Wolfninjajedi Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 (edited) Yoda is a great Jedi warrior not a pacifist./QUOTE] Um no. Read up on Yoda. Watch Episode V and VI. Explore the EU. Then tell me he's "not a pacifist." The entire Dooku fight makes zero sense. As does everything Yoda does in episode 3. It destroys his entire character. For Yoda, the prequels are Highlander 2. What makes him a pacifist, you think? Last I checked, theres no evidence of jedi being complete pacifists, they fight when needed they just don't fight if its not necessary. Edited April 14, 2012 by Wolfninjajedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ISDEnterprise Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 (edited) Yoda might have come toe-to-toe with Dart Sidious, however Master Windu utterly defeated him. I'm sick of seeing this said everywhere. It was clearly an act. Sidious literally let himself appear to be defeated to finish turning Anakin to the Dark Side. Sidious is the King of manipulation. He manipulated the situation in his favor. Edited April 14, 2012 by ISDEnterprise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayla_Felana Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 I'm sick of seeing this said everywhere. It was clearly an act. Sidious literally let himself appear to be defeated to finish turning Anakin to the Dark Side. Sidious is the King of manipulation. He manipulated the situation in his favor. Lucas in the RotS 2005 commentary would like a word with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 I'm sick of seeing this said everywhere. It was clearly an act. Sidious literally let himself appear to be defeated to finish turning Anakin to the Dark Side. Sidious is the King of manipulation. He manipulated the situation in his favor. The duel itself wasn't an act, the last bit of it was when he was on the floor begging Anakin to help him. That was the manipulation part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thelna Posted April 15, 2012 Share Posted April 15, 2012 1. Yoda vs. Dooku: Dooku could not carry yoda's jock strap in a dump truck. Meaning: Sideous glammered Dooku into thinking he could compete on the level of yoda. (side note - even the most skilled and force guided jedi can be caught in a trap and killed. Yoda knew this, and let Dooku know that he almost got the drop on Yoda. Too late for Dooku, but it probably helped him sleep a tiny bit better that night.) Once again, Yoda using only the light side of the force can kick Dooku's ***. If yoda mixed in the dark side, the fight Dooku had with Anikin would seem like a mercy killing compared to what yoda could do. 2. Yoda Vs. Darth Sideous: Sideous wins. If yoda could have killed Sideous, he would have. No questions asked, no exscuses made, sidous simply was more powerful then Yoda at that time. (it was said that the Force told yoda that he had never had a shot at beating Sidous, but this might have meant more then just armed combat. But, beyond a shadow of a doubt, the force let Yoda know that he would die if he fought Sidous.) Credit Yoda with being so in tune with the force that he could understand the outcome of the fight, long before it was too late for him to come up with a plan "B". Most jedi, the force tells them they are going to lose, but this awareness comes in the closing minutes of the fight, and there is no plan "B" available.) Take a big sniff, Yoda is The Pooh. 3. Mace windu Vs. Sidous: Movie and book both have mace beating sidous. Mace never got notification from the force whether he could beat Sidous or not. Mace did not care if he could beat anyone, mace's style was to use the force to make him win. Aka the dark side. very dangerous indeed is this path. In the end, he lost because he lacked the awareness to let the force guide him to the right path. instead, what mace does- is peek into the force, check out what makes the most sense to him and then force that outcome to his advantage. Unfortunately he needed to look at Anakins importance and not Sidous. 4. Obi Wan vs all. the only reason Obi Wan lost to Vader, was because the force told him to. That is my take on just how serious Obi wan was. His connection to the force was equal to Yoda and only Luke skywalker has shown similar connection. Vader could have gotten there, but he went dark side. No dark side user can ever connect to the force like a light side user can. The dark side user simply does not care if something might not go their way, because they ARE going to MAKE it go THeir way. - Obi wan, to me is the scariest of all the jedi to get into a fight with. He simply did what the force told him to do. But sideous was more powerful than him and obi wan probably would have lost the fight also, but that would have been up to the force. - hee hee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thelna Posted April 15, 2012 Share Posted April 15, 2012 (edited) Yoda is a great Jedi warrior not a pacifist./QUOTE] Um no. Read up on Yoda. Watch Episode V and VI. Explore the EU. Then tell me he's "not a pacifist." The entire Dooku fight makes zero sense. As does everything Yoda does in episode 3. It destroys his entire character. For Yoda, the prequels are Highlander 2. I am not sure what you mean by the fights making no sense. Episode 3 - Yoda could not beat sidious. If he died, no one would know that the jedi order had been duped by the Sith. Yoda figiured it out and knew he needed a new strategy. If he died, to quote Yoda " this would be a problem". watching the fights in the movies are very plain and kind of sad. If you understood how Darth Sidious fights, it would stunt your growth. The only thing the movies showed when he fought, was how quick he killed the other jedi masters. they were masters and they died without even swinging their light sabers. It is a credit to