To the biased Sents/Maras defending their OP class

[Isislol]

I think every melee remembers the number of sorcs in every Huttball pre 1.2 spamming FL/knockbacks. Now that there's more maps and mindless knockbacks don't work anymore most sorcs die fast because they refuse to adopt to using more than 2 abilities.

So yea, come to forums and cry some more because you tried to hard cast vs mara who just popped Ravage.

[Seravis]

Haha the mythical 31/31/31 build! Complete with a 6 second root that doesn't exist, and about 2120 global cooldowns, half the CCs breaking on damage (making them worthless with DOTs, the main damage Sorc now does), and somehow not triggering resolve. All, incidentally, also with longer cooldowns than force leap.

 

Heck since you've got the Sorc having all of its possible talents, and a new made up one, might as well add Marauder Obliterate too, or maybe the Ataru speed boost, or Predation, the root on force charge, and then a new ability of some sort. There's also of course deadly throw, force crush etc.

 

The problem is not only do you not know the one class you do play, you don't know any of the other classes or simple system mechanics.

 

 

This is why you have so much trouble with Sorc and they kite you so easily. But you get mad when we try to tell you ways to deal with these things.

 

Oh well, whatever. I don't get kited, and I eat bad Maras like you for breakfast on any of my characters.

 

You are now more fun than the actual game's boring and shallow PVP. Congratulations I guess. Although I am a bit surprised the mods don't give you any infractions when you're constantly telling people they're bad, I bet I get an infraction for this post even though I haven't even called you a name like you constantly do to me. I guess the swtor mods know who pay their bills and will continue to pay them for years.

 

All of those abilities can be used with 17 points in lightning. Their is a 5 second root in the lightning tree btw. Not sure why you would think otherwise.

 

Also insults make your arguments seem more logical I heard.

Edited April 29, 2012 by Seravis

[Arzoo]

the 15% trooper/BH HoT is unbelievably lame.

 

It's hard to find a worse defensive cooldown except for... the tank spec cooldown they actually have to pay a talent to get.

Edited April 29, 2012 by Arzoo

[V-Serp]

All of those abilities can be used with 17 points in lightning. Their is a 5 second root in the lightning tree btw. You obviously don't even know the sorcerer class so why are you acting like you are in a position to balance classes?

 

Oh that's funny, I was going to let your last stupid post go but you had to respond.

 

You wrote 6 seconds, now it's down to 5 because you actually learned to read? Did you read the fact that it breaks on damage too?

 

Just like the blind does, which you probably don't even know how to "cast" on opponents? If you did you probably would know why it doesn't work well either. Also you probably don't know it has a debuff and can't be recast right away, and further it's another GCD anyway.

 

GCDs and all the CC possibilities to waste what, 12s, give full resolve, and do no damage, while the Mara can root for 2s on the force charge, and then leap back in...after 12s? And now the Sorc has no means of getting that Mara off of them, with full resolve, and ready to crush that squishy Sorc.

 

I can beat stupid Maras like you with my Sage because you don't know what you're doing. But I have zero problems getting in on and wrecking even good Sorc with my Mara, while you seemingly get kited and lose constantly.

 

And you think you're in position to tell people to L2P? Brilliant.

 

Once again, your posts are more fun than the actual game. And I actually play a Mara. It's just I actually play other classes, and understand multiple classes. You don't even know how a Mara works.

[Guioki]

5 second root does exist sorry for being 1 second off. Their is a talent in the lightning tree to add a 5 second root to your knockback.

 

Learning to use resolve is very important as a sorcer, and if you chain your CC in the wrong order you will fill the enemy resolve bar with sometimes just 1 CC(talented whirlwind fills the entire CC bar so you should never start a fight with it).

