Just a simple list pros / cons Player City / Housing

[mattgyver]

I hope my 40 man raid boss drops the curtains for the home I just purchased! It's the only place to get them!

 

A new purple offhand item is just an icon in your invo with a small increase in stat bonuses, yet you would raid for that.

[Sholagar]

This is probably one of the 1000st threads about it but I couldn't find one to add this up so fast.

 

 

 

Pros

 

1. New features to do for many (80% - 90% maybe is there poll going on?) players (not if its not your cup of tea)

 

English is not my native tongue so forgive me for my errors.

 

No offense, but housing imo is a complete waste of time and effort, especially when they have pretty much stated that our spaceships will be our player housing. Even with it being in the game already, I think any time they spend on spaceship housing is a depressing waste of time and effort better spent elsewhere.

 

I've played lots of mmo, and alot that have housing (Lotro, EQ2, AO, probably others I can't think of) and housing has NEVER been more than the most momentary of distractions. I'd never hinge my decision on whether to stay or go in an mmo on whether or not they have housing.

[Lord_Ravenhurst]

No offense, but housing imo is a complete waste of time and effort, .

 

No, it is not. Housing belongs to a MMO, period. Not in a dumb instanced version, but in a sandbox. Analyze the following words:

 

MASSIVE. MULTIPLAYER. ONLINE. ROLE. PLAYING. GAME.

Edited April 6, 2012 by Lord_Ravenhurst

[greenleef]

You left one Con out, 99% of SWG player cities were dead and uninhabited, just taking up useless space with more useless space.

 

they fixed this after not loging in for 90 day any player could ` the sign and remove it they did this to clean up dead houses for that exact issue

[greenleef]

No, it is not. Housing belongs to a MMO, period. Not in a dumb instanced version, but in a sandbox. Analyze the following words:

 

MASSIVE. MULTIPLAYER. ONLINE. ROLE. PLAYING. GAME.

 

love it

[Kaphik]

No, it is not. Housing belongs to a MMO, period. Not in a dumb instanced version, but in a sandbox. Analyze the following words:

 

MASSIVE. MULTIPLAYER. ONLINE. ROLE. PLAYING. GAME.

 

Let's talk about the last word you so seriously emphasized, the word "game". Here is part the Dictionary.com online dictionary definition of game:

 

a competitive activity involving skill, chance, or endurance on the part of two or more persons who play according to a set of rules, usually for their own amusement or for that of spectators.

 

which adequately describes what we are playing. The key aspect is the phrase "set of rules". Each game has different rules. One chooses to play a specific game because of the rules and objectives in that specific game. One does not choose to play football because one likes the rules of tennis and tries to apply the tennis rules to the game of football.

 

The whole point is that you choose a game because of what it has and what it offers you. Sure, it's nice to have input into a game's content (i.e. rules) and hope that the creators of said game offer more to appease you, but nowhere does it say that an online MMORPG has to have housing, nor does it have to have pvp, raiding, customization, etc.

[BlazingShadow]

There should be empty planets meant specifically for player housing and cities.

 

That way it doesn't interfere with the storytelling planets and allows for the expansion of the galaxy, even if only as a storage/RP/decoration feature.

[LahLahSr]

Player housing fails because the designers forget the golden rule of MMO design:

 

1) Player housing should come with something TO DO - and continue to do so for as long as you have it. And of course, everything you DO in an MMO should provide entertainment, be interesting and serve a purpose that makes sense to the player.

 

2) Player housing should give you an advantage of some sort. This advantage or benefit has to be significant enough to an incentive to the player.

 

As a random brainstormed idea:

• As residential areas grow, missions should begin to spawn.
  
• As residential areas grow, it should be possible to contribute with effort and credits, to build an infrastructure that serves a purpose an infrastructure that is useful to the players in the area. That could be vendors with rebated prices that gradually improve their selections and their rebates based on the size of the neighborhood it serves.
  
• Transportation services that allows players to reach more and more remote areas directly.
  
• As neighborhood reach certain sizes, the vendors there could offer visually unique/branded social items/clothing.
  
