1.2 Hard Mode loot. Why raid when you can just run dailies?

[Koynov]

I can't understand people who claim they deserve end game gear with solo play gameplay. I think you don't deserve, this is MMO game, grouping must be rewarding a lot more then solo. And if you play solo i don't understand why you need from this gear

I will be ok with daylies only if they are heroics 4.

Edited March 27, 2012 by Koynov

[Claudistine]

Simple If they want the raid gear they should raid. I am more then happy for gear to be designed around SOLO play. Should people who do Dailies get Rated PVP Gear? No.

 

I would even go 1 Step farther. You can buy the gear of the Flashpoints. That is acceptable to me as well.

 

Raiding and Rated PVP are both End game content that takes more effort that SOLO can never take. If people are crazy enough to pay a monthly sub for SOLOing on an MMO they can have Non Rated PVP gear and Flashpoint gear.

 

Yes I say people are crazy for paying a sub just to Solo in an MMO because I dont understand that logic. I can Buy a Single Player game and get everything for $30 to $50, where as a year sub is $180. I play MMOs to hang with friends, I personally would never pay a sub for a single player game.

 

You do realise that your repeating yourself over and over again to prove your point?

 

I'm someone that enjoys Ops alot, i (with 7 others ofc) clear all content each week on normal and hardmode, we do normal for people that wants to enjoy an Ops and get some loot (if there lucky, that is) I also do the dailies for the implants and earpiece, and i can tell you, i 'd rather have them drop from a boss in any Ops, cause man grinding dailies is boring! I also couldnt not care less if all loot is obtainable by doing dailies, because it DOES take way more effort, but thats something you just do not want to see.

[GaryFlynn]

Rated PVP gear looks awesome, can I get rated PVP gear for dailies please because I don't have time to PVP thanks.

[krinaman]

The "elites" aren't behind those decisions, it is in the developer interest to provide that to them. A "challenge" without a carrot will only last you 3 maybe 4 raid lock outs. At which point you get bored, unsub until next raid content patch and go play something else.

 

They want to keep them in the game, so they get a carrot through different challenges in pve that give rewards. You don't need full raid gear to enjoy the game outside of pve. In fact, you can do so in full greens. Even pvp.

 

So you need a carrot to keep people in the game. Okay, I'll buy that. So why can't we have a carrot for the non-raiders?

 

Don't you think non-raiders are going to hit level cap, have no carrot, and quit?

 

How does a non-raiding carrot affect the raiding carrot? Are these diehard raiders suddenly going to start doing dailies for 20 times as long? Even if they do, that's actually in the Dev's interest as it keeps them longer.

 

But you are right, it's in the Dev's interest to get people into raiding. Promoting group events encourages forming friendships (although loot drama costs just as many). People are less likely to unsub with friends in the game. Scheduled events makes it harder to skip a night. (if I don't log in tonight I'll have to wait another week to raid).

 

The problem is for some people there just isn't a big enough carrot to get them raiding so they need to give something to those people to keep them as well.

[Valhalyn]

Hey guys, I just stood in an Op with my buddies and pressed a few buttons for about an hour or so, check out this phat loot I got!

 

Hey guys, I spent the last week grinding out mobs and quests so I could pick up this one piece of gear from the vendor that doesn't give me a set bonus but has the same rating as the stuff that guy got out of his Op for not standing in fire (Though lets be honest, he stood in the fire) and killing a Boss in 4 minutes with 15 other people.

 

Now here's the tricky part...If you assume the average raider spends 6 hours a week raiding, and the average Solo player spends 2 hours a night grinding we'll say 5 times a week, work that math out for me and tell me who actually put in more work for the gear...

 

6 hours =/= 10 hours. And no, you are not the majority, some of us like raiding for raiding, not because we got PHAT LOOT.

 

Get over it, Solo players and PVP players work just as hard if not harder for there loot as Raiders do. Dont think so? Go ahead roll a new character dont raid and see how quickly you gear out...I guarantee it wont be as fast as you can by slaying digital dragons...

Edited March 27, 2012 by Notannos
rude

[Remulan]

It's like you guys can't read or something.

 

First of all BH comms from raids will only come from NiM current raids and the new operation that is being released, which is more difficult than current hard mode raids. So raiders will have to be competant and work with 7-15 other people to acquire them.

