I Love this game

[Ghaiana]

I've been here since early access and although I don't play the game daily, it is fun for me still. I got 2 level 50's now, I loved the stories and I'm sure I will add a few more level 50's.

[Valkirus]

Actually, if just one time you types would do some market research before bloviating all over the boards you would find that you are not correct in this assumption, no more then any other assumption based on hyperbole.

 

Negative reputation has a negative effect on marketing and sales, always. It is an absolute, which is why the image consulting field is always booming.

 

Na. From day one and even now...WoW's forums have been and are filled with negative posts. I never let those decrease my enjoyment of it and millions of others have been the same way. TOR will succeed or fail not mainly to any negative posts on the forums, but by thier own ( BioWare ) actions. Negative posts can have positive impacts too you know?

Edited July 29, 2012 by Valkirus

[Fornix]

 

There's never been an MMORPG that has had subs nose-dive after release to go on to massive numbers.

 

If there is any that ever do it'll be one with a massive amount of development post launch (and many that have that sort of development still don't do that well - i.e. AoC & Rift).

 

It's just how things are, and it's not really so much to do with the players, as corporate exec slashing developement budgets the instant they realise an MMORPG isn't equally or bettering WoW peak numbers - which is an impossible standard.

 

The initial sales surpassing 500k or even a million is new for MMO's, we simply do not know how it will impact future subscription figures. Take the first multi-million sub MMO lineage, it took them nearly 2 years to reach 1 million subscribers. For World of Warcraft it took about a year.

 

Many other MMO's didn't even make it. Even for those smaller MMO's though, slow trends of increasing players were to be seen.

 

Now MMO's sell initial boxes like hotcakes, and then rapidly drop; AOC, WAR, RIFT, SWTOR, TERA, FF XIV etc. There hasn't been any MMO so far since 2008 which hasn't followed this pattern. The number of total subscribers in MMO's is also on a downwards pattern.

 

And those things have all to do with the players, as development budgets are cut once income is dropping, and income drops by choice of the player. It's not the companies' choice to have overall subscriber figures dropping, or players hopping from MMO to MMO as seen in the past 5 years.

 

However, it will most likely only strengthen their views that the current financial model used in most MMO's is getting dated.

 

Sure there are some people who like to claim otherwise, and come with the notion that it's 2008, 9, 10, 11 or by now 2012 and this or that is expected from an MMO, then refering to previous titles which have been on the market for about 10 years. However, forgetting that as those titles launched you were frequently paying 15 bucks a month to do nothing else than grind. And it's because people kept on playing through that anyway, followed the grind and pushed through that income was generated to create more content.

 

Considering as to how server costs are low, and most costs for MMO's are development costs, this makes it more and more lucrative for developers to take on f2p models. You enlarge your potential customer base a lot, even if you stick to a B2P model, and gain additional chances on income.

 

Also to that, the community itself is the main driving force once again. Don't mistake, but companies only hook in on what is financially attractive to them. Ultimately that means the community decides on what gets produced and which path is taken. And currently the MMO community is pushing developers into a corner where they're going to be forced to release titles as F2P or B2P products with item malls in order to survive.

[Sindorin]

Are you expecting a paycheck or something? BioWare doesn't care, or they'd talk to us directly. We don't need self-professed casuals(+!) telling us everything is okay. MMO vets, and folks who value their $15/month, already know otherwise.

 

Considering Bioware has already pointed out in numerous dev videos and articles during development that they aren't catering to your group, we don't care. Take your $15 and leave.

 

OP, glad you like the game. Keep on keepin' on!

[Tsillah]

I do enjoy the game. I have my criticism on certain elements but I still enjoy it very much.

 

But I am gonna take a break this evening and watch some B5 vids...good thing I have the week off

[jarjarloves]

 

There's never been an MMORPG that has had subs nose-dive after release to go on to massive numbers.

 

.

