Just because your sith doesn't actually mean you are evil right?

[lokdron]

Sith are evil you can't do "good" with the dark side it WILL corrupt you in some fashion. Hence why all sith in game are varying forms of insane. or has the SI says it "Differently rational" which is still insane.

 

For example the SI can lie on how they got the holocron to darth zash.

 

SI: "I killed tu kata took their hearts and drank their blood" (lie)

 

Darth zash: Really? That did not work when I tried it.

[Captain_Zone]

And if you play through the story as either of the jedi classes then you will find many situations where you try to reason with a Sith only to have him/her foam at the mouth about Sith superiority, and every option ending with him/her attacking you.

So I guess that 95pct of the Sith are raging psychopaths?

 

Or maybe this is an artifact of the storytelling. Each class is the hero of their own story. That means their opponents must be the villains.

...

Because very few people actually are able to or enjoy playing a raging psychopath (or cold calculating sociapath at the mildest). Hence the many lightside sith.

It means that the Jedi must be the unforgiving automatic enemies of the Sith, so as to provide the opposition the game needs.

Things could be different if advancing did not require commiting genocide on a galactic scale, but like all combat oriented games it does, and thus in the Sith story the Jedi must attack on sight, or nearly so. And why in the Jedi story the Sith are raging lunatics who can not be reasoned with.

 

My point is that the Jedi are hypocrites for the most part. At least the Sith are up front about it. I never went in as my Knight expecting a Sith to surrender or reason things out. The Jedi, however, aren't supposed to be that bloodthirsty. The SW and SI arcs paint Jedi in an unfavorable light for a reason. Because deep down under all their dogma, most are no better than the Sith they're "protecting the galaxy from".

[Malles]

I know this part, it just seems that when the sith portrayed as being evil and evil only.

 

Sith believe that the ends justify the means. Evil would depend on what that mean is. Destroying an entire planet to make yourself immortal is evil. Killing Jedi in defense of your Empire is not.

[lokdron]

This is a post from jorander he is someone that knows a lot about the background of the sith and has read the jedi handbooks and the book of the sith etc. Some of you may know him. Here is what he said I think it applies to this topic.

 

Post starts

 

Sith philosophy can easily be understood as one of self-validation through personal strength, when one examines their teachings, apart from the code, then looks at the code after the fact. Since we don't really have a documented Sith handbook (that will be coming out in about a month) all we can do is extrapolate based on presented ideas and actions.

 

The first practitioners of the dark side sought the power of what was then called, "Bogan," for the purpose of gaining immortality. Later outcast dark Jedi melded with the Sith species to form the Sith empire. From here we can begin to see a common thread between the various Sith that appear throughout the setting. They believe the Jedi teachings are too limited, because they don't allow access to a certain aspect of the Force. They are always seeking more power.

 

They believe that the path to the power of the Force lies through strong emotions, which we know is how one accesses the dark side, which many of them teach to be the "true nature," of the Force, characterizing the "light side," as nothing more than the Force restrained, and in a sense they are right. They also believe that the strong rule and survive (which, in the eyes of the Sith, are arguably one and the same) while the weak serve and die.

 

We know that, according to many Sith masters, including several of the strongest in the setting, that if one is to use the dark side, one is bound to serve the dark side. Power, but at a cost. Interesting, we begin to see what could be considered a contradiction, the strong rule/live, weak serve/die, but here, we see the Sith admitting to serving the dark side, so they can be strong. This is not a contradiction, this is a progression, from a place of weakness, to a place of strength.

 

For a Sith, mastery of the dark side, is to, at the same time, be consumed, and in control. Once one's weakness is consumed by darkness, one can draw on the strength of the dark side. (Peace is a lie, there is only passion, through passion, I gain strength, through strength, I gain power.) Power, is the ultimate goal of the Sith. But wait, isn't there more to the Sith code? Didn't Palpatine aspire to more than just being really strong? Well, in his own way, no, he didn't, and that is covered by the Sith code.