 

YOU ONLY GET 6 PER WEEK BY DOING DAILIES

 

YOU ONLY GET 6 PER WEEK BY DOING DAILIES

 

YOU ONLY GET 6 PER WEEK BY DOING DAILIES

 

YOU ONLY GET 6 PER WEEK BY DOING DAILIES

 

YOU ONLY GET 6 PER WEEK BY DOING DAILIES

 

YOU ONLY GET 6 PER WEEK BY DOING DAILIES

 

Please read the above and realize how long it will take to get any BH comm gear by doing dailies and end this stupid *** thread.

[Koynov]

LOL 3 button DPS, take sentinel/marauder and tell me about the 3 buttons

[JamieKirby]

1.2 PvE Gear:

 

"Campaign" hard Raid Gear is Rating 146 (Mod Slot 61)

"Blackhole" Corellia Commendation Gear is Rating 146 (Mod Slot 61)

 

Whats the point of raiding in SWTOR when I can just run some faceroll dailies and get "hard mode" raid gear.

 

Raiding in this game keeps getting worse not better. GW2 out yet?

 

erm, for the fun of it?

[Tarmi]

I can't understand people who claim they deserve end game gear with solo play gameplay. I think you don't deserve, this is MMO game, grouping must be rewarding a lot more then solo. And if you play solo i don't understand why you need from this gear

I will be ok with daylies only if they are heroics 4.

 

I can't understand why raiders think they deserve exclusive access to the best end game gear. As a long time WoW and Rift raider I just don't see that raiding is very difficult. Raiding is just spending time grinding out scripted content with a group of people. Raiding is a traditional mmo time sink no different than token grinds and pvp so why do "hardcore raiders" believe their playstyle is more deserving?

 

I also don't understand why so many raiders get butthurt at the thought of a differnt mmo time sink provided the same rewards. If someone wants to grind for gear in a different manner than you choose why do you care? It's not like raiding is hard.

[wezzlan]

Raid gear is for...Raiders and ofc its supposed to be the best PVE gear out there...

 

solo players getting raid gear is just stupidity..... if you cant see this then maybee you shouldnt play a "MMO" a solo game "singel player" should fit you more... Geez...

 

its like i should deemand getting top pvp gear for killing lowbies...

 

this should be easy.

 

If you want top pve gear...go raid...

if you want top pvp gear...pvp more...

Edited March 27, 2012 by Notannos
rude/ use of retarded, no warning

[Dark_Ombra]

The problem with something like that is that the PVE/Operation gear gives you stats that are usable in all situations and circumstances. Expertise is useless outside warzones. Presence is useless without a companion. Yet the stats given to Operation players has a use in flashpoints, operations, soloing, warzones, etc. Why should this be the case? If you wanted true equality there would be a 3rd stat that is purely for operations and useless outside of it (pve-expertise or something). Would raiders be happy with that?

 

You dont understand the game at all!

 

PvP = expertise ( Expertise should give more stats in PvP and more defense... making PvE gear less strong and useless )

 

PvE raider = Big boss, big challenge... Very hard content. They need bigger stats solo.

 

PvE solo = Small challenge, not great fight, they have a puppet that follow them. They need to make their pet a little stronger, they dont really need great stats because the content is easy.

 

 

I dont understand why they give to solo player that dosent want to group, that dont want to do the big fight the same gear.

 

I dont understand why PvE gear is better then PvP gear in PvP! Also why a new player should get the same gear as someone that take a long time to get is gear, work hard to get it??? It make no sens! Casual gamer should do casual stuff, get casual gear... Raider should get raider gear and PvPer should get PvP gear... Each type of gear should be very diffrent.

[schwiz]

I think the better question to ask is, why run dallies when you can just run ops? Seriously, who wants to do daily quests they are boring as ****.

[ADTRr]

This post is still going? holy crap this seems so obvious to me lol if you want to have fun and get gear, raid. If you want to just get gear and run around with it, do dailies. This is not a question of who deserves what or who worked harder for what, because the bottom line is that this is a freaking game, and your thinking way too much into it. I do enough work during the day im not concerned about the freaking morals of who deserves what in terms of gear is an mmo, I mean that is just simply amazing that someone would think that much into it. Edited March 27, 2012 by ADTRr

[Molrune]

I don't see why people have a hard time with such a simple concept. PVE Epics should not be handed out. Raiding epics should come from raiding, PVP epics from PvP'n. Neither from dailies.