 

DDO, DCUO, and LotrO now have more paying subs then they did at launch and after their numbers fell.

 

So... yeah you're wrong

[cshouston]

DDO, DCUO, and LotrO now have more paying subs then they did at launch and after their numbers fell.

 

So... yeah you're wrong

 

DDO: 100k subs

LotrO: 250k subs

DCUO: can't find the numbers, I wonder why?

 

Sometimes, "sub" numbers are misleading as well because (in DCUO's case for instance) they can claim new non-paying accounts are "subs".

 

While substantial in real word terms, hardly what I would call thriving communities for an MMO, or ones worthwhile of cranking out continual AND quality content for.

Edited July 29, 2012 by cshouston

[Diktat]

Wow. You see everyone? There's tons of negativity but once in a bit you'll see a positive thread or two pop up. Proved that in my latest thread.

 

Now, I'm really glad you're enjoying this game. I'm glad you're taking your time and all but here's the thing: I think this game was designed for players like you.

 

This game was aimed for players who didn't have to devote all their time or just could devote as much time as they wanted to for the game. It was also for those players who wanted this story BioWare provided above all else—a story that BioWare praised highly. The thing is, all of that work that's put into the story and voice acting kinda made a hollow elimination of the grindfest this game really had. Now you, being a player of your caliber, enjoys taking your time playing several classes that you don't see it the way many of us do.

 

Not only that, but the Legacy system is, too, a grindfest. The reason why you enjoy the Legacy is because you enjoy playing so many characters that you get to advance without getting bothered by the way the majority of the community feels about the Legacy.

 

Unfortunately, I realize this game was meant to be a PvE-oriented game that would be enjoyed by players that would like playing several stories that would be very amazed by all the story and voice acting that you wouldn't spacebar, and that you would like going through each of the side-quests which makes it far easier and more entertaining for you to advance your Legacy.

 

This game had potential. I just think it's too late for BioWare. This game may go F2P (or *cough*P2W*cough*) and may bring back some players, but only the players that would sit back and enjoy this game would be players of your caliber. Everyone else will eventually be unsubscribed and move on to MMOs that are bigger and better in their eyes.

Not for all players like him. Some, like me, are too casual players who after level up 1 character see no reasons to level alts of both factions just for the storyline as soon as we realized that is a grind through the same planets and quest 16 times (or 8 tiems if we only count classes).

The game fails the inmemsion badly since relies too much on voicing and cinematics for that, and in my case I feel no attachment to my own characters, and combat doesn't make me feel heroic because my chances to beat a mob or an area depends too much on my gear.

Edited July 29, 2012 by Diktat

[soldenal]

I do enjoy the game. I have my criticism on certain elements but I still enjoy it very much.

 

But I am gonna take a break this evening and watch some B5 vids...good thing I have the week off

 

Exactly how I feel about the game. It has the solid polish of an AAA game, and quite casual friendly.

 

I played other MMO games before and never did I make it to top level until I played RIFT and SWTOR. I played a hunter to mid 30s level in vanilla WoW and quit, played till mid 40s level a ranger and a friar in DAOC before I stopped because the time needed to stay not totally gimped was too much.

 

Only made it to level cap in RIFT for the first time of my MMO experiences. Just because it is much easier to get there. RIFT is even easier to level than SWTOR. I have 2 level 50s in RIFT and had good time while I play. Now I haven't log in RIFT in weeks but I still give them a 3-month sub just out of support to the company to continue development.

 

Now in SWTOR even though I started play since early access, I currently only have one level 50 with half war-hero PvP gears and half Columi gears. And 5-6 level 20ish chars of various classes. The alt leveling system is least boring of any MMO that I have played. The legacy system to put all the alts in a family tree is a nice touch.

 

The in-game community is the best I have experienced too. It has the right casual-hardcore mix that I feel is just right for me. With my guild, the hardcore players always organize something to run with the casual and help them gear up while everybody have fun. I am not a hardcore player but I also pitch in to help new level 50s whenever I can. It is a nice true guild feel that keep pulling one back.