 

The goal of the Sith is power, we see that is all they are ever working toward. First and foremost, their goal is to be strong, and this is again covered by Darth Revan and Darth Bane, when they say that to gain the full strength of the dark side, one must seek power, "for power's sake." So then, why does the code say, "through power, I gain victory?" It is commonly thought, that the Sith use the power mentioned, to achieve some kind of victory, be it victory over enemies, victory over oneself, victory over...take your pick. Well, the answer is in the actions and presented teachings of the Sith. One must seek power, for power's sake. Power is the goal. Achievement of power, is the condition for victory. It is in the achievement of power that victory is met, "through power, I gain victory." The next two lines of course, fall into place nicely from there. In meeting the conditions for victory, they are made all-powerful through the Force.

 

Once one completely and totally understands the mechanics of the dark side, and their relation to Sith philosophy, it becomes quite apparent that the ultimate end of the progression of the darksider, is the complete and total annihilation of all life everywhere. Kudos to Malgus for figuring that out. But he is still dumb about other things.

 

Post ends here.

 

As the sith inquisitor said when an npc asked why did you do this horrible action to get more power. The sith inquisitor said "Power is its own purpose". Sith are evil plus doing evil things as a dark side force user makes you stronger in the dark side. Since the dark side feeds and grows on destruction, suffering and all the other negative things.

 

Hence why kriea gives the exile the option to murder your companions. Kriea says "If she does she will become stronger for it and if she releases them she will be weaker" she says something along those lines.

Edited April 12, 2012 by lokdron

[Sith-Viscera]

One is only evil, as evil as ones actions is.

[CJ_SAX_MAN]

Would you like a deconstruction of the Sith Code to show you how it isn't evil? I've already done it. The Code itself isn't evil. The only evil about it is how it's interpreted by the majority of Sith.

 

Also, if you look at the history between the Sith and Jedi, the Jedi are as bent on destroying the Sith as the Sith are on destroying the Jedi. The Jedi are NOT the white knights they claim to be when it comes to the Sith. Only ONE Jedi during my LS SW playthrough was actually cool enough that he didn't even think about attacking me first. In fact, after he aided me with the final boss on the planet we were on, we parted as friends.

 

My point is EVERY other Jedi either attacked no matter what I said, or they were seriously thinking about it. Yes, I'm convinced the Jedi are an Order of about 95% hypocrites.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Vectivus

Oh, and as far as ALL Sith doing evil..... Here's one who didn't.

 

Yes the Jedi of this era are ridiculous, I have raised that arguement many times myself, though I have been encouraged play a knight or consular to see it from their side and actually see the Jedi who are truly good and not hellbent on destroying the sith.

 

Someone mentioned Satele, but she is just like the rest of them, at BT mouthing off with how their ship is under Jedi protection. Jedi at this all think they are all powerful.

 

Even sith, due to how they were raised, know there is always someone stronger. (except my SW, who always brags about what a bad *** he is)

[Drakeclaw]

That's cuz peace IS impossible. As the SW timeline proves. You'd do better not to generalize so.

 

If the Force was in perfect balance, then there would be perfect peace. The absence of War is not peace. Peace is serenity and balance.

 

IF the Force in the Galaxy was in perfect balance, then there would be no poverty, no need for war, or Jedi or Sith. The Galactic community artificially achieves peace through a galactic utopia (SW 10-12 is about THX:1138 in Space).

 

However, there is another possibility, perfect balance through natural means. Jedi and Sith anihilate each other and most of all technology. Most of the Galactic Community regresses to a pre-Hyperspace age.

 

However, the cycle starts again when the Sith appear. And Force Ghosts from the distant past start training a new Jedi order through one man. It's perfect for 10-12; better than George could have thought up.

[Seigon]

Good and evil all comes down to ones point of view

[Darth_Solrac]

Ironically it is impossble...mostly due to the Sith.

