Illogical Melee Weapons

[yerbigpops]

Hey guys,

 

So this has been bothering me about the game for a long time. I don't understand why so many npc's and companions use melee weapons. It doesn't make sense. They have laser guns at their disposal, but they choose to use melee weapons instead. It kinda breaks immersion for me. Other than force users, a melee weapon could not be used efficiently in the hands of a non-force user. A ranged weapon would win every time. I can see street thugs using vibro knifes, but prison guards, commandos, and others using an awkward looking sword thing? Not so much. I don't think a mandalorian like Torian would use a vibro staff. I don't think a demolitions expert like Tano Vik would use a sword. Not to mention these non-force using characters have the same run and battle animations with their swords and staves as the jedi and sith do. Do they have secret inside knowledge on jedi and sith fighting styles?

 

Is there something I'm missing as to why so many non-force users use melee weapons in this game? I didn't play the KOTOR series, maybe there is an answer in there? I love this game, I have just been wondering about this little thing for too long. Thanks for the input guys!

 

/endrant

[Nyoro]

I think I speak for everyone when I say it would be boring if next to every NPC had to use a blaster.

[Goretzu]

Yeah it doesn't make a lot of sense.

 

Jedi/Sith get away with it for obvious reasons, but an average person using a sword over a blaster does require a pretty large suspension of belief.

[SNCommand]

Apparently the first Kotor game revealed that because Shields protected soldiers easily from blaster fire, and the increasing need for a efficient CQC weapon when boarding enemy ships or assaulting small planetary bases cortosis covered melee weapons has become standard issue within most of the galaxy's armed forces.

 

I guess that still is the case in SWTOR, people sure seem to take a lot of shoots with a blaster rifle, that's for sure

Edited July 25, 2012 by SNCommand

[chimunga]

Well, think about it gameplay wise.

 

Unless there is a giant surplus of Jedi somewhere, you would pretty much always be fighting ranged mobs. And that would be both annoying and boring. I'd say as an Imperial, maybe MAYBE 10% of the mobs I fight are Jedi. So... without the non-force using melee-ers, it would get really boring and repetitive.

[Dylota]

1: The melee weapons vibrate to do more damage and be more effective then a simple sword.

 

2: They are covered in a sort of substance that is one of the few things light sabers can't cut through.

 

3: I remember is KOTOR 2 that Attom Rand told you that in a fight between a fight between a guy with a sword and a guy with a blaster the guy with the sword will win as long as they can get close enough.

 

Essentially they are to be used just in case they encounter a Jedi, Sith, or a lunatic that got hold of a lightsaber.

[piethief]

Apparently the first Kotor game revealed that because Shields protected soldiers easily from blaster fire, and the increasing need for a efficient CQC weapon when boarding enemy ships or assaulting small planetary bases cortosis covered melee weapons has become standard issue within most of the galaxy's armed forces.

 

I guess that still is the case in SWTOR, people sure seem to take a lot of shoots with a blaster rifle, that's for sure

 

This is the answer. The alien merchant in the first apartment block you arrive at in Taris confirms this.

 

Energy shields create a stale mate in blaster combat, so melee weapons once again become important to decide fights between shield users.

[SentinelDranoel]

This is the answer. The alien merchant in the first apartment block you arrive at in Taris confirms this.

 

Energy shields create a stale mate in blaster combat, so melee weapons once again become important to decide fights between shield users.

 

Good job guys, I was going to tell the OP that he answered his own questions. He did not play KOTOR, yet he is playing a sequel to a game in that universe. All KOTOR fans are already accustomed to melee weapons and no they are not illogical.

[BenjaminminU]

Only thing i don't understand is that Torian Cadera clearly uses a blaster rifle/sniper rifle during the class quests on taris, yet when you get him as a companion he starts using a techstaff. It really doesn't make sense since even in his companion quests he is shown wielding a rifle and how he has been practicing new shots for the battlefield.

[Xothos]

To the OP. That is like asking why people still use knives to stab others when guns are readily available. Its all preference. I'd be more worried about why cutting anything with lightsaber is not a 1 shot kill.

[Valkirus]

To the OP. That is like asking why people still use knives to stab others when guns are readily available. Its all preference. I'd be more worried about why cutting anything with lightsaber is not a 1 shot kill.

 

This. We saw in the movies Obi'wan and Anakin slicing thru droids like a hot knife can slice thru butter. Luke slicing off the arm of the ice cave monster, etc. In this game, they should have had the mobs deflect your lightsaber or dodge to miss it. Then when you did actually hit them, body parts would fall off or they would get one shotted.