 

I bet all those people trolling around saying that Raiders shouldn't be upset would have a much different outlook if they gave away PVP top tier for running around face-rolling a few mobs everyday, and then crushing them in WZ's.

 

I agree raiding should be fun with friends. I also think that if you don't put in the time and effort, you should\t get the reward.

 

Give the non pvp, non raiders some social gear. That's what they are. social players.

[Gavin_Darkl]

I don't see why people have a hard time with such a simple concept. PVE Epics should not be handed out. Raiding epics should come from raiding, PVP epics from PvP'n. Neither from dailies.

 

I bet all those people trolling around saying that Raiders shouldn't be upset would have a much different outlook if they gave away PVP top tier for running around face-rolling a few mobs everyday, and then crushing them in WZ's.

 

I agree raiding should be fun with friends. I also think that if you don't put in the time and effort, you should\t get the reward.

 

Give the non pvp, non raiders some social gear. That's what they are. social players.

 

Its nice to see other people agree with me that Raiders should get their separate gear from PVPers from Solo Players.

 

Players like this.

 

Hey guys, I just stood in an Op with my buddies and pressed a few buttons for about an hour or so, check out this phat loot I got!

 

Hey guys, I spent the last week grinding out mobs and quests so I could pick up this one piece of gear from the vendor that doesn't give me a set bonus but has the same rating as the stuff that guy got out of his Op for not standing in fire (Though lets be honest, he stood in the fire) and killing a Boss in 4 minutes with 15 other people.

 

Now here's the tricky part...If you assume the average raider spends 6 hours a week raiding, and the average Solo player spends 2 hours a night grinding we'll say 5 times a week, work that math out for me and tell me who actually put in more work for the gear...

 

6 hours =/= 10 hours. And no, you are not the majority, some of us like raiding for raiding, not because we got PHAT LOOT.

 

Get over it, Solo players and PVP players work just as hard if not harder for there loot as Raiders do. Dont think so? Go ahead roll a new character dont raid and see how quickly you gear out...I guarantee it wont be as fast as you can by slaying digital dragons...

 

Just because you pay $15 a month does not mean you should be given the content via mail or single player content. This is an MMO, Raiding is Mutliplayer content, therefore the gear reflects Mutliplayer stats. PVP is Mutliplayer content this too reflect mutliplayer stats. BW was nice enough to create a stat which is All for soloing, ask for gear of that stat if you wish

 

6 Hours raiding does not equal there 10 hours solo. Yea Ok where is the logic here? In A raid if a tank can not handle his role as a tank Your Group Fails and does not down a boss, therefore you are not just handed the boss kill and gear. You can be doing everything possible to down the boss like not standing in fire however 1 other person not handling themselves can cause you not to get the gear. Soloing dailies places all failure or success on your shoulders, you do not have 7 or 15 other people that you need to count on to do a daily. You have YOURSELF and you COMPANION, You control the situation and the result no one else does. Sorry but your 10 hours is meaningless when you have full control weather you clear the dailies or not, you are not counting on a single other person.

 

Again if Solo players want Solo presence gear I am all for it, however they feel entitled to Raid gear without having to raid.

Edited March 27, 2012 by Notannos
reply to quote

[Raeln]

Did the only smuggler in our raid really "earn" the 4 pieces of Rakata the hardmode bosses in EV dropped last week?

 

Yes, he got 4 pieces of Rakata during one lockout. The rest of us were kinda like... "hey, where's our loot?" Sadly, only one other token dropped that was non-smuggler.

 

#3 Just because you pay $15 a month does not mean you should be given the content via mail or single player content. This is an MMO, Raiding is Mutliplayer content, therefore the gear reflects Mutliplayer stats. PVP is Mutliplayer content this too reflect mutliplayer stats. BW was nice enough to create a stat which is All for soloing, ask for gear of that stat if you wish

 

I've participated in these discussions on these forums, the Rift forums and the WoW forums and I do not remember a single serious poster ever asking for gear to be mailed to them for just logging in.

 

Hyperbole is working against you here.