 

One decent order is

 

3 second blind + knockback/5 second root + another 3 second blind(bubble should be used twice in any fight if you prebubbled correctly)

 

That combo will give you 11+ seconds of CC every 20 seconds and won't even fill the entire resolve bar. Now you can use either your stun or mez at the end of it if you wish. If you start with the stun or mez you will fill their resolve bar too quickly, and they will likely overwhelm you.

 

 

All of your CC abilities except slow can be used to keep Marauders out of melee as well as give you time to leave melee.

 

The removal of chain lightning from Wrath procs did not destroy the hybrids single target dps. Also I will say it again. If you do not have 17 points in lightning you will lack the necessary tools to deal with Marauders effectively. If you want to do well against marauders then spec 17 into the lightning tree and learn to use your CC correctly, but don't go complaining about how you have no recourse to dealing with marauders because you don't feel like changing your spec.

 

Keep arguing for your 17 point lightning spec, 2 second snare on CT is far better then 3 second mez and is off the resolve bar.

 

Predictable CC > unpredictable CC and also you just gave your enemy max resolve at about 40% health, so stand by for a GBTF and him healing back up to half health while he wails on you. Oh you think you'll kill him in 20 seconds while you have him mez'd or snared in a breakable snare for 11 of those seconds? No your going to give him full resolve without having done any damage to him while his dots are ticking on you because you aren't actually attacking him?

 

Your theoretical CC does look really good... but that isn't how PVP plays out.

[Guioki]

All of those abilities can be used with 17 points in lightning. Their is a 5 second root in the lightning tree btw. Not sure why you would think otherwise.

 

Also insults make your arguments seem more logical I heard.

 

The original post said 6 second root, not 5, and everyone knows the 5 second snare breaks after 2 seconds if damage is done, and that to get the best out of having 17 points in lightning you have to use affliction, and to use affliction you break your mez and roots early.

[Guioki]

Assassins and power techs have a self heal which is just as good if not better than a defensive cd.

 

Certain mara specs have self healing too...

[V-Serp]

Keep arguing for your 17 point lightning spec, 2 second snare on CT is far better then 3 second mez and is off the resolve bar.

 

Predictable CC > unpredictable CC and also you just gave your enemy max resolve at about 40% health, so stand by for a GBTF and him healing back up to half health while he wails on you. Oh you think you'll kill him in 20 seconds while you have him mez'd or snared in a breakable snare for 11 of those seconds? No your going to give him full resolve without having done any damage to him while his dots are ticking on you because you aren't actually attacking him?

 

Your theoretical CC does look really good... but that isn't how PVP plays out.

 

You give him way too much credit. You didn't even mention the GCDs, the actual CDs, the Mara's Force Charge on 12s CD, the fact that you have DOTs ticking so those CCs are worthless. They don't look good at all if you know the class, the resolve system, think about damage, and actually play this game. And of course the Lightning turret that is the worst against Maras because of how stationary it is, and how easily interrupted that tree is so it's useless in PVP against semi-intelligent players.

 

But as I think it has been proven time and time again, this guy doesn't use interrupts and doesn't use defensive cooldowns with his Mara, and hence why he can be kited so easily. I think this stuff actually does own him. Remember he thinks UR and Force Camo both suck.

[Guioki]

You give him way too much credit. You didn't even mention the GCDs, the actual CDs, the Mara's Force Charge on 12s CD, the fact that you have DOTs ticking so those CCs are worthless. They don't look good at all if you know the class, the resolve system, think about damage, and actually play this game. And of course the Lightning turret that is the worst against Maras because of how stationary it is, and how easily interrupted that tree is so it's useless in PVP against semi-intelligent players.

 

But as I think it has been proven time and time again, this guy doesn't use interrupts and doesn't use defensive cooldowns with his Mara, and hence why he can be kited so easily. I think this stuff actually does own him. Remember he thinks UR and Force Camo both suck.

 

I think that you are absolutely right and 90% of the people on this forum play SWTOR in their browser and not in game.

