AHHHH, it burns!!! The Recruit gear does nothing!!!

[Pekish]

I am not sure the weak people should stay defending... defending is the place where u want few people but that can hold the ground till more come

 

if u are in recruit step up say it let ur team know u wont last long then stick urself to the healer and play protection with the big group your damage is useless but ur stun/slow/kb are as good as a WH stun/slow/kb

 

if u can guard then ur guard is as good as a WH guard

 

the problem with people in recruit is when they try to DPS or to defend in my opinion. the drop to fast and do zero damage

 

you should use all the skill that doesnt relate to damage that are as good as if u were WH... taunt slow interrupt all those things

Edited June 29, 2012 by Pekish

[vimm]

The goggles; they do nothing!

[Varicite]

I like that it took 15 posts for somebody to get this man a hug.

 

/hug

[DroidDreamer]

Once you realize that a fresh 50 in 50s bracket is the same as a level 10 in the 10-49 bracket then you will do better.

 

Change your mentality: stay in the back, pick off low health guys, timely cc. You will be able to contribute more to the warzone once you gear up.

 

No, it's not the same because a level 10's gear is Bolstered up to match higher level gear. I agree with your other points, though and what others have said about BM not being hard to obtain *now* after the server transfers made PvP pops easy to get.

[Malefik]

I am not sure the weak people should stay defending... defending is the place where u want few people but that can hold the ground till more come

 

if u are in recruit step up say it let ur team know u wont last long then stick urself to the healer and play protection with the big group your damage is useless but ur stun/slow/kb are as good as a WH stun/slow/kb

 

if u can guard then ur guard is as good as a WH guard

 

the problem with people in recruit is when they try to DPS or to defend in my opinion. the drop to fast and do zero damage

 

you should use all the skill that doesnt relate to damage that are as good as if u were WH... taunt slow interrupt all those things

 

This pretty much. The defensive lessons you learn now will serve you well later on. err..."remember what you have learned, save you it can" Hmmm....where did I hear that ? Its a game stick with it .

Edited June 29, 2012 by Malefik

[Belly]

Well, i'll have to be ok with the two hugs so far

 

At any rate, i've decided that until I get some decent gear i'll just do my best to be annoying. Luckily I can be of some use via taunts and guarding. Oh, and positioning to. Guardians are nothing if not mobile with the 2 leaps and all that.

[Keblitis]

/hug brochacho...

Yup, you're gonna get beat down for a day or two, just hang in there. Before you know it, you will be in full aug WH, face-melting the fresh recruits.

[JeramieCrowe]

Finally got to 50 and put on my spiffy new recurit armor. I figure, I can at least hold my own right?

 

NOPE!!

 

Seems like everybody on the other team has at least 18k HP, that was like the lowest I saw in about 15-20 warzones I ran. In some cases, it was just 3 or 4 GCD's and my poor little guardian was taking a trip to the spawn point. Whats worse, some of them simply ignored me, laughing at my small and puny lightsaber

 

I don't want any battlemaster nerfs or anything, can I just have a hug plx?

 

This is the concern I have about Expertise, period. What's going to happen when the next tier set comes out? Bracket level 50 PvP then? And the next set after that? Another bracket, segregating the pool even more?

 

Recruit-level PvP is already a chore, where you can contribute very little and just zerg like mad. Sorry, but that's not PvP...

[AngusFTW]

If you'd saved up your comms you could have had a piece of war hero gear and a piece bm gear..

[JeramieCrowe]

If you'd saved up your comms you could have had a piece of war hero gear and a piece bm gear..

 

This is assuming someone does significant PvP before 50. However, BioWare's goal (which had been working so far) is to get people who normally don't PvP to try it and like it. To encourage the casual PvP. Which many people wait until higher levels to do. Expertise, imho, works against that goal.

 

Especially given the sudden, quite noticeable, drop in viability from 49 to 50.

Edited June 30, 2012 by JeramieCrowe

[Sinemetu]

If you'd saved up your comms you could have had a piece of war hero gear and a piece bm gear..

 

I can see the BM item, but how do you get the WH item? That takes rated comms, right? And wouldn't I have to turn in my BM item to get the WH item regardless?

[cashogy]

This is assuming someone does significant PvP before 50. However, BioWare's goal (which had been working so far) is to get people who normally don't PvP to try it and like it. To encourage the casual PvP. Which many people wait until higher levels to do. Expertise, imho, works against that goal.