• As neighborhood grow, they would naturally attract crime which in turn could spawn missions. If left unchecked the threat of this crime - mobs and recurring incursions would increase in number and/or difficulty.
  
• In turn, this could offer a market for community security measures - players could contribute to the funding of security walls, droids etc.
  
• Ultimately, when a certain size and maturity is reached, Flashpoints and Heroics could become available.
  

 

...you get the idea.

 

Bottom line is that player housing has to be MEANINGFUL to players, which in MMOs mean that it must offer something to do and benefits as incentives to develop and maintain it.

 

I haven't yet come across an MMO who fully understood and embraced this properly.

[Kaphik]

Player housing fails because the designers forget the golden rule of MMO design:

 

1) Player housing should come with something TO DO - and continue to do so for as long as you have it. And of course, everything you DO in an MMO should provide entertainment, be interesting and serve a purpose that makes sense to the player.

 

2) Player housing should give you an advantage of some sort. This advantage or benefit has to be significant enough to an incentive to the player.

 

As a random brainstormed idea:

• As residential areas grow, missions should begin to spawn.
  
• As residential areas grow, it should be possible to contribute with effort and credits, to build an infrastructure that serves a purpose an infrastructure that is useful to the players in the area. That could be vendors with rebated prices that gradually improve their selections and their rebates based on the size of the neighborhood it serves.
  
• Transportation services that allows players to reach more and more remote areas directly.
  
• As neighborhood reach certain sizes, the vendors there could offer visually unique/branded social items/clothing.
  
• As neighborhood grow, they would naturally attract crime which in turn could spawn missions. If left unchecked the threat of this crime - mobs and recurring incursions would increase in number and/or difficulty.
  
• In turn, this could offer a market for community security measures - players could contribute to the funding of security walls, droids etc.
  
• Ultimately, when a certain size and maturity is reached, Flashpoints and Heroics could become available.
  

 

...you get the idea.

 

Bottom line is that player housing has to be MEANINGFUL to players, which in MMOs mean that it must offer something to do and benefits as incentives to develop and maintain it.

 

I haven't yet come across an MMO who fully understood and embraced this properly.

 

Basically you want SimCity put into your MMO. That's why housing fails to meet your criteria, it is an entirely separate form of gameplay.

[Gurpsmeister]

No, it is not. Housing belongs to a MMO, period. Not in a dumb instanced version, but in a sandbox. Analyze the following words:

 

MASSIVE. MULTIPLAYER. ONLINE. ROLE. PLAYING. GAME.

 

No, I disagree with you entirely.

 

Housing does not belong in an mmo. It's a feature that either does or does not exist. It's obviously a very important feature to you. To others it's not. You're currently talking about SWTOR, a game that launched with essentially no player housing. They gave you a ship and that's as close as it gets.

 

This is the game you got. You want a more elaborate style of player housing, then go find that game. I recommend the sims personally.

 

Your polls and what your asking for are meaningless. Would it be nifty if there were these distractions? I suppose, but I can think of about 100 other distractions I'd rather see in the game than what color couch I put in my den that I won't use, most people won't see and has no function at all other than to waste my time.

 

People have said it before me, but in SWG 99% of player cities were abandoned ghost towns full of cluttered buildings that just got in your way. VERY few of them were populated, fewer still had anything worth going to see. Frankly if your at the point in a game where all you got to do is visit someones decorations in their living room, it's maybe time to look at a new game.

 

Something else people already mentioned but I feel is worth reiterating; this housing feature doesn't distract the masses enough. Sure, there are a few like you who would spend hours and hours adjusting the vases to get the proper lighting, but the bulk of the playerbase (IN particular in a game that launched With NO player housing) doesn't care. At most they decorate for a few mins walk away and never come back, realistically the people in this game as it is would just view it as more bank space.

 

You wana throw in pod racing, some space flight, pazzak, any other number of minigames that are actually interactive, I'm with ya. Housing is for lonely people who ran out of things to do in the game so are looking for an excuse to stay. Stop looking, if you're not enjoying it move to something you will.

