Why a $150 million Star Wars game is going free

[lovefool]

If by "excellent article" you mean "CNN Money once again reports a corporate press release as verified, entirely truthful news" then yes, it is indeed an excellent article.

 

Anybody who parrots that "40% of players said they were leaving because of the subscription fee" dross has no *********** idea what they're talking about.

 

And you can read everyone's mind and have access to the statistics of why subbers leave, I see.

 

I am one of those people. I have less and less time to play SWTOR and when I log on for an hour a day to play a little and within that hour I won't be able to do much I don't feel quite happy about spending money on something I cannot play.

 

Don't get me wrong, £8.99 is not much at all, but its still something that could be used on something else. It is a bout setting priorities, I don't mind spending money on things I like and have time to do, I do not like wasting money on something I can barely touch due to work/personal obligations.

 

Plus I also want to try out GW2, so I will have even less time to play SWTOR for a while but I do not want to stop playing completely. Thats why I welcome the change from just month. sub. to munth.sub. + f2p content.

 

So before you start stating again that you can read other people's minds and know the answers on the reasons why they all left (most probably based on the thoughts your friends had when leaving or w/e), please provide why your opinion is more relevant than other people's opinion, please do.

[Tiaa]

http://money.cnn.com/2012/08/10/technology/star-wars-free-play/index.html

 

well said

 

Well said?...

 

This article is beyond garbage.

 

There is nothing to be "well said" other than SWTOR was developed poorly.

 

Period.

 

The process won't change. It's too damn late to apologize. Will they see the mantle or will they see the skies? It's almost over now. It's almost over now. They think that you don't have to ever quit. They think that they can get away with it . It's almost over now. It's almost over now.

[lovefool]

So 40% say they didn't want to pay for the game? So why did BW ignore the other 60% and why they left. You know, 60 being a larger number than 40 and all.

 

40% of players said that one problem is the reason.

60% of players said other parts of the game are a problem, each is different, lets say 3 problems that gives 20%, 20%,20% to each problem, making it the minor problems (numbers are made up and serve just for explanation). In other words 100 players left, 40 players said money is the issue...then there is the rest 60% out of which there are 3 issues

 

money = 40% out of a 100 = 40 people

other = 60% out of a 100 = 60 people but out of 60 people, 20% out of total 100, (30% of the 60 = 20 people) have

reason A = 20 people

reason B = 20 people

reason C = 20 people

 

together = 60 people so 60%.

 

and 40 people is > than any other 20 people for the other problems.

 

Parreto charts are good for this, even though its just 40%, its 40 people for one reason as opposed to 20 for 3 other reasons, making those 40 people a much bigger issue, that needs to be solved first.

[Orcron]

All I can think about is a few things. DE saying they've got content ready to be pushed out. You can do this an that or be this crafted that can be the only one on the sever to craft something. A lot of what they intended to do (or lied about) was not delivered at all. The game has a lot of flaws in it at this point. Still some haven't been addressed and not to mention devs are not even speaking about crap because they need something to present at a convention.

 

I'm sorry but at this point BW has screwed up by allowing the f2p people go from 1-50 in which they can complete the main core of the game. Class story. Should of allowed them to go to level 24. Get them hooked on it so they sub up or spend money.

 

WoW in it's first year didn't have crap to do when you maxed out levels. No warzones no raids maybe a few instances? What the problem is BW went with this idea of let's cater to casuals. Bad idea. An I'm sure some of you will disagree with that. But as you look at wow it still has some of the best hardcore hard modes for this players. I mean hell those same players stuck around for almost a year doing alts or hardmodes in raids without an update before cataclism. They dumbed the game down a bit so the more casual player can achieve some of that. But that stuff comes later in patches, not right away.

Let's tor launches rated war zones. Bad idea. Start with arenas 2-2 3-3 4-4. An make a arena (a few map). Players have a hard time with ques even with sever jammed together.