Edited July 25, 2012 by Valkirus

[FiveBBassist]

I would agree that it does seem illogical, unfitting, and off, but this game does already have more than 4 times the use of ranged mobs of any MMO I've played in the past. And part of MMOs is tank going in, pulling mobs all together, and then have an AOE damage dealer kill them. This is really hard to do with mobs who have range (because you can't AOE without people in the AOE range).

 

More animals (who don't use weapons at all) would be a good alternative, but I like how this game is more about fighting people than just fighting animals. Plus, melee using non-force wielders aren't all that common.

 

Another thing to think of, however, is lasers (realistically) travel at the speed of light (which can go around the Earth 15+ times in a second). Even in the Star Wars movies, however, lasers travel far slower than bullets.

[Twickers]

If we're trying to bring realism into this explain to me why jet packs enable enemies to do mystic kung foo leaps to enemies or that really annoying attack where they jump around to everyone nearby hitting them for heavy melee damage, it gets pretty stupid when you see some random hobo mob doing that kinda stuff

[pocketthesaurus]

Yeah it doesn't make a lot of sense.

 

Jedi/Sith get away with it for obvious reasons, but an average person using a sword over a blaster does require a pretty large suspension of belief.

Star Wars is rife with hand to hand combat in the EU. Look at the guards at Jabba's palace! Most of them used melee weapons. They had blasters, too, but they were armed to the teeth with melee weapons. Polearms, swords, vibroaxes galore!

 

A lot of them were from more primitive races, too. And look a lot of the melee companions: Bowdaar, Qyzen Fess. Both of those guys are from somewhat primitive cultures that relish combat and hunting, so using a melee weapon makes sense for them.

[Raila]

Hey guys,

 

So this has been bothering me about the game for a long time. I don't understand why so many npc's and companions use melee weapons. It doesn't make sense. They have laser guns at their disposal, but they choose to use melee weapons instead. It kinda breaks immersion for me. Other than force users, a melee weapon could not be used efficiently in the hands of a non-force user. A ranged weapon would win every time. I can see street thugs using vibro knifes, but prison guards, commandos, and others using an awkward looking sword thing? Not so much. I don't think a mandalorian like Torian would use a vibro staff. I don't think a demolitions expert like Tano Vik would use a sword. Not to mention these non-force using characters have the same run and battle animations with their swords and staves as the jedi and sith do. Do they have secret inside knowledge on jedi and sith fighting styles?

 

Prison guards and police use billy clubs and nightsticks all the time. Most commando's and special forces have extensive hand to hand combat training. So those make perfect sense to me. As for the in game ones. Mandalorians are all about the challenge of the fight, so yeah I can see melee weaps there. Tano, just the way BW developed the char, I can see him as someone who likes to make it personal.

 

Now for the animations I agree. would be nice to see some difference between regular weaps and lightsaber skills. Obviously when it comes down to it swinging a sword is swinging a sword, but a few more exclusive animations couldn't hurt anything.

[venomlash]

Only thing i don't understand is that Torian Cadera clearly uses a blaster rifle/sniper rifle during the class quests on taris, yet when you get him as a companion he starts using a techstaff. It really doesn't make sense since even in his companion quests he is shown wielding a rifle and how he has been practicing new shots for the battlefield.

 

All the techblade/techstaff companions (except possibly Akavi Spar) were originally intended to be ranged characters, which is why you see Tanno Vik using his rifle in certain cutscenes, and why there is early pre-release footage showing Qyzen using a rifle to support his Consular partner.

Then the Devs decided that every class needed 1 melee and 1 ranged tank and DPS, and so they changed things around. I sort of wish they hadn't; it would be awesome to have Yuun next to me blasting away with a rifle instead of jumping in with a techstaff.

[Goretzu]

To the OP. That is like asking why people still use knives to stab others when guns are readily available. Its all preference. I'd be more worried about why cutting anything with lightsaber is not a 1 shot kill.

 

I'm fairly sure the reason all current armies use guns rather than knives isn't purely because of preference.

[Goretzu]

Star Wars is rife with hand to hand combat in the EU. Look at the guards at Jabba's palace! Most of them used melee weapons. They had blasters, too, but they were armed to the teeth with melee weapons. Polearms, swords, vibroaxes galore!