 

I do try out other new games while I take a break from SWTOR from time to time. For example I played TERA for a few weeks to get a warrior to level 40, but the game gets boring out side of the combat being a little different from other MMOs. I played The Secret World a bit, although the quests are kind of nice and engaging, I don't see I play that game for long term.

 

And these days to be honest too many new games is what keeping good MMO from maintaining a big sub number. Because most people will be only willing to pay one sub. A lot of the new games are pretty solid in their own right, but the market is just saturated, the poor economy doesn't help either.

 

So even when I took a break from SWTOR I still keep my sub, because I want to help fund the game to get better, and I believe a lot of players do the same. This game just gives me the "home game" feel. Aside from guildies I always see familiar names while I play. And even total strangers are mostly nice and helpful often times.

 

Now comes suggestion for improvements, I do have few that I believe a lot of players have suggested too:

 

* More frequent world events like the rakghoul event a while back.

* More new contents both PvE and PvP soon as in 1.4.

* Cross server ranked war zone queue.

* Lower cost pulling out mods, not to exceed 10000 credit per piece of mod please.

* Lower the PvP war hero gear commendation cost by 1/3. You want the game to be casual friendly and encourage people to level alts, but to gear another alt up for WH gear is a bit out of question unless you are very hardcaore.

* Reduce the legacy perk cost especially the per character once, by at least 1/3.

* More faster travel legacy perks.

* More character slots, or add this as legacy perks.

 

That's what I can think of off top of my head for now.

[Yyrmega]

I have to say that i love this game as well. it is by far the best mmo on the market.

 

Don't let the stupid and idiotic haters/trolls ruin your experience by spending time on the fora.

 

I am starting to think that someone is paying them just to trash it.

 

May the force be with SWTOR!

[MrGrizzly]

I also love the game. And there are many many more that do.

 

I recognise the game can't be all things to all people; but I also love the game. I wish it was a huge success and that EA wouldn't have hung so many hopes on it to the point where now they are cutting staff. That being said I think Bioware with do right by the future of the game with the resources they have. As an working father or two my game time is precious and right not SWTOR gets about 95% of it. Maybe once I have 8 50s (one in each class) I'll split my time more, but right now it's my favorite free time thing to do.

 

MTFBWY

[WildbloodX]

The game had? potential. Think it's too late? The game's been out for 7 months, that's extremely young for an MMO. It takes years for most MMO's to truly settle in. People keep on forgetting that. The competition is formed by games with 10 years or more of development pumped into it so far.

 

If people keep on having this sort of mentality, that it needs to outdo all of that within 6 month, we may just as well declare the genre dead, as it's never going to work out anymore anyway. That bigger and better MMO you're talking about, will never be found in a newer MMO due to that.

 

But if there are not enough subs then where will they get the money to continue to pay the people that build the content? 7 months in should have somewhat stable subs not dropping at the rate it has and is.

[jarjarloves]

DDO: 100k subs

LotrO: 250k subs

DCUO: can't find the numbers, I wonder why?

 

Sometimes, "sub" numbers are misleading as well because (in DCUO's case for instance) they can claim new non-paying accounts are "subs".

 

While substantial in real word terms, hardly what I would call thriving communities for an MMO, or ones worthwhile of cranking out continual AND quality content for.

 

all far more then they had at launch. DCUO doesn't have to report sub numbers. But there are far more paying subscribers now.

 

 

All three of them have seen a bunch of big updates and new content. All have seen the additon of new character classes as well as other things.

 

But yeah 100k subscribers is a big deal for a MMO. Might be hard to grasp your head around that if you have only played WoW.

Edited July 29, 2012 by jarjarloves

[ahnog]

I totally agree with the OP. Love this game long time.

