The end of the arguement. Is SWTOR in decline? Can it be saved?

[Elgarr]

And as you leave, 5 more new accoutns have subscribed

 

have a nice day

 

Have you ever had a dream Daylin, that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to wake from that dream? How would you know the difference between the dream world and the real world?

[Gungan]

And as you leave, 5 more new accoutns have subscribed

 

have a nice day

 

No they haven't.

 

My usual Best Buy has like 5 copies of SWTOR and have taken down all the advertising material.

[Ansultares]

Boy, people are so quick to believe the worst.

 

FWIW, just got the email about the pet a couple hours back.

The way it is worded suggest you need an active count with either paid game time in excess of 30 days or with your billing information saved and your account set to automatically bill.

 

If you're one of those people who remove your CC information after making a payment, you may not (and very likely won't) receive any free game time.

 

I don't know that I even received the free day offered as compensation for last week's downtime, given the wording they used.

 

All I know is, I was "active" enough to count amongst their 1.7M figure, but I'm not "active" enough to qualify for their giveaways. So, while I was on the fence about re-subbing for the one month interim between now and D3, this was just enough to make me say to myself that I don't want to be included amongst their second quarter statistics which they're obviously so desperate to inflate.

[Pantheros]

"The site claims Battlefield 3, which it spent $30 million marketing and only generated $13 million from, and Star Wars: The Old Republic, which received similar treatment and has supposedly already seen subscription numbers decline"

 

Eh, I don't claim that subs haven't dropped, but nobody has numbers. At least some figures were provided for BF3.

 

No, Battlefield 3 sold 13 milliion units, which is $780 million in revenue.

[ZeusThunder]

"The site claims Battlefield 3, which it spent $30 million marketing and only generated $13 million from, and Star Wars: The Old Republic, which received similar treatment and has supposedly already seen subscription numbers decline"

 

Eh, I don't claim that subs haven't dropped, but nobody has numbers. At least some figures were provided for BF3.

 

Did BF3 sell for $1 each? BF3 sold 13 million units, not generated $13 million. Kind of a big typo there in the article.

[Elgarr]

Did BF3 sell for $1 each? BF3 sold 13 million units, not generated $13 million. Kind of a big typo there in the article.

 

Not if it cost nearly as much to make as what they sold it for.

 

Let's be honest, these games aren't cheap to make after all, generating 13 mill profit (if that's what it's supposed to mean,) isn't that far fetched. Also 13 mil profit for a company as big as EA is nothing special, it's all bout the bottom line after all.

Edited April 18, 2012 by Elgarr

[Pantheros]

Not if it cost nearly as much to make as what they sold it for.

 

Let's be honest, these games aren't cheap to make after all, generating 13 mill profit (if that's what it's supposed to mean,) isn't that far fetched. Also 13 mil profit for a company as big as EA is nothing special, it's all bout the bottom line after all.

 

The statement which he was reffering to in the first article was a misquote from the source article. The source article said 13 million units were sold and $30 million was spent on marketing.

 

That being said I don't think a game that sold as well as BF3 could have been a financial failure without some really serious mismanagement.

Edited April 18, 2012 by Pantheros

[Elgarr]

That being said I don't think a game that sold as well as BF3 could have been a financial failure without some really serious mismanagement.

 

EA = nuff said

[Holden_Dissent]

Have you ever had a dream Daylin, that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to wake from that dream? How would you know the difference between the dream world and the real world?

 

You've been down that road Elgarr, you know that road, you know exactly where it ends. And I know that's not where you want to be

Edited April 18, 2012 by Holden_Dissent

[XenonTitanium]

At 7:30am Central Time today, there were 2 people on the Republic Fleet on my server. Someone explain to me how any game can advertise playable content with 2 people online? That right there tells you a lot on some of the problems that desparately need to be fixed.

[DragoAskani]

At 7:30am Central Time today, there were 2 people on the Republic Fleet on my server. Someone explain to me how any game can advertise playable content with 2 people online? That right there tells you a lot on some of the problems that desparately need to be fixed.

 

7:30am.

