Thoughts on class changes in recent patch notes?

[Chessack]

There is absolutely no way I would drop Quick Recovery. I use Sweep all the time vs. normal 3-NPC clusters and follow it up on the targeted NPC with a pommel strike (thanks to the temp stun) that usually finishes him off. I like all my talents. Unless they delete them, I'm keeping them all.

 

And I'm definitely NOT wasting my talent points on PVP-centric crap like Force Fade, Focused Pursuit, or Inflammation.

[popober]

There is absolutely no way I would drop Quick Recovery. I use Sweep all the time vs. normal 3-NPC clusters and follow it up on the targeted NPC with a pommel strike (thanks to the temp stun) that usually finishes him off. I like all my talents. Unless they delete them, I'm keeping them all.

 

And I'm definitely NOT wasting my talent points on PVP-centric crap like Force Fade, Focused Pursuit, or Inflammation.

 

 

Wait, you use sweep as a watchman? Unless you're levelling, I don't see any point in it, honestly. Even in Ops/FPs at 50, I'd focus on the boss, I won't aoe unless needed as I might pull aggro on what I don't want. But that's me.

 

Although I do see the plus for other trees, I am planning on switching back to combat once this comes, ans the added centering build helps greatly. Although this is a little bad for Focus specs, I think.

[ProfessorWalsh]

As a watchman this changes very little for me. Most of what they are changing is to talents I don't use, and the one that I do use being moved down now that I am level 49 has zero effect (I have it already and have had it for many levels).

 

Mostly I am just going to have to write down everything I have so that I can make sure to re-create the character as is on the new tree.

 

This was mostly a boost to Combat, which may now have higher burst than Watchman does for single target damage.

[Mal-Sharran]

Wait, you use sweep as a watchman? Unless you're levelling, I don't see any point in it, honestly. Even in Ops/FPs at 50, I'd focus on the boss, I won't aoe unless needed as I might pull aggro on what I don't want. But that's me.

 

Although I do see the plus for other trees, I am planning on switching back to combat once this comes, ans the added centering build helps greatly. Although this is a little bad for Focus specs, I think.

 

With Force Sweep currently costing 1 Focus (talented) it is an acceptable replacement for Slash, as it hits for 2/3 of what a Slash does, for half the cost. If it was half damage, half cost, it wouldn't matter. But that isn't the case.

 

They haven't mentioned whether or not they've addressed the stuttering and misfire that is so noticeable in Combat either. If they haven't this spec is still going to feel very awkward.

 

Master Strike snare has nothing to do with being interrupted or not. Nothing. It has to do with the range of your target when you begin your Master Strike. If they are at max range and still moving, the chances of the snare taking hold are minuscule. So long as you start Master Strike while the target is firmly 'in range', they can move as far as 10m away before the channel is 'broken' and they stop receiving damage.

 

Ataru proc currently does Energy damage, which is mitigated by armor. Always has been. Hover your mouse over your armor readout and it will show you it absorbs Kinetic and Energy. The fact that it counts as a Force attack DOES increase the accuracy, but it does nothing to bypass armor. The 10% boost will be exactly that, 10%. Weapon damage/Kinetic/Energy are all equal in this way.

 

The entire problem with Combat is the absurdly ridiculous 4.5 second window for Precision (yes, 4.5 seconds, because the buff begins to wear away before the GCD is finished from using Precision Strike). Maybe call it a flat 5 seconds. That's enough for Master Strike and one Blade Storm, or potentially 3 Blade Rushes under Zen. Then you get CC'd (root, stun, knockback, doesn't matter) right after using Precision and BAM, it's wasted. Where Overload Saber is not. I really hoped BW would address this...

[Snuffalupagus]

Lol, only 1 person has realised how ridiculous focus is going to become in 1.2.

Seriously read through, guardians will get so riped off since they r getting a slight nerf to their focus tree (increased cd's) while our force bombs keep the same cd, the watchman talent that they dont have will keep the cd at 9 sec as we get as swelling winds now.

 

Every spec is getting a buff, focus is getting a huge boost to damage (master-strike, force sweep) combat at top lvl gear will get a small boost with the 10% increase offset by decreased accuracy and watchman will get a snare that is viable at 50% on cauterise. This is not to mention the decrease in force costs of other moves and the dispatch buff.

 

Get as much playtime on your sent while you can when 1.2 comes out cos they will get nerfed shortly after if the devs dont realise through PTS. Let the good times roll =)

 

Oh, obviously im talking about pvp, sorry to all u pve people out there

Edited March 17, 2012 by Snuffalupagus

[AidanLightwalker]

Nope, Centering doesn't generate while your Zen is active.

