Wheres all the excitement gone?

[Rethos]

WoW had a luxury that SWTOR doesn't have.

 

WoW didn't have to compete with WoW at release.

 

But didn't they have 5+ years in development to realize they were going to have to compete with WoW? Didn't they pick up development staff from other MMO's that launched competing against WoW and got their asses handed to them? The problem is Bioware's arrogance. I mean seriously? Launching with only one working raid and only the first boss of the second and customer service that refuses to provide in game resolutions to simple things like bosses not dropping loot in raids are just a few examples. How do you do that unless you suffer from complete stupidity or total arrogance?

[ISTrick]

I'm excited!! If that helps.

[Anti_Bodies]

Back in 2004? Fair enough back then. But its 2012.... they should have learned by now

 

Making games in 2012 is harder then in 2004 because their are tons of expectations and the technology is much more advanced.

[noodlehaus]

Making games in 2012 is harder then in 2004 because their are tons of expectations and the technology is much more advanced.

 

exactly. they know what they'll be competing against, have a good idea of what the player base will expect, and yet, here we are.

[Mashy]

Swtor is dying.

 

The population is suffocating, and the developers couldn't care less.

 

This pretty much. I have never seen such a tight lipped community team. I mean they don't even reply to any posts with even a joke or witty reply. It really fosters that `holier than thou`attitude that everyone hates so much. Honestly, after seeing end game and the lack of communication here, I hope the damn game tanks!... well, it looks like its going to anyways.

Edited May 16, 2012 by Mashy

[Kubernetic]

Excited right here.

 

Hit 50 a few weeks ago with my Commando.

Threw a bigass Star Wars Day party and gave out around 2 million credits worth of stuff.

 

And just finally made enough credits to purchase my first set of recruit PVP armor, so I can start getting into PVP. Let's hope that +900 points of Expertise helps me avoid becoming a mophead in matches...

 

 

This pretty much. I have never seen such a tight lipped community team. I mean they don't even reply to any posts with even a joke or witty reply. It really fosters that `holier than thou`attitude that everyone hates so much. Honestly, after seeing end game and the lack of communication here, I hope the damn game tanks!... well, it looks like its going to anyways.

 

Some perspective would help, I think. There's a player who posted a thread today stating that she has determined that the character transfer functions "will be" available on June 21st, 2012, and if they are even a day after that, they will be considered "late", since BioWare clearly said they would be available in "early summer", and June 21st is the last day of "early summer".

 

Additionally, since almost everything the Devs add to the game is met with a "You need to fix the broken problems in this game rather than adding this other stuff" response (or multiples), I'm quite sure a number of the Devs don't care to have every one of their posts met with "You should be programming and fixing this game, not playing around on the forums."

 

When the community on this forum lightens up, I fully expect that we'll see more Dev interaction here.

Edited May 16, 2012 by Kubernetic

[Encima]

Hype is always about games yet to be released, nothing new.

[Bleakmage]

Believe it or not, I have an easy solution that will work wonders:

 

Spread the word. Tell about the trial. Show your excitement. Know why that will work? All the servers will fill up so nobody has to leave the ones they love. If the servers are full and can stay full, you will gain a lot more than you lose if everybody puts the word out, and soon, your long-assed wait to try and get an operation going will be over, and I think alot of people either quit or stop playing much (I'm in the second category) when they have no one else to play/group/operation/pvp with. Alot of people have left, but how may have tried it out, and how many of those have stayed or came from exciting advertisements or word or mouth or whatever, ects ects

[Bleakmage]

Hype is always about games yet to be released, nothing new.

 

There was alot of hype when Dungeons in Dragons Online: Stormreach became Dungeons and Dragons Online: Unlimited or whatever anyway they have much fatter subs last I knew (which since I've started playing this, even in off and on mode these days, this is the only MMORPG I'm playing) and I practically own the game instead of ever having to have a sub there at least last time I 'updated' by buying the latest module at the time (Adventure Pack, whatever), well anyway, this game has much potential and the more that are playing is indeed the merrier when that means the more money they're making the more they can advertise the more they can add the stuff we all love the idea of eventually being in the game, and as it stands, you have 8, count them 8 buddy, different storylines you can pass the time with while you're waiting to be able to do operations as often as you can do PvP in the daytime.

