Beziel Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Down by 25% heh? And just by how much will it drop once the big titles of 2012 come out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKDeath Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Down by 25% heh? And just by how much will it drop once the big titles of 2012 come out? Probably by a lot. And then summer, and people who wouldn't have resubbed sudden;y all disapearing when the free month runs out... I still can't get over this chart. http://www.chartgo.com/savedcharts/ff183fffaa.png No game bounces back from that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valkirus Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 You know what the most stunning thing about this massive drop in subs is? Bioware has managed to lose this many subscribers in such a short period of time without any real new competition cropping up. Seriously, Skyrim came out a couple weeks before TOR launched in December and the only major PC release since then was ME3. TOR also launched right in the middle of the single biggest content lull n WoW's history, seriously Dragon Soul is an 8 boss dungeon with 90% reused assets Blizzard expected to last 8-10 months. They also had probably the best IP there is for an MMO in Star Wars and one of the biggest game development budgets of all time. And in the end an MMO which was supposed to rival WoW in popularity may end up being less successful than Rift in the long-term. Diablo 3 is coming out in 3 days and that's gonna take another sizeable chunk of people. But that's nothing compared to the downright brutal two-pronged pincer attack that's coming this fall that will be akin to American and Soviet forces closing in on Berlin at the end of World War 2. On one end there will be GW2 with it's no-sub model and pvp-centric gameplay which will tempt the PvPers away, followed by MoP where Blizzard actually learned their lesson on mistakes made during Cata and will have a new playable class and boatloads of new dungeons and raids for the PvE crew. A knockout one-two punch if there ever was one. I love this game, I really want it to succeed, but it's kind of sad watching it follow the trends of so many failed MMOs before it despite BW's excellent storytelling, Star Wars' great IP, and an insane budget. Bioware has about 3-4 months to fix this game, and I truly hope 1.3 and 1.4 deliver everything I hope they will and finally make this the game it should have been at launch. Because winter is coming and I'd really like to see TOR at least achieve strong niche popularity like Rift and EVE and not follow Age of Conan, Warhammer, Tabula Rasa, etc into oblivion. Excellent post. Mentioned are good examples why TOR may very well experence another 25% reduction in subs the next quarter. He expresses my feelings about TOR and what I fear may happen and what I want to to happen. Which is for TOR to become a strong successful game many of us feel it can be with the right additions and changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthVindictus Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Down by 25% heh? And just by how much will it drop once the big titles of 2012 come out? It's already lower, they used free months given out in April to pad their numbers, plus many people have already unsubscribed from their 6 month subscriptions, they're just riding out the time they already paid for. It'll probably be under 1 million subscriptions come august when the 6 months time out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostvein Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Sorry, TOR is not a Copy and Paste of WoW. And if BW/EA were trying to do that, they did a piss poor job of it. Quoted for lulz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowandiki Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA!!!! WoW has over 10m subscribers, has been going strong since 2004 and Activision ONLY counts paid subscriptions that have been active in the last 30 days. SWTOR has dropped to an alleged 1.3m subscribers, is 5 months old and EA are cynically including trial accounts and free gametime promotions as 'active subscriptions', including the free month they gave away (by SHEER COINCIDENCE) immediately prior to the quarterly report. LOL! Not true activision has played with wow's numbers for some time. I get and don't disagree with your general point wow has a lot of subscribers and losing 25% isn't the same as SWTOR losing 25% of subs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valkirus Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Not true activision has played with wow's numbers for some time. I get and don't disagree with your general point wow has a lot of subscribers and losing 25% isn't the same as SWTOR losing 25% of subs. I think that was his point. That for TOR to lose 25%, WoW during that same period ( everything esle being equal ) would have lost more than 25%. You can claim WoW plays with it's numbers, but really have no way to prove that other than speculation. From my experence atleast, Blizzard has allways been up front and honest about thier sub rates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demonwar Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Probably by a lot. And then summer, and people who wouldn't have resubbed sudden;y all disapearing when the free month runs out... I still can't get over this chart. http://www.chartgo.com/savedcharts/ff183fffaa.png No game bounces back from that. That chart is probably is little more than someone wants a argument to stick with numbers. Anyone can make something look good/bad with numbers, most if not all of those games would of been region releases i.e First US then EU/rest of the world. So not really a chart that be followed by the numbers increasing. Plus please tell me where those numbers for that chart came from? As the website is just a online host of charts....I could make up a chart and post it here....doesn't mean it's a fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkulous Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 I think that was his point. That for TOR to lose 25%, WoW during that same period ( everything esle being equal ) would have lost more than 25%. You can claim WoW plays with it's numbers, but really have no way to prove that other than speculation. From my experence atleast, Blizzard has allways been up front and honest about thier sub rates. Of course they've been honest with their numbers - there's nothing embarrassing about them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Down by 25% heh? And just by how much will it drop once the big titles of 2012 come out? Yep, just 25%. Rift's was down almost 58% at 6 months. TOR is quite above the typical MMO curve. They really have their work cut out for them, though, if they want to stop the downward trend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokar Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Yep, just 25%. Rift's was down almost 58% at 6 months. TOR is quite above the typical MMO curve. They really have their work cut out for them, though, if they want to stop the downward trend. according to MMOData it took rifts almost a year from release to drop to 250k from a peak of 600k over that first year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valkirus Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Of course they've been honest with their numbers - there's nothing embarrassing about them. Well...losing 1.7 million subs during a year or so..was not something they wanted to brag about. But they took it like a man and fessed up. Admiting they made too many mistakes with Cata. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkulous Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Well...losing 1.7 million subs during a year or so..was not something they wanted to brag about. But they took it like a man and fessed up. Admiting they made too many mistakes with Cata. yuppers:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalkobot Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Yep, just 25%. Rift's was down almost 58% at 6 months. TOR is quite above the typical MMO curve. See, I dont see it like that because things are not equal or the same and as a result things are quite relative. MMOs in 2004 had a much smaller potential audience than today, due in part by technology (a PC was still a luxury item) and due in part with infrastructure (reliable internet, SWG and WoW had 56k modems on their spec lists) . Whats a million subs today? 100k in yesteryear? A meg of ram in 1973 cost around $3million as an offhand example of how things change. (note - I appreciate that theres also more competition available now diluting potention customers) Anyway I digress, given the scope of potential suitors and the popularity of the IP involved I dont see anything special or curve breaking about SWTORs performance because it hasnt had anything similar to compare it to recently, Rift is a total no name IP and is quite incomparable. I actually cant think of a global IP in SWs league off hand, I would be interested if someone could actually convert past SWG data into todays figures as a percentage but Im no where near invested enough to do that myself. I see SW as a shinier Warhammer Online with less versatility and longevity as theres less scope for the players to carve out their own game due to the lack of PvP, just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arcdaemon Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 (edited) Yep, just 25%. Rift's was down almost 58% at 6 months. TOR is quite above the typical MMO curve. They really have their work cut out for them, though, if they want to stop the downward trend. You're wrong swtor shipped 2.2 million units they are down 900 thousand to 1.3 million that's a 41 percent drop. Edited May 13, 2012 by Zilrota removed insult Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostvein Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 (edited) You're wrong swtor shipped 2.2 million units they are down 900 thousand to 1.3 million that's a 41 percent drop 2.4 is rumored before launching in other countries. Edited May 13, 2012 by Zilrota removed insult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfeisberg Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 2.4 is rumored before launching in other countries. 2.4 Million is actually a fact, not a rumor, according to the Stock Holder information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfeisberg Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Yep, just 25%. Rift's was down almost 58% at 6 months. TOR is quite above the typical MMO curve. They really have their work cut out for them, though, if they want to stop the downward trend. SWTOR went down 25% in just under 3 months (Beginning of Febuary to End of April), not in 6 months. We don't know the exact number from December through the end of January, but they did sell 2.4 million, so that is 1.1 million that are not playing. With Rift, I don't remember Trion ever releasing numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 (edited) You're wrong swtor shipped 2.2 million units they are down 900 thousand to 1.3 million that's a 41 percent drop Oh, ok, if you want use box sales, then Rift sold/gave away almost 2 million boxes and has 250k subs after 6-8 months. That's a decrease of 87.5% Oh, look, TOR still above the curve. Edited May 13, 2012 by JeramieCrowe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalkobot Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 (edited) Oh, ok, if you want use box sales, then Rift sold/gave away almost 2 million boxes and has 250k subs after 6-8 months. That's a decrease of 87.5% Oh, look, TOR still above the curve. What curve are you using? Factored in a mega budget marketing campaign? Existing IP player base? Continued IP lease costs? I dont see how comparing totally dissimilar things infers any kind of curve at all. Are golfers ahead of the curve because they hit their ball more times than baseball players? Its totally asinine. Also you said lets compare sales then again didnt compare like with like, sales implies someone paid for the product, adding in imaginary "gave away" numbers is meaningless. Edited May 13, 2012 by Stalkobot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfeisberg Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 (edited) Oh, ok, if you want use box sales, then Rift sold/gave away almost 2 million boxes and has 250k subs after 6-8 months. That's a decrease of 87.5% Oh, look, TOR still above the curve. Any proof that Rift sold 2 million boxes? Please don't show the article about 2 million forum accounts, that includes people who signed up on the forums before the game even released, and they never got rid of those account before or after releasing the game. The 2 million forum account article is the only place where I see 2 million in relation to Rift. So please show where it talks about 2 million sales. Edited May 13, 2012 by Wolfeisberg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meluna Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Hello there, everyone! We recently had to remove or edit some posts in this thread. We wanted to take a moment and remind everyone of the Forum Rules and Guidelines. Please remember that members are allowed to disagree with one another - do not make personal attacks or derail the thread into semantics arguments. We understand that sometimes people will want to compare SW:TOR to other games, but we do ask that all posts are related to the original topic. Here are some quick examples to keep in mind when posting. Never insult another community member. Always discuss the topic and give constructive criticism. If you feel someone is violates the Rules of Conduct, do not reply to them; simply report (flag) the post. If someone is being disruptive, don’t feed them. Simply do not reply and report (flag) the post. Be respectful to all community members; while you may not agree with their opinion, you should not be rude to them.Thanks for your understanding, and please enjoy your friendly debate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikelGoff Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 SWTOR went down 25% in just under 3 months (Beginning of Febuary to End of April), not in 6 months. We don't know the exact number from December through the end of January, but they did sell 2.4 million, so that is 1.1 million that are not playing. With Rift, I don't remember Trion ever releasing numbers. That's saying that each box sold with TOR was to a different person. This is not the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostvein Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 That's saying that each box sold with TOR was to a different person. This is not the case. Well then, we can assume that the 1.3 mil remaining subs don't each belong to a different person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfeisberg Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 That's saying that each box sold with TOR was to a different person. This is not the case. Not talking about people, talking about subscriptions. Even then, more then 1 account per person is still pretty low in comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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