[P-Funk]

 

You wana throw in pod racing, some space flight, pazzak, any other number of minigames that are actually interactive, I'm with ya. Housing is for lonely people who ran out of things to do in the game so are looking for an excuse to stay. Stop looking, if you're not enjoying it move to something you will.

 

I agree with adding interactive things for sure, but housing is not for lonely people, especially if you're an RPer.

 

Considering the fact that 90% of the coolest rooms and areas in TOR are blocked off from RPers thanks to instancing, having a personal space, that has value to your character and can be customized to feel like more than just the one crappy broom closet that doesn't have a big red wall on it that says "FUUUUUUU RPers!", is actually a pretty cool idea.

 

A huge part of an MMO for many people is the ability to feel like you have a unique place in it. This is particularly important in such a linear instanced story based MMO.

 

What we need is firstly for this to be optional, as in you dont NEED it. Secondly it could be a part of Legacy, meaning you can unlock progressively larger apartments or more customization features as you move through Legacy levels giving us something to do when we get tired of Ops and FPs. Also, you should have different planets with different apartments. So you get a Nar Shadda apartment so you have a hip penthouse with a killer view off a balcony, lots of neon and stuff. On Coruscant you get something similar but now you're in the clouds, maybe you have a view of the Senate tower, you have traffic flying by. Tatooine you can have maybe apartments built into a cliff face or something, or part of some underground conclave. Hoth you could have a little hole in the wall like inside the Rebel base or in a Cave.

 

The point is that the hermits could live on the lonely planets, the social butterflies could live in the cities, and the guys who don't care could just not have one.

 

Variety makes an MMO appealing. Its not just about saying "This is whats important, and only this matters, and anybody who likes anything else shouldn't play this game". Thats not a formula for inclusive experiences.

 

Also, whomever said that housing has no place in Star Wars must not have seen the new Trilogy. Practically every other scene involved some ridiculously dressed Natalie Portman sitting down at a table for tea, crumpets, and a conversation on the future of the Republic.

[Gurpsmeister]

I agree with adding interactive things for sure, but housing is not for lonely people, especially if you're an RPer.

 

Considering the fact that 90% of the coolest rooms and areas in TOR are blocked off from RPers thanks to instancing, having a personal space, that has value to your character and can be customized to feel like more than just the one crappy broom closet that doesn't have a big red wall on it that says "FUUUUUUU RPers!", is actually a pretty cool idea.

 

A huge part of an MMO for many people is the ability to feel like you have a unique place in it. This is particularly important in such a linear instanced story based MMO.

 

What we need is firstly for this to be optional, as in you dont NEED it. Secondly it could be a part of Legacy, meaning you can unlock progressively larger apartments or more customization features as you move through Legacy levels giving us something to do when we get tired of Ops and FPs. Also, you should have different planets with different apartments. So you get a Nar Shadda apartment so you have a hip penthouse with a killer view off a balcony, lots of neon and stuff. On Coruscant you get something similar but now you're in the clouds, maybe you have a view of the Senate tower, you have traffic flying by. Tatooine you can have maybe apartments built into a cliff face or something, or part of some underground conclave. Hoth you could have a little hole in the wall like inside the Rebel base or in a Cave.

 

The point is that the hermits could live on the lonely planets, the social butterflies could live in the cities, and the guys who don't care could just not have one.

 

Variety makes an MMO appealing. Its not just about saying "This is whats important, and only this matters, and anybody who likes anything else shouldn't play this game". Thats not a formula for inclusive experiences.

 

Also, whomever said that housing has no place in Star Wars must not have seen the new Trilogy. Practically every other scene involved some ridiculously dressed Natalie Portman sitting down at a table for tea, crumpets, and a conversation on the future of the Republic.

 

I get what you're saying. I just don't see it happening. This game isn't focused on those kinds of things, no game focuses on the RP crowd. Sure they're there and occasionally they get a pat on the head like the poor red headed step child of the community, but RP'rs aren't who the devs are thinking about when making features. Nor should they be if they want to make the most of their money.