This I blame on the casual gamers. Stick to you're xboxes n ps3. Then again I can say I knew some hardcore raiders that only spend 3-4 hours gaming those raids one time a week. That IMO is very casual. But it seems casual again say things like they don't got time to do this an that. But in wow I seem hardmode raids only play 4 hours during raid night in the best of best gear.

 

F2p with boost numbers for a while. When those casual players do story an then eff off the numbers will drop. Community will be split due to well f2p players won't have access to areas of the game. Then eventually the company's will say hmm how do we get sub players to spend some real $$ plus sub. Well we toss up armor n weapons and so on. Maybe with not mods. But down further in the vendor. O look mods armoring an so on. I'm am sadden by the way they are handling things.

 

What will happen is WoW and GW2 will drop this fall an snag more of tor's player base sub wise an then what? Offer more cartel coins for playing or goodies on vendor.

IMO its sad to say that if they don't start pumping out major amounts of content that isn't finished in 4 hours or with in a week it will sink an sink fast. Make no mistake about that. Content an raiding/pvp is what can make the game better an they keep dropping the ball on it.

F2p will roll just like EA Does on console. You watch, not at start but in will slowly creep in

 

My 2c anyhow

[Steele_dk]

WoW in it's first year didn't have crap to do when you maxed out levels. No warzones no raids maybe a few instances? What the problem is BW went with this idea of let's cater to casuals. Bad idea. An I'm sure some of you will disagree with that. But as you look at wow it still has some of the best hardcore hard modes for this players. I mean hell those same players stuck around for almost a year doing alts or hardmodes in raids without an update before cataclism. They dumbed the game down a bit so the more casual player can achieve some of that. But that stuff comes later in patches, not right away.

Let's tor launches rated war zones. Bad idea. Start with arenas 2-2 3-3 4-4. An make a arena (a few map). Players have a hard time with ques even with sever jammed together.

 

I think the major part is the gaming community has done alot of games now and there is less room for patience on actually playing a game and getting new stuff. Wow as you said didnt have warzones untill 6months in the game from launch, but back then the type of game was still new to many ppl.

The community expects more today. At least basic things in a mmo. Swtor has failed on a lot of these basic things and paying a monthly subscription basicly just to wait is what i think made lots of ppl quit.

I remember one of my own m8s who reached full BM before we were still waiting for 1.2 came out and there was just nothing for him to do. Naturally he quit. And when 1.2 finally came out, they cut one of the major content updates for pvpers which i bet made even more ppl drop the game.

 

For a game as swtor i think f2p option will save them lots of subscribers.

 

And i think introducing arenas requires a really good balance between classes. And at this point swtor has one of the worst pvp balance atm.

 

On the catering to casual comment i think its because it makes more money. If you take a game that everyone can play, then you will get more playing it versus if you make a game very hard only a small group will accept that challenge (because most ppl are committed to other than gaming)

 

Its a delicate balance to both have something for casuals and hardcores. But i agree the feeling of having no challenge is worse than having a bit of challenge. I am glad i quit wow back when it was on top and not still playing with these pandas and pet fights coming to the game, cuz the level of target audience is now at a riduculas low almost being kindergaarden stage.

Edited August 13, 2012 by Steele_dk

[Revchong]

I think that the games problems started from day 1 of development. BW had a stella reputation for making very good games and this led to an arrogance growing among their team. Thinking they know best and ignoring data from real beta testers, not their internal team led us to where we are now.

Their vision was flawed from the outset, had they listened to the fans from the outset,maybe the game could have been saved.Its too late now.

The Star Wars title,massive budget and respected dev company should have been a dead cert quality game but i guess the combination of complacency,arrogance and EAs greed proved more powerful in the long run.

They can spin it how they like, but going F2P so early in the games lifecycle screams failure and desperation. Those lost subs may come back, or some of them anyway, but are they going to resub? No. The same problem still exists.Lack of PvP, not enough endgame. Giving away the best stuff for free and hoping this will lead to cash being spent on the poorest content is laughable.As far as carrot and stick goes, this is one mouldy old carrot.