 

A lot of them were from more primitive races, too. And look a lot of the melee companions: Bowdaar, Qyzen Fess. Both of those guys are from somewhat primitive cultures that relish combat and hunting, so using a melee weapon makes sense for them.

 

 

 

Yeah, it is.

 

But basically it's a storytelling device, and whilst the energy shield is a decent plauisible explanation, it's basically an old Sci-fi nono. i.e. technology makes something happen you want to happen, but for no reason that really stand up to hard scruitiny.

 

But if it makes things fun then that's a reasonable suspension of belief to accept (basically like every Hollywood car explosion ever, or indeed SW space combat which doesn't have real physics, but rather atomspheric flight in space - but it looks great in the films ).

[grezgorz]

Hey guys,

 

So this has been bothering me about the game for a long time. I don't understand why so many npc's and companions use melee weapons. It doesn't make sense. They have laser guns at their disposal, but they choose to use melee weapons instead. It kinda breaks immersion for me. Other than force users, a melee weapon could not be used efficiently in the hands of a non-force user. A ranged weapon would win every time. I can see street thugs using vibro knifes, but prison guards, commandos, and others using an awkward looking sword thing? Not so much. I don't think a mandalorian like Torian would use a vibro staff. I don't think a demolitions expert like Tano Vik would use a sword. Not to mention these non-force using characters have the same run and battle animations with their swords and staves as the jedi and sith do. Do they have secret inside knowledge on jedi and sith fighting styles?

 

Is there something I'm missing as to why so many non-force users use melee weapons in this game? I didn't play the KOTOR series, maybe there is an answer in there? I love this game, I have just been wondering about this little thing for too long. Thanks for the input guys!

 

/endrant

 

Agreed. Vibro weapons should be limited. I hate using Torian because, to me, he looks retarded using what looks like an American Gladiators jousiting staff.

[DiLune]

Now for the animations I agree. would be nice to see some difference between regular weaps and lightsaber skills. Obviously when it comes down to it swinging a sword is swinging a sword, but a few more exclusive animations couldn't hurt anything.

 

As you can see, the core skills are the same whether or not you're holding a traditional melee weapon or a lightsaber.

 

[Arlbo_Nabbins]

I'm fairly sure the reason all current armies use guns rather than knives isn't purely because of preference.

 

And yet armies still train soldiers in the use Bayonets as well as guns.

 

As is mentioned in SWTOR in places Ray Shields make people immune to blaster fire.

[Newyankalt]

Well story wise the only I can see with Melee is force users and with the exception of people like khem Val and qyzen.

[Goretzu]

And yet armies still train soldiers in the use Bayonets as well as guns.

 

As is mentioned in SWTOR in places Ray Shields make people immune to blaster fire.

 

 

Yes, because it would be daft not to do so. Most armies will train their troops to use radios, that doesn't mean they charge into battle and throw radios at the enemy.

 

But again as history proved time and again all you get with bayoents (or swords or spears or even bows) vs guns is a lot of corpses on one side.

 

I've no idea why (or even how) you'd think it would be otherwise.

[The_Butler]

Well apart from the Lore reason mentioned above there would be many reasons why melee weapons would still be of use.

 

1) Stealth. All those lasers going pew pew make a lot of noise and light.

2) Limited resources. Bullets or energy supplies are often scarce - especially in most of the SW:ToR worlds we are sent to save. Being proficient in melee would make sense.

3) Since when is SW about realism? It's about things that look cool on screen and are interesting. Everyone with a blaster is not interesting.

4) Oh and as people have mentioned KOTOR had a reason which makes as much sense in a fantasy universe - the invention of personal shields narrowed the gap between the viability of blasters versus melee.

[BenjaminminU]

All the techblade/techstaff companions (except possibly Akavi Spar) were originally intended to be ranged characters, which is why you see Tanno Vik using his rifle in certain cutscenes, and why there is early pre-release footage showing Qyzen using a rifle to support his Consular partner.

Then the Devs decided that every class needed 1 melee and 1 ranged tank and DPS, and so they changed things around. I sort of wish they hadn't; it would be awesome to have Yuun next to me blasting away with a rifle instead of jumping in with a techstaff.

 

Yeah I agree, i wish they hadn't since it really is immersion breaking when Torian talks about practicing with a rifle, and then i take him off the ship and he starts swinging a bat around

 

I wish they would change a few things back to how they were before launch, Torian would still be a melee dps using a rifle if he used similar abilities to a powertech tank.