 

Especially given the sudden, quite noticeable, drop in viability from 49 to 50.

 

if you want to be effective in PvP, you need to get pvp gear. its not rocket science.........

 

i dont expect to be able to dabble into hardmode operations with my PvP gear, and you dont see me asking the devs to decrease the difficulty of PvE so that I can do it in lesser gear.

[JeramieCrowe]

if you want to be effective in PvP, you need to get pvp gear. its not rocket science.........

 

i dont expect to be able to dabble into hardmode operations with my PvP gear, and you dont see me asking the devs to decrease the difficulty of PvE so that I can do it in lesser gear.

 

I understand that. But PvP shouldn't be about gear, period.

[Crystabel]

If you were a fresh 50 before the free recruit gear you would know that recruit DOES make a difference. When I moved up from my regular gear and bought recruit I lasted longer than pre-recruit. Sure, it was still a semi-fast death, but it wasn't instantaneous. I just pushed through until I could get the battlemaster, and am still working on war hero.

[Omnistarr]

This is where you learn, my friend! I've done it once on my main (though, that was during the few weeks following launch proper and the token system was in use) and twice on my alts. Yeah, it sucks and you go down fast. But, you learn how to get the most out of your class in a very short amount of time. Also, you learn key survival techniques. There's more to PvP than charging in and trying to bash face, mate. I'm sure you'll be fine, just keep at it.

 

P.S.: If you want to see just how nice Recruit gear is, do some Warzones in PvP gear.

[Vaipyr]

855 (base damage) + 345 (bonus) + 18.20% PVP = 1425damage (14500HP)

980 (base damage ) + 430 (bonus) + 22.23% = 1725damage (18000HP)

1085 (base damage) + 500 (bonus) + 24.48%PVP = 1975damage (20000HP)

 

multiply the difference for 8 members...

 

just so you know this reflect similar on all classes

 

Best point made so far. This is why it really doesn't matter if you're in recruit gear or not, you're still a wasted slot on your team. You will die on demand and you will not kill anyone who's not in recruit gear. It's free so yeah might as well wear it, but it really does seem more of a value to take the credits instead and buy aug kits and augments for the BM gear you're saving up for with it.

[JeramieCrowe]

If you were a fresh 50 before the free recruit gear you would know that recruit DOES make a difference. When I moved up from my regular gear and bought recruit I lasted longer than pre-recruit. Sure, it was still a semi-fast death, but it wasn't instantaneous. I just pushed through until I could get the battlemaster, and am still working on war hero.

 

It's different now. Try a fresh 50 now, or put on your recruit gear now that almost everyone else is in WH.

[Jaiyne]

Just adding a ./hug.

 

My significant other actually geared out my alt Guardian as I don't have as thick a skin and he is used to telling people off

 

It took a week to get full BM and now she does fine - is already 1/2 WH as well. Full augments. I can play her without wanting to stab my eyes out.

[Vaipyr]

Just adding a ./hug.

 

My significant other actually geared out my alt Guardian as I don't have as thick a skin and he is used to telling people off

 

It took a week to get full BM and now she does fine - is already 1/2 WH as well. Full augments. I can play her without wanting to stab my eyes out.

 

Indeed, and your SO is a good man for doing that for you. Grinding up out of recruit gear was one of the worst wastes of time I've every had in the game. After the 10th match or so I just started putting the game on my second monitor and watching a movie instead, occasionally moving or auto attacking someone just to keep from getting the afk buff. Thank god for defender medals.

 

Once you hit full BM then it's actually fun to play.

[NismoGThirtyfive]

Just call them Moral Victories my friend:D

[Daikeru]

I don't know about you, but I started PvP at 10 on my Vanguard and Gunslinger and both were top damage, objectives, and medals frequently.

 

I don't know about you, but I'm pretty sure that lvl 20+ Vanguard/Gunslinger has more abilities and provide more utilities than yours does. In the 10-49 Q the difference between players isn't the numbers they dish out, it's the abilities they have at their disposal.