 

See thats the problem you have unrealistic expectations.

 

At 7:30am Fatman had 38 people on the fleet and no one wanted to do anything that early cause they had to go to work/class/etc soon. So guess what? The most jam packed server in the game no one could be ran with either.

 

You need more realistic expectations in life.

[Elgarr]

You've been down that road Elgarr, you know that road, you know exactly where it ends. And I know that's not where you want to be

 

I'd ask you to sit down, but, you're not going to anyway. And don't worry about the vase.

[Pantheros]

7:30am.

 

See thats the problem you have unrealistic expectations.

 

At 7:30am Fatman had 38 people on the fleet and no one wanted to do anything that early cause they had to go to work/class/etc soon. So guess what? The most jam packed server in the game no one could be ran with either.

 

You need more realistic expectations in life.

 

Well at prime time most servers don't even reach 38 players so what does that tell you?

[faymar]

Well at prime time most servers don't even reach 38 players so what does that tell you?

 

That you make crap up?

[vsalcedo]

I just canceled, no reason just boredom from lack of anyone else I know still having a subscription.

 

And even when we did play the game together we didnt actually do anything together. The game encourages you to play solo. I am not running around an MMO anymore wasting hours trying to find a healer exc exc.

 

Why didn't you make a healer class or yourself or wait for buddies to hop online to run flashpoints. The game is what you make it I group up regularly even on a low pop server.

[vsalcedo]

7:30am.

 

See thats the problem you have unrealistic expectations.

 

At 7:30am Fatman had 38 people on the fleet and no one wanted to do anything that early cause they had to go to work/class/etc soon. So guess what? The most jam packed server in the game no one could be ran with either.

 

You need more realistic expectations in life.

 

lol fatman has over 100 at 7:30 am.........I know I'm one of those people.

[ROSS-]

At 7:30am Central Time today, there were 2 people on the Republic Fleet on my server. Someone explain to me how any game can advertise playable content with 2 people online? That right there tells you a lot on some of the problems that desparately need to be fixed.

 

this is not a problem of "game content" imo. rather, subscriber management. I think BW has done great with the former and not so great with the latter. I'm starting to wonder if they have anyone in charge with significant MMO experience, becase they seem oblivious to what's going on. This server issue is a big deal and they don't seem to have a clue what to do.

[DarthVindictus]

Here is what was actually said:

 

"As John stated, we have sold through 2 million units of the game since December. We currently have a little over 1.7 million active subscribers. The rest have either not started playing yet or have opted out. This is an outstanding start for an MMO, and the metrics on engagement suggest players are loving the game." [Frank Gibeau, President EA Labels, February 1, 2012]

 

What does this mean in plain English?

 

1. The gap of 300,000 includes both players that have opted out of a subscription and players who never started. There are a number of reasons for the latter: Lack of time, change of plans, hardware incompatibilies, etc. I personally have a bunch of games that I owned for quite some time before I started playing them. The fact is that there is no information on what share of the 300,000 opted out and what share never started playing.

 

2. Practically all MMOs include 30 days of play with the purchase of the game. Enjoyment of games is highly subjective. Just as there are many players who don't play single-player games to completion, there will be players who, for whatever reason, are not sufficiently attracted to a particularl MMO to keep subscribing. Assuming, for argument's sake, that all 300,000 consist of players who opted out, this still represents a capture rate of 85%, which is deemed excellent for an MMO.

 

What this means in plain English is that you have your head in the sand.

 

Stage 1 of dealing with grief: Denial.

[unseenmaji]

Why are all the BioWare crusaders and apologetists saying these sources are not reliable? We have confirmation from EA that they are indeed laying off 500 - 1,000 employees (to be expected, the EA PR machine has already spun this layoff as a "restructuring plan where we expect to recuperate the number of people being shifted around by the end of the year") and that poor performance for BF3 and SWTOR is reflected by the huge losses resulting from a huge investment on marketing strategies which are not returning a proper return on investment.

