random. The schematics for the appearances of the green items (blue and purple appearances are still an unknown; possibly unattainable) drop, at random, at some low-drop-rate interval from Underworld Trading.

Random does not equal choice.

 

All items being modable would be an appearance customization system, as customization requires choice. This system is not one of choice, it is one of random luck, and thus not an effective customization system.

 

Remember how they said they wanted crafter to craft different and unique stuff and that they wanted some crafter to be recognized for their crafted gear?

 

Well there you go, each crafter will craft some different looking armor. Now if you see someone with a good looking armor you can always ask him who crafted it.

 

Its a mmo.

 

 

edit : not saying it could not use a tweak, but i dont think appearence tab is a solution. I also dont think making every piece of gear costumizable is a solution.

Edited December 21, 2011 by boobaffet

[AeonWeapon]

Want to be the leading MMO? Give your players all the stuff that other MMOs have, so they don't want to go back to their old games.

 

I still play City of Heroes. Character customization is a big selling point for me: it takes my immersion level to over 9000.

[Terko_Koslah]

I play a jedi knight and haven't found an orange heavy armor that I would like. All the models that gravitate towards a jedi character have hoods on and there for look silly in a conversation. There's some cool orange light armor though and I like the syntweaving heavy armor recipes which have hoods off.

[boobaffet]

 

In all of these games appearance and gear stats are completely separate from eachother (though, handled differently in each). But essentially you have your character's appearance on one hand and stats gained through gear on the other.

 

Exactly how this work in swtor !

 

Appearence : Armor.

 

Stat : Mod.

[Matte_Black]

Couldn't you just go on the GTN and buy orange stuff?

 

Better yet, sell your extra orange stuff and encourage others to do so too.

 

Then there will be even more. Yes, it is random but, you can usually greatly reduce randomness through vomlume of trials. The more people there are selling orange gear, the more opportunity you will have to find it.

[AeonWeapon]

I play a jedi knight and haven't found an orange heavy armor that I would like. All the models that gravitate towards a jedi character have hoods on and there for look silly in a conversation. There's some cool orange light armor though and I like the syntweaving heavy armor recipes which have hoods off.

 

You just made me think of another good point: What if you like the look of a light armor? Can you use that appearance? Nope, you're screwed by the modding system, unless you want to give up your armor stats by wearing light armor and die easily.

 

This feature needs to be added, among others, just to take the game to above the status of "generic MMO with star wars logos stamped on it and Mass Effect's dialogue system stuck in" to "great MMO that has everything you could ask for in an MMO and is competitive with other games in every way." As it is, the customization options in TOR were surpassed in other MMOs 7 to 10 years ago.

Edited December 21, 2011 by AeonWeapon

[VisionStorm]

Exactly how this work in swtor !

 

Appearence : Armor.

 

Stat : Mod.

 

Only in those games you don't have to farm gear to look good (well, maybe in DCUO a little). You get good options since the start and throughout the game.

 

To be honest (and to address another point I've seen you brought up before) I don't care about appearance customization being available only through orange gear instead of a tab, as much as I care about the apparent lack of options, particularly at low levels. If there was a good selection of orange gear and mods since the start, I probably wouldn't be here right now.

 

So this is more about more/better appearance options for me than specifically the Appearance Tab per se. Though, I believe that an Appearance Tab that handles appearance separate from gear would be simpler and more efficient. Instead of having to craft the appearance, you could just focus on crafting your gear for stats, and have any appearance you want without having to go through the extra work of crafting an item to not only have the stats you're looking for, but also look a certain way.

[Guen]

As someone who was really wanting an appearance tab, after playing I've decided I really like the mod system better, and am enjoying it immensely, however it does need a few tweaks. We do need a dye system (or color match to chest piece) so that while we are searching for the other orange pieces we need, we don't look so silly. Especially since the odds are we won't be able to find a full matching set for a very long time, or without looking it up on a 3rd party site (which I haven't found one yet with really accurate and full information).

 

Also I was under the impression that Underworld Trading was the skill that gives orange recipes but my husband has leveled it to 180 and only gotten 1 recipe, so a possible slight increase in chance to get an orange recipe might be nice.

 

Other than that I am really really liking the mod system and am holding off my wanting an appearance tab until I really see that the mod system won't work. And right now it has potential. I got a matching orange chest and pants from Athiss the other night and I think it looks pretty awesome so for now that is what I plan on leveling with til I find something better. I am saving all the other orange gear I get just incase. It's a surprisingly fun part of the game for me.

[VisionStorm]

In all of these games appearance and gear stats are completely separate from eachother (though, handled differently in each). But essentially you have your character's appearance on one hand and stats gained through gear on the other.

 

Exactly how this work in swtor !

 

Appearence : Armor.

 

Stat : Mod.

 

Actually, Ive been giving this further thought after playing tonight, and the more I play the game the more I realize that this isn't really how this works in SWTOR. In those games I mentioned, appearance is totally separate from stats. Here they are interlinked together because you can't wear your stats without wearing the armor you have assigned those stats too. In those games you can wear your stats with any armor appearance you want.

 

There is no "modding" of a piece of an individual piece of equipment with a set appearance, in order to make that particular piece of superficial armor useful. And you don't need to carry additional items taking up space in your inventory in order to have a pretty extensive selection of outfits.

 

The way the system is currently implemented is very limited, inaccessible and cumbersome. Orange gear offers a very limited selection compared to games with real appearance customization, because in order to have a good selection of "costume pieces" you would need to aquire and carry around multiple sets of gear using different appearances--all modded out so they'd actually be of use to you while running around with them.

 

Pieces are hard to aquire and require extra costs and additional work to add mods to them. I would need to devote an extraordinary amount of time and resources aquiring every single piece I like (still limited by the armor available for my class) in order to acheive what I can in games where Armor Appearance and Stats are trully separate.

 

And all these pieces would be taking up space in your already limited inventory. So they would be competing for space with all the junk you will aquire as you go about doing missions and fighting enemies.

 

In order to trully achieve in this game something on par with what games with full appearance have to offer, without getting rid of orange gear or scrapping the current system entirely, they would have to add perhaps an additional inventory tap (similar to what we already have for mission items and such) to store gear of this kind.

 

This would allow us to keep a selection of modded "costume pieces" we could fit together to build up our outfit and change it from time to time.

 

 

TL;DR:

 

In all of these games appearance and gear stats are completely separate from eachother (though, handled differently in each). But essentially you have your character's appearance on one hand and stats gained through gear on the other.

 

This^ is not exactly how it works in SWTOR. In SWTOR the stats must be bound to a specific piece of armor. In those games the stats are handled completely 100% separate from the armor appearance. And the "appearances" don't take up space in your inventory.

Edited December 22, 2011 by VisionStorm

[Matte_Black]

Personally, I'd be against appearance tabs but, I can respect that many want them. Let's face it though, they aren't even "needed", much less "badly needed". This game is a very good game that could use a great many things more than appearance tabs.