 

#4 6 Hours raiding does not equal there 10 hours solo. Yea Ok where is the logic here? In A raid if a tank can not handle his role as a tank Your Group Fails and does not down a boss, therefore you are not just handed the boss kill and gear. You can be doing everything possible to down the boss like not standing in fire however 1 other person not handling themselves can cause you not to get the gear. Soloing dailies places all failure or success on your shoulders, you do not have 7 or 15 other people that you need to count on to do a daily. You have YOURSELF and you COMPANION, You control the situation and the result no one else does. Sorry but your 10 hours is meaningless when you have full control weather you clear the dailies or not, you are not counting on a single other person.

 

With a group of friends, I'd rather play 6 hours and walk away with gear than play for 10 hours solo and walk away with almost nothing.

 

Our guild smuggler earned 4 pieces of Rakata for 1.5 hours investment. It is simply not possible to have that kind of luck anywhere else in the game. It requires 30 to 40 hours of playtime doing dailies to earn enough commendations to buy one single Rakata ear/implant piece.

 

Something seems off in that comparison. At some point, investing 30 to 40 hours of game time (20 days * 1.5/2 hours a day) deserves some kind of reward. Sure, most people are not going to win 4 pieces of raid loot in one night - yet, it happened. It is possible in raiding. It is not possible anywhere else.

 

I'm a raider. I disagree with you. I think all forms of PvE end game should be able to earn all PvE gear, given enough investment. I'm fine with raiding being the quickest path to the gear but dailies/soloing should certainly be able to work toward that goal also.

 

Again if Solo players want Solo presence gear I am all for it, however they feel entitled to Raid gear without having to raid.

 

Not all Solo players are always Solo players.

 

I like to do my dailies solo so I can watch Netflix and Hulu - yet I raid two nights a week and run Flashpoints. Currently, there is very little reason to do dailies other than for the credits. It would be nice if doing dailies and running Flashpoints still contributed in some minor part to my gearing up for raiding.

 

If it continues to not have any benefit, then eventually I will no longer need credits (I'm already there actually. What good are a million credits after you've bought all the cargo bays?) and then what do I have to do until the raid lockouts reset? Log off and play something else? That's hardly a good business plan for a MMO. While I fully acknowledge that no MMO should try to provide 24/7 entertainment - there needs to be more than 4 to 5 hours of entertainment per week and that is just about all that I have left outside of leveling more alts - and I'm waiting until 1.2's Legacy system to do that.

 

There are other reasons as to why to allow the general playerbase access to high end PvE gear as well but I really don't think you are interested in them.

Edited March 27, 2012 by Notannos

[Remulan]

The way they have 1.2 set up is perfect.

 

Raiders will get everything first, as they should, while solo players can work towards the gear eventually.

 

It will take a solo player over a MONTH to afford 1 item, the cheapest one available. To get an actual armor piece will take over 2.5 MONTHS of dailies. Someone spending that much time doing dailies deserves the pittance that they are given.

[Raeln]

The way they have 1.2 set up is perfect.

 

Raiders will get everything first, as they should, while solo players can work towards the gear eventually.

 

It will take a solo player over a MONTH to afford 1 item, the cheapest one available. To get an actual armor piece will take over 2.5 MONTHS of dailies. Someone spending that much time doing dailies deserves the pittance that they are given.

 

Really?

 

So you think 70 days of 1.5 to 2 hours a day - or 105-140 hours of gameplay is what it takes to earn one piece of end-game gear?

 

Average that to 122.5 hours of dailies - that is equivalent to me raiding 24.5 weeks at 5 hours per week. I'm pretty sure I could gear all my alts in full Rakata/T3/T4 in 24.5 weeks of raiding. Which is incidentally, 6 months of me raiding.

 

I think the amount of time to earn one piece of gear through dailies needs to be reduced a bit.

Edited March 27, 2012 by Raeln

[Remulan]

Really?

 

So you think 70 days of 1.5 to 2 hours a day - or 105-140 hours of gameplay is what it takes to earn one piece of end-game gear?

 

Average that to 122.5 hours of dailies - that is equivalent to me raiding 24.5 weeks at 5 hours per week. I'm pretty sure I could gear all my alts in full Rakata/T3/T4 in 24.5 weeks of raiding. Which is incidentally, 6 months of me raiding.

 

I think the amount of time to earn one piece of gear through dailies needs to be reduced a bit.