 

Meh. There's plenty of violence within the Republic & its space from secessions too.

[Koronii]

Asking if the Sith are evil is pretty much the same as asking if the Nazis were evil. There were good guys, but they were the exception to the rule, and are usually held in contempt by the rest.

 

Also Lord Praven isn't a good example of a non-evil Sith, since his virtue is what motivates him to defect to the Jedi.

[TKMaster]

Meh. There's plenty of violence within the Republic & its space from secessions too.

 

Small pockets of violence / in-fighting now and then yes....full scale galactic war? Not without the Sith pulling the strings.

[maxetius]

Light side Sith are Sith in name only. They are really just force adepts. Free spirits with lightsabera.

[Brorim]

Would you like a deconstruction of the Sith Code to show you how it isn't evil? I've already done it. The Code itself isn't evil. The only evil about it is how it's interpreted by the majority of Sith.

.

 

You might not have to be evil to attempt the sith way but if you actually have to follow it to perfection there are no other options available to you than become "evil" to stay sith.

 

Evil really is not something you "choose" it is a fundamental difference in people that creates the foundation for the entire "good vs. evil" concept. This conflict is shown in the Star Wars universe as the battle between The Jedi's ( representing good ) and The Sith ( representing Evil ) .

 

The Jedi order is bound by morality and the Sith order is bound by hatred.

 

I guess that the firmer you are in either two convictions the more successful you will become

within either field of advancement.

[Bekillinyou]

Good and evil all comes down to ones point of view

 

agree

 

you will find that manny things we cleang to are basied on our own point of view

-ben kenobie-

Edited April 12, 2012 by Bekillinyou

[Selvec]

We had this discussion in a party a few days ago.

 

Here's how I see it.

 

Sith are a culture, a race. They have a reputation for evil, and destruction because the majority of their people and culture is based around these concepts, its also what embodies their leadership. The tactics they use are evil because thats how they are taught.

 

Just like the republic, which also has its fair share of good and evil sentients. The difference is the majority of the republics figureheads and reputation is mostly evil.

 

The great confusion comes in the use of the word "Sith" for many different things. There is Sith the race. Sith the culture and Sith the Dark Force User. The origin of all this comes back to the original race themselves who called themselves "Sith". Thus everything they gave birth to inherited the name. It was probably a mistake for Bioware to call the culture "The Sith", rather then "The Sith Empire" or "The Empire", but that was probably an attempt to avoid confusion with "The Empire" in the original Star Wars Trilogy. In saying this Bioware themselves seems to have gotten a bit confused at times when characters refer to residents of "The Empire" as "Imperials".

 

So to summarize. Your not evil unless your aligned with the Dark Side of the Force. Reputation is really the only difference between the two sides, and how they wish to rule the galaxy.

Edited April 12, 2012 by Selvec

[TalkingDinosaur]

I know this part, it just seems that when the sith portrayed as being evil and evil only.

You'll rarely find a Sith for his sympathetic for his allies

[MithrilGear]

I actually put alot of thought into this when I was considering what path my Sith Warrior would take.

 

First off, power corrupts. So often a Sith falls into a downward spiral of corruption, because he or she loses control of himself in his mad pursuit of power and/or vice.

 

The Dark Side is not necessary evil. Its like saying a gun is easy. But it is definitely the easiest to perceive as corruptible. I'm sorry, not being able to love or enjoy some pleasure in life only because you might and only might lead you into your destruction seems like pretty shaky logic for a Jedi, where fighting for someone you love or care for can give you the strength one needs to do so.

 

I still think my character is completely Sith while not have to be a mass murderer.

 

He will kill anyone that opposes him, but will not go out out his way to slaughter every woodland creature in his path. His strength comes his passion to become the strongest and from the hate for his enemies, which at the moment consists of Darth Baras and some RP elements that I rarely talk about.