 

This game is a gear-centric themepark with obvious progression systems. That's what it is, it's not going to change. That means more pvp, raids, flashpoints, gear and things that effect people who do those things are always going to take priority over things like housing or wether or not you can sit on chairs.

 

It's really just a matter of fact, people have been saying gee it'd be great to have housing in wow since wow was birthed. It hasn't happened and won't, because the people making the game realize that what's making them money is more gear grind and progression, not furniture and wall paint.

[Megaloz]

Im not opposed to adding more things to do besides pvp and ops. It adds depth to an mmo, and makes it more full. Even Eve Online, that added ability to get out of your ship, i think was a great addition. Was it needed? No. But is it nice to have as an OPTION? Yes.

 

So again, some of things you guys talking about arent "needed", but they sure as hell wont hurt, and can only add value to the game.

 

Unfortunately for SWTOR, it has to play ALOT of catching up just to get the fundamentals of this game up to par where it should be, so I would not expect anything cool in this regard until the first year is over with. In fact i think they themselves stated the first few updates wont be incredible awesome in terms of...fun stuff...but more of stuff that just HAS to get in.

Edited April 6, 2012 by Megaloz

[Florial]

Unfortunately for SWTOR, it has to play ALOT of catching up just to get the fundamentals of this game up to par where it should be, so I would not expect anything cool in this regard until the first year is over with. In fact i think they themselves stated the first few updates wont be incredible awesome in terms of...fun stuff...but more of stuff that just HAS to get in.

 

Bingo---you hit the nail on the head. I wouldn't predict something like housing happening---if it ever happens, for awhile. Heck, as I recall, I think it took LoTR a year or so to get housing in the game. EQ2 did it right---had your own personal little hovel right from the start of the game. I really enjoyed that aspect and spent many an hour decorating and saving up for the bigger place. I remember working hard to get reputation items to reduce the rent. I happily leveled my carpenter to make house goodies. EQ2 for example, had a depth to it that many other MMOs can't match in terms of fun things to do----shinies, crafting, housing, etc. When my husband and I returned to EQ2 as a filler between games--Rift and waiting for SWTOR to come out, I was amazed at how much further they progressed housing. Having housing leader boards and being able to visit some remarkable dwellings. One player had his house ( or mansion) decorated as a casino with statues, marble floors, gambling tables, etc. Another player had a dwelling on an island that was remarkable. I remember touring his place for almost an hour with my mouth open. EQ2 was remarkable. I never played SWG much beyond a few months but from what I hear, housing was also amazing.

 

But mentioning fun stuff, I think it is so important to have fun stuff aside from the normal gear grind. The lack of hobbies is something that concerns me a bit and I hope it is added at some point in the game. If a game is solely gear collection--yawn. I'm even eyeing GW2 a bit for having personal neighborhoods. Housing is a big appeal for me. If I could just customize my ship a bit I would be happy. Give me an EQ2 freeform decorated penthouse in Nar Shadda? BioWare, you would have my subscription dollars for years.

 

Finally I'm surprised that folks haven't jumped on the "Go play Sims if you want your doll house." My response is that I have the Sims games and have gotten many years of use out of them. If we could get a bit more Sims in our MMOs, the happier I am....

Edited April 6, 2012 by Florial

[LahLahSr]

Basically you want SimCity put into your MMO. That's why housing fails to meet your criteria, it is an entirely separate form of gameplay.

 

I write:

 

1) Player housing should come with something TO DO - and continue to do so for as long as you have it. And of course, everything you DO in an MMO should provide entertainment, be interesting and serve a purpose that makes sense to the player.

 

2) Player housing should give you an advantage of some sort. This advantage or benefit has to be significant enough to an incentive to the player.

 

 

Bottom line is that player housing has to be MEANINGFUL to players, which in MMOs mean that it must offer something to do and benefits as incentives to develop and maintain it.

 

I haven't yet come across an MMO who fully understood and embraced this properly.

 

..and you get "SimCity" out of that? There should be a reading comprehension test as a pre-requisite for forum access...