 

Ok, that enough fat paragraphs for one day

[Bleakmage]

Hype is always about games yet to be released, nothing new.

 

Also, I like your avatar ;D

[Bafucin]

Best costum support ever. I report a bug and get back that I can use this forum for suggestions! It was a bug report for god sake! And the "robot" didn't know what NPC I was talking about. One NPC on Hutta, there is only one of that NPC.... do they just sit there and write mails?

[Bleakmage]

best costum support ever. I report a bug and get back that i can use this forum for suggestions! It was a bug report for god sake! And the "robot" didn't know what npc i was talking about. One npc on hutta, there is only one of that npc.... Do they just sit there and write mails?

 

rllmfaolawz

[EJedi]

But didn't they have 5+ years in development to realize they were going to have to compete with WoW? Didn't they pick up development staff from other MMO's that launched competing against WoW and got their asses handed to them? The problem is Bioware's arrogance. I mean seriously? Launching with only one working raid and only the first boss of the second and customer service that refuses to provide in game resolutions to simple things like bosses not dropping loot in raids are just a few examples. How do you do that unless you suffer from complete stupidity or total arrogance?

 

That is a moot point. For every year of development SWTOR had, so did WoW. BioWare was chasing a moving target.

 

WoW got to come out, get stable, remove several major bugs, then add six years of content AFTER release. Do you honestly think WoW didn't have any development time before its release in 2004?

 

There is no way any company can afford to release a game with the amount of content that WoW currently has. WoW has had years of $15 monthly subscriptions to help offset their continued development efforts. For every day SWTOR was in development, prior to release, BioWare was bleeding money. WoW was continuing to rake in tons of money that allowed them to keep raising the bar.

 

SWTOR is not perfect, and my subscription runs out in a few days. I hope they're able to keep enough subscribers to turn it into something I want to come back to play. I just don't have the time or interest to fund that effort.

 

I do sympathize with BioWare, though. I just don't sympathize with them enough to put up with the ME3 ending AND the crap coming out of SWTOR.

Edited May 17, 2012 by EJedi

[davidpop]

If all you're looking for is the 'hype factor' of a new release, then you'll be changing games every few months. Also MMOs may not be your style of game. Just sayin'

 

MMOs is my style of game, just there are no real MMOs left, they are all just co-op console games now

[Razot]

Just browsing through a few game news sites, and I can see NOTHING about SWTOR in the news, apart from the obvious 400k subscriber loss.

 

Its all about these new games coming out, why people are so excited for them etc.. A new year, a new chance for gaming. SWTOR is so last year (why right before new year? )

 

It seems like this game has just fallen into the shadows.

 

 

 

That pretty much sums it up ^

Cause everyone knows this is turning out to be another EA/Bioware Cash grab.

Copy paste WoW ,hype it up like crazy, sell some boxes recover losses, keep silent, and create crappy mini games with grinds to milk the base for all it can before you start getting into micro transactions for content and PTW models.

[Shonuff]

MMOs is my style of game, just there are no real MMOs left, they are all just co-op console games now

 

I think you hit an important note here. MMO's are not true MMO these days. Most of the questing, story, and content is single player. Your Class quest contributes to the majority of your leveling up. It use to not be that way. Back in the day if you wanted to tackle harder quest you had to go out in the woods and grind some mobs and upgrade your gear. That was the old fashion way.

 

Now everything is handed to you; complete single player quest and they give you gear to get to the next quest. You almost don't even have to buy any new gear really.

 

All the Multiplayer quest and content is at the end, only PvP really has purpose for playing early since Warzone Commendations are universally used from day one. Thats why more people do PvP than doing quest. You can even level up from 1 to 50 with PvP alone.

 

As a Console gamer, most of the multiplayer content is no different than what you see on home console games. A good example is Mass Effect 3. Very small Multiplayer content but the progression to get better gear and weapons is exactly the same. In a way it's eerily similar to SWTORS Gear Progression give or take.

 

MMO's are designed for Casual games now, just like every other game out their, you can thank Nintendo for that.

[Lazirus-]

* Yeah that is 100 players vs 100 player vs 100 players.

 

Sounds good on paper.

 

Much less enticing when you actually experience the massive zergfest which turns into a frustrating form of "Red Rover" in a sea of nameless faces and one second deaths.