Dreams of millions of new F2Players arriving all of a sudden are hollow and empty, explayers coming back? some, for a while. MMO players from other games? Maybe a few just to see how bad it is but unlikely to spend.

Tor is on its knees right now and instead of trying to cure it, ie solve its many problems, the suits are busy digging it a shallow grave. To be filled in and forgotten once the shareholders have been paid.

[Celise]

http://money.cnn.com/2012/08/10/technology/star-wars-free-play/index.html

 

well said

 

i wont take this media spin at face value. i mean its using its connections to justify LOTRO's existance instead of SWTOR, and most of the comments on that article are right and are more concrete then what is mentioned by the writer.

 

subs have gone down indeed, but that is more on the part of ea/bioware for a failure to step upto the plate and show what they got. i mean they could of produced the best thing since sliced bread, the opportunity was in their hands quite easily, but now it is gone. so now in order to rescue the game they are lowering their prices and going F2P. although i am still holding out hope for it to keep out of the nightmare zone (P2W) and lift itself out of trouble before long.

[Sporin]

At least someone was honest about it. Hats off to "Bob Olmstead", sir, we salute you!

 

The rest is spin, EA should run for government!

[Karkais]

There is nothing to be "well said" other than SWTOR was developed poorly.

 

I wouldnt say SWTOR is developed poorly. Its actually pretty well-made for a MMO. The problem as I perceive are the design decisions behind it that make it an almost carboncopy of the marketleader MMO in terms of game mechanics. Theres very little attempt made to be original. This is why I am so negative about SWTOR myself.

 

ps. In case its not obvious, the claim that people left because of subscription fee are garbage. Unless you interpret "We don't think this game is worth the subscription fee" as "The subscription fee is too high".

 

And I can almost see EA's greasy fingers in these decisions.

Edited August 13, 2012 by Karkais

[Moatcarp]

I wouldnt say SWTOR is developed poorly. Its actually pretty well-made for a MMO. The problem as I perceive are the design decisions behind it that make it an almost carboncopy of the marketleader MMO in terms of game mechanics. Theres very little attempt made to be original. This is why I am so negative about SWTOR myself.

 

ps. In case its not obvious, the claim that people left because of subscription fee are garbage. Unless you interpret "We don't think this game is worth the subscription fee" as "The subscription fee is too high".

 

And I can almost see EA's greasy fingers in these decisions.

 

 

MMO consumers don't want original....

 

The MMO graveyard is filled with MMOs that tried to be "original"

[Andryah]

i mean its using its connections to justify LOTRO's existance instead of SWTOR

 

It's a business article. They are primarily discussing two business elements:

 

1) the MMO market is struggling under a subscription model, which is a true statement.

 

2) they are exploring the Freemium model in the market and how it can and does work for MMO, even when they started as subscription only. Also true, and further, they explore how it has worked successfully.

 

Tip; Don't let your dislike for SWTOR inhibit you from looking at an atricle that is relevant way beyond just SWTOR in the MMO marketplace. Even Blizzard is done with pay to play MMOs. WoW is their last one.

Edited August 13, 2012 by Andryah

[Tic-]

MMO consumers don't want original....

 

The MMO graveyard is filled with MMOs that tried to be "original"

 

You're right, they want fun...

 

Buying a new game thats essentially the same as the old game, could lack fun, it used to be fun, but now its gotten old.

 

Or, if i wanted the fun this game is giving me, why would i start a new game, with the same fun?

[DarthTHC]

It's a business article. They are primarily discussing two business elements:

 

1) the MMO market is struggling under a subscription model, which is a true statement.

 

2) they are exploring the Freemium model in the market and how it can and does work for MMO, even when they started as subscription only. Also true, and further, they explore how it has worked successfully.

