Operative Healers vs Sorcs/Mercs in PvP?

[mamosh]

I am kind of trying to understand the design intent with healers here and having a hard time wrapping my head around it. No, I'm not saying Nerf Operative Healers, just mainly the comparison between Sorcs and Merc healers seem skewed very greatly.

 

I don't play any of the above actively in PvP at 50 (Crafting Mules) so I am basing it on the healers I kill, and the ones we bring with our pre-made that keep me up.

 

Why take a Sorc or Merc over an Operative Healer?

 

Operatives have strong instant heals, mobility, and because of that need less baby sitting as they can kite and keep attackers off them for long periods of time while still healing up their team. They are also the hardest to kill for me (And this is coming from probably the highest burst class out there).

 

Sorcs and Mercs, while don't get me wrong, can heal very well, I just feel like their survivability is so much lower and they have a harder time healing around them when being focused. Which, in an active group environment is quite a hindrance. As an attacker it's relatively easy to kill either of those two and I do not have to rely on lucky crits to achieve it.

 

I just feel there is a strong disparity between OPs and the other two. I won't say if it's the fact OPs are too strong and need a "nerf", or the fact Sorcs/Mercs are too weak and need a buff.

 

What am I missing here between these Healers as to why I am gaining an opinion like this?

 

hmmm im running exact same spec as you and i have no problem killing any healers atm maybe the healer on our server just suck =p

[belialle]

As a Sawbones healer, I was considered Under Powered pre 1.2, but I thought I was doing just fine in WZs.

 

Post 1.2 I am considered Over Powered but feel like I am about the same as Pre 1.2.

 

Yes, I know exactly what you mean. My heals certainly aren't any stronger, and my energy basically works out the same in PvP as it did before. In PvE, though, energy regen does feel a bit nicer. Another thing that's changed is that I think there are a LOT more operative healers out there now than there used to be. Maybe a lot of the concealment ops swapped over to heals or something?

 

At any rate, individually speaking, the best PvP healers on my server before 1.2 are still the best PvP healers on my server after 1.2.....Sages, mercs, and all.

[Stavroz]

3. There are more Marauder's now. As a Sawbones I can survive w/o hard casts. Sages and Commandos are more reliant on Hard casts and a Marauder's 6 second interrupt will severely impact them. As a Sawbones, a Concealment Operative gives me the most problems, but they are in short supply right now.

 

As a Sawbones, I still envy the other classes at times. I have survivalbility and mobility, but they have some great utility. I have learned how to be effective in Huttball, but I would love the knockbacks, pulls and force speed of a a Sage. I would love to have the knockbacks and interrupt immunity shield of a Commando.

 

this part is true will agree.

 

But overall 3/4 war zones the op is the most effective. As a healer survivabily is key especially is per made vs premade games as healers are the most harrased classes with sage/sorc having the least survivabily in a group setting

 

Do not confuse this with 1v1 scenarios

Edited April 30, 2012 by Stavroz

[Digtahk]

If you want someone to keep your team alive at a vital point in a match Merc healers are still the best by some margin. They are still 2-300K behind in total healing capacity due to massive resource constraints but they have excellent burst healing and good defensive cooldowns. Often times I will find myself standing around in voidstar using autoshot just hoping someone will kill me because I have overheated badly and can't actually cast any heals.

 

In pugs operatives are great because most people don't actually realise they are healing until they see the scorecard after the match.

[Bazzoong]

I think at the moment anyone who has the choice would bring a IAmed/sawbones and a sage/sorc healer, to get both talented dispels and get the ideal mix between emergency healing and sustained healing, you also will not want to miss the sage/sorc utility on your team.

 

BH/trooper healers suffer because they do not have a spot in the ideal scenario. But then again this goes for a lot of other skill trees.

 

And bringing the player over the class will always reward you in the end, you will get friends and people who are willing to work more on your team this way.

Edited April 30, 2012 by Bazzoong

[pathiss]

As a Sawbones healer, I was considered Under Powered pre 1.2, but I thought I was doing just fine in WZs.

 

Only considered that by bad players. My operative was the best healer against skilled enemies pre 1.2 and even more so post 1.2. My sorcerer is worthless against anyone except for random bad players in a pug. My mercenary is at least viable as a healer, but I will play my operative over it any day of the week.

[pathiss]

I play sorc heals, 4/5 WH augmented atm rest is BM. Bubble+puddle = best thing ever and i always get around 500-700k heals per match (top in the WZ every time so far). But, I can easily be made useless by say a marauder due to interrupts and a good amount of sustained damage. Either way, every class has their advantage, and if you think a sorc healer isn't a good viable pvp healer option then I would have to disagree.

 

You are sort of right. A sorc still has the highest healing bandwidth or in other words, the highest healing potential. However, they have the absolute lowest throughput when fighting against competent players. There is no advantage to playing a sorc against competent enemies because you are too squishy and to susceptible to interrupts. In other words, a wasted slot.

[pathiss]

If you want someone to keep your team alive at a vital point in a match Merc healers are still the best by some margin.

 

No....

 

Op > Merc > Sorc

 

Bottom line against competent enemies for several reasons. I play all three healers, so I have a pretty good idea.