 

1.2 was not the resurgent patch that BW was looking for. This is obvious by the free month of gameplay to keep a hemorrhaging playerbase from dwindling even faster. You can ignore all of the complaints you want from all the people who are having a dismal gameplay experience on low populated servers and the innumerable number of players who are dissatisfied to the game but that would be turning a blind eye to very real issues facing this game in both the short-term and the long-term. Although the forums are probably frequented by a minority of the playerbase, there is still a sufficient number of players to draw a population sample from which would accurately predict the sentiments players are currently having and whether or not this indignation can be statistically projected to result in unsubscribing. Player complaints are not superficial either; they demand answers to very obvious issues.

 

Let's not forget that BioWare has to compete with Diablo 3 next month which is the behemoth to compete against for every single game developer this year -- add GW2 to this furious battle between game developers and SWTOR finds itself in an extremely competitive market.

 

Investors are not dumb. Within two weeks of the game's release, Brean Murray Carret & Co (a reputable investment banking firm) quickly "issued a note to investors on Thursday morning, slashing its price target on EA stock from $22 to $28. Analyst Todd Mitchell said he had “creeping concerns” over Star Wars: the Old Republic’s profitability." These investors did not re-issue another note even when the numbers for February were released. They know this game had too many issues when it came out and no amount of post-release patching was going to save it.

 

EA has already made its initial ROI on this game. But, internally, the management is obviously not happy with the subscription numbers (as expressed in the article linked by the OP) and seem extremely wary about the future health of this game. When the developers include a "preview pane" for the Legacy abilities to come out in 1.3, it's quite pathetic that they need to show players future updates to hopefully keep people playing for their subscriptions for the incoming new features.

 

IMO, the omission of Ranked WZs and a complete destruction of the finely crafted class balanced present pre-1.2 has damaged the game beyond repair.

 

Anyways, I'll be here until Wednesday. Then my subscription is over.

 

Yes finally someone whom can think indeed.

[DarthSublimitas]

I think the Titanic had a better chance at being saved than this game but then again, this game is called the "TORtanic" anyway...

 

Some things were meant to last, WoW, EQ franchise, and some things were meant to go down faster than a $2 whore. It's just the nature of the beast....

[Pantheros]

That you make crap up?

 

Check for yourself, it's really not that difficult.

[Kthx]

Well at prime time most servers don't even reach 38 players so what does that tell you?

 

Data? Citation? Anything to prove that this is not a completely made up statement?

[Kthx]

What this means in plain English is that you have your head in the sand.

 

Stage 1 of dealing with grief: Denial.

 

Stage 1 in losing a debate: Name calling.

 

If you can find any factual errors in my posting, please point them out.

[Kthx]

No they haven't.

 

My usual Best Buy has like 5 copies of SWTOR and have taken down all the advertising material.

 

I'm not sure what we are supposed to learn from the inventory at one store. It is, however still the number #6 best selling PC game on bestbuy.com. I have a sneaking suspicion that those who buy the game also create accounts to play...

[Plautus]

Bioware has done a lot right with SWTOR, but the declining subscriptions are entirely on them...there's not a better competitor sniping subs. The biggest issue I see is responsiveness to issues, as in they have none. On my main, I somehow got a class quest twice. I could only complete it once, after which my story progressed beyond the point at which I could complete it...though there was a weird point where I had both phases of the story going at the same time, and both required me to talk to the same guy, but he was about 15 feet away from where he'd been originally, so I had two copies of them, only the "fresh" copy interactable. I submitted a ticket and was told "Sorry, we can't remove that quest from your log. Too bad". Similarly, the imperial side daily on Ilum that gets bugged out every reset. It's a wholly uncomplicated mission...interact with thing on ground, fight x mobs (or x time) defending it. Profit. 3 months after release it *still* hadn't been corrected, and their only response was "known issue, we're investigating." Meanwhile, one faction can't earn as many daily commendations as the other, because there's a flaw in one of the few things for a level 50 to do. Ilum was a good example in general of Bioware's basic approach of "do nothing until we absolutely, positively have to...then kneejerk like its a brand new issue and do the wrong thing."

 

If I leave, it'll be because Bioware doesn't care to fix their mistakes, not even the easy ones.