 

Tip; Don't let your dislike for SWTOR inhibit you from looking at an atricle that is relevant way beyond just SWTOR in the MMO marketplace. Even Blizzard is done with pay to play MMOs. WoW is their last one.

 

1) That's not necessarily a true statement. There are subscription MMOs on the market who do not seem to be struggling at all. It's more correctly worded as there are numerous MMOs on the market whose features and content do not convince players that they are worth a subscription, therefore they struggle.

 

2) They are not exploring the model. They are implementing it.

 

Yes, Blizzard does pay-to-play MMOs. In the West, that's a subscription. In the East, it's game time fees. If you're talking about the author's statement that even WoW has "free-to-play to 20", let's don't confuse FREE TRIAL with FREE TO PLAY like he did, k? We're smarter than that, being the actual players & all, where he's just an EA mouthpiece.

Edited August 13, 2012 by DarthTHC

[belizar]

It's a business article. They are primarily discussing two business elements:

 

1) the MMO market is struggling under a subscription model, which is a true statement.

so rift is struggling WoW also tera ? maybe TSW < havnt followed that one only bad mmos struggle or ones with VO that cost lot of cash instead of content

2) they are exploring the Freemium model in the market and how it can and does work for MMO, even when they started as subscription only. Also true, and further, they explore how it has worked successfully.

they going for a quick cash grab then forget it like warhammer quick buck see a return and call it a day

Tip; Don't let your dislike for SWTOR inhibit you from looking at an atricle that is relevant way beyond just SWTOR in the MMO marketplace. Even Blizzard is done with pay to play MMOs. WoW is their last one.

 

dont let your love for all BW does with swtor inhibit you from what is really there

[Celebrus]

The article basically amounts to:

 

"People can't afford .50 cents per day to play a video game." Thats a pretty pathetic excuse, and as broke as I am, even I don't buy it. 15$ per month is absolutely worth it to enjoy a AAA mmo that will regularly deliver content, but this game is not, and they did not.

 

Please people, if they had had such great foresight, and had known that the sub model was going to fail them, that they weren't going to sustain it, the game would have launched as F2P. It's great and all that captain hindsight can come out of the blue after something has already occured and label it an inevitability, but it simply isn't always the case. In this situation, it obviously wasn't planned for otherwise they would have been working on it in March of 2011 and not March of 2012.

 

This article takes what is an unplanned occurence and attempts to turn it into a foreseen inevitability. You're an idiot if you can't see why this simply isn't the case.

 

The game failed to deliver, stop trying so desperately to excuse mediocrity by allowing them this enormous cop out.

Edited August 13, 2012 by Celebrus

[Jnight]

Who's going to try and develop a game that has 8 years of content in a relatively short amount of time?

 

Stop talking reason, that doesn't fly around here.

 

And it's true. If you look at what WoW had at launch vs what SWTOR had its night and day. WoW started with some instances to play while leveling. Over the next 8 months (where we are with SWTOR) they had introduced

3 instances

2 World Bosses

2 Battlegrounds

1 Raid

http://www.wowwiki.com/Patches/1.x

 

SWTOR started with all that and more and will only improve.

 

No Timmy! You can't have all your advent chocolates on Dec 1.

Edited August 13, 2012 by Jnight

[belizar]

Stop talking reason, that doesn't fly around here.

 

so your saying nothing can beat a massive series ? MoH used to be the top dog in FPS COD took over u make a better game ppl play it simple tho that dont fly around here with sw fans i guess

 

making a game now to compete with WoW 2006 is just LOL

[Jnight]

so your saying nothing can beat a massive series ? MoH used to be the top dog in FPS COD took over u make a better game ppl play it simple tho that dont fly around here with sw fans i guess

 

making a game now to compete with WoW 2006 is just LOL

No I edited my post, I'm saying people need patience and to remember what WoW was like in it's first year. Sure SWTOR can learn from some of WoW's mistakes, but you can't compare WoW now to SWTOR now. It hasn't even had a year to grow yet.