[soldenal]

Or just rabid fanboys of GW2 wanting to get more people to play with. I will very likely play GW2 to try it out at some point. But not likely to end my SWTOR sub unless 1.4 is a big let down.

 

I think 1.1, 1.2, 1.3 are all decent patches that kept my sub in the past half a year or so. As long as BW keep delivering at or above that standard, the game should be fine.

 

I have to say that i love this game as well. it is by far the best mmo on the market.

 

Don't let the stupid and idiotic haters/trolls ruin your experience by spending time on the fora.

 

I am starting to think that someone is paying them just to trash it.

 

May the force be with SWTOR!

[Kane_Ren]

Yep, I still enjoy the game a lot too. The forum posts from people who still play and enjoy the game are always well written and encourage better debate than the whine-fests from the naysayers. Imo BW needs to delete the 'I quit' posts so they actually do quit rather than bump/repost as much of their negativity as possible.

[Goretzu]

The initial sales surpassing 500k or even a million is new for MMO's, we simply do not know how it will impact future subscription figures. Take the first multi-million sub MMO lineage, it took them nearly 2 years to reach 1 million subscribers. For World of Warcraft it took about a year.

 

Many other MMO's didn't even make it. Even for those smaller MMO's though, slow trends of increasing players were to be seen.

 

Now MMO's sell initial boxes like hotcakes, and then rapidly drop; AOC, WAR, RIFT, SWTOR, TERA, FF XIV etc. There hasn't been any MMO so far since 2008 which hasn't followed this pattern. The number of total subscribers in MMO's is also on a downwards pattern.

 

And those things have all to do with the players, as development budgets are cut once income is dropping, and income drops by choice of the player. It's not the companies' choice to have overall subscriber figures dropping, or players hopping from MMO to MMO as seen in the past 5 years.

 

However, it will most likely only strengthen their views that the current financial model used in most MMO's is getting dated.

 

Sure there are some people who like to claim otherwise, and come with the notion that it's 2008, 9, 10, 11 or by now 2012 and this or that is expected from an MMO, then refering to previous titles which have been on the market for about 10 years. However, forgetting that as those titles launched you were frequently paying 15 bucks a month to do nothing else than grind. And it's because people kept on playing through that anyway, followed the grind and pushed through that income was generated to create more content.

 

Considering as to how server costs are low, and most costs for MMO's are development costs, this makes it more and more lucrative for developers to take on f2p models. You enlarge your potential customer base a lot, even if you stick to a B2P model, and gain additional chances on income.

 

Also to that, the community itself is the main driving force once again. Don't mistake, but companies only hook in on what is financially attractive to them. Ultimately that means the community decides on what gets produced and which path is taken. And currently the MMO community is pushing developers into a corner where they're going to be forced to release titles as F2P or B2P products with item malls in order to survive.

 

 

Lineage launched in a different time. Lineage 2 hasn't reclimbed after it's decline started.

 

I can't think of one that has really recovered after a decline.

 

Your right the "themepark" grind model should have been abandoned long ago, it was staid even in WoWs launch time, the only reason it worked for them was because they made it so much easier than EQ1, however making a game easier than WoW also makes it pretty pointless.

 

Hybrid themebox or sandpark MMORPGs are the only viable future.

[Khaki]

This game isnt perfect, but it doesnt need all this negativity. Theres constructive criticism and just pure trolling. The developers need to work hard though, since GW2 and MOP are coming out soon, this is make or break really. I dont want this game to be a failure, i hope it isnt the case.

[DarthCDiv]

Any criticism is consider trolling by people on here. And when you attack someone in a post in which you criticize people for not being constructive... Well, I think it's obvious what that makes you, but in-case you're too stupid to know, it makes you a moron. This isn't directed at any specific person.

[kirorx]

We all know SWTOR is not made of blue cheese, but if it was made of BBQ spare ribs....Would you Eat it?

 

I know i would, i'd have seconds. Then i would polish it off with an ice cold budweiser.