 

(Ironic right cause I'm on the forums? lawl)

[Xerain]

Oh that's funny, I was going to let your last stupid post go but you had to respond.

 

You wrote 6 seconds, now it's down to 5 because you actually learned to read? Did you read the fact that it breaks on damage too?

 

Just like the blind does, which you probably don't even know how to "cast" on opponents? If you did you probably would know why it doesn't work well either. Also you probably don't know it has a debuff and can't be recast right away, and further it's another GCD anyway.

 

GCDs and all the CC possibilities to waste what, 12s, give full resolve, and do no damage, while the Mara can root for 2s on the force charge, and then leap back in...after 12s? And now the Sorc has no means of getting that Mara off of them, with full resolve, and ready to crush that squishy Sorc.

 

I can beat stupid Maras like you with my Sage because you don't know what you're doing. But I have zero problems getting in on and wrecking even good Sorc with my Mara, while you seemingly get kited and lose constantly.

 

And you think you're in position to tell people to L2P? Brilliant.

 

Once again, your posts are more fun than the actual game. And I actually play a Mara. It's just I actually play other classes, and understand multiple classes. You don't even know how a Mara works.

 

Oh yes on your sorc you dominate everyone and pew pew them down and on your mara you dominate everyone and pew pew them down, and on your vanguard you dominate everyone and pew pew them down, and on your merc you dominate everyone and pew pew them down because you're such and amazing player and can see that marauder is unbalanced but you pew pew everyone down no matter the class you play. No one is on your level.

[V-Serp]

Oh yes on your sorc you dominate everyone and pew pew them down and on your mara you dominate everyone and pew pew them down, and on your vanguard you dominate everyone and pew pew them down, and on your merc you dominate everyone and pew pew them down because you're such and amazing player and can see that marauder is unbalanced but you pew pew everyone down no matter the class you play. No one is on your level.

 

Obviously someone that can actually understand class imbalances and is good with one class will likely be good with multiple ones.

 

Only the people that need their class to be OPed in order to even be competitive will have serious trouble and only be able to use that one class.

 

I was in the closed beta and the classes overall haven't changed too much. Marauder has probably changed the most, but it was fine for the release build anyway. I played the class in beta and it was awful, you people have absolutely no idea.

 

The irony is that I insisted the Mara needed buffs to compete in those pre-release builds, and also the Jugg/Guardians. Who knew they'd actually listen, or maybe they didn't, and they just have no idea what they're doing. I thought pre-1.2 was very nicely balanced, maybe they just needed to buff up a few classes a little more, but what they did was instead a debacle. If this is how they're going to do things PVP will be a joke as they overreact and destroy balance every patch.

[Guioki]

Oh yes on your sorc you dominate everyone and pew pew them down and on your mara you dominate everyone and pew pew them down, and on your vanguard you dominate everyone and pew pew them down, and on your merc you dominate everyone and pew pew them down because you're such and amazing player and can see that marauder is unbalanced but you pew pew everyone down no matter the class you play. No one is on your level.

 

It wouldn't surprise me, most games are like this. Some people just have better reflexes or character control so it doesn't matter what class they play they will dominate.

[Xerain]

Obviously someone that can actually understand class imbalances and is good with one class will likely be good with multiple ones.

 

Only the people that need their class to be OPed in order to even be competitive will have serious trouble and only be able to use that one class.

 

I was in the closed beta and the classes overall haven't changed too much. Marauder has probably changed the most, but it was fine for the release build anyway. I played the class in beta and it was awful, you people have absolutely no idea.

 

The irony is that I insisted the Mara needed buffs to compete in those pre-release builds, and also the Jugg/Guardians. Who knew they'd actually listen, or maybe they didn't, and they just have no idea what they're doing. I thought pre-1.2 was very nicely balanced, maybe they just needed to buff up a few classes a little more, but what they did was instead a debacle. If this is how they're going to do things PVP will be a joke as they overreact and destroy balance every patch.