[islander]

Yes Excellent. According to an exit survey, your "$150 million dollar" game, isn't worth $.50 a day, but for "free", I might play it.

 

Wonderful news for the genre'

 

I know, right?

 

The thing is, it's more then the .50 a day. Many people aren't interested - in an age when even Blizzard gets hacked - in submitting credit card information online. Yeah, you can buy/use gamecards but that's somewhat inconvenient. The idea of keeping CC information on this website turns some people off.

 

The bigger reality is, EA is right - the day of subscription MMOs is going away. They can all thank Turbine for being a pioneer in this, along with the numerous FTP games that you can even run in browsers these days.

[belizar]

No I edited my post, I'm saying people need patience and to remember what WoW was like in it's first year. Sure SWTOR can learn from some of WoW's mistakes, but you can't compare WoW now to SWTOR now. It hasn't even had a year to grow yet.

 

thats the prob u have to compare WOW now to a 2011 game SWTOR u cant go back and say SWTOR is as good as WOW TBC. if u cant better a 8yr old game somthing is v wrong in the games market

clones of WoW fail as ppl leave WoW as it gets boring they dont want WoWv2 now with lightsabres thats the prob

[bobmcbo]

As long as you still have to pay to install the game, it shouldn't be TOO bad.

[pocketthesaurus]

If by "excellent article" you mean "CNN Money once again reports a corporate press release as verified, entirely truthful news" then yes, it is indeed an excellent article.

 

Anybody who parrots that "40% of players said they were leaving because of the subscription fee" dross has no *********** idea what they're talking about.

But they did say that.

 

Can you prove otherwise?

 

If they clicked the box, then they said it. That's all there is to it. Whether they had other reasons or not is moot, because they clicked that box.

[Jnight]

thats the prob u have to compare WOW now to a 2011 game SWTOR u cant go back and say SWTOR is as good as WOW TBC. if u cant better a 8yr old game somthing is v wrong in the games market

clones of WoW fail as ppl leave WoW as it gets boring they dont want WoWv2 now with lightsabres thats the prob

I'm trying to be positive. What I'm saying is that SWTOR has a lot more than WoW did then and I expect it to only get better. Until some future MMO is released with a bazillion hours of polished game play with no bugs and complete balance MMOs will always be works in progress.

 

SWTOR hasn't even been out for a year yet, has been a lot of fun for a lot of people (despite the forum complainers), and more content is on the way.

 

I do see point you are trying to make, but saying "8 year old game" is a little miss-leading considering that's 8 additional years of paid development time on top of the initial development time.

Edited August 13, 2012 by Jnight

[MaximusRex]

"40% say they were turned off by sub fee"

 

yah because the game is so bare bones it's not worth it to far too many...

 

this article is garbage.

 

WoW PROVES if a game is good enough and has enough things to keep you playing people will HAPPILY pay a monthly sub.

 

article is garbage..fact.

 

but thanks for playing.

 

WoW has lost 5 million subs in the last 18 months, and no other game or combination of games has picked them up. The Pay to Play market is saturated and shrinking, and the Free to Play market is growing.

 

You people are like the people who thought "talkie" movies and color TV were just passing fads.

[Vellem]

What I want to know is why they are more worried about that supposed %40 that didn't want to pay a monthly fee. What makes them think that they will spend any money when they are hoped to flock back to the now f2p game? Even if you get a percentage of them to spend money in your cash shop it doesn't seem like it would be enough to make up the difference in lost sub money.

 

Sad thing is, f2p models rely on a few people with poor impulse control to spend tons every month while the majority pay nothing at all. Once those "whales" dry up or start playing something else, all you are left with is a bunch of players playing for free. It is a model that I think is unsustainable long term. Even the king of f2p games, Zynga is doing poorly and their games are losing millions of players as well.

Edited August 13, 2012 by Vellem