I will generate if you have Inspiration/Trans active, but not with 'Zen'

 

Just tested, your right, my bad.

[Mastr_KB]

still not seeing much to brag about as far as combat goes, our ramp just got a little steeper. There have been times when force leap + zealous strike completely filled my focus bar, but even without it being filled, I could still do precision+rush(or slash)+rush+storm from leap+zealous...now I'm going to have to add a strike or lose a rush.

 

As for that 10%, is that for the 6 second ataru form bonus(+30% chance of second strike after using blade rush + 10%?), or for all hits while in the ataru stance/form. I've always found the wording for ataru abilities a little odd, so maybe I've misunderstood how it works.

[AidanLightwalker]

With Force Sweep currently costing 1 Focus (talented) it is an acceptable replacement for Slash, as it hits for 2/3 of what a Slash does, for half the cost. If it was half damage, half cost, it wouldn't matter. But that isn't the case.

 

They haven't mentioned whether or not they've addressed the stuttering and misfire that is so noticeable in Combat either. If they haven't this spec is still going to feel very awkward.

 

Master Strike snare has nothing to do with being interrupted or not. Nothing. It has to do with the range of your target when you begin your Master Strike. If they are at max range and still moving, the chances of the snare taking hold are minuscule. So long as you start Master Strike while the target is firmly 'in range', they can move as far as 10m away before the channel is 'broken' and they stop receiving damage.

 

Ataru proc currently does Energy damage, which is mitigated by armor. Always has been. Hover your mouse over your armor readout and it will show you it absorbs Kinetic and Energy. The fact that it counts as a Force attack DOES increase the accuracy, but it does nothing to bypass armor. The 10% boost will be exactly that, 10%. Weapon damage/Kinetic/Energy are all equal in this way.

 

The entire problem with Combat is the absurdly ridiculous 4.5 second window for Precision (yes, 4.5 seconds, because the buff begins to wear away before the GCD is finished from using Precision Strike). Maybe call it a flat 5 seconds. That's enough for Master Strike and one Blade Storm, or potentially 3 Blade Rushes under Zen. Then you get CC'd (root, stun, knockback, doesn't matter) right after using Precision and BAM, it's wasted. Where Overload Saber is not. I really hoped BW would address this...

 

Last I seen, master strike rooted the target, not snared them till they moved out of range. Maybe im wrong. And atura strikes doing weapon damage instead of force is going go be a boost. My weapon damage based attacks do more damage than my force based ones. Add 10% on top of that and I think people will be suprised. I cant wait till the patch rolls out and we can all start comparing logs.

 

Im so tired of hearing about how much dps people are doing in wz as the aoe and cleave to high numbers. The tools are about to be here, lets really see what spec is the king of single target dps.

 

Game on fellas!

[Vasinar]

yeah I didn't see anything for sents but did for guards so might have changed to just them

 

lol yes Im a sent, so I had a bit of tunnel vision

[AidanLightwalker]

still not seeing much to brag about as far as combat goes, our ramp just got a little steeper. There have been times when force leap + zealous strike completely filled my focus bar, but even without it being filled, I could still do precision+rush(or slash)+rush+storm from leap+zealous...now I'm going to have to add a strike or lose a rush.

 

As for that 10%, is that for the 6 second ataru form bonus(+30% chance of second strike after using blade rush + 10%?), or for all hits while in the ataru stance/form. I've always found the wording for ataru abilities a little odd, so maybe I've misunderstood how it works.

 

Dont use slash, saber storm makes blade rush out perform slash. Im pretty sure our focus generation will be just fine

[Mal-Sharran]

Last I seen, master strike rooted the target, not snared them till they moved out of range. Maybe im wrong. And atura strikes doing weapon damage instead of force is going go be a boost. My weapon damage based attacks do more damage than my force based ones. Add 10% on top of that and I think people will be suprised. I cant wait till the patch rolls out and we can all start comparing logs.

 

Im so tired of hearing about how much dps people are doing in wz as the aoe and cleave to high numbers. The tools are about to be here, lets really see what spec is the king of single target dps.

 

Game on fellas!

 

I'm sorry, I wasn't clear. I meant without the talented snare effect in Combat. Without it, so long as you begin Master Strike, they can actually move quite far away before the channel is broken prematurely.

 

WITH Debilitation, so long as it procs correctly, yes they are rooted for the entirety of the MS. Usually. Some problems that occur though are...

 

1.) Begin MS at max range, while the target is moving, the MS animation begins without actually initializing MS itself, rooting YOU in place and doing no damage to the opponent.