 

Over and over and over again.

Edited May 17, 2012 by Lazirus-

[Nyteblades]

I think you hit an important note here. MMO's are not true MMO these days. Most of the questing, story, and content is single player. Your Class quest contributes to the majority of your leveling up. It use to not be that way. Back in the day if you wanted to tackle harder quest you had to go out in the woods and grind some mobs and upgrade your gear. That was the old fashion way.

 

Now everything is handed to you; complete single player quest and they give you gear to get to the next quest. You almost don't even have to buy any new gear really.

 

All the Multiplayer quest and content is at the end, only PvP really has purpose for playing early since Warzone Commendations are universally used from day one. Thats why more people do PvP than doing quest. You can even level up from 1 to 50 with PvP alone.

 

As a Console gamer, most of the multiplayer content is no different than what you see on home console games. A good example is Mass Effect 3. Very small Multiplayer content but the progression to get better gear and weapons is exactly the same. In a way it's eerily similar to SWTORS Gear Progression give or take.

 

MMO's are designed for Casual games now, just like every other game out their, you can thank Nintendo for that.

 

You know i have to agree with you. Some of the best memories i have of my mmo times. Was me and my wife with some more friends out in perma frost grinding frost giants . And just chatting it up with the other groups in the area about all sorts of things.

 

Yea it was a grind and sometimes a pain but man when you hit that right lvl and had a new class quest or a new epic quest. Then you and you guild/friends all piled in and raided parathor or avatar of hate (wich i despised) lol but loved the group effort.

 

Man you lost xps when u died or got death debt. Lost money and had to wait for CotH to get summoned back after repairs lol. Spent 4 days in mistmoores tomb rotating out with other firends just w8ing on his spawn for our shot at him lol.

 

Those was some of the best times i ever had playing a game and would love to see that again.

[Andryah]

MMO's are designed for Casual games now, just like every other game out their, you can thank Nintendo for that.

 

Not Nintendo per se, game boxes in general and the FPS mentality has settled into much of the MMO community.

 

That combined with years of WoW and you have what you have now. And successful MMO companies are going to face their products toward the audience, not try to reprogram the audience back to some sort of old school MMO approach.

 

The MMO community is becoming more of a consume and discard community because of all of this, whereas in the classic days of MMOs, people more often stuck with an MMO through good and bad for years. Of course the community was also much smaller.

[tloops]

That is a moot point. For every year of development SWTOR had, so did WoW. BioWare was chasing a moving target.

 

tor went into devolpement around the time lich king came out,so tor should have at least been on par with that expansion,which it still isnt. basic mmo features were excluded because of extensive voice acting,which was nice the first playthrough,but a spacebar exercise at this point. bioware is so far behind the times,they will never catch up.

[EJedi]

tor went into devolpement around the time lich king came out,so tor should have at least been on par with that expansion,which it still isnt. basic mmo features were excluded because of extensive voice acting,which was nice the first playthrough,but a spacebar exercise at this point. bioware is so far behind the times,they will never catch up.

 

It couldn't be on par with the WotLK expansion because the WotLK expansion had an extra couple of years development time after WoW's release. You forget that SWTOR started being built around the time WotLK came out. That means they had to start from scratch when Blizzard was continuing to add on new features.

 

They can't just magically create, in a couple of years what another company has been able to do in more than four. Everything they do takes time. All the time they spend is time the competitor can be doing more to raise the bar.

[Bleakmage]

You know i have to agree with you. Some of the best memories i have of my mmo times. Was me and my wife with some more friends out in perma frost grinding frost giants . And just chatting it up with the other groups in the area about all sorts of things.

 

Yea it was a grind and sometimes a pain but man when you hit that right lvl and had a new class quest or a new epic quest. Then you and you guild/friends all piled in and raided parathor or avatar of hate (wich i despised) lol but loved the group effort.

 

Man you lost xps when u died or got death debt. Lost money and had to wait for CotH to get summoned back after repairs lol. Spent 4 days in mistmoores tomb rotating out with other firends just w8ing on his spawn for our shot at him lol.

 

Those was some of the best times i ever had playing a game and would love to see that again.