 

I was in closed beta also and nothing has changed with marauders. We've got a few little quality of life changes and that's it, everything has been the exact same since 1 or 2 builds before release build. Took my marauder to 50 three times in beta and my Sentinel to 50 once in beta and it's the same.

 

If you insisted that mara/sent needed buffs then you are probably terrible at this class, it was fine then, it was fine from release, and is fine now as it always has been.

 

And yes i agree pre 1.2 was pretty nicely balanced and sure a few classes needed tweaks but nothing extreme and I still don't feel anything really needs to happen now post 1.2.

[Xerain]

It wouldn't surprise me, most games are like this. Some people just have better reflexes or character control so it doesn't matter what class they play they will dominate.

 

It was partly a joke and yes if a good player can play different classes and succeed the same with all of them then the game is probably pretty balanced, it's just other people are bad.

[V-Serp]

I was in closed beta also and nothing has changed with marauders. We've got a few little quality of life changes and that's it, everything has been the exact same since 1 or 2 builds before release build. Took my marauder to 50 three times in beta and my Sentinel to 50 once in beta and it's the same.

 

If you insisted that mara/sent needed buffs then you are probably terrible at this class, it was fine then, it was fine from release, and is fine now as it always has been.

 

And yes i agree pre 1.2 was pretty nicely balanced and sure a few classes needed tweaks but nothing extreme and I still don't feel anything really needs to happen now post 1.2.

 

No that's wrong, Georg himself talked about the major reworking he did for that last build or two in beta. What you call "quality of life" are major changes, just calling it something else won't change anything and just makes you look ridiculous.

[Xerain]

No that's wrong, Georg himself talked about the major reworking he did for that last build or two in beta. What you call "quality of life" are major changes, just calling it something else won't change anything and just makes you look ridiculous.

 

No that's what he said, go read through your dev tracker. Talents getting moved to different places so trees like carnage and rage could access something that was far too important for the class over all and a point off of our intimidating roar and kick (juggs did get the last two also) didn't make the class go from complete crap to omg amazing.

[Derian]

Haha the mythical 31/31/31 build! Complete with a 6 second root that doesn't exist, and about 2120 global cooldowns, half the CCs breaking on damage (making them worthless with DOTs, the main damage Sorc now does), and somehow not triggering resolve. All, incidentally, also with longer cooldowns than force leap.

 

Heck since you've got the Sorc having all of its possible talents, and a new made up one, might as well add Marauder Obliterate too, or maybe the Ataru speed boost, or Predation, the root on force charge, and then a new ability of some sort. There's also of course deadly throw, force crush etc.

 

The problem is not only do you not know the one class you do play, you don't know any of the other classes or simple system mechanics.

 

This is why you have so much trouble with Sorc and they kite you so easily. But you get mad when we try to tell you ways to deal with these things.

 

Oh well, whatever. I don't get kited, and I eat bad Maras like you for breakfast on any of my characters.

 

You are now more fun than the actual game's boring and shallow PVP. Congratulations I guess. Although I am a bit surprised the mods don't give you any infractions when you're constantly telling people they're bad, I bet I get an infraction for this post even though I haven't even called you a name like you constantly do to me. I guess the swtor mods know who pay their bills and will continue to pay them for years.

 

You use Undying Rage at 66^ health, you are not good. lol.

 

Below is not the post of a marauder/sentinel that knows what they are doing. Warning, it's ugly.

 

lolol eventually you crappy players will probably figure out how to use this ability correctly. Probably though instead you'll be complaining the game sucks because all the other Maras will be using it on you.

 

PVP medpacs have a 1.5 min cooldown now, which matches with UR perfectly. When you are down to about 66% health you might as well pop UR because it's 5 seconds of immunity and a medpac will take you right back to the HP you had before you used it. It is highly unlikely that you will find a better use for the medpac than to consistently use it in this method.