[jasta_]

If you want someone to keep your team alive at a vital point in a match Merc healers are still the best by some margin. They are still 2-300K behind in total healing capacity due to massive resource constraints but they have excellent burst healing and good defensive cooldowns.

 

Burst healing maybe but good defensive cooldowns??

 

A half hearted knockback, a laughable 25% damage reduction shield and... er... what else exactly? A single target stun once every 4 years?

 

My Jugg has great defensive cooldowns.... my Merc has virtually nothing. If someone gets in my face they can take me out of the game without breaking a sweat.

[veyl]

1) Bubbles save lives. Scoundrels don't have anything that can heal for enough instantly to save somebody who is dying and buy time for the big heal. Hoping EMP crits in a chain is not a reliable solution.

 

2) Salvation is the most efficient heal in the game. Seriously, this ability is awesome - you can drop it near a busy turret in Civil War and easily be healing 5 or 6 people at the same time for far from insignificant amounts.

 

3) Force Sprint on a 30s CD means that it is dubious that Scoundrels can escape better, or redeploy between locations better. Yes, a Scoundrel is better at spamming self-heals while kiting but we rarely actually survive that way unless another healer throws some love our way.

 

Don't misunderstand me, I love my Sawbones but the idea that a Sawbones is so much better than a Sage is a joke. They have different styles, ideally you want one of each as they compliment each other well.

 

1) 3.5k bubble that is gone in one hit and can't be reapplied to the target that you just "saved" for 17 seconds. You're comparing this to surgical probe? (emergency medpack for repub I think?) A spammable 2500 heal while your dots are ticking and continue to do so? The big difference here is that if you have 2 operative healers on your team, they're both hitting that button at the same time which results in a instant 5k heal (combined, both critting). Your theory on bubble keeping someone alive long enough for a big heal is laughable.

 

2) Yeah, it's the most efficient heal in the game : FOR PVE. In PvP , yes, it's great for healing mutliple people at the same time and padding your numbers. However, the total heal over the duration is a wopping 2500-3000 (because of trauma) and if anyone is being focused in that puddle of heals (even the healer) they are still going to die with the way DPS is currently.

 

3) Really sick of seeing Force Sprint as a "healer saving" comparison because everyone that I play with knows to root a sorc/sage the second you see the little white lines around them. And even if they managed to get a few feet away, the root is more than enough time to catch them and destroy them.

 

1 Operative Healer still heavily out weighs its buddy healers because of their mobility. Plain and Simple.

[KLGr]

my big question is where all the crybabies who were calling out Sorc/Sage nerfs pls.

they must have either left the game crying or finally got good enough to take one down and then chalk it up to 1.2 nerfs.

 

Nah... we are here being sustained by the delicious and super tasty sorc/sage tears. Good job BW. keep up the good work in balancing the heal classes. Btw, ops and mercs still need the one aoe ability we can spam and fill 1/3 to 1/2 of the whole raid's health bars in the middle of the fight and while hiding behind a pillar.

[Jenrais]

1) Bubbles save lives. Scoundrels don't have anything that can heal for enough instantly to save somebody who is dying and buy time for the big heal. Hoping EMP crits in a chain is not a reliable solution.

 

2) Salvation is the most efficient heal in the game. Seriously, this ability is awesome - you can drop it near a busy turret in Civil War and easily be healing 5 or 6 people at the same time for far from insignificant amounts.

 

3) Force Sprint on a 30s CD means that it is dubious that Scoundrels can escape better, or redeploy between locations better. Yes, a Scoundrel is better at spamming self-heals while kiting but we rarely actually survive that way unless another healer throws some love our way.

 

Don't misunderstand me, I love my Sawbones but the idea that a Sawbones is so much better than a Sage is a joke. They have different styles, ideally you want one of each as they compliment each other well.

 

Tell that to the top smuggler healer on my server who takes a year to die and does 500k healing a match =p

[IThrowRocks]

Iam so *********** tired see ppl all the time whine about *********** opratives! ****!! Leave those opratives alone! Your not happy before they are removed from game!!!!!!!

 

English is really hard isn't it?

[ChrisLBC]

You are sort of right. A sorc still has the highest healing bandwidth or in other words, the highest healing potential. However, they have the absolute lowest throughput when fighting against competent players. There is no advantage to playing a sorc against competent enemies because you are too squishy and to susceptible to interrupts. In other words, a wasted slot.

 

Only a wasted slot if the sorc healer is bad. But you're right as well, if there's at least 2 competent dps on their team and I don't have guard, I will last maybe 5 to 10 seconds if I'm focused

Edited April 30, 2012 by ChrisLBC

[TrumpetNut]

I actually made a thread about wether or not to make an operative vs. sorc. My sorc is 20 and I find myself walking in and getting killed by nearly anything FAST. il bump static barrier self heal get a tank on me and sometimes survive but overall it does seem like operative is way better by most aspects. I have a 50 mercenary heals and it is great but I even like my sorc more with LIGHT armor vs heavy and I will be making an operative prob too. Almost certainly the Sorcs/mercs heals need a buff and op shouldn't be nerfed.

[MidichIorian]

Nice necro ^^^!

 

And yes, ops healer is still the most OP AC in the game. Smash and bubble stuns dont even come close to the imbalance operative healers are bringing.

[LuciferinDNA]

Ops are fine, others are not.

 

this!