Windu's abilities that not only did he survive the opening salvo, but that he could even win. it is entirely possible that Mace could beat Yoda, but even mace knew that it was not likely he could beat Obi Wan. That should give u a clue to just how bad *** obi wan and Anikan were. One more thing. The giant elephant in the room is this: everyone credits Mace Windu with winning the fight. However, it is entirely possible and plausible that Darth Sidious lost on purpose. we will only find this out when we here the fight from Sidious's Memiors. - Thelna Edited April 15, 2012 by Thelna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GarfieldJL Posted April 15, 2012 Share Posted April 15, 2012 (edited) One more thing. The giant elephant in the room is this: everyone credits Mace Windu with winning the fight. However, it is entirely possible and plausible that Darth Sidious lost on purpose. we will only find this out when we here the fight from Sidious's Memiors. - Thelna You're assuming Palpatine would ever admit that he got clobbered? No he'd come up with some excuse, that it was part of some plan. Yoda nearly beat Palpatine, it was just the explosion that threw both Yoda and Palpatine, threw Yoda in a way that he couldn't get back at Palpatine quickly enough to continue the fight. Both of them if I remember correctly had lost their lightsabers, and the place probably was about to be swarmed with troops. It was a fairly even match. Edited April 15, 2012 by GarfieldJL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBetty Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 You ever notice Windu has a very hard time staying calm lol how sith of him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Girdeux Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 (edited) One more thing. The giant elephant in the room is this: everyone credits Mace Windu with winning the fight. However, it is entirely possible and plausible that Darth Sidious lost on purpose. we will only find this out when we here the fight from Sidious's Memiors. - Thelna Its been known for years now since the ROTS DVD which stated by Lucas that Mace Windu beat Sidious fair and square in the lightsaber duel. He also stated Sidious was NOT faking the fight and was TRYING to kill windu with force lightning but couldnt. Also that the strain of exertion from the lightning reflecting back on Sidious was causing his face to melt off. Edited April 16, 2012 by Girdeux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malrus Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 According to wookiepedia Yoda and count Dooku were the only known people to have bested Windu. So If what everyone is saying is true, than Windu could not beat Sidious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Girdeux Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 According to wookiepedia Yoda and count Dooku were the only known people to have bested Windu. So If what everyone is saying is true, than Windu could not beat Sidious Wrong. "You have to be either Mace or Yoda to compete with the Emperor," Lucas says. "If Anakin hadn't got all beat-up, he could've beat the Emperor." “The close up shots where Palpatine is getting the force lightning reflected back and he’s getting zapped and the strain of all this exertion is what transforming him into the Emperor that we see later in ROTJ.” - Knoll. The Jedi Master is winning when Anakin arrives, but Palpatine, as the scene has been rethought, now seizes the occasion to exaggerate his weakness in order to force Anakin's hand-after which Palpatine kills Mace. "Ok, well this sequence always started out with Mace uh overpowering Palpatine and then Palpatine using his powers to try to destroy Mace and Mace deflecting his rays with his lightsaber." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habushun Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 Windu probably managed to beat sidious only because his fighting style combines the strongest points of both the dark and light side. the reason yoda couldn't beat sidious, although they were probably an equal match is that the balance of power had somewhat shifted to the dark side as yoda repeatedly mentioned in the movies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBentOne Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 Read Yoda: Dark Rendezvous. Dooku is a great swordsman and the fact that he is even capable of standing his ground against Yoda for a while is a testament to that. But even on a world shrouded in the dark side Dooku was not powerful enough to best Yoda and was forced to flee again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeC Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 I was actually disappointed with that scene. It totally negated what yoda said in tESB. "The force is my ally, not this crude matter." i was expecting him to be like "lightsabers? dooku please. The force I will defeat you with. Crush you with it I will." And then we see yoda do stuff with he force we never seen before. Instead we got well...you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 (edited) I was actually disappointed with that scene. It totally negated what yoda said in tESB. "The force is my ally, not this crude matter." i was expecting him to be like "lightsabers? dooku please. The force I will defeat you with. Crush you with it I will." And then we see yoda do stuff with he force we never seen before. Instead we got well...you know. So you know, a lightsaber is just a tool even when a jedi or sith is using one. They are still using the force while fighting, that is their main weapon the lightsaber is just a tool and secondary weapon. Edited April 16, 2012 by Wolfninjajedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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