 

I abuse the hell out of this, even if people are blowing all their CDs, all it does is buff up my resolve or make me use a CC breaker while I pummel an opponent. Chances are he's slowed and I am just wailing on him, and he will die and I can heal up out of combat. Also I use Anni so my bleed effects heal me anyway. Usually I don't even have to use the medpac but I get free kills out of this. Worst case scenario I just stealth and position better. The best Maras also constantly use the stealth offensively to get yet another free gap closer and generally to slow or force choke out of it, or reduce accuracy etc. So many things you can do if you are intelligent.

 

That 50% HP drop is absolutely worthless. You are far more likely to lose that amount, and more, not using the ability everytime it's up. Anytime my health dips and I think it'll be useful, I will just pop it, I'd much rather my opponent is on the defensive rather than myself being pressured.

 

Also, if you have a healer, and usually there will be one, it gives them plenty of time to heal you. Further, I love watching people try to go after a healer and just ignore me completely. I will kill you trying to chase a healer every time, you'll never get by just ignoring me and tunneling after a healer.

Edited April 29, 2012 by Derian

[Derian]

Certain mara specs have self healing too...

 

No, really? I didn't know that. Dark Charge is much better though.

[Derian]

I was in closed beta also and nothing has changed with marauders. We've got a few little quality of life changes and that's it, everything has been the exact same since 1 or 2 builds before release build. Took my marauder to 50 three times in beta and my Sentinel to 50 once in beta and it's the same.

 

If you insisted that mara/sent needed buffs then you are probably terrible at this class, it was fine then, it was fine from release, and is fine now as it always has been.

 

And yes i agree pre 1.2 was pretty nicely balanced and sure a few classes needed tweaks but nothing extreme and I still don't feel anything really needs to happen now post 1.2.

 

Same. I always argued against people who said we needed buffs.

[Derian]

No that's wrong, Georg himself talked about the major reworking he did for that last build or two in beta. What you call "quality of life" are major changes, just calling it something else won't change anything and just makes you look ridiculous.

 

The major reworking never happend. Zen/GBTF etc came before the "Reworking" message, and those abilities were Sentinel only, the reworking was JK/SW wide. There was no re working and a lot of people were upset about it because they were bads and thought SW/JK were bad classes.

[xxIncubixx]

its a tool to survive not to deal dmg, so it should also have at least 50% outgoing damage reduction, even then it would still be OP.

[V-Serp]

The major reworking never happend. Zen/GBTF etc came before the "Reworking" message, and those abilities were Sentinel only, the reworking was JK/SW wide. There was no re working and a lot of people were upset about it because they were bads and thought SW/JK were bad classes.

 

What a load of garbage. You must have just been on weekend betas a month before release. I tested from about 6 months before release, the changes were drastic.

 

But you and others have constantly been caught outright lying, so I guess there's no reason to expect that to change. I doubt anybody reading these posts still believes the three of you has a shred of credibility, especially after a few of us exposed major inaccuracies in the past page or two.

[DynamiCtagez]

YAWN. Another QQ-Thread.

[Raansu]

its a tool to survive not to deal dmg, so it should also have at least 50% outgoing damage reduction, even then it would still be OP.

 

Then all hard stuns should have the same damage debuff. I mean clearly it's unfair that you can stun me and and blast me down while I have to chase you down while being knocked back after I pop GBTF.

 

/sarcasm.

[Blloodbane]

its a tool to survive not to deal dmg, so it should also have at least 50% outgoing damage reduction, even then it would still be OP.

 

Ehhhhh just because something gives you an ability does NOT make it an defensive or offensive in nature.... UR or GBF is MEANT to be used offensively so you can stand a little longer and do more DPS...

 

Its like going beserker for beserkers... Ever play DnD or similar games?

 

You think something that sucks half your life for a 50% DR for 5 seconds would still be OP... It would make it worthless...

Edited April 29, 2012 by Blloodbane