[Pekish]

ahaha in 10-49 like in 50 the is never the skill alone or the ability they show is always

 

gear>ability

 

play a lvl 15 in half green half blue with no head no earing no relic no implant

 

vs

 

a lvl 49 fully purple fully augmented

 

the lvl 49 probably can win in AFK leaving the cat pushing random botton on the keyboard with the tail

 

my lvl 15 decently geared with blue/purple in WZ has 13500K

my lvl 49 fully purple not augmente because i dont have time to waste is almost 17000K

 

and really i can 2 shoot or close to 2 shoot low lvl badly geared

Edited June 30, 2012 by Pekish

[RickyChavez]

At least as far as healer goes in recruit you can do about 80% of the healing someone in awesome gear can do. The big difference is your defense. In recruits I couldn't 1 v1 stalemate. Now I have almost full bm other then the implants and earpiece and I have the war hero mystic saber and none of it is augmented, and I can 1v1 most people and even survive a bit 2 v 1. My suggestion is if you are a healer, is to hide as best as you can so you don't get steamrolled.

[Navaris]

Tried recruit and then used my PvE campaign gear... Campaign gear gave me better results in the end according to about 3 different end scores with recruit and campaign gear, however it was with a GS DF.

[Alphasgimaone]

ahaha in 10-49 like in 50 the is never the skill alone or the ability they show is always

 

gear>ability

 

play a lvl 15 in half green half blue with no head no earing no relic no implant

 

vs

 

a lvl 49 fully purple fully augmented

 

the lvl 49 probably can win in AFK leaving the cat pushing random botton on the keyboard with the tail

 

my lvl 15 decently geared with blue/purple in WZ has 13500K

my lvl 49 fully purple not augmente because i dont have time to waste is almost 17000K

 

and really i can 2 shoot or close to 2 shoot low lvl badly geared

I don't think that's a fair analysis.

 

For one, your example is the exception and not the rule. Most 49s aren't going to have what you have. From my experience, it seems like the majority of people think twinking is not worth the money in this game--especially with all the gold sinks. So it's vary rare to see a 49 that decked out because he's saving his comms/cash for 50.

 

Heck, I've seen 49s that still haven't bought an expertise weapon yet.

 

And skill does still play a part, but as far as the original argument, I think some classes are better off at 10 than others. I think Shadow-sins and Van-techs are the obvious example here. Either of those well played can sill wreak havoc at ten and consistently score towards the top of the rankings while still being vary useful to the team, way more so than a fresh recruit 50. The is, of course, assuming you stick to the same basic concepts: focus fire and help burn down dying targets, don't Leeroy mid on ACW, etc.

 

And I've been able to solo cap with both classes at 10 against guys in the 30s or 40s.. I'd be the first to admit I'm a pretty bad player, so these guys must have been down awful. But it just shows that gear is not always > skill.

 

On the other end of the spectrum are Jugguardians. Especially for fresh players with out any money. They get off of the shuttle ready to give WZ a shot and they're a tank class still stuck in medium armor--something the bolster can never make up for. So they can't even play their assigned role. But that doesn't mean they can't sill dish out some timely damage/kills.

 

For one, and I really have no idea (just personal experience), it seems the bolster isn't totally linear. That is, they give an extra advantage the lower your level. It just seems to me that while leveling my Op, Backstab did (on average) more damage at 10 than it does now at 36 despite having speced for it. Of course, this could completely be my imagination.

 

On the other hand, I will admit, one huge disadvantage I've noticed here, is I think stealth checks are still based on natural level. Again, I could be totally wrong. But just last night I was in VS and I stealth and ducked down in a corner out of the way to wait for the guy to come and start capping a door. I expected him to run right past me, but he saw me a mile away and he was only 6 levels above me.

 

 

I understand that. But PvP shouldn't be about gear, period.

I'm still waiting for someone, anyone, to give me a reasonable explanation as to why there needs to be a special PvP stat at all.

 

This game is my first experience to PvP and as noted above, I'm still pretty terrible, but the logic just completely escapes me. I mean, unless I'm totally missing something, the whole thing ultimately ends up being a zero-sum. The only thing it does is feed peoples' desires to troll noobs.

 

I mean there's the obvious carrot and stick. But I don't see how that's necessary if they make a game fun enough for people to keep playing it for the excitement or just make special gear attractive enough for people to want to collect it just for the look. Instead they just put out over-designed garbage created by the same kind of talentless artists who put fins on cars just because.

 

And form what I can tell expertise is the number one killer of endgame OWPvP--or heck owpvp in general. I mean, once you get past the excessive faction segregation, similar level encounters do happen from time to time and can be fun--especially if the lower level defeats the higher level. But replay that scenario with a 49 vs a 50 in even the recruit stuff and it's pretty much faceplant.