 

He treats friends and foes with the respect of how strong they are and how they treat him and return. He will fight and honorable duels, but there is no way that the opponent will get spared in the end. But heaven forbid you do something that upsets him, which usually falls under killing and/or insulting a friend or himself and then the gloves come off.

 

He is honest and loyal mostly, for he doesn't need others gaining power from their hate of him, it just seems counterproductive. He will lie and use tricks, especially if he sure if his opponents have already done so. He doesn't tolerate greed or treachery and will kill a person for such things. Sparing or condemning weaklings is always a toss up between if they are still useful or did they just soil themselves in fear.

 

He doesn't have contempt for aliens, they are a colorful piece of paint to the red and black colors he seems to enjoy. And they come with all this nifty functions, like guns, grappling hooks, and interesting sexual deviance. That being said, he is Sith and damn proud of it and he will put anyone in their place about their rank. Sith > Everything Else.

 

Unfortunately in Game Mechanics terms this puts my Sith's Alignment between -400 and 400 at all times.

[Aelther]

I was on the ptr and I was doing the Jedi zone and this time around I was actually paying attention to what a lot of the jedi masters tell you, there is no emotion there is only peace and so on and so forth. I completely disagree. In fact the more I thought about it the more the sith code makes more sense, then I got to thinking does that really you'd be evil? I have a Sith Warrior with a heart of gold, and only resulted to violence when forced upon.

 

It just got me wondering, can there really be a good sith? All I know is if this was real (I know that sounds silly) I couldn't stand being a Jedi, no emotion..sounds dull and boring, I would follow my emotions and use my rage to defeat those who would harm those I care about.

 

What do you guys think?

 

You do not need to be Evil if u are Sith, but you will never be Good either. How can a good person be part of the empire, when

The Emperor wants to destroy all life in the galaxy so he could become immortal

, the sith kill all force sensitive people who refuse to train to become one of them and the imperial military loses all their 'honor' (even though there's very little to begin with) when some random sith comes along and orders them to do his bidding? A real good person would defect to republic, or at least try to do so.

 

As for the Jedi code, you do not see the point for it. Jedi are not trying to turn every living thing into Elcor from Mass Effect. Unlike Sith, Jedi are selfless guardians, who sacrifice their personal lives to protect the people of the republic. They are monks in a way who treat everyone equally. And emotions would cloud their judgements.

For example: someone is holding your girlfriend and 3 other people hostage and let's you chose who to save: your girlfriend or those 3 random people that you never saw before. Also there is no way whatsoever of saving all 4.

 

Based on your statement:

I would follow my emotions and use my rage to defeat those who would harm those I care about.

I'm pretty sure you'd save your girlfriend (as would most people), because you don't want any harm to come to those you care about.

But that doesn't make you a very good guardian now, does it? You just picked 1 person over 3, because you acted on emotion.

Also enemies could exploit your emotions and people you care about very easily.

Look what happened to Anakin... If he had stayed away from emotion and wouldn't have married Padme he would never have turned to the dark side...

 

So if you want to be a good person, without sacrificing emotions just be a trooper or something. Not a very good idea to grant great power to a person who will turn all emotional and cause more harm than good.

Edited April 12, 2012 by Aelther

[FigeroMentel]

One of the things I've really enjoyed about this game so far is that good and evil isn't about what faction you are, but your actions. Indeed, most of the evil I've seen committed so far in this game has been on The Republic side, not The Sith side. That old saying that The Republic offers you a pretty lie and The Sith an ugly truth seems to be pretty true to life - The Republic likes to pretend it's the paragon of virtue and cloaks its misdeeds in flowery words, whereas The Empire really is about Freedom and individuality, but has no problems with its people being as ruthless as they can be.

 

So far, both of my characters have been Light V Sith (a BH who only hunts criminals and an Inquisitor who treats her victims with mercy and kindness) and my future Jedi Knight will be a Dark V Jedi. It's about what you do, not who you are, just like in real life.