 

2.) Successfully initiate MS, but the snare does not take effect (since snares do not influence and are not influenced by resolve, this should NEVER happen, but it does, infrequently)

 

3.) Successfully initiate MS, snare the target, but snare breaks prematurely. This could be from a CC break, it's hard to tell, but honestly who uses their CC break on a root? I'd just turn and stun the Mara/Sent rooting me.

 

Now, say you throw Crippling and snare the target, then begin Master Strike with Debilitate, and the entire thing goes off without a hitch. THAT is some impressive damage...it just doesn't work as flawlessly as it should. I average about 55ms to the game, and I'm on a top spec PC. WZs are usually 50-60fps (which is really quite high, sadly). So it really can't be attributed to a connection issue or PC fps issue. The synergy between MS and Debilitate just sucks right now.

[bionamaster]

I practically cried with joy when I found out Master Strike can't get interrupted! Thank you, Bioware! :D:D

[verydanger]

First I played a Sentinel to valor 60, and thought they pretty damn good.

 

Then I played a Vanguard to valor 60, and realised that Marauders were easily the toughest opponents to face.

 

Now, I see 1.2 brings nothing but a TON of buffs for Sents/Marauders.

 

I really don't know how this is supposed to work out?

[nachoman_randy]

First I played a Sentinel to valor 60, and thought they pretty damn good.

 

Then I played a Vanguard to valor 60, and realised that Marauders were easily the toughest opponents to face.

 

Now, I see 1.2 brings nothing but a TON of buffs for Sents/Marauders.

 

I really don't know how this is supposed to work out?

 

Watchmen just got awe, pacify and kick for free.

 

Combat/Focus got that plus some of the watchmen utility and more damage.

 

Watchmen are going to be almost the same to face, you'll just going to see more combat and focus sents and their mirrors in WZ and groups.

[andrew_b_gross]

With Force Sweep currently costing 1 Focus (talented) it is an acceptable replacement for Slash, as it hits for 2/3 of what a Slash does, for half the cost. If it was half damage, half cost, it wouldn't matter. But that isn't the case.

 

Except that Slash has a chance to reset the cooldown on our most important ability, Cauterize. This is a significant advantage of Slash, not just an afterthought.

[Mal-Sharran]

Except that Slash has a chance to reset the cooldown on our most important ability, Cauterize. This is a significant advantage of Slash, not just an afterthought.

 

That is a very good point, however I so infrequently fail to refresh Cauterize with Merc Slash that I tend to forget this. I think in the last Voidstar I just did an hour ago, I literally refreshed Cauterize with every single Merc Slash I did.

 

But, (I'm really tired on the verge of sleep, I may be wrong) we're losing Quick Recovery, so this will be a moot point in 1.2. You'll never use Sweep for anything but exactly what it is, AoE (or Sweep Bombs as Focus).

[Chessack]

Wait, you use sweep as a watchman? Unless you're levelling, I don't see any point in it, honestly.

 

Did you READ what I said? I use it on 3-NPC spawns of normals. When do you see 3-NPC spawns of normals in ops or FPs? Those are group content and usually have multiple strongs/elites per group. Clearly what I said was in reference to leveling, which as a level 49 I am still doing. I've never even done an op and I can count the # of FPs or Heroics I've done with this character on one hand.

 

It is an absolutely useful power against normal content with normal spawns in groups. Again I would not give it up.

[andrew_b_gross]

Did you READ what I said? I use it on 3-NPC spawns of normals. When do you see 3-NPC spawns of normals in ops or FPs? Those are group content and usually have multiple strongs/elites per group. Clearly what I said was in reference to leveling, which as a level 49 I am still doing. I've never even done an op and I can count the # of FPs or Heroics I've done with this character on one hand.

 

It is an absolutely useful power against normal content with normal spawns in groups. Again I would not give it up.

 

Normally people don't bother to post their opinions about how useful a skill or talent is for leveling, becuase (1) leveling consumes a very very small fraction of the total amount of time you'll spend on a character, and (2) leveling is so easy that it doesn't matter all that much if you do things optimally or even average, so it's not all that interesting to consider how useful something is for leveling.

 

There are actually several skills that are useful for leveling that aren't used once you start running Ops. For example, the Watchguard skill in the Watchman tree that reduces the CD on Force Kick from 8 seconds to 6 seconds is pure gold when leveling, but a useless waste of points in Ops. For new players, this is probably useful to point out, I guess, as it might take them a week or two of running Ops before they figure it out for themselves. But if they were to remove Watchguard or change it to a differerent tree or whatever, you wouldn't see many responses in threads about it, because it's just a leveling skill, and ultimately, we don't really care.