 

Why does it need to be reduced? The gear isn't needed for solo play, but it gives the solo player something to work towards. It gives the raiders something to do outside of raid time as well that will actually help them be better while raiding. Also, the comms come from weeklies, so you only have to actually do the dailies one day a week, not every day, perfect for the casual player.

[Kinediks]

You run dailies now for Rakata Implants and Earpieces. Some crafted gear is also the best in the game. Some of you are overreacting. "Oh 60 people in my guild canceled subs because of this". They definitely all came from WoW. HARDCORRREE BRO!

[Raeln]

Why does it need to be reduced? The gear isn't needed for solo play, but it gives the solo player something to work towards. It gives the raiders something to do outside of raid time as well that will actually help them be better while raiding. Also, the comms come from weeklies, so you only have to actually do the dailies one day a week, not every day, perfect for the casual player.

 

2.5 months of doing a weekly for one piece of gear places the carrot too far away to be of any real value.

 

Again, I'll have the full set long before non-raiders get their first piece on a 2.5 month time frame. It should be shortened to about a month per piece of gear.

 

As for the solo player needing the gear, they need it just as much as a raider does - which is to say that neither side "needs" the gear. Raiders only feel like they should get better gear because historically speaking, developers have had to bribe raiders with awesome gear just to get enough of them to show up to the raid. There is no "requirement" that the last raid boss must have a higher gear level check than the first boss.

 

All players need something to work towards. In a genre of gaming that is practically only centered around gear progression, what else is there for anyone to really invest time for?

Edited March 27, 2012 by Raeln

[Tenthletter]

Does it really matter if solo players have the same gear as raiders?

 

Especially when the gear is so awful looking, and the Orange Crit gear is inherently superior due to extra stats, literally no hardcore raiders will be wearing it anyway.

 

First of all, stop pretending like raids in this game are in any way challenging. They are not.

 

Second, all the shiny raid gear you're "working" for will be replaced in two to three months.

 

Third and finally, if you're raiding for the gear, and not for the challenge, for the strategy involved in downing new content, or for the sheer enjoyment of raiding, then you're doing it wrong.

 

All those players who raid strictly for the gear are the same ones that hoard DKP for their BiS items, passing on upgrades and hurting the group. That don't show up for progression bosses or on certain raid days because they "don't need those bosses" or "don't want to wipe all night", or best of all quit the game the moment their "set" is complete and then complain that there's not enough content.

 

When you figure it out, you'll enjoy raiding (and MMOs in general) much more.

[Gavin_Darkl]

There are other reasons as to why to allow the general playerbase access to high end PvE gear as well but I really don't think you are interested in them.

 

Sorry but no, if you do not raid you do not need raid gear. Which is what many other raiders have said. Give them Solo gear end of story.

[Gavin_Darkl]

You run dailies now for Rakata Implants and Earpieces. Some crafted gear is also the best in the game. Some of you are overreacting. "Oh 60 people in my guild canceled subs because of this". They definitely all came from WoW. HARDCORRREE BRO!

 

Sorry but People are quitting over this. People came here from WoW because they were tired of the Hand outs, if people want handouts WoW is -> That way.

[Gavin_Darkl]

2.5 months of doing a weekly for one piece of gear places the carrot too far away to be of any real value.

 

Again, I'll have the full set long before non-raiders get their first piece on a 2.5 month time frame. It should be shortened to about a month per piece of gear.

 

As for the solo player needing the gear, they need it just as much as a raider does - which is to say that neither side "needs" the gear. Raiders only feel like they should get better gear because historically speaking, developers have had to bribe raiders with awesome gear just to get enough of them to show up to the raid. There is no "requirement" that the last raid boss must have a higher gear level check than the first boss.

 

All players need something to work towards. In a genre of gaming that is practically only centered around gear progression, what else is there for anyone to really invest time for?

 

No Raiders need the gear, that is how DPS get their DPS up to para to down a boss, thats how tanks get enough stats to keep alive from the damage incoming from the boss, and healers need to increase their healing output. Solo Players need None of this. There is no way to make a Solo mob fight as complex as a Raid boss fight which take 8/16 people into account. NEVER will happen. Solo Players are making their choice by not wanting to do the gear, they are not being told they can not so Tough **** they do not have a right to the gear. Its Freedom of choice for them not to do it so they are choosing not to go for the gear.