[Jarvus]

A hallmark of the KOTOR 1 and KOTOR 2 games was the creativity of the writing, especially with dialogue you got from NPCs after taking DS choices. In this game, from what I've seen they distilled the essence of what it means to be a Sith down to being rude and cruel, which really has little to do with the idea of being manipulative and selfish, which is what I think of when I think of Sith.

[xrndmx]

i have always said the jedi code is flawed if interpreted wrong, strength and power is drawn through our emotions all the jedi code is saying is that emotions must be controlled too, being able to draw upon our emotions in time of need is what makes us strong, but knowing when to call apon them is the difficult part.

 

The code teaches us to be calm and control the emotions in which can lead to control our actions, passion is one of these as it leads to lust and lust can lead to anger. this is why the code tells us to control our passions. A jedi's place in the universe is to protect the innocent no matter the cost. If the cost is one you are passionate about and you choose your passion over the "right" choice, you are not full filling your role as a jedi.

 

Emotions lead to power, but power can lead to corruption, this is why we control our own emotions.

[Cyberwoman]

I was on the ptr and I was doing the Jedi zone and this time around I was actually paying attention to what a lot of the jedi masters tell you, there is no emotion there is only peace and so on and so forth. I completely disagree. In fact the more I thought about it the more the sith code makes more sense, then I got to thinking does that really you'd be evil? I have a Sith Warrior with a heart of gold, and only resulted to violence when forced upon.

 

It just got me wondering, can there really be a good sith? All I know is if this was real (I know that sounds silly) I couldn't stand being a Jedi, no emotion..sounds dull and boring, I would follow my emotions and use my rage to defeat those who would harm those I care about.

 

What do you guys think?

 

I have to completely agree. To me an emotion like love is what makes life worth living, and I just hate the fact that the Jedi seem to want to dull that. They are rather ignorant and closed minded in that respects, they can only see the darkness and not look at who is using it and why. It’s one of the reasons I have yet to keep a Jedi character, and when I do, they are going to be ether Grey or Dark pathed.

 

All that being said... my main (Sith Inquisitor) is a rather cold hearted girl. I wouldn’t say she was evil per say, more completely insane

[lokdron]

I have to completely agree. To me an emotion like love is what makes life worth living, and I just hate the fact that the Jedi seem to want to dull that. They are rather ignorant and closed minded in that respects, they can only see the darkness and not look at who is using it and why. It’s one of the reasons I have yet to keep a Jedi character, and when I do, they are going to be ether Grey or Dark pathed.

 

All that being said... my main (Sith Inquisitor) is a rather cold hearted girl. I wouldn’t say she was evil per say, more completely insane

 

 

Npc:You are insane!

 

Sith Inquisitor: "I prefer differently rational"

[Cyberwoman]

Npc:You are insane!

 

Sith Inquisitor: "I prefer differently rational"

 

One of the reasons they are my favorite class

[flusa]

According to the lore, modern Sith are not born (though bloodline helps it seems) they are made. You become a Sith by choice. Therefore it is not so much are all Sith evil, but rather why would anyone who is not evil become a Sith?

 

Following the same logic, all Jedi are good. That doesn't mean however that everyone that is force sensitive is a Sith or a Jedi. So in my opinion, yes all Sith are evil, and all Jedi are good, but not everyone that can wield the force is a Sith or a Jedi...

 

The game mechanics force you into these black and white roles. I am hopeful that the legacy system will introduce some much needed realistic ambiguity. I would also LOVE to see a third 'independent' faction become playable. With the Smuggler, Bounty Hunter, and maybe a few new class types put in this group.

 

In my opinion, like in the movies, these are 'swing' characters. Their decision to chose one side over the other often swayed the outcome of the battle at the last second. Han Solo was not a heroic figure when first introduced, he was a hard nosed mercenary. Still, Han becomes a heroic figure when at the last moment he switches from merc to hero and saves Luke.