[Zekkau]

I think it'd be best if player housing were instanced somehow, and not quite like SWG.

 

They could also put housing on our specific faction planets like Dromund Kaas and Coruscant.

 

What might be cool, is that while they could instance the housing, there would be multiple apartments.

 

For example on Coruscant... You would go to a vendor which sells deeds on apartments.

 

These would be:

 

Residential District Apartment ($100,000 credits)

-This apartment is located in the undercity, a dark, dingy part of Coruscant. It is the smallest of the apartments and has no real impressive views.

 

Temple Precinct Apartment ($500,000 credits)

-This is also a relatively small apartment located near the Jedi Temple, which is in ruins. Its "Jedi" themed, with a meditation chamber and Jedi artifacts scattered about.

 

Corellian District Apartment ($500,000 credits)

-This apartment is fitting for a smuggler or trooper, and is about the same size as the Temple Precinct Apartment.

 

Senate District Apartment ($2,000,000 credits)

-This is the biggest, most prestigious apartment and is also at the highest elevation, providing beautiful panoramic views of Coruscant. Its theme is much like that of the Senate Building itself, lavish and ornate.

 

In this setup, you have a small apartment that is relatively affordable, for everyone. Two apartments that are medium sized but are themed (or can be themed) for each profession. Knights/Consular's for the Temple Precinct Apartment, and Trooper/Smuggler for the Corellian District Apartment.

 

The absolute largest, most lavish apartment is the Senate District Apartment, which also has the absolute best views.

 

That is just an example for Republic. The Imperials would get their own setup like it on Dromund Kaas.

 

Each one of these is instanced for your character, like your ship. They also have their own storage, and you can purchase or earn decorations for them. (though these decorations may be preset, not movable)

[Lord_Ravenhurst]

No, I disagree with you entirely.

Housing does not belong in an mmo. It's a feature that either does or does not exist. It's obviously a very important feature to you. To others it's not.

 

1. You´re wrong

2. The majority wants housing

3. Many other MMOs had it, have it in will continue to implement that feature

 

LOTRO

 

SWG

 

Everquest II

 

Guild Wars II has an even bigger concept of a whole "Home Instance"

 

AION

 

Also many other MMOs like "The Repopulation", "Darkfall" and "Mortal Online" have housing.

I´m sure there are more but those are the ones I know of.

 

 

 

Your polls and what your asking for are meaningless.

 

You can ignore the results as long as you want. Just because your opinion does not represent what the majority wants, I respect the fact they are meaningless to you.

 

 

 

People have said it before me, but in SWG 99% of player cities were abandoned ghost towns full of cluttered buildings that just got in your way.

 

 

It´s the game companies design decisions on how housing works. If there are sandbox areas outside the questing areas, simply keep your nose out of these areas if you don´t like to see player created content. No one will force you to go there.

Also it could work similiar to LOTRO where you buy houses, it´s not totally necessary to let the player actually "build" houses from scratch.

Regarding abandoned houses, those could be easily auto-deleted after three months or sold to other players. Problem solved.

Edited April 7, 2012 by Lord_Ravenhurst

[Damon_Mott]

Let's talk about the last word you so seriously emphasized, the word "game". Here is part the Dictionary.com online dictionary definition of game:

 

 

 

which adequately describes what we are playing. The key aspect is the phrase "set of rules". Each game has different rules. One chooses to play a specific game because of the rules and objectives in that specific game. One does not choose to play football because one likes the rules of tennis and tries to apply the tennis rules to the game of football.

 

The whole point is that you choose a game because of what it has and what it offers you. Sure, it's nice to have input into a game's content (i.e. rules) and hope that the creators of said game offer more to appease you, but nowhere does it say that an online MMORPG has to have housing, nor does it have to have pvp, raiding, customization, etc.

 

You realize you just completely contridicted your entire argument, yes? You are arguing SWTOR as a "game" only but you are failing to recognize the kind of game it is... a role-playing game. Different rules than what you want in a game, sir...sorry.

 

Any self respecting role-playing game includes player housing. The current ships barely classifies them as housing, they are teleport instances at best.