 

Asheron's Call ~deep satisfied sigh~ This is the distant next best thing to it atm, and the potential with the Hero Engine makes the possibilities even greater that they may reach that plateau and surpass it, plus all the stuff we know from these days. When they're ready for your character to really make a difference, they'll start letting characters affect the storylines differently on every server, so they can surpass Asheron's Call's stated intention to do just that only to cheat the players of one server in the end and bring in a Digitally Acted Character played by a gm to cheat so they didn't have to do all the work they promised, and when some company is willing to go past that and do as intended (Oh, long lost almost-memories of Hero's Journey, the game that is the corpse this one spawned from, kinda) and push the boundaries and spend a little extra money on awesomeness it would go a long way to bring in more people than WoW who keep using the 'make it worse not better strategy' but when someone gets it right. . .this game has its chance, but if it can't do it all in the long run, at least for the time being, then its chance for greatness will pass and something else might maybe get us to those old great plateau's someday, and then beyond. . .~starry eyes~

 

Ahem.

[Bloodstealer]

Well I never said I would not try it.

* But knowing its going to use the same engine, really does not bring me any comfort.

 

Why didn't they use the "Cryengine 3" is well beyond me...

 

Of course you know all the ins and outs of the engine... you know how, seeing its now not a alpha or beta engine anymore, that a game producing company such as Bethsheda went about deciding on what engine was best for them.. of course you know all about what actually gets done to an engine during game development... and of course you know what BW did to an engine not even through Alpha test, how many years back, and you know what kind of experience they had to make it what it is today in SWTOR.... If you answered yes to any of that then I would be sure in saying Bioware needs your CV.... if of course (and much more likely) you know diddly squat about the engine and its capabilities, I would suggest you learn not to judge a book by its cover..

 

SWTOR was the first MMO to use the Hero Engine - taking an unfinished, untested product and worse still, closing shop and putting down the shutters so not even the experts who Knew the engine could have an input into how it was going to be re-worked, re-coded, re-hashed to get it to work in the game that we're now seeing...

Did Bioware have the necessary expertise, the time, the spark of genius required... we will never know but the performace of SWTOR speaks volumes... but until ESO is even close to putting something out there.... I take a more conservative view on the Engine and what is capable of doing.

[Bloodstealer]

Elder Scrolls arent sandboxes they're open world free-roam games, and they've said its in MMO. We all know Hero Engine allow to make huge zones already, no reason to doubt it. Bioware didnt understand Hero Engine's potential sadly.

 

I will go along with this, though I do not think Hero Engine is flawless either but I would hazard a guess that from where it was when BW took it and played with it to where it is now... I would hope that it has something pretty decent to offer,

Bethsheda like BW is a decent gaming outfit... but just saying your game is an MMO, doesn't always cut it, SWTOR imo is not an MMO but to others who see it differnt it is - ecxept there is something not right for it to be leaking subs at the rate it is doing so soon after launch.... almost like they went out bought the box, played the game, went out and bought the next.. much like an XBOX gamer does.

MMO's are tricksy things to get right for its numerous critics... actually millions of critics, if they get the sales and marketing right before hand .. but just cos BW or Bethdheda say its an MMO doesn't necessaily make it an MMO, certainly not one of choice anyway but I seriously hope ESO ticks more boxes for me cos I really enjoyed the earlier renditions of that series.... much like I really enjoyed the Baldurs Gates, NWN etc etc...

 

BUT thats just it those types of games are short term start to finish games... MMO's are not, they grow, they evolve, they change, they are meant to hook you in and try to keep you... for me SWTOR falls very, very short so early into its life, which makes me sad cos I grew up around Star Wars and had waited with baited breath for this MMO.. perhaps I set my expectations way to high but when I saw Bioware / Star Wars / MMO in the same sentence... wooohohoo was my impression, now its hmmmmmmm

Edited May 19, 2012 by Bloodstealer

[Bleakmage]

.. perhaps I set my expectations way to high but when I saw Bioware / Star Wars / MMO in the same sentence... wooohohoo was my impression, now its hmmmmmmm

 

I came at the opposite way. Loved Knights 1 btw but 2 was meh, never played the revamped version, but all that aside with whatevers and ects and all that, I thought it would be meh at first but when I started playing it well, though some things do need work, overall, this game is great, I don't care what anyone says. It worth my money, and I will keep feeding the beast as long as it feeds me